Music Elitists

[The_Echo]

The only elitism I display on a regular basis is against what I consider "lazy" music. Songs that by a comfortable margin seem to have just been thrown together to score a quick buck, rather than actually feel like someone put their heart into it. (For me, a large majority of rap/hip-hop, post-2005 pop and dubstep qualify as lazy.)

I also have a tendency to dislike lyrics that date the song. Like, mentioning pop culture, current technology, etc. Something about music that's "timeless" in that sense really appeals to me.

 

[sXeth]

*Double snip*

There's also my personal favorite of the fact that wailing "Baby baby baby" through half a song is basically Robert Plant (Led Zeppelins) go to improvisational tool. It gets absolutely horrendous on some of the live work.

 

[Vault101]

By the way Vault, I've started listening to a new genre of RAP called "cloud rap" you know anything about that? Anything to recommend?

0_0...why no, I havnt heard of that

please..tell me more!

 

[Ishal]

By the way Vault, I've started listening to a new genre of RAP called "cloud rap" you know anything about that? Anything to recommend?

0_0...why no, I havnt heard of that

please..tell me more!

From what I gather and from what I've heard its rap, but laid back with the actual rapping toned down. Lyrics and rhymes are still important but its really chill. I'm still not completely sold on it, but its something I've listened to while studying and doing other stuff. Its good background music, very ambient with more focus on the music than other styles (imo).

Fav song so far is this.

 

[Fluffythepoo]

All music started going downhill after the phonograph

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

Em maybe I'm wrong but this comes off as a bit elitist. You keep mentioning that you like prog rock as though that adds to your argument and then say

AC/DC and Guns n' Roses are, by my definition, pop music. They write commercial, accessible music that follows the 4 chords, verse/chorus, three minutes structure.

It sounds like "If anyone should be elitist it's me, I mean I listen to prog rock." It doesn't sound like you're criticising elitism, it sounds like you're criticising elitists who don't have your superior music taste.


As to what makes indie music better than top 40 stuff. Well the stuff I listen to tends to be more personal. Jeffrey Lewis writes songs because he has something he wants to say that means something to him. But indie itself isn't automatically better, a lot of stuff is "underground" because it's awful. But at the same time I don't really look down on any music or films or books or tv shows because what's the point? I don't listen to the Violent Femmes, unable to enjoy it because I know someone somewhere is listening to Lady Gaga.

Good post. Firefly avatar. 9/10 would read again.

The OP undermines his own point by appearing a little TOO desperate to distance themselves from pop music while trying to defend it. If your defence was sound you wouldnt need to try and distance yourself since it wouldnt matter.

On that musical elitism sucks. MACRO musical elitism is annoying, my genre beats your genre but what REALLY GRINDS MY GEARS. WHAT REALLY REALLY. REALLY. WITH THE BLAZING INFERNO OF A QUADRILLION BURNING SUNS. GRINDS MY GEARS TO THE POINT WHERE THE FRICTION CAUSES NUCLEAR FISSION. Is MICRO elitism as i call it or "I heard about song X from a BETTER location BEFORE you did so NHEH". I mean FUCKING REALLY?! No one flies out of their mother singing song lyrics or knowing bands. You learn by your stupid friends or a stupid advert or a stupid movie or some stupid radio station. None are inherently "Superior" ways to hear about music.

Case and point youtube ANY song recently in an advert/tvshow/movie and watch the "Real fans" cry tears of pure ignorance and rage that people found out about their precious music AFTER they did ("fuck those guys after i hear a song i make it my goal to ritualistically deafen all of mankind so no one can hear it after me what a peasant i am the lord of music i am the final listener") or from a place they didnt ("MY FRIEND TOLD ME AT THE URINAL LAST YEAR AND YOUUUU HEARD IT ON TV SO IM A TIER 1+ A* EXTRA GOD AMAZING SHITS GOLD AND CRYS AMBROSIA FAN AND YOURE A PISS FILTH FAN BY COMPARISON")

If i could pick these people up and throw them into a super nova i would.

 

[Grottnikk]

I like music elitists. I like to pick them apart by making fun of their shit .

You like death metal? Really? I think all their lead singers sound like the cookie monster: "graaarrr! mwarrrr! CISFORCOOKIEGOODENOUGHFORME!"

Speed Metal? Oh, you mean polka-metal! Love that stuff, man!

You like emo? Naw, too easy

You've never met a music elitist in your life. Just as a little experiment, take that to /mu/ and see how it works out for you.

People in this thread seriously underestimating what these people are capable of. Nothing sways them. They're like autistic rocks.

Oh, I'm sure /mu/ is quite intimidating *shaking in boots - no really!*. However, I don't really give a shit if it sways them. I didn't say I was interested in changing their mind, just in fucking with them.

