This looks horrible, slow to navigate, and near impossible to use if you have more than 20 programs.
Why the fuck are they naming them apps now?
Why the fuck are they naming them apps now?
Microsoft Making Waves With Tile-Based Interface in Windows 8
- Thread starter Tom Goldman
- Start date
Judging from the interface, I had better get a free touch screen desktop/laptop with any purchase of Windows 8. I'm perfectly content with 7 as it is. This tile layout looks too damn cluttered. I like my simple list of icons and the ability to dig through my laptop to keep everything organized.
Like some before me have said on this thread. I hope that there is the ability to disable the tile interface.
Even then...why bother upgrading? What could really be that pressing to make drool over the new OS. I already use 0 of the "astounding" features of 7. It's just a faster, less buggy, sleeker, Vista to me.
This whole touchscreen thing the world is obsessed over grinds my gears. I'm all for customization, and moving in a new direction, but I don't like the idea of following a strictly gimmick based OS. Not appealing.
Like some before me have said on this thread. I hope that there is the ability to disable the tile interface.
Even then...why bother upgrading? What could really be that pressing to make drool over the new OS. I already use 0 of the "astounding" features of 7. It's just a faster, less buggy, sleeker, Vista to me.
This whole touchscreen thing the world is obsessed over grinds my gears. I'm all for customization, and moving in a new direction, but I don't like the idea of following a strictly gimmick based OS. Not appealing.
So someone bought himself an ipad and then then next day went: "Guys I had this amazing design idea! And it did not at all come from anyone else, and me using the word app all of a sudden is also pure coincidence!"
And if you are copying someone else atleast see why they do it as they do, tiles filled with text is a horrible messy idea, pictures are distinguishable at first glance text is not, it's 2000 and bloody 11 get your design cues sorted out.
And if you are copying someone else atleast see why they do it as they do, tiles filled with text is a horrible messy idea, pictures are distinguishable at first glance text is not, it's 2000 and bloody 11 get your design cues sorted out.
"For those still using a mouse and a keyboard" Seriously Microsoft? There's only maybe a whole 5 percent or less of Desktop users who don't use a mouse or keyboard. Touchscreen PC's aren't that popular, and those who have them prefer using a mouse and keyboard anyway.
Love the ergonomic keyboard too. Looks like they expect us to pick up a 30 inch monitor and type with our thumbs on the side -_-. I like the tile interface, really I do. But it shouldn't be the entire operating system. It should be more of a Windows 7 Utility you can charge for or a different Windows 7 Version. I have enough problems with Windows Media Center, so how do you expect me to fit my whole computer into it.
Love the ergonomic keyboard too. Looks like they expect us to pick up a 30 inch monitor and type with our thumbs on the side -_-. I like the tile interface, really I do. But it shouldn't be the entire operating system. It should be more of a Windows 7 Utility you can charge for or a different Windows 7 Version. I have enough problems with Windows Media Center, so how do you expect me to fit my whole computer into it.
I really appreciate your knowledge of the subject and you can take it for granted that you have a level of technical competence far greater than my own.RAKtheUndead said:
I can attest(not personally) that well over 2000 years ago, they didn't have calculators or precise measurement tools of any sort to check on their work, but people calculated Pi to umpteen decimal places and used it to prove some lovely theorems. And they did some fantastic things with geometry
It doesn't mean that people who don't understand trigonometric functions are lazy, or intimidated beyond the operating interface. It just means that people clever at maths were doing it then and people who are slightly less clever at maths use them now.
Basicallly, my Mum wasn't using those computers you so helpfully pointed out, people clever at computers were because computers weren't very mainstream. They have become better, more mainstream and more people use them. Yet ordinary people who I know and interact with on a daily basis still find it difficult or confusing. I don't appreciate you (accidentally) calling them lazy or irrationally intimidated by some deep freudian revolution.
I do appreciate you embracing technology that reaches those people
Problem with that solution is it keeps your "closed" programs mixed with open ones on the task bar. (btw, Quick Launch isn't third party. The system still supports it, but you have to go through 4 menus to make it active, and none are very clear.).Serris said:
The whole "pin" mechanic is interesting, and I know many that use it, but I like my bar organized from left to right: Start Button->QuickLaunch->Open Programs->System Icons. Windows7 does not allow that set up without a lot of research on where they buried options that were normally a rightclick away.
Getting the old Windows XP Start menu (when you click start) is what requires a third party mod.
Disclaimer: I work for Microsoft, although I'm not involved with the Windows team. The only information I have about Windows 8 is what I've gotten through public channels. Any opinions shared here are mine and mine alone.QUINTIX said:
With this said, I love the demo, and the other videos and information that are flying around today. Seeing how the "Metro" UI that so totally rocks on the Windows Phone is going to translate into the larger screen is damned exciting.
