Male Protagonists
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
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I think the basic difference between a "manly man" and a "macho man" is that "manly men" recognize, accept, and do what NEEDS to be done, while "macho men" are obsessed with showing the rest of the world what they CAN do.
A good read, and nice to have another update on Fun space game: the game. I look forward to playing it, especially knowing the effort that has gone into it.
That was a good tirade on Manly vs Macho, and a good reference point for the children who don't know the difference. Interesting idea using engine freezing over as a game play mechanic, I look forward to seeing how it plays out.
Nicely put! I think the main problem with the macho protagonist is in games that actually take themselves seriously. Think Tommy Vercetti from GTA:VC. He's abut as macho as anyone who can't swim can get, yet I don't find him pathetic, mainly because the whole game is just so damn hilarious.
Looking back at my time playing Halo3 (last week, out of boredom, and so that RDR would seem even better by comparison), Master Chief comes across as a) fucking stupid, b) having a tendency for stating the obvious, c) incapable of social interaction aside from a creepy fascination with a hologram and the admiration of those annoying sycophant soldiers, d) did I mention fucking stupid? I suppose I can understand why games with macho protagonists are so popular, after all the socially inept, overweight, hideous parental basement dwelling gamer that (stereotypically) enjoys them can fantasize about how awesome his life would be if only he could flip tanks and utter badass (sarcasm, obviously) one liners.
If humanity is really too much to ask for in a protagonist, could we just play as robots? The Terminator is just a step below your average macho protagonist in terms of relatability imho
Looking back at my time playing Halo3 (last week, out of boredom, and so that RDR would seem even better by comparison), Master Chief comes across as a) fucking stupid, b) having a tendency for stating the obvious, c) incapable of social interaction aside from a creepy fascination with a hologram and the admiration of those annoying sycophant soldiers, d) did I mention fucking stupid? I suppose I can understand why games with macho protagonists are so popular, after all the socially inept, overweight, hideous parental basement dwelling gamer that (stereotypically) enjoys them can fantasize about how awesome his life would be if only he could flip tanks and utter badass (sarcasm, obviously) one liners.
If humanity is really too much to ask for in a protagonist, could we just play as robots? The Terminator is just a step below your average macho protagonist in terms of relatability imho
There are few things more irritating than when a game expects us to take a macho protagonist seriously, but few things funnier than when the game DOESN'T expect us to. Tommy Vercetti is another example, so (I hope) are Leon Kennedy and Chris Redfield.
Why is the Macho-Man so hated in the gaming community? Am I the only one who likes playing an 80s Action Hero as my video game persona? I love the Rambo/John McClain macho badass banter, but it seems that it is constantly ripped apart in the games media.
Have all gamers been so emotionally ripped apart by "bros" and "football jock douches" that they can't enjoy the macho-man for fear of being thrown in a trashcan and given a wedgie? All joking aside: really, what is the issue with having a character that has muscles on his muscles and uses a gun as big as he is?
Have all gamers been so emotionally ripped apart by "bros" and "football jock douches" that they can't enjoy the macho-man for fear of being thrown in a trashcan and given a wedgie? All joking aside: really, what is the issue with having a character that has muscles on his muscles and uses a gun as big as he is?
I think the route of the problem is bad writing.
It doesn't mean we just get lackluster stories for the characters to exist in, we also get lackluster characters to inhabit the lackluster worlds.
It doesn't mean we just get lackluster stories for the characters to exist in, we also get lackluster characters to inhabit the lackluster worlds.
Well, yes, the games can be functional, but it's better if some though has been put into it. Kratos, for example, does not have the exaggerated looks typical of what Yahtzee once called "a twelve-year-old's vision of masculinity." He wears a skirt and some sandals. And the fleece, but that has a purpose.Sovvolf said:
And besides, the games do their best to show just how demented Kratos is, letting you have fun, but showing you at a lot of points that your actions are quite questionable. If anything, it's a self-aware macho game with a dark parody of the macho protagonist.
Anyway, nice to hear FSG:TG is progressing. Piloting a faulty ship and making it part of the gameplay sounds like a good way to introduce a sense of urgency. Only, the freezing thing isn't believable without some further elaboration - space isn't really cold (despite what The Phantom Menace tells you). If the ship had a faulty cooling system, with the coolant unable to stop circulating, you would have to run the engine to avoid it being frozen. But, if it's actually more intuitive for the average player to have space be an Antarctica-like environment where ships get hypothermia, it's a valid choice.
To each his own. It all comes down to personal preference, and softer characters can be good as well (Nathan Drake comes to mind), but ,as I stated, I'll stick with Marcus Phoenix as my character =)Dark Templar said:
Great article. The sad thing is that the whole "manly vs macho" business is not confined to games either. The "macho" men of the real world might not be spending their time running around wielding swords, but that attitude of "everyone different from this is a pussy/gay/woman/etc" is something that is unfortunately all-too common amongst people that I have met. Those people, like their gaming equivalents, are always uninteresting and obnoxious to deal with, especially for someone like me who has a strong dislike for "set standards" and those who live by them.
So basically, Manly men are masculine while remaining humanized during the coarse of the game while the macho man just wants to kill stuff and looks for reasons to kill stuff? That, of coarse, being the broadest definitions of the two. I think both can be interesting in any case. It just depends on the way the character is presented. A macho man in the real world where people actually punish him for what he does would be funny, though wouldn't make for a good game. A 'manly man' seems like they'd fit perfectly into any situation though.
OMG!!! I finally understand it, and it all goes back to my original point!!! The Macho-Man main characters remind people of the "Macho-Man" Real people they know...and hate. So, due to transitive properties, they hate these traits in the main characters!!!! Thanks Yureina, this is a major psychological breakthrough ;-)Yureina said: