Mass Effect: Thermal Clips vs Overheating

[Somebloke]

Apparently they DID experiment with a hybrid system, during development, but couldn't find a balance that did well in playtesting.

 

[kTrmnatr]

Overheat. I never really had any problems with ammo supply with the thermal clips system, and I think that the guns could have overheated a little more quickly in ME1 (though it was serious fun to equip the higher level heat sinks to pistols or assault rifles and have a bullet hose), but the overheat really made ME1 distinguish itself for me in terms of gameplay, and it made sense given the setting. I do really like the idea of a hybrid system though. Maybe they'll put it in ME4! xD

 

[Zen Toombs]

Not really, as in ME2 (I haven't played 3) I found myself running out of clips quite often which is partially why I hated the whole clip thing.

0.o Really? Because I can count on my hands the number of times I've run out of ammo with a gun other than in the final boss fight, and I usually only use one gun (sometimes more to better hit enemy protection, but I usually only use one gun). And that's over the course of 9 playthroughs, most on veteran or hardcore.

Huh, I guess I'm better at the game than I thought.

Anyways, back on subject. I was only suggesting a reduction of about one clip per gun, and add Mass Effect 1 style cooldowns when you run out of clips.

It would have also had the additional benefit of making Jacob's Loyalty mission less headscratchy and far more tactical, because they could reasonably make your enemies not drop thermal clips on that mission.

 

[Twilight_guy]

I like the overheating system. Honestly the thermal clip thing conflicts with core design decisions in ME2. You regenerate health but you need to pick up bullets. In the first game you essentially had infinite bullets. Regeneration health and not needing bullets seem to mesh more then regen health and thermal clips.

 

[cswurt]

Thermal Clips were made with idiots in mind.
People just aren't capable of controlling their own rate of fire to minimize heat buildup in their weapons.
A real life (sorta -- mean the plaers ) example of this is on Left 4 Dead 2. Almost anyone who jumps on a mounted machine gun will just hold the button down until the weapon overheats and becomes temporarily useless.

Why not just burst fire or break between groups of shots? Then you can use it indefinitely

 

[Supertegwyn]

I was wondering what peoples thoughts were on Thermal clips vs ME1s overheat system.
I also liked the fact that the speed of cooldown was an important factor when modding weapons. I was interested in what you guys thought though

I greatly preferred ME1's cooldown system.

I HATE the fact that after every battle in ME2/3, I need to run around the empty area looking for spare thermal clips for my Sniper Rifle (or whatever). Thermal Clips break game flow - cooldowns slow down people who use Assualt Rifles (and no one else).

And, come on, - who uses Assualt Rifles? They are far and away the worst weapon in the game. Heavy Pistols are better than Assualt Rifles. Submachine Guns in 2 and 3 are better than Assualt Rifles. There is no class that benefits from having an Assualt Rifle compared to other weapons.

Edit:
To people saying that "I liked the combat better in ME2/3, so I guess clips" - I say, clips had NOTHING to do with the better combat in ME2/3. I liked the combat better in ME2/3 too - and I would have liked it even better if I didn't have to backtrack for fucking Thermal Clips after firing my Sniper Rifle six times.

I don't know how you play Mass Effect, but unless you just run around spraying bullets at walls, I can't see how you would need to collect clips. There are so many it's not funny.

And no, Assault Rifles are not useless. Soldiers can rape face with an Assault Rifle, as can a Sentinel.

 

[Ordinaryundone]

Thermal clips, both in-universe and in-game. The idea behind the infinite ammo was nifty, but it seemed a little silly in the same universe where people have shields, armor, and possibly be protected by a psychic barrier. MORE shots isn't going to be as effective as ones that can punch straight through.

Plus, it made the fights much more interesting when the answer to every situation wasn't "Heat Dampeners+RT=Win"

 

[ElPatron]

That being said, in real life I would prefer unlimited ammo, that shit would be cash

I disagree. Reloading has to be the most aesthetically pleasing part of battle.

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

I don't know how you play Mass Effect, but unless you just run around spraying bullets at walls, I can't see how you would need to collect clips. There are so many it's not funny.

Two words: Sniper Rifle.

Most sniper rifles in ME3, and all but one Sniper Rifle in ME2 used one clip PER BULLET. If I head-shot nine enemies with one bullet each, I then need NINE CLIPS to reload.

That was a serious pain in the ass. Both my Infiltrator and Soldier were sniper specialists. Having infinite ammo in ME1 was VASTLY superior. ME2 and 3 KEPT the long wait between shots, made worse by having to leave scope-view to reload, but have none of the advantages.

Shotguns (for my Vanguard and Sentinel) have the same problem, just slightly less so (unless you like using the Krogan Shotgun, then the problem is identical).

 

[halfeclipse]

Overheating.

Stick a couple Frictionless Materials on it then turn around and fire forever! Dakka, Dakka, Dakka

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Clips, the overheating system was a huge fucking annoyance.

So pausing for 5 seconds so your gun could cooldown was more of an annoyance for you than running out of clips and having to switch from the gun you were comfortable with to a gun you were uncomfortable with until you found some more f*ing clips. o_0

Yeah, combat pacing was fucked up. With the clips, it's frantic, and also requires you to think and prioritise a little - especially if you're sniping. Presumably you don't play many shooters if you find running out of ammo annoying.

Well no I don't play many shooters, but I can't imagine it being any less annoying even if I did; it would just be a matter of getting used to it. And I would still think that any opportunity to avoid that annoyance, even if it meant pausing for 5 seconds while your gun cooled down, would be welcome. ...or is it more a matter of "It's different so therefor I hate it." Come on, be honest.

Not really, as in ME2 (I haven't played 3) I found myself running out of clips quite often which is partially why I hated the whole clip thing.

