You seem to be inferring meaning that isn't there. All this means to me, personally, is that the oft-used argument that women are a small minority (especially among RPG players), and should therefore not be prioritized, now holds even less water.Keoul said:
Well then this thread is filled with nothing but lying, perverted gamers cause I know you have all done both of those, be you man or woman. We're just a bunch of lying perverts. I wouldn't call someone who gambled 2 years ago, a gambler. I wouldn't even call someone who bets $20 on the super bowl every year a gambler. I wouldn't call someone who played a game 2 years ago, a gamer. I wouldn't call someone who once told a lie (or even lies on an average of once every 5 years at that) a liar. If you think looking at someone naked makes you a pervert, art colleges must be a really creepy place for you. Has someone who has been sober for 2 years still an alcoholic in your eyes?erttheking said:
Did you miss the part where I said that you can drop the habit? Because I did say that. Wait, you were saying that we called a person who played a game once and then never again a gamer? I'm pretty sure that isn't where we were going with this.Savagezion said:
No, I saw it and acknowledged it but it only served to steer around that specific hyperbolic scenario. If you drop the habit you are not a gamer anymore. If someone no longer lies all the time would you go around calling them a liar because they used to be? Ditto with all the other scenarios? Dropping the habit IS dropping the title. "I used to be" a gamer is way more accurate. I am currently starting a new DnD campaign. I mentioned it to my buddy who is going to play about it and his wife heard us. Her exact words were "I used to be a big DnD nerd when I was younger" and proceeded to tell me about all the stuff she had and how much she played. However, I wouldn't tell someone that she IS a DnD nerd.erttheking said:
A) When did GGers post this and claim that (at least I didn't see it here)?Gethsemani said:
How do you know? Do you regularly ask all of your colleagues, your neighbours, your doctor and dentist and dog-walker?Silentpony said:
I agree with this sentiment, though not the specifics. As far as companies go, while the term "gamer" makes for a good tag to a market segment, is really ineffective. The main reason is that gaming as a past time has become mainstream enough that you can't be looking at it strictly from a "these people are gamers, and these people are not." The moment you get into that kind of thinking, you end up making definitions on thin air as to what constitutes a "real" gamer and what doesn't, which often ends with people saying things like "this is not a real gamer" vis-a-vis another person's gaming habits. If any of the executives listened to what some of the people here considered "real" gamers as their barometer for making business decisions, the industry would be a lot smaller and you'd see a lot less content being made, since you'd have less money invested into it, and less companies would crop up to make new content.rhubarb_j said:
i think it's general disdain/fear of the current trend pushing for social justice (excuse the term, can't think of anything better / more neutral at the moment) in games. heavily skewed statistics like this make the situation look in a way that it quiet isn't and can be used for justification of pushing more "serious" non-social games gaming (again, sub-optimal term, but i can't think of something better) into a direction that many (myself, as a girl, included) is harmful to the quality of games.RedDeadFred said:
I get the sense it has a lot to do with fear. Mostly that there is a fear whereas they used to be the core audience that the industry serves. With this kind of shift, they might not be the most profitable demographic to serve anymore, and they fear that as a result, more of the money in the industry will be spent on catering to other players. And lord knows that if there is one thing people can't stand, it's the idea that this "other" group might now have more stuff than they do.Kathinka said:
I don't see how that could happen since any game developer would look at these statistics and realize what the numbers are coming from. Also, I'm not really sure what you mean by using a poll like this to push games in a direction that is harmful to their quality. Are you saying that they might start sexualizing men a lot more to try and appeal to the larger, female audience? I'm not saying you're wrong here (statistics are used to push harmful agendas all the time), just give me an example of what they might do. Maybe I'm just not very imaginative.Kathinka said:
oh no worries mate, my brain is all mushy today, i'm somehow having difficulties properly expressing what i mean.RedDeadFred said:
I'm all for more woman getting into gaming culture and communities. But that doesn't mean we include games that everyone knows mostly those who don't even consider themselves gamers play in massive numbers. Not to mention that if woman want more respect by the communities they have to earn it. I think that's the biggest issue that woman are having. They are expecting gaming culture to have the laws and rules that modern day governments force in reality. And that isn't the case. You want my respect as a gamer? Learn to wave dash and L-cancel and do well in a smash bros melee tournament. Post me up stats where you did extremely well in a online match of Quake or Unreal Tournament. Show me that your someone to actually care about and be respected as an individual, otherwise don't waste my time demanding for equality. I treat you the same way I treat men who don't have skill... like noobs. Lambs for the slaughter for those better.RedDeadFred said:
I think it's funny, personally. Watch these kinds of threads and see how long it takes for people to bring up casuals. Even in threads just about women who play games, the conversation shifts very quickly to casuals. Some people can't stop themselves.RedDeadFred said:
What's wrong with giving people a choice in what gender they play as? I personally find it more immersive to play as someone who is of the same gender as myself. I imagine that many female gamers feel the same way. Sure, not all (and maybe not you), but I'm sure it would be appreciated. And really, how much extra resources could that possibly require? Actually, this post has just given me another answer to question 1 in the OP. RPGs (especially of the Western variety) tend to let you choose your gender. Maybe women are picking these games more and more because they can better relate to their character.Kathinka said:oh no worries mate, my brain is all mushy today, i'm somehow having difficulties properly expressing what i mean.RedDeadFred said:
i agree that publishers are smart (and greedy) enough to check out any statistic they base their businesses strategy around very very closely. i don't really see it happening either. but the direction is a bit there.
as for what i meant with the development being harmful to the quality..maybe i can explain it better via an example.
when arma 3 was made, there was a relatively small, but very vocal and rather obnoxious group pushing hard for the inclusion of the female player models. now, in this case the devs stayed clear of that and stuck with male player models.
however, if this obnoxious and vocal minority gains more moment, maybe they'll be able to push devs into catering to their agenda, expending resources, budged and development time that could much better be used for game play improvements. rather than to shut up one nagging group that represents a small minority of the fan base.
i hope that example illustrated what i mean a little more clearly, sorry for the confusion earlier.
I didn't say that we should count those social/casual games that you are referring to. In fact, I said quite the opposite.Artaneius said:
Thinking about it, my mother probably plays more that I do at this point. My busy schedule prevents me from playing long gaming sessions as I used to. My mother has a very stressful job and has discovered that playing Plants vs Zombies in the evening relaxes her a great deal so she now puts in something like 1-2 hours per day playing that game.kasperbbs said:
