Man faces jail for handing in a gun.

[Xanian]

well, over here we have very strict gun laws. But see, a teacher once told me that in America, where firearms are legal, almost every crime has a lower rate, except murder. Could it be because of guns? I guess we'll never know.

The vast majority of our murders are hand gun related. This being said, they are usually illegally owned guns, {most counties don't allow people to own hand guns without a very difficult to obtain permit, and only a very few counties allow people to have a concealed weapon.}

Also, most of the hand gun related murder are associated with illegal activity to begin with, such as drug trafficking and the like.

Our issue remains with illegal guns most of the time.

Now ACCIDENTAL gun death is usually attributable to legally owned guns...that we are very silly for.

But I think we would continue to have similar problems if we got more stringent codes in about guns.

I blame our drug-related issues. Stupid American drug users.

 

[0p3rati0n]

WOW talk about bullshit! This is one reason why I hate people and my social life is only on the computer!!! Another reason I hate people is...................... well go to your local toy store, look at some toys, and then you'll know what I mean.......

 

[Xanian]

As a silly American girl, I'm shocked, disgusted, and a little amused. Maybe it's because my kids brother got to own his first gun when he was thirteen or the fact that my Dad carried one when he had to work in LA during the riots, but I don't understand what the big deal is.

This becomes one of those silly scenarios where the law encourages you to disobey it. He either should have left the gun where it lay, chancing that some cheeky school boys pick it up and blow their brains out, or taken it and simply never told anyone.

There should be far more flexibility in the legal system than that, otherwise people are discouraged from interacting on a friendly basis with their legal system and stop trusting it.

I understand how it may be a little difficult for an American to understand. I'm from Australia where the laws are similar to the UK so it makes perfect sense to me.

If you see an abandoned gun, you don't touch it - you're possibly interfering with evidence, including forensic evidence. Common sense tells you that gun has been abandoned for a reason. That gun might have just been used to kill ten people, or rob a service station, or it might not. Who knows. You ring the police, you follow their instructions. Simple. You don't do what this guy died, which is ring the police, say "I need to see you" and then cart the gun over to them without even telling them that you have a gun until it comes out of your bag, that's MORONIC. Imagine if, instead of a gun, it was a dead body or some other kind of possibly criminal evidence. Do you hand the dead body or the criminal evidence into the police station? No. You ring the police, and you do what they tell you.

I understand the point you are trying to make, but I don't believe a dead body will attack people, and if the evidence were, say, narcotics, I would still pick them up or watch over them very carefully. We have many children playing in the streets where I live, particularly young children who wouldn't no better and might eat it.

A few years ago a child in my city shot one of his close friends on accident with a gun he found and killed him. This is not too uncommon a story in the US. [Please put aside your beliefs about our loose gun laws for a moment, we have other issues to discuss at present] We have some contextualizing factors here that lead us to wonder why a responsible adult isn't picking up the gun, rather than why he isn't calling the police casually from his home.

 

[axia777]

Wow, fuck the Judge and fuck everyone who is screwing this man. He needs the British equivalent of the ACLU or something on his side as he is getting legally raped. Where is Johnny Cochran and his Chewbacca defense when yah need him?!

 

[BonsaiK]

As a silly American girl, I'm shocked, disgusted, and a little amused. Maybe it's because my kids brother got to own his first gun when he was thirteen or the fact that my Dad carried one when he had to work in LA during the riots, but I don't understand what the big deal is.

This becomes one of those silly scenarios where the law encourages you to disobey it. He either should have left the gun where it lay, chancing that some cheeky school boys pick it up and blow their brains out, or taken it and simply never told anyone.

There should be far more flexibility in the legal system than that, otherwise people are discouraged from interacting on a friendly basis with their legal system and stop trusting it.

I understand how it may be a little difficult for an American to understand. I'm from Australia where the laws are similar to the UK so it makes perfect sense to me.

If you see an abandoned gun, you don't touch it - you're possibly interfering with evidence, including forensic evidence. Common sense tells you that gun has been abandoned for a reason. That gun might have just been used to kill ten people, or rob a service station, or it might not. Who knows. You ring the police, you follow their instructions. Simple. You don't do what this guy died, which is ring the police, say "I need to see you" and then cart the gun over to them without even telling them that you have a gun until it comes out of your bag, that's MORONIC. Imagine if, instead of a gun, it was a dead body or some other kind of possibly criminal evidence. Do you hand the dead body or the criminal evidence into the police station? No. You ring the police, and you do what they tell you.

I understand the point you are trying to make, but I don't believe a dead body will attack people, and if the evidence were, say, narcotics, I would still pick them up or watch over them very carefully. We have many children playing in the streets where I live, particularly young children who wouldn't no better and might eat it.