To me the Win 7 -> Win 8 move seems very similar to the DOS -> Windows move. Lots of users who were never very comfortable with DOS said "Finally! Something that is simple enough for me to use it!" And lots of users who were very comfortable with DOS said "Who needs this crap? The command line is all I will ever need!" and went on using the command prompt in Windows. I expect that people who love the Start menu and desktop of Windows for the last 15+ years will go on using and loving that UI. I also expect that people who have been wondering if they should buy an iPad or an Android tablet will look at this and say "Oooo.... it's a fondleslab AND a real computer at the same time!"
I wonder how long it will be before we start to see iPad hardware running Windows 8?
Did he really just use an onscreen keyboard...? An onscreen keyboard...?!
I mean, seriously? It looks fine for a smart phone or a tablet, but NOT a desktop computer. I don't want to be constantly holding my arm up to the screen when I could just use a mouse. Touch screen is not the way of the future, it's just a future-esque technology. And apps being the major feature on the start screen? I'm almost embarrassed to have watched that.
I mean, seriously? It looks fine for a smart phone or a tablet, but NOT a desktop computer. I don't want to be constantly holding my arm up to the screen when I could just use a mouse. Touch screen is not the way of the future, it's just a future-esque technology. And apps being the major feature on the start screen? I'm almost embarrassed to have watched that.
DAMMIT MICROSOFT! I like the start button. I dislike how even things like the new look of the control panel make it so much more difficult to operate.
Just look at the Keyboard guys. While in the long run it's better to change, we likes what we has now! How about selling an update that fixed all the things wrong with the current OS systems? I bet it'd sell just as many.
Just look at the Keyboard guys. While in the long run it's better to change, we likes what we has now! How about selling an update that fixed all the things wrong with the current OS systems? I bet it'd sell just as many.
Either dude is Godzilla or he was using a six inch screen. Those little flicks of the wrist are probably not going to carry over well to a mouse and a 19+ inch LCD.
And that start screen? Ewwww. How's that gonna even work for blind people? Or the sighted people struck blind by the gaudy new shell? There's an idea! I'd turn on the "I'm blind you morons" accessibility options if it'll revert things back to something less ugly.
I think MS just wants less programs to support. No more phone interface vs. desktop interface! It's all one shell!
Also, I think I'll leave this here: http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/G/gorilla-arm.html
And that start screen? Ewwww. How's that gonna even work for blind people? Or the sighted people struck blind by the gaudy new shell? There's an idea! I'd turn on the "I'm blind you morons" accessibility options if it'll revert things back to something less ugly.
I think MS just wants less programs to support. No more phone interface vs. desktop interface! It's all one shell!
Also, I think I'll leave this here: http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/G/gorilla-arm.html
Ugh. G%*$"*£mit. Microsoft, stop stealing the ideas I've had for years but never told anyone about, then making them look stupid with your half-assed implementations.
Eh. Kidding. Sort of.
I've had a lot of UI ideas over the years, mostly because the 'windows' concept annoys me (Not Windows as in Microsoft windows. But the core UI idea; The one that is the common feature of Macs, Linux X-window based systems, and pretty much 99% of all GUIs ever made.)
I've seen various groups implement ideas like mine over the years though, with limited success, which helps refine the concept in my mind by virtue of where those implementations don't work that well.
(Blender contains a UI concept similar to something I devised years ago... But, that's a moot point when you consider I never implemented or even wrote down the idea. - Just goes to show if you're thinking of something, chances are someone else is having similar thoughts.)
Eh. Kidding. Sort of.
I've had a lot of UI ideas over the years, mostly because the 'windows' concept annoys me (Not Windows as in Microsoft windows. But the core UI idea; The one that is the common feature of Macs, Linux X-window based systems, and pretty much 99% of all GUIs ever made.)
I've seen various groups implement ideas like mine over the years though, with limited success, which helps refine the concept in my mind by virtue of where those implementations don't work that well.
(Blender contains a UI concept similar to something I devised years ago... But, that's a moot point when you consider I never implemented or even wrote down the idea. - Just goes to show if you're thinking of something, chances are someone else is having similar thoughts.)
I'm all for advancing computers and UI, but advancing doesn't have rip out often used items. I'm going to step through your stuff though for my rebuttalauronvi said:I am going to pick out a few choice vocabulary words that you used to try and make a point. Don't take this personal.PxDn Ninja said:
traditional, should, old.
All of this language is referring to the past. Go talk to some senior citizens and they will tell you all about tradition, what should have been and the old days. I would venture instead of fighting a losing battle and trying to get Microsoft to make what you, the minority, want and embrace the changes and learn the new systems.
These are all the new features that will make PCs better than they currently are.
Icons, get rid of them. I never use them. I right click my desktop and uncheck view > Show desktop icons. When I do IT work at peoples houses, the desktop is always a mess with icons everywhere and this is because organizing them takes unnecessary work and they are so small that trying to find something in even 20 different icons can be a chore.
Make touch standard. The mouse is quickly becoming obsolete as a pointing device. So much now that I spend time on my Droid phone, I want to be able to use my finger on the screen instead of reaching for the mouse. Keyboard is still the most efficient form of input based solely on the fact that it gives feedback letting you know you pressed a button.
Customization. Since they haven't shown everything and this is one of the real first looks at Windows 8, I can venture a guess and say that those square tiles won't all be the same size and will be completely customizable as oppose to say, everything being stuck either in the start menu or a task bar.
I am just asking people instead of "reacting" to just sit and think about what IS possible for change and not just stick with what you are familiar with. How can computing and UI get better if we just make everything the same year after year.
I want a Stark computer and I want one yesterday!
Simply reading over this thread alone I think it's safe to say I'm not in the minority. A majority of the people here alone dislike the idea of these tiles and touch screen. I would love to see market research stating that something like this is what people want on their desktop PCs.
Many many people use Icons, especially in the business world, just for quick access to often used programs. Personally I use the quicklaunch bar instead, and even on Windows7 the pin option is available. Defaulting them to off with a popup asking if you want them on, or vice versa would easily be acceptable.
This is tricky. If you mean make it the standard way to interface with your PC (which is what they are pitching 8 as being for, not a mobile platform, but a PC platform), then I disagree. Making it a standard option sure, but until we have a 3d display we can interact with without physically touching anything, the Mouse and Keyboard approach is pretty much here to stay. Touch is a great supplement to it, but not a replacement.
This I agree with completely! However I want the option to keep what I'm familiar with and add in the new stuff I like, without the old. They show in the vid that the old 7 shell will still be available, so give me the option to run with just that and I will have no problem with windows8. HOWEVER do not bury that option within dozens of obscure menus. Make it a simple option when you install. "Do you want to use the classic layout or the new Windows8 layout".
I think about what is possible all the time. My job has included UI design, interface design, and implementing advancements on existing systems so all of this has been before me from a dev standpoint, and every time we have to consider "How will our existing customers feel about this? Will they want the old system, or will the new one allow them to adapt without a feeling of chaos?" Microsoft doesn't seem to do this. They create new systems and throw out all the stuff that would connect the old with the new.
When it comes out I will be interested in seeing how they attempt to address these issues if they do.
In the end, you can have your windows8 (as it stands now) and I'll keep wishing they would have an XP mode
How does this work with the 99.9999% percent of the population that doesn't own a touchscreen monitor? The mouse would make this unwieldy What about the weird people like me who multi-screen? Why would I want to touch-type the screen when my keyboard is already here?
Also, Dvorak. It needs support for Dvorak.
Also, Dvorak. It needs support for Dvorak.
Oh please no...
Seriously, I absolutely loathe every move that Microsoft makes towards obscuring the underlying functions of the computer from me, the user who knows what he's bloody doing - if that... abomination of a desktop OS interface isn't something you can firmly turn off forever and ever (amen), I may have finally reached the point where something Microsoft has done was enough to make me genuinely consider just switching to bloody Linux.
On the other hand, I could probably just keep 7 around since, while it is certainly annoying sometimes trying to find the stuff they don't think I need to see, it's definitely less loathsome than the prospect of a computer OS designed for stupid people (or just really lazy people) and no one else. I'll probably do that.
Seriously, I absolutely loathe every move that Microsoft makes towards obscuring the underlying functions of the computer from me, the user who knows what he's bloody doing - if that... abomination of a desktop OS interface isn't something you can firmly turn off forever and ever (amen), I may have finally reached the point where something Microsoft has done was enough to make me genuinely consider just switching to bloody Linux.
On the other hand, I could probably just keep 7 around since, while it is certainly annoying sometimes trying to find the stuff they don't think I need to see, it's definitely less loathsome than the prospect of a computer OS designed for stupid people (or just really lazy people) and no one else. I'll probably do that.
What the fuck is this!? If I wanted my computer to only be able to do what my smartphone does, I'd just use my fucking smartphone and save some cash.
Every OS has been like that, though the actual feature removal probably started when ME halfway ripped out DOS mode even though it was just as DOSsy as 98. (And then did the same thing to their knowledge base, thanks Microsoft.)Gildan Bladeborn said:
We're the sorts of people who made the "Windows 7 God Mode" trick so popular even though it's just a bunch of control panel options in a searchable list format. Problem is, we're not most people. We spend the first few hours after a Windows install customizing the system so it's usable for us, configging a different browser, installing our must-have apps, finding replacements for any must-haves that don't work on a new OS, etc. Most people spend the first few hours waiting for the Acer/HP/Dell/whatever installer to finish installing Norton/McAfee/whatever plus some free games, promotional offers, and AOL!
I wonder how much of a resource hog Windows 8 will be, from what I'm seeing probably a lot. I have a feeling they are just trying to streamline their OS so they only have to make one for phones, tablets and PCs...*sigh* good from a business standpoint but not consumer. Well unless you're one of those consumers that don't care to fiddle with your computer down to its very soul