Men: Now a Minority in PC Gaming.

[Kathinka]

snip

tl;dr: it would be nice to have, but should be much lower on the priority list than say, more vehicles, equipment, map design, quality voice acting and so on.

For some games, I agree, it's definitely a low priority. For others, I think it's really high up. For example, imagine not being able to choose your gender in an Elder Scrolls game. That would be blasphemous at this point. I think RPGs should always allow for this choice, unless of course the narrative is strongly built around the character being male (i.e. the Witcher series). If I was forced to play as a women in Skyrim, I honestly would enjoy the game less. For me, RPGs are about getting immersed in the game world and playing as a character who is a different gender than myself partially breaks that immersion. It's simply because since I am a man, I am going to better relate to my male character. Who knows though, maybe that's just my personal preference and it's not actually as big of a deal to people as I think.

agreed. RPGs, at least that sort that lets you shape your protagonist to your liking, must have it, it's such an essential choice. the majority of RPGs have it i guess, and that's a good thing. other RPGs do fine without it. Planescape Torment, perhaps the greatest RPG of video game history (at least concerning storytelling) had a male-only protagonist and did perfectly fine. But the whole story was built around his character, I don't really see how they could have made him female.
but yeah, as a general rule: gender choice in RPGs: very good thing.

but in things like say, shooters or real time strategy, i'm totally ok with an all male cast, and that doesn't make the developers privileged sexist cis scum.

 

[cleric of the order]

Your heard that right folks, men are now a minority in PC gaming. According to a study by SuperData Research, 50.2% of all PC gamers are women.

That number spikes up to 53.6% for RPGs and 57.8% for Mobile games.

On the flip side, 66% of all FPS and MMO players are men.

Personally, I think it's a good sign that the PC Game Market has achieved an almost-equality in the gender distribution.

It also brings about an interesting change in perception of gaming as an activity, usually seen as "Something nerdy guys do" it's nice to see that the reality is rather more different. Whilst it has been the case for a long time that men and women seem to be more prominent in certain genres that other, it's nice to see the figures that finally support that.

However, I do caution that this is only one study and suggest people consider a number of sources before forming a firm overall opinion on the matter.

For those still reading, a few questions:

1. Why do you think more women play RPGs than men?

2. Why do you think more men FPSs than women?

3. Mobile, Social or "Casual" games are included in these numbers, do you think they should be discounted, if so, why?


Now, to any men reading the thread, I'll be handing out minority cards for you to use at your leisure. (Please don't hurt me female overlords, I'm joking.)


Source: Here! [http://www.gameranx.com/updates/id/24894/article/women-play-more-pc-games-and-rpgs-than-men/]

This does not seem legit, mobile games I understand but RPGS is odd.
I'm not good at the peer review or any of this nonsense but a minimum of a 1000 sample size seems off
What defines the RPG in this sense, what were the questions asked, whom and with area group did they ask>
Where is the raw data, what are the age groups, can this be confirmed?
I don't know really, it seems very light for a formal positivist study but I don't have a lot to work with in both my experience with these sorts of studies and their published work.
I don't want to research this so I'm going to say, more time and patience is needed to be sure and this smells like some grade A cow pats.
>linked to gaming blog Owned by the company that owns time warner published this study.
No, no thank you, I doubt this study greatly.
Give time this will be proven to be correct or not anyway.
That being said it would not surprise me for most parts, the rpgs surprise me.
Also it's pretty nebulous what makes an rpg, perhaps If they included the sims and other life games then I can for sure expect the numbers to be that high.
But rpgs are weird.

The question of why men prefer Fps seems like a not much of a question if you would forgive my bluntness.
Men have greater preference for action, violence and the like.
Frat boys enjoy the FPS quite a lot.
FPS are competitive which if i am not mistaken men tend to prefer those sorts of games by nature.
I remember women not having eyes as adapted to detecting and responding to movement quickly but are able to see shades of colours deeper then the male can.
This is the sort of thing you could talk up a tree with the amount of conflicting but oddly harmonious information facts and figures laid out in lock step.
And a lot of it works under the banner of sexual dimorphism.
Sorry for the large spiel I've just been amassing data in that area and I've never been able to shut up about it when i get the chance.

The mobile games part is weird and I think that It should be discounted if we are doing with PC gaming, I mean if it's a mobile game then it's not a PC one. On top of that people don't take into account the time spent playing those games. For all we know it's little more then 10min on the subway.
Actually yeah I'd like to see a man hour split between men and women gamers, now that could be cool. Also a good indicator of ... something.

Oh and thanks for the Minority card, it feels good to have one.

 

[Aaron Sylvester]

Yes, well done for gathering utterly meaningless and generic statistics and file everything from toddler with an iPhone to an EVE Online addict under "gamer".

Doesn't change the fact they are exactly that - utterly meaningless and generic statistics that are of no use to anyone, especially not gamers, game developers or publishers. Why even bother with trying to use statistics like this to hide the truth?

Lets see a breakdown of gender with all categories/genre of games. Good luck finding that because no company wants to reveal those numbers.

It's like The ESA all over again.

 

[medv4380]

Your heard that right folks, men are now a minority in PC gaming. According to a study by SuperData Research, 50.2% of all PC gamers are women.

That number spikes up to 53.6% for RPGs and 57.8% for Mobile games.

On the flip side, 66% of all FPS and MMO players are men.

Studies that don't report the Margin of Error, or sampling methodologies can't, and shouldn't be trusted.

What was reported when you follow the link trail to the original article is that it's several different studies that generate those figures.

With a minimum of 1000 sample size your Margin of Error is at least +-3%, if not higher, so the females ratio being at 50.2% means nothing because the MOE overlaps so solidly that women being ahead could easily be a measurement error.

Mobile could be a sampling issue which is why methodology, and selection process are important. If it is anything it probably has a bit to do with Facebook clicker games being so dominant on the mobile platform. Those games are made to appeal to women because facebook has a lop sided male to female ratio in favor of women. So when the games move from Facebook to Mobile their audience moves with them.

For First Person Shooters I'd just point out the very simple real world statistic that Men are 4 times more likely to buy a gun than a women. I'd expect games about guns to have the same, or similar lop sided value. However, I'd still question their sampling methodology even though it meets my expectations.

RPG's could be nothing more that MOE, or Sampling issue, but if it were something then I'd say it may have a bit to do with RPG's vanishing from most platforms. Bravely default was one of the latest to try and breath life back into the genre, but since it wasn't release everywhere so it's going to reflect the population of Nintendo's audience more than the population at large.

Also RPG is a vague term. There are Western RPG's, JRPG's, Action RPG's, CRPG, Turn Based RPG, Strategy RPG, and so on. Women might not make that distinction since a lot of that is married to the past when male gamers made up a much larger population. Does the guy who likes Turn Based Strategy JRPS's say he likes RPG's, or does it answer Strategy instead? This is why disclosing methodology is important. We'd know if they took this into account, or not if they had.

 

[JUMBO PALACE]

Games are games, regardless of how "casual" they are.

Anyway, it's hardly a minority. Having near identical representation is not the same thing as being a minority.

I don't know about this. If we were talking about the prevelance of women in tabletop games like DandD or Warhammer and the data included people who play Candyland you probably wouldn't think they were comparable.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

It never fails to impress me how fervently, how stridently some "gamers" push back against studies like this. As if it affects them in any way.

Games are games. Full stop. They may be good games or they may be bad games, but if the creator of a games says it's a game, then it's a game. And we can argue whether it's a good game or not.

But it doesn't make it not a game. As much as don't like spunkgargleweewee, I'm never going to call it "not a real game" because that'd be ludacris.

 

[runequester]

I am curious why people are so busy hating on people playing browser games. They're more advanced than the NES games people grew up with, but I don't see people running in circles declaring that 8 bit gaming is "Not true gaming".

Why are people so afraid at the idea that someone out there is playing a game you don't happen to like?

What makes you "hardcore" enough? Why would that matter at all?

I know people who only play one game, but play it for hours every day. Others play a hundred games a month but only spend an hour or two on each.

What about people who only play video games? Who only play PC games? Who only play one genre of PC games?

What about people who play Call of Duty on the weekends but spend most of their time on casual games?


Give me a clear definition of the term "gamer" and we can have this discussion for real. Until then, it's just a lot of people yelling.