A few years ago a child in my city shot one of his close friends on accident with a gun he found and killed him. This is not too uncommon a story in the US. [Please put aside your beliefs about our loose gun laws for a moment, we have other issues to discuss at present] We have some contextualizing factors here that lead us to wonder why a responsible adult isn't picking up the gun, rather than why he isn't calling the police casually from his home.

Okay, to clarify:

1. You see a gun, body, drugs, [insert illegal thing here].
2. You ring the police.
3. If the police say "do nothing, we are coming" you WAIT and keep an eye on the [illegal thing], and make sure no-one touches it, until the police get there. If someone does touch it, you tell the police what happened when they arrive, who touched it and why.
4. If the police advise anything else to you on the phone or in person, you follow their instruction.

 

[Littlee300]

Another note, theis guy stabbed a cop and was getting ready to finish her off when another cop shot the guy who was in "progress".

guess what happened:

they fired the cop. and then they fired the stabbed cop for standing up for the other one. (welcome to the most insulated city in the Midwest, Madison Wisconsin.)

Then the family claimed the stabber guy had a mental retardation (duh he was trying to kill a cop) then sued the city for 8 million dollars.

I think our legal system also needs some tweaking

I really hope your lying

 

[BonsaiK]

Another note, theis guy stabbed a cop and was getting ready to finish her off when another cop shot the guy who was in "progress".

guess what happened:

they fired the cop. and then they fired the stabbed cop for standing up for the other one. (welcome to the most insulated city in the Midwest, Madison Wisconsin.)

Then the family claimed the stabber guy had a mental retardation (duh he was trying to kill a cop) then sued the city for 8 million dollars.

I think our legal system also needs some tweaking

I really hope your lying

I would need references to believe this one. Also I'm sure it's not that simple.

 

[mew4ever23]

/e is now flying the flag of BULLSHIT

These people need to get their priorities in order. Since when do the police have a problem with someone giving them a weapon they found, even calling ahead to let them know their intent to do so.

Wow, fuck the Judge and fuck everyone who is screwing this man. He needs the British equivalent of the ACLU or something on his side as he is getting legally raped. Where is Johnny Cochran and his Chewbacca defense when yah need him?!

Never mind Cochran, Where's Phoenix Wright?

 

[Akai Shizuku]

As a silly American girl, I'm shocked, disgusted, and a little amused. Maybe it's because my kids brother got to own his first gun when he was thirteen or the fact that my Dad carried one when he had to work in LA during the riots, but I don't understand what the big deal is.

This becomes one of those silly scenarios where the law encourages you to disobey it. He either should have left the gun where it lay, chancing that some cheeky school boys pick it up and blow their brains out, or taken it and simply never told anyone.

There should be far more flexibility in the legal system than that, otherwise people are discouraged from interacting on a friendly basis with their legal system and stop trusting it.

I understand how it may be a little difficult for an American to understand. I'm from Australia where the laws are similar to the UK so it makes perfect sense to me.

If you see an abandoned gun, you don't touch it - you're possibly interfering with evidence, including forensic evidence. Common sense tells you that gun has been abandoned for a reason. That gun might have just been used to kill ten people, or rob a service station, or it might not. Who knows. You ring the police, you follow their instructions. Simple. You don't do what this guy died, which is ring the police, say "I need to see you" and then cart the gun over to them without even telling them that you have a gun until it comes out of your bag, that's MORONIC. Imagine if, instead of a gun, it was a dead body or some other kind of possibly criminal evidence. Do you hand the dead body or the criminal evidence into the police station? No. You ring the police, and you do what they tell you.

It's still borderline retarded.

In any case, better to just hide the gun in your closet than to phone anyone.

That'll work fine unless the gun is inadvertently found by a law-abiding citizen or someone finds out you have it and rings the cops. Then police ballistics analyse the gun and link you to a crime that you didn't committ. Then you get a charge for a crime you had nothing to do with AND an illegal firearm possession charge.

In a country where guns are almost completely illegal, you don't just "abandon a gun" because you just bought a better one or you didn't like the colour of the barrel or whatever. People generally abandon guns because those guns could be linked to crimes that carry hefty penalties. If you pick that gun up and don't contact the authorities, you're at best, a fool.

What if there are zombies?

EDIT: On a more serious note, you couldn't know that without taking a law course. No matter how you look at it there's no justification for penalizing this man; all he tried to do was be a good citizen.

Not true. It's just common sense. If you see something criminal you ring the police. You don't need a law course to understand that.

