Learning my first programming language :-D what should I learn?
- Thread starter Annoying Turd
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Or it can be a pain if he does learn it without background knowledge and no instructions.CyberSkull said:Learning C first will make you appreciate all the higher level languages even more.CyberSkull said:
In my opinion it's better to start off with something easier to understand if you wanna learn it by yourself - it is just not as frustrating and keeps you motivated.
Over several gruelling years.cookieXkiller said:
In my software class we went
Pascal (using Turbo Pascal), because it's very strict with it's syntax.
Visual Basic, because it's easier to make practical programs that look.... well not like dos.
Java, because it's VB but as an actual programming language /superiority
You could easily learn html from web tutorials and using the view source feature on web browsers to reverse engineer the stuff you want. Javascript is a little trickier but you'll need that to nice things on a website.
If you want to become an expert programmer you should start off with a degree in computer science or software engineering and go from there.
There is a wide world of difference between a computer scientist and a self taught programmer. I've worked in the software industry long enough to see both.
There is a wide world of difference between a computer scientist and a self taught programmer. I've worked in the software industry long enough to see both.
I started with C to learn the general coding practices such as variable declarations, basic data structures, functions and pointers.
Then moved to Java to learn object orientated stuff and then on the C++ (also OO).
The reason I started with C and not a OO language is there's extra theory on object orientated practices to learn and it could be come too much. So I'd say start simple.
Once you've done C and Java/C++ you'll have no problems using many other languages. Plus these 3 are the ones mostly used in the programming industry.
EDIT: There seems to be a lot of people saying VB, which I kind of disagree with. There just aren't many uses for it and as its relatively easy it'll probably make learning other languages more frustrating, but that's just my opinion.
Then moved to Java to learn object orientated stuff and then on the C++ (also OO).
The reason I started with C and not a OO language is there's extra theory on object orientated practices to learn and it could be come too much. So I'd say start simple.
Once you've done C and Java/C++ you'll have no problems using many other languages. Plus these 3 are the ones mostly used in the programming industry.
EDIT: There seems to be a lot of people saying VB, which I kind of disagree with. There just aren't many uses for it and as its relatively easy it'll probably make learning other languages more frustrating, but that's just my opinion.
I have no idea why anyone is saying VB.
VB sucks, and although it's easy, it really doesn't help you move on to other languages without having to unlearn a load of stuff.
I've heard good things about Python, but I really haven't worked with it enough to give a real opinion.
Java is... eeeh. Despite my personal dislike of it, I suppose it's a pretty good place to start.
VB sucks, and although it's easy, it really doesn't help you move on to other languages without having to unlearn a load of stuff.
I've heard good things about Python, but I really haven't worked with it enough to give a real opinion.
Java is... eeeh. Despite my personal dislike of it, I suppose it's a pretty good place to start.
I see a lot of recommendations for Visual Basic here. I personally have no experience with it, but I've always kind of stayed away from it because of this Edsger Dijkstra[footnote]important computer scientist and Turing Award winner[/footnote]: "the teaching of BASIC should be rated as a criminal offence: it mutilates the mind beyond recovery."[footnote]http://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/EWD/transcriptions/EWD08xx/EWD898.html[/footnote]
In order to recommend a good language, I think it might help to know what someone actually wants to get out of it, and what s/he would like to make. If you spend a lot of time on the internet, it is probably interesting to make a website. If you really like mobile phones, maybe you'd prefer to make an app for that. If you like a particular game, you might be able to make a mod for it and there are also game editors to make simple games "from scratch".
I think that as long as you are smart enough, one of the big "dangers" in learning to program is just losing interest. Therefore I would always recommend that you do something that is fun to you. If you don't mind doing something with no real practical applications, you could also participate in programming games such as Robocode [http://robocode.sourceforge.net/].
You can learn the basics of programming from almost every language, so I think it is more important to consider what you want to do. If you don't really have ideas about that, I would suggest taking a language/environment that is specifically designed to teach you to program, such as Greenfoot [www.greenfoot.org/].
If you can avoid it, I would probably stay away from low-level languages such as C and C++ (unless you need them for something you really want to make), because they can be fairly verbose compared to higher-level/scripting languages like Python, Ruby and Scala.
In order to recommend a good language, I think it might help to know what someone actually wants to get out of it, and what s/he would like to make. If you spend a lot of time on the internet, it is probably interesting to make a website. If you really like mobile phones, maybe you'd prefer to make an app for that. If you like a particular game, you might be able to make a mod for it and there are also game editors to make simple games "from scratch".