0.o Really? Because I can count on my hands the number of times I've run out of ammo with a gun other than in the final boss fight, and I usually only use one gun (sometimes more to better hit enemy protection, but I usually only use one gun). And that's over the course of 9 playthroughs, most on veteran or hardcore.

Huh, I guess I'm better at the game than I thought.

Anyways, back on subject. I was only suggesting a reduction of about one clip per gun, and add Mass Effect 1 style cooldowns when you run out of clips.

It would have also had the additional benefit of making Jacob's Loyalty mission less headscratchy and far more tactical, because they could reasonably make your enemies not drop thermal clips on that mission.

Or maybe I just suck, that could be it too.

 

[Uncle Comrade]

I don't know how you play Mass Effect, but unless you just run around spraying bullets at walls, I can't see how you would need to collect clips. There are so many it's not funny.

Two words: Sniper Rifle.

Most sniper rifles in ME3, and all but one Sniper Rifle in ME2 used one clip PER BULLET. If I head-shot nine enemies with one bullet each, I then need NINE CLIPS to reload.

That was a serious pain in the ass. Both my Infiltrator and Soldier were sniper specialists. Having infinite ammo in ME1 was VASTLY superior. ME2 and 3 KEPT the long wait between shots, made worse by having to leave scope-view to reload, but have none of the advantages.

Shotguns (for my Vanguard and Sentinel) have the same problem, just slightly less so (unless you like using the Krogan Shotgun, then the problem is identical).

This, so much.

It always seemed to happen at the worst possible moment too, forcing you to leave cover and run (usually straight towards the enemy) to grab some more clips. Highly frustrating.

Despite that, I think I still prefer the clip system, I just can't get my head around why Shepard would go on a mission with only enough ammo for about ten shots.

 

[Woodsey]

Clips, the overheating system was a huge fucking annoyance.

So pausing for 5 seconds so your gun could cooldown was more of an annoyance for you than running out of clips and having to switch from the gun you were comfortable with to a gun you were uncomfortable with until you found some more f*ing clips. o_0

Yeah, combat pacing was fucked up. With the clips, it's frantic, and also requires you to think and prioritise a little - especially if you're sniping. Presumably you don't play many shooters if you find running out of ammo annoying.

Well no I don't play many shooters, but I can't imagine it being any less annoying even if I did; it would just be a matter of getting used to it. And I would still think that any opportunity to avoid that annoyance, even if it meant pausing for 5 seconds while your gun cooled down, would be welcome. ...or is it more a matter of "It's different so therefor I hate it." Come on, be honest.

I enjoy hectic gunfights, a sense of scrappiness and desperation. The overheating side-steps that and dives straight into annoying. It also ruins any real sense of rhythm which reloading gets you in to.

It just sounds like you don't want to think about what you're doing or move about.

 

[Jitters Caffeine]

Thermal Clips just feel more satisfying. It also makes Caster classes more useful when every gun doesn't have infinite ammo.

 

[TheKruzdawg]

I think the overheat system, especially once you got the Spectre X weapons and the level X heat reduction mods, made late gameplay or a replay far too easy. The assault rifle can literally be fired infinitely without overheating, same with the shotgun.

I don't mind the clip system, but I hated in ME2 that slower firing weapons like shotguns and sniper rifles got shafted with a very small amount of ammo or clips before they ran out. I think ME3 balanced that a little bit better so that weapons weren't depleted as quickly, at least in my experience.

Both are fun, but I think the clip system is better suited to the more cover-based gameplay of ME2 & 3. Trying to stand and run around the battlefield without using cover similar to ME1's gameplay is a great recipe for suicide in the sequels.

 

[w9496]

I prefer clips.

It makes sense why they would switch from infinte to finite, at least from a real life perspective. Overheating can cause many problems for a weapon, like poor performance and even barrel deformation. By limiting the ammo with thermal heat sinks, you avoid the possibilty of such accidents.

On another note, reloading just feels cool in the middle of a firefight. And Zaeed wouldn't have been able to kill that Blue Suns guy so awesomely without them.

 

[nothingspringstomind]

I loved the switch to clips from a lore perspective because it was technically based on maths.

The codex entry points out it was originally a Geth invention because they analyzed the data from firefights they'd had with organics and determined that the winner was statistically the side who could get more shots downrange, the quickest.

The clip system meant that a soldier could fire to overheat capacity, eject the clip, and fire again instantaeneously, thereby providing more covering fire for flanking units to take advantage of.

If you couldn't tell, it was stuff like this that really got me immersed into the world of Mass Effect. The kind of thing that shows the developers really think about how to justify game changes they implement for the betterment of gameplay.

 

[DeMorquist]

Didnt read.....Overheating...nothing was more annoying then in ME2 when I was so used to...ya know...try not to hold down the fire button to LOLFIREFIREFIRELOL!

 

[RyoScar]

I prefer thermal clips, I hated the overheat system in Mass Effect 1, welcome change.

 

[Ticonderoga117]

I like both systems since they are pretty much the same thing. Fire all the "rounds" and you need to reload in clips. In cooldown, fire in short bursts and you will never "overheat". Both are awesome. Switching between them... less so.

Conrad says it best in ME3. Basically it's along the lines of "Wait, we went from an ok system with nigh-unlimited ammo, to one used a hundred years ago. What?"

I just think it doesn't make much sense from that perspective for a change like that based on the universe.

Honestly, if someone came up to me and offered two guns, one had unlimited ammo but overheated versus clips, I'd take unlimited ammo. You would never be in the "Oh God, I ran out of clips! Which technically aren't bullets but part of the barrel to the gun so I can't just let it cool by itself!"