Mass Effect 3 ending SPOILERS!
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Well, what you have to keep in mind, is that BSN is the place where the most vocal fans post their opinions. Out of the 3.5 million copies that have been sold so far, 8000 is a very low percentage and since the majority of people who bought the game won't post on forums or something similar, there's no way for sure of knowing whether Bioware has alienated "a huge chunk of their fanbase"Blachman201 said:
I personally hope Bioware stick to their guns and don't cave to the majority on BSN. First of all, it would cheapen the entire trilogy and secondly, they would get another shitstorm going, this time from the anti-DLC people.
They do make a difference as you'll in this guide. Depending on much you gather and what you did in ME2, you'll get a different ending.Matt King said:
Take into consideration that most people don't finish a 30+hour game in just a few days.Sp3ratus said:
In that respect 6500 people saying the ending sucks is crushing, and I expect Bioware to issue some sort of statement either defending or apologising for their choice in the conclusions.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8o_C18ytst0
from the looks of it shep is on earth, and from the start up to 11 sec you can hear what its probably a reaper (turn up the sound since its in the background) and the fact that he is on earth, would mean that shep never got inside the citadel and the endings werent such (since that happens after the detroy ending, it could show that shepard will to destroy them, doesnt let him die until he finally achives it), could this be bioware cop out for a dcl if people didnt like the ending?
i do think its a reaper:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKxXqAuPe3E
0:34 i think its the same one
from the looks of it shep is on earth, and from the start up to 11 sec you can hear what its probably a reaper (turn up the sound since its in the background) and the fact that he is on earth, would mean that shep never got inside the citadel and the endings werent such (since that happens after the detroy ending, it could show that shepard will to destroy them, doesnt let him die until he finally achives it), could this be bioware cop out for a dcl if people didnt like the ending?
i do think its a reaper:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKxXqAuPe3E
0:34 i think its the same one
Well, you have to face the fact that not everyone are great übermenschen with the vastly superior intellect that is required to truly understand and appreciate the real meaning of the ending like you, SajuukKhar, and synobal.Sp3ratus said:
I have read hundreds of posts everywhere from people who are disappointed with endings, and paraphrased most of them boils down to: "I liked everything about the game except for the last 15 minutes. I feel betrayed by the ending, it was as if control was taken away from me, and that my choices were invalidated at the last minute. I don't feel like touching Mass Effect 1 or 2 ever again, because what is the point, if my choices doesn't matter in the end?"
And so far these kinds of posts vastly outnumbers the ones who defends the endings. I don't know which one is worse; the fact that BioWare, a company who have said that they truly care about their fans, won't at least throw these disappointed people some kind of bone, or that people like you, who, by all indications, belongs to a minority, think that they shouldn't.
Insulting people for their opinions now? What a greay way to argue and get your point across. When did I ever state I was of superior intellect or say that I'm smarter than you or the other people who dislike the ending? Go ahead, find a quote where I say anything vaguely similar to that.Blachman201 said:
I defend the ending because I thought the ending was amazing and fit the game and overall series perfectly. Me, SajuukKhar and synobal are posting how we see the ending and what the ending is to us and that's somehow wrong? Why is your opinion any more valid than mine? Or why is my opinion any less valid than yours?
Alright, I'll give you that a majority might not like the ending, but why does that make it the correct opinion? The majority isn't necessarily right. It's not necessarily wrong either, but it's just that, an opinion that a lot of people hold, not "the only opinion that can ever be".
I have a serious problem with the ending. There seems to be large anti-synthetics overtone, which I know makes a lot of sense in this installment. However, I hate the fact that the only ending Shepard survives is the destroy all synthetics option. That means everything from the Reapers, to the Geth, to even EDI. Not to mention, in my playthrough at least, I brokered peace between the Quarians and Geth. Hell my favorite character from Mass Effect 2 gave up his life so that the Geth can gain individuality. I am in tears remembering the part where Tali tells Legion that he has a soul. I just hate that ending.
From what I heard of the endings... sounds like that marks the end of the Mass Effect series. You cant honestly make any more games with endings like that. I was kinda hoping after ME3, there will be one or two spin-off games. Shit...
Okay, I do apologize for lumping you into that group of people. I have just seen many of those who defends the ending, being incredibly smug about how they "get it" and how everyone complaining must be "self-entitled children."Sp3ratus said:
However, we have SajuukKhar saying things like:
Which comes across as being quite arrogant and condescending against those who asks for closure.SajuukKhar said:
I know I can't change the fact that you like the ending, and as I said ealier: "Good for you." But why is that you people are against any changes to the endings at all?Sp3ratus said:
Most people are merely asking for another option, which is why a fully optional DLC that changes the ending would be perfect for that task. If someone, like you, likes the in the ending in its present form, they don't have to buy and install it. Why would it in any way hurt you if such a solution where made available?