 

[Keoul]

You seem to be inferring meaning that isn't there. All this means to me, personally, is that the oft-used argument that women are a small minority (especially among RPG players), and should therefore not be prioritized, now holds even less water.

No no I agree, the argument that "Women are a small minority" really doesn't hold water.
But now I feel like you're trying to flip the tables. Instead of saying something like "Women no longer a minority in gaming" or something to emphasis how girls are no longer a minority, you're trying to make it seem like guys are the small minority now.

Maybe it's just me but the whole thing rubs me off the wrong way like you felt oppressed (can't think of a better word) before and now you want to be the oppressors.

I mean personally I don't think anyone should give a shit about the percentage, everyone goes on an on about how games are catered to males and it's a male dominated industry but if over 50% of the gamers (in America at least) are girls then the industry really doesn't have a problem product wise right? Girls do enjoy the games that are being pumped out. That's just my two cents on the topic though.

 

[Something Amyss]

pfffft like hell you have.

Funny, that was my thought when you claimed you got good grades on the subject.

Lulz, So let me get this straight, you say that this survey is valid and yet when I question you about it, you refuse and throw rude remarks.

Except for the part where none of that's true. I indicated the sample size was sufficient, something that is true. I did not say the survey was valid. To that end, I even said you were free to question the methodology. I mean, I assume these are terms you're familiar with, since you cited your credentials and all that.

But just to restate, I didn't speak to anything in the study other than its sample size.

Sorry, it sounds like you're on the SJW wagon.

You twisting my words puts me on the SJW wagon? I would think I would have to do something to merit that, but eh.

I think it's funny, personally. Watch these kinds of threads and see how long it takes for people to bring up casuals. Even in threads just about women who play games, the conversation shifts very quickly to casuals. Some people can't stop themselves.

And then the whole `but I have never met a female gamer!` thing. That's always a funny one.

I'd like to think that most people would either like more women gaming or are neutral on it. It'd be pretty damn weird to not want women to play games, but I have run into some people like that before.

Well, in fairness, men are never, ever casual gamers, right?

 

[Something Amyss]

I am curious why people are so busy hating on people playing browser games. They're more advanced than the NES games people grew up with, but I don't see people running in circles declaring that 8 bit gaming is "Not true gaming".

Browser games are a subset of "games I don't play." Therefore, they get limped into the set of "not real games."

 

[Phasmal]

Well, in fairness, men are never, ever casual gamers, right?

It's true, we don't seem to have to rush into any discussion concering male gamers and add `But! but! - CASUALS` like we apparently have to when talking about female gamers.
Maybe what we need is some sort of international service so that these people who apparently haven't met any female gamers can meet one. They pay us some money, we show up and say hi to them once and then disappear forever and they can no longer use it as a complaint on the internet.

 

[Vigormortis]

That's because that's not what any of us mean when we use the term PC gamer. When people identify themselves or others as PC gamers, the last thing on their mind is a person who plays social games.

Perhaps not, but that doesn't necessarily negate the use of the term for those who game on a PC but don't routinely play "core" games.

We can argue, until we're both blue in the face, over what differentiates a "true" video game from a "fake" one, but I'd like to think that we can both agree that anyone using a PC to play video games (on a regular basis) is, by definition, a PC gamer.

If we can't agree, that's fine. It just means we have differing opinions on the definition.

 

[LittleJoeRambler]

It seems like it's a problem moreso with the terminology than whether or not Farmville-type games are "real games." The term "gamer" for most of its life has had an "enthusiast" implication that doesn't really apply any more. Nowadays, "gamer" simply means "one who plays games" and has largely lost the enthusiast connotation as games started coming on less and less dedicated platforms.

The best analogy I can think of would be for cars. Much like "gamer," you could use the term "driver" for anyone that drives a car. However, there's a distinct difference between me and, say, my brother, who could reasonably be called a gearhead. I own a car and drive it everyday; to me, cars are a tool to solve a problem and little more. To my brother, they are fascinating pieces of engineering, technology, and even works of art. He tinkers with them, he's rebuilt or helped rebuild several of them, has several magazine subscriptions for car magazines, and does his own mechanic work. Sure, we're both "drivers," but he's also a gearhead, and it's oversimplification to simply refer to him as a driver. We're not on the same level of time, money and passion investment; not even close.