 

[ninjaRiv]

Why are you so worked up about it if you hate the fact that people get worked up over music? Sure, classic rock fans are a pain for that but leave them to it. What does it matter to you? Ah, I think I get it; you've been reading Youtube comments. You should stop that.

Besides, I think you'll find that the majority of elitism comes from the likes of Beiber fans. There's more of them, I think. This enrages some of tghe more vocal fans of classic rock. Of any genre, actually.

My CD collection includes Guns n Roses, Sage Francis, RHCP, Green Day, The Heavy, Atmosphere, B. Dolan, etc. So I see the crap that comes from most genres. I think Dubstep is the worst kind of shit but that doesn't make me wrong or right. I just have an opinion. Just like the people you're pissed at. Just like you.

I dunno, I think you're blowing off steam over something silly.

 

[ninjaRiv]

AS for Led Zepplin's album you mentioned, it's just plain better than a lot of stuff. I'm not even much of a fan. But taking Black Dog to illustrate you're point... They'd be a pretty shitty band if they didn't have fun songs. Besides all that, you only seem to be talking to the fans. Not everyone sees it as that great. Good, sure. It's opinion, sometimes it's strong. I tell everyone that Blood Sugar Sex Magik is the fucking BEST but it doesn't make me right, it makes me a RHCP fan, a passionate one.

I'm pretty sure the phrase that sums it up is "Deal With It." Don't read the comments on Youtube and just enjoy.

 

[MorganL4]

I point you to a article from my favorite website: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/118758-Science-Proves-Your-Grandma-Right-About-Pop-Music


Basically this......... More variety in the music by Zeppelin, than the music by Bieber....

 

[Waaghpowa]

My problem with pop music is that it generally feels artificial to me. Sure, they may be talented, but their music seems disingenuous as if they're doing it just for the money rather than try to spread a message. Music is powerful in the sense that it can spread an idea or message, and to not do that just seems like a waste to me.

This is a better version of "baby" by Beiber.

 

[JonnyHG]

I like music elitists. I like to pick them apart by making fun of their shit .

You like death metal? Really? I think all their lead singers sound like the cookie monster: "graaarrr! mwarrrr! CISFORCOOKIEGOODENOUGHFORME!"

Speed Metal? Oh, you mean polka-metal! Love that stuff, man!

You like emo? Naw, too easy

Myself, I like most music. I'll listen to most things except rap and country, but even then there are a few songs/artists from those genres I like (seriously, who doesn't like Johnny Cash)

Hopefully no one has posted this. I couldn't resist.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6kS0J58H1L0

 

[smithy_2045]

To elaborate on the video game analogy, I personally don't like twitch shooters. I don't have an amazing reaction time and like to play tactically so they're not really for me. That said, I think that the CoD games are a good example of some well polished and tight twitch shooters. I guess you could bring up the killstreaks as not promoting skill but now I'm going off on a tangent, so I'll just shut up.

I wouldn't really call CoD a twitch shooter. In my experience it's a game that rewards spamming bullets til the thing you want to kill dies, unlike say Counter Strike where a couple of well placed bullets will kill anything, so you'd better be on your guard. Of course, it's nowhere near Gears of War level spray and pray, so maybe I'm just projecting my biases onto my genre descriptions.

 

[launchpadmcqwak]

I think music can be bad. I don't just mean in a subjective opinion sense i mean just flat-out bad.

I haven't listened to the radio or 'chart music' in general with any regularity in my entire life. Therefore pop music and it's occasional complete and utter failure as a musical form fascinates me. Take Will.I.Am (even his name is slightly obnoxious) his solo/recent B.I.P. music is so unlistenable it serves as a useful study and dissection of how you DON'T make music.

"Check it out" for example is one of the least appealing things ever produced a human being;


It starts off with a wasted, straight lift sample of "Video killed the Radio Star" (a song that is actually an example of how to make GREAT pop music by the way) that really has no point being there apart from filling a void were they couldn't be bothered to put a hook. The original sections are even worse, they grind and bleep to the words "Check it out" over and over with no real redeeming quality. And Niki Minaj doing her usual non-singing and non-rap about 'haters' just adds another level of obnoxious to the whole thing. It's truly a work of unintentional genius, we can look at this and go "You see that? Yeah do the opposite of that"

I to am a musician, that does not make my opinion on music any more valid than any other persons opinion.

 

[launchpadmcqwak]

I think music can be bad. I don't just mean in a subjective opinion sense i mean just flat-out bad.

