LimeWire Settles with Record Companies for Only $105 Million

[The Lugz]

lime-wire and all similar services are deliberate legal loopholes for people to do whatever the crap they like on, it's fair-play imo that it gets fined, shut down ect

don't get me wrong, i think record company's in particular are guilty of similar or worse things, but we cant exactly lie cheat and steal then sit on our high horses and point fingers can we

 

[Snotnarok]

I love the way these people overexaggerate their losses so badly.

However what I don't love is Lime Wire, 90% of the computers I fix, have that god awful program and they're stuck with viruses galore.

My thought when LimeWire was taken down was "Finally, the word's biggest virus distributor is offline" It's really a terrible program that should have been taken down for many reasons besides sharing of copyright material ages ago. I am impressed that it's been able to stay alive this long though.

I'm impressed people are still dumb enough to download things off it.

Also: I like the posts I read saying "yeah down with pirated music!" when the artists wont see a dime of any money taken because that's how the RIAA works, they take 99% of the profits made by any CD/song sales. There's a lot of artists that hope their stuff is pirated just to have their stuff spread and heard, also because most don't see any money off that sale anyway. (Pretty sure System of a Down and Eminem said to 'go ahead')

The BEST way to support your band is to go to their shows and buy stuff there, they see the most money for it. Buying a CD from a store? You might as well go up to a millionaire and hand them your money.

 

[Yopaz]

Quote where I said Peer to peer is illegal. I stated the use of LimeWire as a peer to peer software.
I am not sure if you are quite updated on the news. Did you miss the fact that Pirate bay actually had to go to both criminal and civil court for their involvement in Pirate Bay? Not for copyright infringement, but for promoting copyright infringement. Because promoting copyright infringement is also a crime.

Well I say that yes, you can be punished for not stopping someone being murdered, but you cannot be punished for selling a perfectly legal object if it is then used for murder.

If you actually witness the murder right after selling the perfectly legal hammer, then yes. It is a crime to not do anything about it. If the murder happens behind a few shelves, but still inside the store without you noticing the incident you can still be punished for it since it is in a loacation which you are responsible of.
Google will give you pirate bay as the first hit when you search for pirate because that's how Google works. It searches for the most popular site containing certain phrases. The reason this hasn't been changed is that they haven't been requested not to. If they had received a request to lock it out from their search and not done it, they too could go to court for promoting piracy. There are several sites that have been removed from the search, and there are browsers that wont let you enter sites with illegal material. The fact that some haven't been removed is because they haven't been reported.
Now answer me, how many legal files are there on LimeWire and how many do you know who use it for legal purposes?

I don't actually know anyone who uses LimeWire, but that's beside the point because it doesn't matter how many people use it for illegal purposes and how many use it for legal ones. If a single person has ever used LimeWire for a legal use, then I think it should not be shut down.

My point is that all that Limewire does is allow people to share files, it takes no responsibility for what files are shared. The service LimeWire provides is not illegal in any way, so it should not be liable for any sort of punishment. Punish the people who actually commit the crime.

"If you actually witness the murder right after selling the perfectly legal hammer, then yes. It is a crime to not do anything about it. If the murder happens behind a few shelves, but still inside the store without you noticing the incident you can still be punished for it since it is in a loacation which you are responsible of."

Why is it that LimeWire is apparently responsible for what files are shared through it, when Microsoft isn't liable when a pirate downloads a game through Internet Explorer?

Why hasn't the Post Office been shut down because people have used it to send letter bombs?

Why hasn't Facebook been shut down, when psychos have used it to stalk innocent people?

Because that would be ridiculously stupid, is why. None of these services are illegal, and the actions of the people that use the services are not the responsibility of the service-provider. LimeWire provides a similar service to the Post Office, in that it allows people to share files between one another. LimeWire doesn't own, control, or even know what those files are, so why is it punished when someone exchanges something illegal?

Facebook hasn't been shut down because you have to be stupid and accept friend quests, and Facebook secures themselves by warning about accepting friend quests from people they don't know. That way they take away the responsibility. LimeWire does not warn about sharing copyrighted files, and there is the difference. Limewire lets you choose categories to make it more effective to download illegal files, and each update made it easier. If Internet Explorer comes bundled with a toolbar that allows you to download illegal files more easily, then Microsoft is indeed guilty and should be punished. If the postal services had a special service for letter bombs, then they should be punished too. If either Microsoft or the postal service earned money on it, then yes they should be punished.
When he made LimeWire, a free program where he would earn money on advertisement, do you really think he expected friends to send legal files to each other? As it is LimeWire is not a software that makes it easier to share files with friends. They will have to open the client, search for the name, ignore all the files with similar names and download it. All the time I've been sharing files with friends I've either used a USB drive, a messenger or sent an email. Yes, this does give me the opportunity to share illegal files too, but most email clients don't allow files bigger than 10mb, and it you don't share it with the whole internet when you use either of these.
The fact that LimeWire has refused to shut down besides being warned is also a reason why they're actually guilty. Other providers actually block sites that provide illegal downloads if it's made clear to them. The postal service holds back suspicious packages. LimeWire is guilty of promoting piracy because they haven't taken action against it when the primary use (not secondary such as illegal browser downloads and letter bombs) has been established at least 7 years ago. To exaggerate this more than it's needed. This is like knowing Fritzel kept his daughter in the basement without telling.
I have also noticed that you use the same hypothetical situation with different companies. First it was Google, then Microsoft and the postal service. If you can't come up with a new situation you will at least prove to me you got nothing more to go on.
Here's the differences between the 3 though, listed up nicely so you'll see why these are different.
1: Does the postal service gain anything when someone sends a letter bomb or anthrax spores?
No, they do however gain bad publicity if they handled it poorly.
2: Does the postal service try to limit the chance of said event happening?
Yes, there's security checks on packages, yet some slip through the system, meaning the system still needs work.
3: Does Microsoft earn anything on illegal files being downloaded using Internet Explorer?
No, nothing is gained or lost here.
4: Is Microsoft taking action to prevent this?
Not as far as I know, unless you count the fact that those sites often come bundled with viruses.
5: Does LimeWire gain anything on illegal files being downloaded?
Yes, LimeWire pulls in money from advertising, and probably gained what fleeting popularity it had because of piracy.
6: Does Limewire try to prevent this from happening?
No, far from it. LimeWire has been updated several times and added categories to make it easier to find and download the exact file you want and ignored warnings about this issue.

 

[DEAD34345]

Facebook hasn't been shut down because you have to be stupid and accept friend quests, and Facebook secures themselves by warning about accepting friend quests from people they don't know. That way they take away the responsibility. LimeWire does not warn about sharing copyrighted files, and there is the difference. Limewire lets you choose categories to make it more effective to download illegal files, and each update made it easier. If Internet Explorer comes bundled with a toolbar that allows you to download illegal files more easily, then Microsoft is indeed guilty and should be punished. If the postal services had a special service for letter bombs, then they should be punished too. If either Microsoft or the postal service earned money on it, then yes they should be punished.
When he made LimeWire, a free program where he would earn money on advertisement, do you really think he expected friends to send legal files to each other? As it is LimeWire is not a software that makes it easier to share files with friends. They will have to open the client, search for the name, ignore all the files with similar names and download it. All the time I've been sharing files with friends I've either used a USB drive, a messenger or sent an email. Yes, this does give me the opportunity to share illegal files too, but most email clients don't allow files bigger than 10mb, and it you don't share it with the whole internet when you use either of these.
The fact that LimeWire has refused to shut down besides being warned is also a reason why they're actually guilty. Other providers actually block sites that provide illegal downloads if it's made clear to them. The postal service holds back suspicious packages. LimeWire is guilty of promoting piracy because they haven't taken action against it when the primary use (not secondary such as illegal browser downloads and letter bombs) has been established at least 7 years ago. To exaggerate this more than it's needed. This is like knowing Fritzel kept his daughter in the basement without telling.
I have also noticed that you use the same hypothetical situation with different companies. First it was Google, then Microsoft and the postal service. If you can't come up with a new situation you will at least prove to me you got nothing more to go on.
Here's the differences between the 3 though, listed up nicely so you'll see why these are different.
1: Does the postal service gain anything when someone sends a letter bomb or anthrax spores?
No, they do however gain bad publicity if they handled it poorly.
2: Does the postal service try to limit the chance of said event happening?
Yes, there's security checks on packages, yet some slip through the system, meaning the system still needs work.
3: Does Microsoft earn anything on illegal files being downloaded using Internet Explorer?
No, nothing is gained or lost here.
4: Is Microsoft taking action to prevent this?
Not as far as I know, unless you count the fact that those sites often come bundled with viruses.
5: Does LimeWire gain anything on illegal files being downloaded?
Yes, LimeWire pulls in money from advertising, and probably gained what fleeting popularity it had because of piracy.
6: Does Limewire try to prevent this from happening?
No, far from it. LimeWire has been updated several times and added categories to make it easier to find and download the exact file you want and ignored warnings about this issue.