Likewise for games, there are what we've termed "casual gamers" and "hardcore gamers," but the term "gamer" itself is still a little muddy. If I'm waiting in the doctor's office, I'm way more likely to play Hay Day on my phone than to read some magazine from 1998, and so is my wife; we'll both use games as a tool to pass the time while we wait for something else. The difference between us is that when I get home, I'll fire up my $1200+ gaming PC and play Battlefield/Skyrim/Minecraft/Starcraft II, whereas she'll queue up a show on Netflix on her laptop. I'll also come onto a game forum to talk about it, watch Let's Plays, Extra Credits, Zero Punctuation and Errant Signal; I seek out articles on new gaming tech or game analysis. I care about games as a teaching medium and as a form of artistic expression, one that uniquely allows for interaction with the art; my wife uses them as a time passer. You're not wrong to call us both "gamers," but there's a huge difference in our time, money and passion investment, so it's oversimplification, just like "driver" and "gearhead."

What we need is for the term "gamer" to become ubiquitous, and to get a more distinct term for "gaming enthusiast," 'cause that just doesn't roll off the tongue well.

 

[Savagezion]

Well, in fairness, men are never, ever casual gamers, right?

It's true, we don't seem to have to rush into any discussion concering male gamers and add `But! but! - CASUALS` like we apparently have to when talking about female gamers.
Maybe what we need is some sort of international service so that these people who apparently haven't met any female gamers can meet one. They pay us some money, we show up and say hi to them once and then disappear forever and they can no longer use it as a complaint on the internet.

Nah, I would say we did exactly that when CoD got big and every publisher under the sun was trying to cater to the CoD audience. (Who is mostly male. Everyone considers a CoD gamer a casual here. We all know there are people who strictly play it and maybe another shooter on the side like Destiny or Titanfall. But CoD holds a fanbase that has zero interest in anything that isn't CoD or CoD-like in nature. The phrase "Go back to CoD" means we will do exactly that to other men. Especially considering CoD's fanbase are primarily guys in their mid 20s.

 

[Loonyyy]

Your heard that right folks, men are now a minority in PC gaming. According to a study by SuperData Research, 50.2% of all PC gamers are women.

That number spikes up to 53.6% for RPGs and 57.8% for Mobile games.

On the flip side, 66% of all FPS and MMO players are men.

Studies that don't report the Margin of Error, or sampling methodologies can't, and shouldn't be trusted.

What was reported when you follow the link trail to the original article is that it's several different studies that generate those figures.

With a minimum of 1000 sample size your Margin of Error is at least +-3%, if not higher, so the females ratio being at 50.2% means nothing because the MOE overlaps so solidly that women being ahead could easily be a measurement error.

Mobile could be a sampling issue which is why methodology, and selection process are important. If it is anything it probably has a bit to do with Facebook clicker games being so dominant on the mobile platform. Those games are made to appeal to women because facebook has a lop sided male to female ratio in favor of women. So when the games move from Facebook to Mobile their audience moves with them.

For First Person Shooters I'd just point out the very simple real world statistic that Men are 4 times more likely to buy a gun than a women. I'd expect games about guns to have the same, or similar lop sided value. However, I'd still question their sampling methodology even though it meets my expectations.

RPG's could be nothing more that MOE, or Sampling issue, but if it were something then I'd say it may have a bit to do with RPG's vanishing from most platforms. Bravely default was one of the latest to try and breath life back into the genre, but since it wasn't release everywhere so it's going to reflect the population of Nintendo's audience more than the population at large.

Also RPG is a vague term. There are Western RPG's, JRPG's, Action RPG's, CRPG, Turn Based RPG, Strategy RPG, and so on. Women might not make that distinction since a lot of that is married to the past when male gamers made up a much larger population. Does the guy who likes Turn Based Strategy JRPS's say he likes RPG's, or does it answer Strategy instead? This is why disclosing methodology is important. We'd know if they took this into account, or not if they had.