I haven't listened to the radio or 'chart music' in general with any regularity in my entire life. Therefore pop music and it's occasional complete and utter failure as a musical form fascinates me. Take Will.I.Am (even his name is slightly obnoxious) his solo/recent B.I.P. music is so unlistenable it serves as a useful study and dissection of how you DON'T make music.

"Check it out" for example is one of the least appealing things ever produced a human being;


It starts off with a wasted, straight lift sample of "Video killed the Radio Star" (a song that is actually an example of how to make GREAT pop music by the way) that really has no point being there apart from filling a void were they couldn't be bothered to put a hook. The original sections are even worse, they grind and bleep to the words "Check it out" over and over with no real redeeming quality. And Niki Minaj doing her usual non-singing and non-rap about 'haters' just adds another level of obnoxious to the whole thing. It's truly a work of unintentional genius, we can look at this and go "You see that? Yeah do the opposite of that"

I to am a musician, that does not make my opinion on music any more valid than any other persons opinion.

sorry mate, quoted the wrong thingy

 

[launchpadmcqwak]

Because I respect their skills as musicians, not just as artists.

To me, it's infinity harder to play a good guitar solo, live, with 3 or 4 other band members while staying on key, and all on the same 1,2,3 and 4's.

Opposed to standing on stage lip-syncing while your back ground dancer put more time in their work then you ever did.

Or earning your fortune by having the auto-tune squeeze your voice is such a way that even GLaDos sounds human.

I have respect for bands like Iron Maiden, still touring, still making great albums for more then 20 years, while current pop-stars are not artists, they're products.

You sir, have won the thread. This is the reason that music elitism and people like me, you, and the OP exist. I love Dream Theater and Pink Floyd to all hell, but I understand why people would not like them. I, like you, respect their music and the meaning of what it means to be a musician.

There's also the fact that I'm a violinist myself and good music is engrained into my bones. I hate pop music as it isn't musically sound. I can't listen to auto-tuned music and repetitive beats as my mind needs more. I NEED music with proper tone shifts. I NEED music with different takes on the scales. I NEED something that's rhythmically diverse. I NEED music that makes me feel.

I need them, as I cannot have my music any other way.

Oh sure, some people are going to still prefer pop music. Would I look at them like I'm inferior? No! Will I convict them of not getting the balls to go out of their safety net? Yes. There is good music out there that many people are flat out ignoring, and it makes me unhappy in a sense. Unhappy that because of them choosing to support the pop artists, I may not be able to enjoy and get more of what I like.

maybe...the pop music makes them feel something that your "challenging" music makes you feel?.

The other thing to consider is that I'm a musician, so I have a better understanding of what it takes to play better music. This is an argument I can't really bring up in real life before some idiot turns that into a whinefest rather than a logical, discussion.

I am also a musician, it does not make my opinion more valid than another individuals.

 

[thesilentman]

Because I respect their skills as musicians, not just as artists.

To me, it's infinity harder to play a good guitar solo, live, with 3 or 4 other band members while staying on key, and all on the same 1,2,3 and 4's.

Opposed to standing on stage lip-syncing while your back ground dancer put more time in their work then you ever did.

Or earning your fortune by having the auto-tune squeeze your voice is such a way that even GLaDos sounds human.

I have respect for bands like Iron Maiden, still touring, still making great albums for more then 20 years, while current pop-stars are not artists, they're products.

You sir, have won the thread. This is the reason that music elitism and people like me, you, and the OP exist. I love Dream Theater and Pink Floyd to all hell, but I understand why people would not like them. I, like you, respect their music and the meaning of what it means to be a musician.

There's also the fact that I'm a violinist myself and good music is engrained into my bones. I hate pop music as it isn't musically sound. I can't listen to auto-tuned music and repetitive beats as my mind needs more. I NEED music with proper tone shifts. I NEED music with different takes on the scales. I NEED something that's rhythmically diverse. I NEED music that makes me feel.

I need them, as I cannot have my music any other way.

Oh sure, some people are going to still prefer pop music. Would I look at them like I'm inferior? No! Will I convict them of not getting the balls to go out of their safety net? Yes. There is good music out there that many people are flat out ignoring, and it makes me unhappy in a sense. Unhappy that because of them choosing to support the pop artists, I may not be able to enjoy and get more of what I like.

maybe...the pop music makes them feel something that your "challenging" music makes you feel?.

The other thing to consider is that I'm a musician, so I have a better understanding of what it takes to play better music. This is an argument I can't really bring up in real life before some idiot turns that into a whinefest rather than a logical, discussion.

I am also a musician, it does not make my opinion more valid than another individuals.

*Shrugs* More power to you then. I don't mind if people like to listen to other music. I just get pissed when other people try to stop my enjoyment for them.

 

[launchpadmcqwak]

Because I respect their skills as musicians, not just as artists.