The Post Office makes money with every letter bomb sent, same way they make money on any letter. Facebook earns money on advertisements from stalkers, just like they do from any other user. Finally, LimeWire earns money from advertisements from illegal users as well as legal users. Where is the difference?

(To be honest, I don't know what Microsoft gains from having a browser at all, so I can't really answer that one.)

Oh, and about Google not being asked to take the Pirate Bay down, that isn't true at all. They have been warned many times to take the site off their lists, but they have refused as is well within their rights. Just like how it is well within the rights of LimeWire to ignore the warnings they have been given.

You're right about me using the same kind of examples each time, but that's because showing examples of other companies doing the exact same thing without it being illegal, is a very good way of getting the point across that it simply isn't illegal. You have yet to give me a real reason as to why it is only illegal when LimeWire does it. Other companies earn money from illegal uses just like LimeWire does.

You're also right when you say LimeWire is about sharing files with the world, rather than between friends, but what's your point here? Allowing people to share files with the anyone on the net is still not illegal. In fact there was a movie created once which was only spread via P2P filesharing, and this was the intent of the creator of that movie. P2P filesharing was how he got his movie out there for people to view. Only putting copyrighted files on the net is illegal. Luckily LimeWire does not and has not done that.

 

[Yopaz]

The Post Office makes money with every letter bomb sent, same way they make money on any letter. Facebook earns money on advertisements from stalkers, just like they do from any other user. Finally, LimeWire earns money from advertisements from illegal users as well as legal users. Where is the difference?

(To be honest, I don't know what Microsoft gains from having a browser at all, so I can't really answer that one.)

Oh, and about Google not being asked to take the Pirate Bay down, that isn't true at all. They have been warned many times to take the site off their lists, but they have refused as is well within their rights. Just like how it is well within the rights of LimeWire to ignore the warnings they have been given.

You're right about me using the same kind of examples each time, but that's because showing examples of other companies doing the exact same thing without it being illegal, is a very good way of getting the point across that it simply isn't illegal. You have yet to give me a real reason as to why it is only illegal when LimeWire does it. Other companies earn money from illegal uses just like LimeWire does.

You're also right when you say LimeWire is about sharing files with the world, rather than between friends, but what's your point here? Allowing people to share files with the anyone on the net is still not illegal. In fact there was a movie created once which was only spread via P2P filesharing, and this was the intent of the creator of that movie. P2P filesharing was how he got his movie out there for people to view. Only putting copyrighted files on the net is illegal. Luckily LimeWire does not and has not done that.