Also, maybe the guy isn't a good citizen? Maybe he tampered with the evidence on purpose. We just don't know.

I sure as hell didn't get it, and obviously, neither did anyone else, with you being the sole exception.

If he did, they would have found out and put him on trial for it.

 

[BonsaiK]

As a silly American girl, I'm shocked, disgusted, and a little amused. Maybe it's because my kids brother got to own his first gun when he was thirteen or the fact that my Dad carried one when he had to work in LA during the riots, but I don't understand what the big deal is.

This becomes one of those silly scenarios where the law encourages you to disobey it. He either should have left the gun where it lay, chancing that some cheeky school boys pick it up and blow their brains out, or taken it and simply never told anyone.

There should be far more flexibility in the legal system than that, otherwise people are discouraged from interacting on a friendly basis with their legal system and stop trusting it.

I understand how it may be a little difficult for an American to understand. I'm from Australia where the laws are similar to the UK so it makes perfect sense to me.

If you see an abandoned gun, you don't touch it - you're possibly interfering with evidence, including forensic evidence. Common sense tells you that gun has been abandoned for a reason. That gun might have just been used to kill ten people, or rob a service station, or it might not. Who knows. You ring the police, you follow their instructions. Simple. You don't do what this guy died, which is ring the police, say "I need to see you" and then cart the gun over to them without even telling them that you have a gun until it comes out of your bag, that's MORONIC. Imagine if, instead of a gun, it was a dead body or some other kind of possibly criminal evidence. Do you hand the dead body or the criminal evidence into the police station? No. You ring the police, and you do what they tell you.

It's still borderline retarded.

In any case, better to just hide the gun in your closet than to phone anyone.

That'll work fine unless the gun is inadvertently found by a law-abiding citizen or someone finds out you have it and rings the cops. Then police ballistics analyse the gun and link you to a crime that you didn't committ. Then you get a charge for a crime you had nothing to do with AND an illegal firearm possession charge.

In a country where guns are almost completely illegal, you don't just "abandon a gun" because you just bought a better one or you didn't like the colour of the barrel or whatever. People generally abandon guns because those guns could be linked to crimes that carry hefty penalties. If you pick that gun up and don't contact the authorities, you're at best, a fool.

What if there are zombies?

EDIT: On a more serious note, you couldn't know that without taking a law course. No matter how you look at it there's no justification for penalizing this man; all he tried to do was be a good citizen.

Not true. It's just common sense. If you see something criminal you ring the police. You don't need a law course to understand that.

Also, maybe the guy isn't a good citizen? Maybe he tampered with the evidence on purpose. We just don't know.

I sure as hell didn't get it, and obviously, neither did anyone else, with you being the sole exception.

If he did, they would have found out and put him on trial for it.

Make that me and at least 12 adults in a coutrroom.

A jury took only 20 minutes to convict him. That's incredibly short. If you've ever done jury duty, you will know that 20 minutes is an open-and-shut case. Juries usually take DAYS to decide if there's even the slightest ambiguity or uncertainty, or any room for debate about the crime whatsoever. 20 minutes is a sign of an absolute unanimous decision where everyone agreed that this guy was a tool and needed the book thrown at him.

 

[Small Waves]

Oh hey it's Judge Badtouch McWristslap. This explains the unfathomable retardation.

 

[dantheman931]

I'm reminded of a quote by a great man (Captain Picard): "There can be no justice so long as laws are absolute." Sure, he was trying to get Wesley off the hook at the time, which is itself a questionable act; but he had a good point, and if it applies anywhere, it's here.

 

[Samurai Goomba]

That's crap. I guess if I find a gun, I'm going to just keep it. Or sell it and make some cash. Or disassemble it and leave the parts in front of the police station in a bag of burning feces. The cops also sound like real scumbags, letting this guy believe he was doing (in the phone conversation) a good deed turning it in.

 

[Akai Shizuku]

As a silly American girl, I'm shocked, disgusted, and a little amused. Maybe it's because my kids brother got to own his first gun when he was thirteen or the fact that my Dad carried one when he had to work in LA during the riots, but I don't understand what the big deal is.

This becomes one of those silly scenarios where the law encourages you to disobey it. He either should have left the gun where it lay, chancing that some cheeky school boys pick it up and blow their brains out, or taken it and simply never told anyone.

There should be far more flexibility in the legal system than that, otherwise people are discouraged from interacting on a friendly basis with their legal system and stop trusting it.

I understand how it may be a little difficult for an American to understand. I'm from Australia where the laws are similar to the UK so it makes perfect sense to me.

If you see an abandoned gun, you don't touch it - you're possibly interfering with evidence, including forensic evidence. Common sense tells you that gun has been abandoned for a reason. That gun might have just been used to kill ten people, or rob a service station, or it might not. Who knows. You ring the police, you follow their instructions. Simple. You don't do what this guy died, which is ring the police, say "I need to see you" and then cart the gun over to them without even telling them that you have a gun until it comes out of your bag, that's MORONIC. Imagine if, instead of a gun, it was a dead body or some other kind of possibly criminal evidence. Do you hand the dead body or the criminal evidence into the police station? No. You ring the police, and you do what they tell you.

It's still borderline retarded.

In any case, better to just hide the gun in your closet than to phone anyone.

That'll work fine unless the gun is inadvertently found by a law-abiding citizen or someone finds out you have it and rings the cops. Then police ballistics analyse the gun and link you to a crime that you didn't committ. Then you get a charge for a crime you had nothing to do with AND an illegal firearm possession charge.

In a country where guns are almost completely illegal, you don't just "abandon a gun" because you just bought a better one or you didn't like the colour of the barrel or whatever. People generally abandon guns because those guns could be linked to crimes that carry hefty penalties. If you pick that gun up and don't contact the authorities, you're at best, a fool.

What if there are zombies?

EDIT: On a more serious note, you couldn't know that without taking a law course. No matter how you look at it there's no justification for penalizing this man; all he tried to do was be a good citizen.

Not true. It's just common sense. If you see something criminal you ring the police. You don't need a law course to understand that.

Also, maybe the guy isn't a good citizen? Maybe he tampered with the evidence on purpose. We just don't know.

I sure as hell didn't get it, and obviously, neither did anyone else, with you being the sole exception.

If he did, they would have found out and put him on trial for it.

Make that me and at least 12 adults in a coutrroom.

A jury took only 20 minutes to convict him. That's incredibly short. If you've ever done jury duty, you will know that 20 minutes is an open-and-shut case. Juries usually take DAYS to decide if there's even the slightest ambiguity or uncertainty, or any room for debate about the crime whatsoever. 20 minutes is a sign of an absolute unanimous decision where everyone agreed that this guy was a tool and needed the book thrown at him.

This is still incredibly retarded.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

Makes me glad I live in Texas, everyone here is carrying. If someone found a shotgun laying in the street, they would either keep it, or ask the police.... if they can keep it.

 

[ScientificDJ]

That is bull shit. The police should have told him that if he would bring in the gun he would get thrown in jail and that he needs to tell them where the gun is so they can go and pick it up...

precisely, what a bullshit situation

 

[Nazulu]

That's it, I've been wanting Britain dead for over 200 years now, but this seals it. They don't deserve to exist as a nation, to say nothing as a people.

Kill them, burn their homes, salt the earth.

You really don't think things through before posting, don't you? If I said that about the USA, would it bother you seeing it or anyone else?

No, I don't. And if you did say that, me and you would have be friends And as far as anyone else goes, no, I prefer to set them on fire too.

Fire. Solves. Everything.

Well I like your style. But just so you know, some escapists may find that offensive and you may end up on probation if your not careful.

 

[fanklok]

the intent of a person possessing a firearm is irrelevant

applying this logic britains entire police force and armed forces should be jailed for 5 years

 

[The_Evermind]

Couple of points to make:
1. The reason that the jury didn't take that much time to decide whether he was guilty or not is because he is obviously guilty, the law may be stupid but the law says you are guilty if you are in possession of a gun and no matter what you think he was, quite obviously in possession of a gun.
2. Even if he hadn't walked it into the police station the gun was still found in a bag which he didn't open until he got into his house so even if he had told the cops to pick it up as soon as he knew it was a gun he still would have been in a tight spot legally, although perhaps not quite as tight as he is now.
3. Even though I am not British and think this whole case is ridiculous I don't believe that people (and when I say people I mean you, yes you) should criticize the whole British legal system, there always have been and always will be stupid laws.

 

[Gaderael]

In, the UK, are the courts supposed to follow the letter of the law, or the spirit of the law? If it's the letter of the law, than the judge and the prosecutor really had no choice, unless they want to lose their jobs.

Personally, I think it's really god damned stupid. The man did the right thing. He found it, called ahead, and brought it in. As someone already stated, the officer who received the call should be smacked with a New York State phone book for not telling him that he would automatically be arrested and charged if he handled the weapon. The defense really should have pressed that point. Not even a soldier would know every single point of law, especially when it comes to something like this.

So, what happens if someone is held up at gun point, but the mugger gets tackled and the victim else pick up the gun to hold on to until the police arrive? Do they get charged with this stupidly worded law?