I think that as long as you are smart enough, one of the big "dangers" in learning to program is just losing interest. Therefore I would always recommend that you do something that is fun to you. If you don't mind doing something with no real practical applications, you could also participate in programming games such as Robocode [http://robocode.sourceforge.net/].
You can learn the basics of programming from almost every language, so I think it is more important to consider what you want to do. If you don't really have ideas about that, I would suggest taking a language/environment that is specifically designed to teach you to program, such as Greenfoot [www.greenfoot.org/].
If you can avoid it, I would probably stay away from low-level languages such as C and C++ (unless you need them for something you really want to make), because they can be fairly verbose compared to higher-level/scripting languages like Python, Ruby and Scala.
I just started programming in school last year and they started me on Java first. I love it. Sure you will see results faster with VB, but that is because a lot of the programming is done for you when it comes to the GUI. Java is very flexible when you have all the tools, you can do almost anything. Minecraft is written in Java for instance.Annoying Turd said:
As for starting, check online for legitimate colleges that have online study options. I took my first two courses online, it was really easy and not very expensive.
(awesomeRead == http://www.amazon.com/Head-First-Java-Kathy-Sierra/dp/0596009208)
Lots of great advice. Just to add my own advice, bookmark the website http://w3schools.com/ it comes in handy A LOT when you need to remember what the hell that function was, or what it did. Specially when you get into the fun shit like PHP and MySQL. Nothing like having PHP tell you the errors 6 lines below the actually one because that Semi-colon DIDN'T WANT TO BE ON THAT SPOT!
Dont start with one language with the plan to move onto another one, that is a terrible, terrible idea. There is no 'best' programming language to start off with
Just learn the language that you want to learn, first. I'd recommend C++, or C#. Yes, even for a complete beginner
People will tell you to start with language xyz to learn this thing, then move onto something else, but just dont. It isn't worth learning the syntax of three languages for.
Programming tips: Join a forum with a programming section, and find some friends to program with. Motivation is the most difficult part of programming. That, and the hard-to-find bugs that like to live in my programs
A good tutorial website for c++ is http://www.cplusplus.com/doc/tutorial/
If you get to the stage where you would like to do 2D graphics, SFML is a good graphics library
If you decide to go with C#, just google it im sure something will come up! And i've heard good things about XNA for 2d graphics
Just learn the language that you want to learn, first. I'd recommend C++, or C#. Yes, even for a complete beginner
People will tell you to start with language xyz to learn this thing, then move onto something else, but just dont. It isn't worth learning the syntax of three languages for.
Programming tips: Join a forum with a programming section, and find some friends to program with. Motivation is the most difficult part of programming. That, and the hard-to-find bugs that like to live in my programs
A good tutorial website for c++ is http://www.cplusplus.com/doc/tutorial/
If you get to the stage where you would like to do 2D graphics, SFML is a good graphics library
If you decide to go with C#, just google it im sure something will come up! And i've heard good things about XNA for 2d graphics
Semi-colons are the bane of new programmers until you learn that "Compiler found OVER9000 errors" basically means, "you missed a colon somewhere, I'm not telling you where though. trolololol!"Qitz said:
Having done a Software Engineering degree, I'd advise the opposite. Most of the really good programmers I know are self-taught, who just happen to go along with the degree. The degree itself attempts to teach you stuff you will never need, because the syllabus is always playing catch up.AC10 said:
Seriously, for my first six months we never used a computer once.
Get some work experience using SAGE or some such while learning in your spare time. The degree is a piece of paper you can easily get from a distance course.
It really depends on what you're planning on doing with the programming skills.
Basic is a good start to simple programming, however.
If you have any interest in programming video games, C++ is apparently still pretty common, at least according to Wikipedia's article [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_programming#Programming_languages] on the subject.
Java is also good for simpler video games, and for web design.
These days, the programming language I tend to use the most often is Perl. Perl and shell scripting are incredibly useful if you're going to look for a job as a network administrator (I'm NOT a net admin, but I work closely with one). My use of Perl is primarily for manipulating data.
Tip for aspiring computer/network admins: automate as much of your job as you can with CAREFULLY TESTED scripts. Even if it takes eight hours to make a script for a task that takes ten minutes of your time each week, you'll regain that time in under a year if you continue using the script. Plus, automated executions are less prone to error than a human attempting the task.
