OuroborosChoked said:
In my experience, Noise is represented by groups like: Negativland
I sure do love me some Negativland. I would personally consider them more "sound collage" then "noise". But that's just debating semantics. They are what they are.
But here's where there's a failing, I think, in this thread. I saw your debate with somebody about whether or not noise is music. But nobody has defined "noise", yet. Are you talking about just recording noise and pressing play? Because I would agree to that not being musical in nature. Or are we talking about Noise music? Because there is such a genre as noise music, which can be very beautifully composed. I'm not sure how one could debate that noise music doesn't fit every definition of music that one could make. Perhaps you both need to lay out your definitions of "noise" and definitions of "music" so you can make sure you're on a level playing field. Perhaps that's why the debate exists, and you might find that the two of you agree more then you think.
To start off, I generally define music as "organized sound", to keep it extremely basic. Yes, I'm stealing that somewhat from Edgard Varèse, but I can't say I disagree with that logic. You can make that definition more complex if you want to, but for the purposes of this discussion, I would imagine that should sum it up fairly well.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not disagreeing with you or your fellow Escapist that you're arguing with, mainly because nobody has really defined what you're talking about, yet. So it's hard for me to figure out who's really saying what.
But I will agree with you that music is defined and that definitions shouldn't be forgotten when approaching a piece and trying to discuss it. But there is most certainly a genre that's been agreed upon that is called noise music. Whether or not that's what you're discussing is what I'm unsure of.
And to clarinetJWD, who started his argument with "I have a music degree". Give it a rest. When talking to somebody about music that would automatically make me want to disagree with anything else you might have to say, just because of the smug level that's inherent in that comment. I've been listening to and enjoying music for a very long time now. I'm not going to listen to somebody tell me that I'm wrong just because they have a piece of paper with a plastic frame.