Yes, the post office makes money with every letter sent, but their primary income doesn't come from letter bombs. In fact I mentioned something called bad publicity there. Building a public image takes years, it takes a lot of cash. 3 envelopes containing anthrax spores resulting in a rash that is cured within weeks sets them back by far. Nothing is gained by this. Because of this they have to hire people to check suspicious packages. Let's say they get 10 dollars for mailing a bomb, how much do they pay every hour to make sure there are no bombs? How often are there bombs? Millions wasted each year because there might be bombs because an occasional package containing a bomb. Just in case you don't know how to add up, but they don't gain from anyone sending bombs. If we don't take this into consideration however the fact is still this: their primary income is not from anthrax or bombs. Their primary income isn't from illegal use.
LimeWire's primary income is due to illegal file sharing and only LimeWire promotes illegal fle sharing. Google might not have blocked Pirate Bay, but they have blocked plenty other sites and this is a fact, as we have both stated we don't know what Microsoft gain on having a browser, probably advertisement, but I can't be sure.

 

[The Artificially Prolonged]

Wait they wanted 75 trillion for illegal downloads HAHAHAHAHA. I'm not sure there is even that much money in the world.

Well guest I should congratulate the RIAA on their victory over piracy /scarcasm. I mean come on has anyone ever used limewire since 2004, and almost 95% of the stuff on it were viruses anyway. All this time spent going after 1 avenue of piracy and yet there are hundreds if not thousands of torrent sites still active. When will publishers learn piracy doesn't always equal loss earnings as a pirate will pirate no matter what. Give your paying customers value for money will win out instead wasting their profits on fighting a losing battle.

 

[DEAD34345]

Yes, the post office makes money with every letter sent, but their primary income doesn't come from letter bombs. In fact I mentioned something called bad publicity there. Building a public image takes years, it takes a lot of cash. 3 envelopes containing anthrax spores resulting in a rash that is cured within weeks sets them back by far. Nothing is gained by this. Because of this they have to hire people to check suspicious packages. Let's say they get 10 dollars for mailing a bomb, how much do they pay every hour to make sure there are no bombs? How often are there bombs? Millions wasted each year because there might be bombs because an occasional package containing a bomb. Just in case you don't know how to add up, but they don't gain from anyone sending bombs. If we don't take this into consideration however the fact is still this: their primary income is not from anthrax or bombs. Their primary income isn't from illegal use.
LimeWire's primary income is due to illegal file sharing and only LimeWire promotes illegal fle sharing. Google might not have blocked Pirate Bay, but they have blocked plenty other sites and this is a fact, as we have both stated we don't know what Microsoft gain on having a browser, probably advertisement, but I can't be sure.

It looks like we will just have to disagree. I understand your argument, and to be honest I think that LimeWire is morally grey at best, but I don't think that companies should be liable for what people do with their products. I also don't think that promoting piracy (or promoting anything else) should be illegal, and I don't think that providing the means for people to share files should be illegal either, whether people use it illegally or not.

It's been an interesting argument, and I'm glad it didn't devolve into petty flaming like these things usually do.

 

[Yopaz]

Yes, the post office makes money with every letter sent, but their primary income doesn't come from letter bombs. In fact I mentioned something called bad publicity there. Building a public image takes years, it takes a lot of cash. 3 envelopes containing anthrax spores resulting in a rash that is cured within weeks sets them back by far. Nothing is gained by this. Because of this they have to hire people to check suspicious packages. Let's say they get 10 dollars for mailing a bomb, how much do they pay every hour to make sure there are no bombs? How often are there bombs? Millions wasted each year because there might be bombs because an occasional package containing a bomb. Just in case you don't know how to add up, but they don't gain from anyone sending bombs. If we don't take this into consideration however the fact is still this: their primary income is not from anthrax or bombs. Their primary income isn't from illegal use.
LimeWire's primary income is due to illegal file sharing and only LimeWire promotes illegal fle sharing. Google might not have blocked Pirate Bay, but they have blocked plenty other sites and this is a fact, as we have both stated we don't know what Microsoft gain on having a browser, probably advertisement, but I can't be sure.

It looks like we will just have to disagree. I understand your argument, and to be honest I think that LimeWire is morally grey at best, but I don't think that companies should be liable for what people do with their products. I also don't think that promoting piracy (or promoting anything else) should be illegal, and I don't think that providing the means for people to share files should be illegal either, whether people use it illegally or not.