Example 1: I had a list of computer serial numbers, which I compared to a text export of the output of a computer auditing program; the script compared the serial numbers on the list to the export file, filled in information about the computers into a tab-delimitated output file, and then I fed the file into a spread sheet, and was able to list, in order, the performance level of each workstation. It took about five hours to create the script from scratch, which is a fraction of the time it would have taken to compile the list by hand. Plus, the automated nature makes user-error less likely.
Example 2: I had to pare down a list of voters, since the County sent the School District I work in thousands of voter names/addresses who weren't actually in the District (and, thus, weren't eligible to vote on the School Budget). I acquired a list of addresses for the tax rolls, and wrote a Perl script to compare the addresses on the voter list to the address on the tax roll list. It took 16 hours or so of work to create the script. It would have taken over 40 hours to examine the list by hand. Plus, the script can be reused, and will take about ten seconds on subsequent executions.
Learning about Regular Expressions will also be incredibly valuable to you in any tech-based career. I'm just beginning to grasp the surface of Regex). Being able to save your bosses secretary eight hours of monotonous work and turn that task into a script that takes five seconds to execute is a good way to stay employed. Just document your code thoroughly, so that you'll know what the heck it does when you come back to it two years later...
Basic is a good start to simple programming, however.
If you have any interest in programming video games, C++ is apparently still pretty common, at least according to Wikipedia's article [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_programming#Programming_languages] on the subject.
Java is also good for simpler video games, and for web design.
These days, the programming language I tend to use the most often is Perl. Perl and shell scripting are incredibly useful if you're going to look for a job as a network administrator (I'm NOT a net admin, but I work closely with one). My use of Perl is primarily for manipulating data.
Tip for aspiring computer/network admins: automate as much of your job as you can with CAREFULLY TESTED scripts. Even if it takes eight hours to make a script for a task that takes ten minutes of your time each week, you'll regain that time in under a year if you continue using the script. Plus, automated executions are less prone to error than a human attempting the task.
Example 1: I had a list of computer serial numbers, which I compared to a text export of the output of a computer auditing program; the script compared the serial numbers on the list to the export file, filled in information about the computers into a tab-delimitated output file, and then I fed the file into a spread sheet, and was able to list, in order, the performance level of each workstation. It took about five hours to create the script from scratch, which is a fraction of the time it would have taken to compile the list by hand. Plus, the automated nature makes user-error less likely.
Example 2: I had to pare down a list of voters, since the County sent the School District I work in thousands of voter names/addresses who weren't actually in the District (and, thus, weren't eligible to vote on the School Budget). I acquired a list of addresses for the tax rolls, and wrote a Perl script to compare the addresses on the voter list to the address on the tax roll list. It took 16 hours or so of work to create the script. It would have taken over 40 hours to examine the list by hand. Plus, the script can be reused, and will take about ten seconds on subsequent executions.
Learning about Regular Expressions will also be incredibly valuable to you in any tech-based career. I'm just beginning to grasp the surface of Regex). Being able to save your bosses secretary eight hours of monotonous work and turn that task into a script that takes five seconds to execute is a good way to stay employed. Just document your code thoroughly, so that you'll know what the heck it does when you come back to it two years later...
I realize that so far you've had just about every coding language thrown at you.
I'd definitely recommend only sticking with one until you're sure of what you're doing, then moving onto another, preferably more complicated, language once you have it more or less down.
This way, you'll hopefully learn how computers function, rather than than becoming too caught up on what one particular language can do and that can be invaluable for larger projects.
I realise that microsoft is the devil, but I would personally recommend c# to start with. The .net suite makes learning all the commands almost as easy as visual basic, but the syntax is much more grown up. It's also similar enough to c++ that you shouldn't feel completely unfamiliar with it when you (inevitably) need to use it.
Quick question though, what do you want to program?
Different languages are used in, for instance, internet programming and general application programing.
I'd definitely recommend only sticking with one until you're sure of what you're doing, then moving onto another, preferably more complicated, language once you have it more or less down.
This way, you'll hopefully learn how computers function, rather than than becoming too caught up on what one particular language can do and that can be invaluable for larger projects.
I realise that microsoft is the devil, but I would personally recommend c# to start with. The .net suite makes learning all the commands almost as easy as visual basic, but the syntax is much more grown up. It's also similar enough to c++ that you shouldn't feel completely unfamiliar with it when you (inevitably) need to use it.
Quick question though, what do you want to program?
Different languages are used in, for instance, internet programming and general application programing.