If you look up the company reported to have done the study, they detail all (And it's a flood, because they have the methodology and terminology for every sort of study they do) of their methodology on their website. The actual study isn't reproduced there, I'm not sure where you'd actually get your hands on it, and as usual, journalists, bloggers, and "news" sources seem to be reporting from an abstract or press release, and don't link to the study in question, or include useful data. *Sigh*. People's reporting of science sucks.

 

[Something Amyss]

It's true, we don't seem to have to rush into any discussion concering male gamers and add `But! but! - CASUALS` like we apparently have to when talking about female gamers.

Well, you don't expect a single standard, do you? That would be unfair, don't ya think?

 

[Doom972]

That's because that's not what any of us mean when we use the term PC gamer. When people identify themselves or others as PC gamers, the last thing on their mind is a person who plays social games.

Perhaps not, but that doesn't necessarily negate the use of the term for those who game on a PC but don't routinely play "core" games.

We can argue, until we're both blue in the face, over what differentiates a "true" video game from a "fake" one, but I'd like to think that we can both agree that anyone using a PC to play video games (on a regular basis) is, by definition, a PC gamer.

If we can't agree, that's fine. It just means we have differing opinions on the definition.

Then we can't agree. Farmville isn't a PC game. Feel free to dismiss it as an opinion if you want. I just gave you an honest answer.

 

[Leoofmoon]

yeah this data collection is very flawed in more ways then one, they don't really list things right and they arn't saying ow many of them are Facebook games or phone game. Hell they put console into one.

 

[Verlander]

Games are games, regardless of how "casual" they are.

Anyway, it's hardly a minority. Having near identical representation is not the same thing as being a minority.

I don't know about this. If we were talking about the prevelance of women in tabletop games like DandD or Warhammer and the data included people who play Candyland you probably wouldn't think they were comparable.

Well, that's kinda your problem right there - "comparable". The survey never said that the games were comparable, just that they fit into the definition of computer game. I think that's for the best too... you can play browser versions of Street Fighter 2 or Altered Beast nowadays, and some of the microtransaction facebook games are more complex than the original God games. And sure, people are playing Candy Crush, which is annoying, but Tetris is just another puzzle game like that. There's no strong distinction of what is a so-called "real game" or "casual" game at the moment, beyond those that play them.

No it isn't. If I cook a Pot Noodle am I a Chef? If I go to see 3 films in a year am I a film buff? If I check my Farmville once a week for 10 minutes am I a gamer. No.
But even by the logic that they are, it still makes NO sense why this survey would matter. After all people who just play Facebook games and Kongregate are playing a completely different type of game, since they're Free to Play they are not bringing any money into the industry or helping it's growth because most of them don't CARE about the gaming industry. The audience for big triple A releases and Facebook Games are clearly different, so why are they being grouped together like this? This is like grouping together Rugby League and Rugby Union players just because both games have, "Rugby", in the title.

I feel the need to mention I don't care if someone likes to play Facebook games, I really don't care what people do with their free time. However a person who occasionally puts 10 minutes into Farmville isn't a gamer. With that also said I should acknowledge that there is a growing number of Female gamers, I'm good friends with a few, however that doesn't mean that when someone pushes a survey so obviously flawed as this I won't insult it.

Well, for a start I never claimed what a "gamer" is, just that games are games... a Pot Noodle is food and a film is a film. My personal definition of gamer tends to be someone who willingly chooses to play games as a leisure activity, in which case the "casuals" ARE gamers. If you go by the logic that a gamer is someone who is an enthusiast, and follows the industry outside of simply playing games, then you have a point. It's an opinion either way, is what I'm saying.

As for the money thing... I'm sorry dude, but you're wrong. Casual games, even F2P games rake in a metric fuckton of cash. That's where the industry lean towards micro-transactions comes from, it's a direct impact on high end titles that began life in casual games. You don't have to like them, I sure don't, but regardless of our opinions the playing habits of these women (and men) is incredibly important to the growth of the industry. Is it more important to growth than AAA gaming? No, but that doesn't mean it's worthless.

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

You misunderstand. I don't consider someone who played a game two years ago once to be a gamer. I consider someone who plays games on any regular basis, even if it's just once a week, to be a gamer. Even if it's just farmvile.

My argument got all mixed up, that's the only point I was trying to make.