It's been an interesting argument, and I'm glad it didn't devolve into petty flaming like these things usually do.

Aww, that's a shame, what if I tell you you're gay, and you say likewise, should we say that's enough flaming and just be on with it.
I have to admit that you're a worthy opponent and that I've enjoyed this too. Enjoy the rest of you weekend.

 

[Atheist.]

A quick Google search shows GDP of EARTH was 58.26 Trillion in 2009. Where the fuck do they get off thinking they sue for more than that?

Or the GDP(PPP) which includes purchasing power was 74 Trillion USD in 2010. They want more money than the World can technically purchase. Nice.

 

[SilentHunter7]

Still, the recording industry is just happy LimeWire is no longer letting people steal music.

They are aware that a hacked version of the LimeWire client went up not 2 hours after the official one went down, right?

 

[hvfreak]

I think that artists must move away from records as primary source of revenue.
Of course there will be people willing to buy collectors edition CD and things like that, but I think the future is this:
1) You can listen 2 music for free wherever you go (be it MP3, radio, YouTube or anything really)
2) Small amounts of collectors edition CD, t-shirs and stuff.
3) Live events. If everyone can listen to the music artists create, fanbase becomes bigger and bigger till you have >80'000 in a stadium watching a concert. If only 2$ from a ticket go to, lets say, 5 artist on stage they can make a lot of money (and I mean artists, not record companies)

 

[Partezan]

I think the people that start up these programs should be poor programmers in Uganda that fight the case as much as they can to waste the other sides money in legal fees and then can't actually pay any of the settlement off when they loose. If you give any money to these retards it just makes them want to sue people more

 

[IamGamer41]

So if I record a song off the radio and play it in my car I'm stealing music? Dose not matter anyway people will still find a way to get there music.Heck people rip music from youtube all the time

Fixed that for you. And to answer you're question technically yes. And if the RIAA could find a way to prosecute you for that I'm sure they would

Thanks mate.Thats so retarded its funny.

 

[TheRundownRabbit]

Hey, I used LimeWire, I used it like a ************. I didnt consider the other parts but you wont get me to feel sorry for a big label artist just because they cant afford a diamond mini-bar for their stretch-limo because people are downloading there music for free

 

[CM156_v1legacy]

If my math is correct, if they got $105 million rather than $75 Trillion, they got .00014% of what they asked for. That is really low, and lawyers will likely take up the ammount they did get.

 

[Sansha]

Record companies demanded $75 trillion in damages?

Are they fucking high?

This is an industry that makes 100% of its revenue off the talents and hard work of others.

They don't know the value of a dollar because they've never had to work for a single fucking one.

Hey, I used LimeWire, I used it like a ************. I didnt consider the other parts but you wont get me to feel sorry for a big label artist just because they cant afford a diamond mini-bar for their stretch-limo because people are downloading there music for free

Gospel, brother.

 

[DaHero]

I love the way these people overexaggerate their losses so badly.

However what I don't love is Lime Wire, 90% of the computers I fix, have that god awful program and they're stuck with viruses galore.

Same...I can sympathize with you so well. It's down to the point where I ask "Do you have LimeWire?" and if they say "Yes" I say "It's a virus" and they think I'm joking. Good to know that things won't be so sour for me anymore.

...meh it's not as funny the 40th time around is it? >.>

 

[Gauntes]

Oh dear god

the name limewire kicked me in the balls with nostalgia.
haven't used it in... 3 years
damn

 

[Lionsfan]

So if I record a song off the radio and play it in my car I'm stealing music? Dose not matter anyway people will still find a way to get there music.Heck people rip music from youtube all the time

Fixed that for you. And to answer you're question technically yes. And if the RIAA could find a way to prosecute you for that I'm sure they would

Thanks mate.Thats so retarded its funny.

Yup, that's the RIAA for you. They used to make a practice of sending random law-suits to people for every song they downloaded, claiming as much as 3,000 bucks per song in damages. Words can't even begin to describe them