It's okay Sp3ratus it isn't the first time I've been attacked for holding different opinions from the group. Besides what can name calling on the internet do to me anyways?Sp3ratus said:
I do find the argument that 'everyone hates the endings' so they must be terrible some what amusing though.
Everyone seems to think a good ending must make the player happy, but that isn't necessarily the sign of a good ending, a good ending evokes an emotional response from the players, and I know that the fight for earth was INTENSE for me (I had it on insanity) then the whole laser beam of death that I didn't really expect. I was like 'meh all these lasers are scripted to miss me...' then zap! Then there was the whole scene with the illusive man and Anderson. Then Shepherds final choice which floored me I tried for minutes to make a decision before finally choosing synthesis.
Then the final cut scene with Joker and EDI obviously suppose to represent Adam and Eve and the whole dawn of a new Era thing full of possibilities and hope now that organic and synthetic life were ultimately free of the reapers and what my shepherd believed would be the inevitable conflict between the two.
The whole thing was emotionally intense for me,a bit draining even and at the end I had to sit there during the credits and consider the ending. Plus all it's implications.
Yet so many people are simply dismissing the endings because they were not what what they wanted. I don't get it, the ending was impactful emotional and ultimately let your character shape the future of the entire galaxy. Yet people seem to be screaming for a power point show that says 'Grunt went back to to Tuchanka and had lots of babies' Garrus became Primarch and was later impeached after a tape of him wrestling with a 'Quarian' ambassador was leaked to the public' etc etc
If it had done that for me I would of been disappointed, they did it for Dragon Age Origins and it kind of worked to some degree but I really doubt that it would of worked for a story that spanned three games, and dealt with a threat that literally destroyed most of galactic civilization.
Yeah, I must stress that besides the lack of closure and catharsis, the deus ex machina, the total clash with the previous established themes and tone, the needless repeat of the already solved Organics vs. Synthetics question (the real resolution to that came in the Quarian vs. Geth war), the complete out of character moment for Joker, the teleporting squad mates, and the crash on planet Contrivance, really was what left with me a incredibility bitter taste in my mouth.Hammeroj said:
I don't think good endings has to necessarily be super happy. I actually liked End of Evangelion for Pete's sake! Sure, it didn't provide much closure to the series, but it was at least a thematically appropriate conclusion, and it had a little sliver of hope at the end. I wish I could say as much for Mass Effect 3.
I can't really address your lack of closure.Blachman201 said:
I can say that it wasn't Deus Ex Machina, the crucible wasn't something that just happened. It was something that you worked for the entire game to make happen. Everyone repeatedly said 'we don't know what it does' except that it is a weapon designed to stop the reapers. They even said they don't know what a catalyst is. Hell even at the end they don't know until shepherd shows up there to speak to it. The choices at the end were a bit of a plot twist but that is all.
Organics VS Synthetics was an overarching theme for the entire game. In the first game you had the Geth, rogue VIs and even a deranged AI. Plus Saren who represented the dangers of transhumanism (though I guess technically he was a transturian).
In the second game EDI was a huge plot point, from the moment you boarded the SR2, and unshackling her was a big deal. Then there was the collectors who were enslaved by technology and made into a parody of the mighty race they once were. Legion was there to give a voice to the Geth and tell you their side of things.
In the third game you had EDI trying to come to terms with humanity and her freedom from her shackles, the Geth and the Quarian conflict come to a head, and then there is cerberus and the illusive man who once again represent the dangers of transhumanism. Plus if you have the DLC the prothean says that in his cycle there were issues with synthetics trying to destroy organic life, and it is even said by the reapers that in every cycle this has been the same.
Then finally we have the Reapers who are in every game are trying to destroy advanced organic life. The only difference is this time we have the reapers come out and say why they are doing it and try to explain some of their backwards logic.
I will still say that the series has been one of the best in gaming history.
Having said that, I understand that people could be pissed about the ending. I was first like, "What just happened?". But then I replayed the ending, and thought about the developers saying that this was the end to Shepard's story, not the Mass Effect story. And plus, the Catalyst said that the cycle will end no matter what. So this could be the new cycle.
I have mixed feelings about the ending, but it wasn't a deal breaker. I probably wouldn't buy a DLC saying this is the appropriate ending. I can also sense that the endings is a way to leave questions so that we would be tempted to buy DLC, which I think that's bullcrap.
Bioware took a big risk with making these endings. Any person with sense could tell these endings provided little closure.