To me, it's infinity harder to play a good guitar solo, live, with 3 or 4 other band members while staying on key, and all on the same 1,2,3 and 4's.

Opposed to standing on stage lip-syncing while your back ground dancer put more time in their work then you ever did.

Or earning your fortune by having the auto-tune squeeze your voice is such a way that even GLaDos sounds human.

I have respect for bands like Iron Maiden, still touring, still making great albums for more then 20 years, while current pop-stars are not artists, they're products.

You sir, have won the thread. This is the reason that music elitism and people like me, you, and the OP exist. I love Dream Theater and Pink Floyd to all hell, but I understand why people would not like them. I, like you, respect their music and the meaning of what it means to be a musician.

There's also the fact that I'm a violinist myself and good music is engrained into my bones. I hate pop music as it isn't musically sound. I can't listen to auto-tuned music and repetitive beats as my mind needs more. I NEED music with proper tone shifts. I NEED music with different takes on the scales. I NEED something that's rhythmically diverse. I NEED music that makes me feel.

I need them, as I cannot have my music any other way.

Oh sure, some people are going to still prefer pop music. Would I look at them like I'm inferior? No! Will I convict them of not getting the balls to go out of their safety net? Yes. There is good music out there that many people are flat out ignoring, and it makes me unhappy in a sense. Unhappy that because of them choosing to support the pop artists, I may not be able to enjoy and get more of what I like.

maybe...the pop music makes them feel something that your "challenging" music makes you feel?.

The other thing to consider is that I'm a musician, so I have a better understanding of what it takes to play better music. This is an argument I can't really bring up in real life before some idiot turns that into a whinefest rather than a logical, discussion.

I am also a musician, it does not make my opinion more valid than another individuals.

*Shrugs* More power to you then. I don't mind if people like to listen to other music. I just get pissed when other people try to stop my enjoyment for them.

Sorry to carry this on..but when has anyone ever stopped someone from enjoying music?

 

[thesilentman]

Because I respect their skills as musicians, not just as artists.

To me, it's infinity harder to play a good guitar solo, live, with 3 or 4 other band members while staying on key, and all on the same 1,2,3 and 4's.

Opposed to standing on stage lip-syncing while your back ground dancer put more time in their work then you ever did.

Or earning your fortune by having the auto-tune squeeze your voice is such a way that even GLaDos sounds human.

I have respect for bands like Iron Maiden, still touring, still making great albums for more then 20 years, while current pop-stars are not artists, they're products.

You sir, have won the thread. This is the reason that music elitism and people like me, you, and the OP exist. I love Dream Theater and Pink Floyd to all hell, but I understand why people would not like them. I, like you, respect their music and the meaning of what it means to be a musician.

There's also the fact that I'm a violinist myself and good music is engrained into my bones. I hate pop music as it isn't musically sound. I can't listen to auto-tuned music and repetitive beats as my mind needs more. I NEED music with proper tone shifts. I NEED music with different takes on the scales. I NEED something that's rhythmically diverse. I NEED music that makes me feel.

I need them, as I cannot have my music any other way.

Oh sure, some people are going to still prefer pop music. Would I look at them like I'm inferior? No! Will I convict them of not getting the balls to go out of their safety net? Yes. There is good music out there that many people are flat out ignoring, and it makes me unhappy in a sense. Unhappy that because of them choosing to support the pop artists, I may not be able to enjoy and get more of what I like.

maybe...the pop music makes them feel something that your "challenging" music makes you feel?.

The other thing to consider is that I'm a musician, so I have a better understanding of what it takes to play better music. This is an argument I can't really bring up in real life before some idiot turns that into a whinefest rather than a logical, discussion.

I am also a musician, it does not make my opinion more valid than another individuals.

*Shrugs* More power to you then. I don't mind if people like to listen to other music. I just get pissed when other people try to stop my enjoyment for them.

Sorry to carry this on..but when has anyone ever stopped someone from enjoying music?

A lot of people don't like the stuff I listen to. A lot. Considering that all I listen to is Progressive and some Classical, I don't know what the fuss is. I was just referring to people not going out of their comfort zone and supporting the pop artists when money could go elsewhere. But again, that's nothing I can control.

 

[Something Amyss]

*Shrugs* More power to you then. I don't mind if people like to listen to other music. I just get pissed when other people try to stop my enjoyment for them.

Which still doesn't make the "I'm a musician" any less baffling.

A lot of people don't like the stuff I listen to.

And seriously, how has this stopped your from enjoying it?

I have a low opinion of most prog music, yes, but how is that preventing you from enjoying it? How is it actively oppressing you to know that? And why can I enjoy my music, knowing that you are not a fan, if you cannot enjoy yours?