After all this, I still enjoyed Mass Effect with much love. I probably don't support Bioware as I used to, but still love the story of Mass Effect. The characters, the interactions, the cinematic feel. Maybe I'll feel different if I play all three simultaneously. If only the ending could've been worked on a little more, I would be shouting how Mass Effect is the best gaming series of all time. Reminds me of how I was disappointed with Halo 3 and it's ending (not to mention the lack of quality in the story and campaign). Hope Bioware doesn't go down the same path as Bungie did, then the story will really suffer.
But if anyone asked if they should play Mass Effect the series, I would still say yes.
Having said that, I understand that people could be pissed about the ending. I was first like, "What just happened?". But then I replayed the ending, and thought about the developers saying that this was the end to Shepard's story, not the Mass Effect story. And plus, the Catalyst said that the cycle will end no matter what. So this could be the new cycle.
I have mixed feelings about the ending, but it wasn't a deal breaker. I probably wouldn't buy a DLC saying this is the appropriate ending. I can also sense that the endings is a way to leave questions so that we would be tempted to buy DLC, which I think that's bullcrap.
Bioware took a big risk with making these endings. Any person with sense could tell these endings provided little closure.
After all this, I still enjoyed Mass Effect with much love. I probably don't support Bioware as I used to, but still love the story of Mass Effect. The characters, the interactions, the cinematic feel. Maybe I'll feel different if I play all three simultaneously. If only the ending could've been worked on a little more, I would be shouting how Mass Effect is the best gaming series of all time. Reminds me of how I was disappointed with Halo 3 and it's ending (not to mention the lack of quality in the story and campaign). Hope Bioware doesn't go down the same path as Bungie did, then the story will really suffer.
But if anyone asked if they should play Mass Effect the series, I would still say yes.
Apology accepted. I think SajuukKhar makes a lot of good points, but I don't agree with everything he posts(namely insulting users and the like).Blachman201 said:
If the DLC(which is unlikely to happen, from everything I've read) would contain something like an epilogue for what your crew, people you met and the different races, then I wouldn't be opposed to it. I am, however, oppesed to it adding an ending, where something like Shepard getting out alive or the Mass Relays not being destroyed along with the Reapers taken care of. To me, that would cheapen the experience and the story as a whole. Even without downloading it, it would still be a case of "Shepard made the ultimate sacrifice, so the galaxy could finally be rid of the Reapers" or "Shepard accomplished nothing(not having the Mass Relays destroyed)/lived to the end of days happily(walking away alive), not really having to sacrifice that much"). To me, the ultimate sacrifice should have the ultimate reward(as it does now) and resonates perfectly with the theme of self-sacrifice.
I realize as well, that I probably can't change your opinion regarding the ending either, I'm just trying to make my position clear. I do appreciate you taking the time to read through me, SajuukKhar and synobal's posts, even if you don't agree with them(as I've done, with almost all posts in this thread). This is a debate forum and open discussion about things is what it's all about, even if you don't agree with all the viewpoints.
Hey Guys, just made an account to post here 
I personally liked the Synthesis ending, and I think that's the "correct" one, if there's any.
The fusion between organic and synthetic life into a new hybrid form of life for everyone, is a thing that implies a lot of things, while also being "the final evolution of life" (as the Catalyst said).
This probably already answers questions like:
- "What did X and Y races eat while stuck on Earth?" - Why eat? Maybe they don't have that weakness anymore.
- "How will races get back to their homeworlds if the Mass Relays are destroyed?" - Since it's the final evolution of life, I think it's safe to assume that everyone's intelligence has greatly increased. Therefore, going back to other systems is just a matter of time - Mass Relays can be replaced with something else. The scientist will probably achieve this in 100 too 1000 years, who knows? In that time, there's plenty of ships or planets in the Sol System that can be colonized. And I really doubt the Mass Relays exploded like the Alpha Relay on "Arrival" (destroying a star system) - it was some other kind of explosion.
The galaxy entered a revolutionary era of peace, free from the Reaper/Rebel synthetics threats.
--
But there are things I DIDN'T like about the end, such as:
- Why was the Catalyst so vague in everything? Why didn't he explain? You know, like Vigil on Ilos? Those were some really awesome revelations. Shepard didn't even ask him anything. There were so many important questions that needed answers, yet they didn't have this dialogue. And they weren't running out of time or anything either. Shepard had to choose a path based on his judgement, barely knowing any info about... anything.
- Is he an AI? Yes, he must be. This implies other lots of things that you can't question him about.
- Why did he appear in that cheesy ghost child form (at least to Shepard)? Wouldn't it have been more awesome if there was something else, bigger, instead of him? Like a supercomputer or... maybe not an AI, how about a big creature or life form?
- Why was he so powerless to do anything else better than his solution? Because he didn't have the Crucible? Well then how did he create the Reapers and stuff without it? Jeez.
- Why wasn't anything explained after the ending and it was left to assumptions for everyone? Sounds philosophical ? It's not. It's stupid.
People are right to question so many things that were left to assumptions.
You weren't even told what happened to many things in the galaxy.
The endings are all incomplete, unsatisfactory and really vague.
About that Dragon Age type of ending: it sucks. Having simple text telling you what happened to x and y over a picture is pretty lazy; might work for a book, not for a video game. BUT it would still be better than what we have now (nothing).
And, the worst thing is that your actions throughout the series matter only pre-ending. The endings are the same no matter what your decisions were. Wow.........
As much as I liked the idea of synthesis, I'm with the majority here, we really need other endings in some DLC or whatever.
Thanks for reading
I personally liked the Synthesis ending, and I think that's the "correct" one, if there's any.
The fusion between organic and synthetic life into a new hybrid form of life for everyone, is a thing that implies a lot of things, while also being "the final evolution of life" (as the Catalyst said).
This probably already answers questions like:
- "What did X and Y races eat while stuck on Earth?" - Why eat? Maybe they don't have that weakness anymore.
- "How will races get back to their homeworlds if the Mass Relays are destroyed?" - Since it's the final evolution of life, I think it's safe to assume that everyone's intelligence has greatly increased. Therefore, going back to other systems is just a matter of time - Mass Relays can be replaced with something else. The scientist will probably achieve this in 100 too 1000 years, who knows? In that time, there's plenty of ships or planets in the Sol System that can be colonized. And I really doubt the Mass Relays exploded like the Alpha Relay on "Arrival" (destroying a star system) - it was some other kind of explosion.
The galaxy entered a revolutionary era of peace, free from the Reaper/Rebel synthetics threats.
--
But there are things I DIDN'T like about the end, such as:
- Why was the Catalyst so vague in everything? Why didn't he explain? You know, like Vigil on Ilos? Those were some really awesome revelations. Shepard didn't even ask him anything. There were so many important questions that needed answers, yet they didn't have this dialogue. And they weren't running out of time or anything either. Shepard had to choose a path based on his judgement, barely knowing any info about... anything.
- Is he an AI? Yes, he must be. This implies other lots of things that you can't question him about.
- Why did he appear in that cheesy ghost child form (at least to Shepard)? Wouldn't it have been more awesome if there was something else, bigger, instead of him? Like a supercomputer or... maybe not an AI, how about a big creature or life form?
- Why was he so powerless to do anything else better than his solution? Because he didn't have the Crucible? Well then how did he create the Reapers and stuff without it? Jeez.
- Why wasn't anything explained after the ending and it was left to assumptions for everyone? Sounds philosophical ? It's not. It's stupid.
People are right to question so many things that were left to assumptions.
You weren't even told what happened to many things in the galaxy.
The endings are all incomplete, unsatisfactory and really vague.
About that Dragon Age type of ending: it sucks. Having simple text telling you what happened to x and y over a picture is pretty lazy; might work for a book, not for a video game. BUT it would still be better than what we have now (nothing).
And, the worst thing is that your actions throughout the series matter only pre-ending. The endings are the same no matter what your decisions were. Wow.........
As much as I liked the idea of synthesis, I'm with the majority here, we really need other endings in some DLC or whatever.
Thanks for reading
I know that the Crucible itself isn't a deus ex machina, but rather a MacGuffin. The Catalyst, however, pretty clearly was.synobal said:
I agree a bit, but I don't feel that was quite as central a theme as self-determination, survival, and keeping your humanity in face of evil and overwhelming odds, and the importance of overcoming differences and work together to accomplish a goal.
The problem is that the ending kind of pushes those themes completely out of the window at the last minute, and suddenly puts the Organics vs. Synthetics theme in square center without doing much of the philosophical legwork to get there. The effect is quite jarring.
No you cannot find a novel does this at least no modern novels. It may of once worked but readers have grown to recognize that for what it is. Lazy writing. These endings all work much better for a book, which may be part of the problem. Bioware tried to elevate the story telling of video games with their Mass Effect series, and thus the ending is much closer to something a novel would have than one of their traditional RPGs. Gamers as a whole I guess aren't ready for that or are just unfamiliar with that so this knee jerk reaction is happening. Given time Mass effect 3 will be seen as the best conclusion to a game series in gaming history I think.Cl0udz0r said: