The game gives you an ending where they all die and no one catches the killer, I guessTravis Austin said:
My Issues with Heavy Rain
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''We can't call it a game.''
So? I don't know if we can call it a game, but who cares? It's just a name. Technicly it is a game.
''Not enough gameplay''
There's gameplay all over the place. Even pressing a button to take orange juice out of the fridge is gameplay
''We can't call it a movie.''
So? We can't call it a book or a cake too. Does that mean that it's bad? Is that an issue?
''A movie has a set in stone plot.''
I don't get it.
''It sounds more like one of those old "Create your own stories book."''
Well...again, so? It is clearly not a book, but you can create your own story and where's the issue again?
''Now would we be willing to pay, what $60 dollars for a movie that could tell a better story?''
Again, it's not a movie. How much would you pay for DVD movie? Well, now imagine how much you would pay for a cinematic game that is longer than a movie, a game where you experience everything they see, you hear their stories, you can choose where the story goes. Damn, yeah, i would pay $60 for it.
''And in gameplay aspects, it sounds like one giant quick time event.''
No, just no. It is not a quick time event. Fahrenheit had quick time events when you were in action, but you had control over your character when not in danger.
So? I don't know if we can call it a game, but who cares? It's just a name. Technicly it is a game.
''Not enough gameplay''
There's gameplay all over the place. Even pressing a button to take orange juice out of the fridge is gameplay
''We can't call it a movie.''
So? We can't call it a book or a cake too. Does that mean that it's bad? Is that an issue?
''A movie has a set in stone plot.''
I don't get it.
''It sounds more like one of those old "Create your own stories book."''
Well...again, so? It is clearly not a book, but you can create your own story and where's the issue again?
''Now would we be willing to pay, what $60 dollars for a movie that could tell a better story?''
Again, it's not a movie. How much would you pay for DVD movie? Well, now imagine how much you would pay for a cinematic game that is longer than a movie, a game where you experience everything they see, you hear their stories, you can choose where the story goes. Damn, yeah, i would pay $60 for it.
''And in gameplay aspects, it sounds like one giant quick time event.''
No, just no. It is not a quick time event. Fahrenheit had quick time events when you were in action, but you had control over your character when not in danger.
From what I've seen so far, it's essentially a visual novel with QTE with normal graphics instead of anime style. I'm interested in it as I like visual novels, though I doubt it will be anywhere near as good as traditional Japanese ones are.
"Now would we be willing to pay, what $60 dollars for a movie that could tell a better story?"
It all depends on how much you're willing to spend for something you want. Plus, pricing is subjective to where you live. If you live in the US where games are $60, you don't know what being shafted is. Games in Australia generally cost $109.95 at most major retailers when they get released, which under current conversion rates is just under $100 US.
"Now would we be willing to pay, what $60 dollars for a movie that could tell a better story?"
It all depends on how much you're willing to spend for something you want. Plus, pricing is subjective to where you live. If you live in the US where games are $60, you don't know what being shafted is. Games in Australia generally cost $109.95 at most major retailers when they get released, which under current conversion rates is just under $100 US.
To those that are worried about Heavy Rain, its really impossible to describe. Play Indigo Prophecy, an earlier game the studio made, that's made in the same style as Heavy Rain, and then get excited for Heavy Rain like the rest of us.
(I believe that you can actually download Indigo Prophecy from xbox live now as an xbox original for like 20 bucks. For those of you who ever never played it, go download it....NOW!!!)
(I believe that you can actually download Indigo Prophecy from xbox live now as an xbox original for like 20 bucks. For those of you who ever never played it, go download it....NOW!!!)
My fella wants to buy this game just to 'see what all the fuss is about', and I'm with him on that but I do agree that it looks one expensive quick time event. I'm not a fan of lengthy cut scenes in games (no MSG4 for me then! Shame...) because they're usually flat and uninteresting so I can see myself grinding my teeth a bit about this one...
As for the idea of it, well... I like it. I used to love choose your own adventure and it'd be interesting to see how it plays out. Does anyone know if you get dialogue choices a la Mass Effect,or whether it'll just be 'press X to open door' and 'press circle to leave door alone' type stuff?
As for the idea of it, well... I like it. I used to love choose your own adventure and it'd be interesting to see how it plays out. Does anyone know if you get dialogue choices a la Mass Effect,or whether it'll just be 'press X to open door' and 'press circle to leave door alone' type stuff?
I loved indigo prophecy (I actually got Farenheight the European name for it). Yeah, the story was fucking insane, but god damn was it ever refreshing to play. It's nearly un-definable genre wise. And even though I find it takes a lot of cues from the old PC text adventures, it's very unlike them in many ways (like that it has graphics).elricik said:
It was just a game unlike any other I had played and I found that to be very exciting for me.
If it's anything like Indigo Prophecy you get dialogue choices, and these choices affect the story.afaceforradio said:
For instance in Indigo Prophecy you play all 3 main characters, including the killer. If you choose to hide the knife or not, that comes up later in the game when other characters are reviewing the file. All your actions affect the game, though to be honest there were only a few KEY choices that affected the larger plot.
However, if it's like indigo prophecy this game is ALL about the story and the characters and the choices you make. There is little "gameplay" such as combat or whatever.
Not necessarily automatically, but as a general rule, I'd say the stories in movies are better (or at least, currently handled better) than games.Pimppeter2 said:
Plot, pacing, charaterisation, and so on are controlled in a movie. That's not true of a game, unless you want to have cutscenes galore -- you can't really /make/ the player look at anything, or behave in a certain way (for example, some of the conversations in KOTOR after The Big Twist become unintentionally hilarious if you've turned to the dark side). Also, games are meant to be played, so IMO plot almost has to be secondary to gameplay. A good plot makes a good game better, but a good plot can't save a shitty game.
Okay, the fact is, you cannot weigh in on this game until you have tried the medium that it belongs to. And, if you wanted to know, there's only one other game that fits that medium. It's called Indigo Prophecy. If you haven't played it, go buy it for $5 off ebay, and play it. Trust me, it's from 2005, on the PS2, and it still beats Metal Gear Solid 4 for sheer cinematic brilliance. It never claimed (and for that matter, neither did Heavy Rain) to even be a game. The developers refer to both as "interactive movies," so, therefore, expecting it to be a game is rather silly. Indigo Prophecy's story is compelling, the characters are convincing, and nearly all of the motion capture is brilliant beyond any reasonable expectations. Not enough people played it, but it really set the standard for cinematic gameplay in a way that no game has yet to match. Now, admittedly, beyond that, the last... quarter of so of the game sucks, but it's one of those stories that was so intriguing at the beginning, the end had no way to be amazing... and near as I can tell someone dealing in the story boards decided it'd be best to make it suck instead.
As far as Heavy Rain is concerned, I have no doubts the ability of the game designers to portray the story will have diminished at all. In fact, I'm certain that it will be better thanks to improved technology and graphics. I'm just a bit iffy on the story. After having been a killer trying to discover why I killed a man and simultaneously playing as the cops trying to find me (a strange and slightly conflicting dichotomy to say the least). And, besides that, there's always the question if the characters will be as compelling. But I can't really judge that just yet.
The point being: try indigo prophecy. At the moment, the cheapest buy it now price on ebay seems to be $2.75, bit more with shipping. So, if you want to try Heavy Rain, and are uncertain about the "gameplay," try it's predecessor out.
As far as Heavy Rain is concerned, I have no doubts the ability of the game designers to portray the story will have diminished at all. In fact, I'm certain that it will be better thanks to improved technology and graphics. I'm just a bit iffy on the story. After having been a killer trying to discover why I killed a man and simultaneously playing as the cops trying to find me (a strange and slightly conflicting dichotomy to say the least). And, besides that, there's always the question if the characters will be as compelling. But I can't really judge that just yet.
The point being: try indigo prophecy. At the moment, the cheapest buy it now price on ebay seems to be $2.75, bit more with shipping. So, if you want to try Heavy Rain, and are uncertain about the "gameplay," try it's predecessor out.
A good example of not reading the thread and the many, many people who have already cited indigo prophecy. I, personally, suggest playing the original Fahrenheit on the PC as it didn't edit out the insanely graphic sex scene like the Xbox version did. It was actually like a porn game at that part.Abulurd said:
Here's my spiel on it. It's going to suck. I personally think QTEs are a bit annoying but whether you like them or not, if you're focusing on the buttons flying around your screen more than likely you aren't going to pay attention as much attention to the dialog or visuals, and telling a story is what this game is pretty much all about.
This was my opinion before I watched the video the second poster presented, which adds to my quips about it. In a story driven game you would want your game to have good voice acting and be aesthetically appealing (see MGS4) but this game has neither. All of the characters in that little section sounded horrible, and the lack of background music or detail made everything very dry and dull. The mouth movements look extremely awkward. The animations seem very detailed, but some of them look a bit too smooth, slow, and and unnatural, and movement in these instances looks very weak and dinky, like in GTA4.
As far as the actual gameplay goes, it looks fucking horrible, even by quicktime event standards. first of all, ALL the QTE buttons are the same color. And they vary in size, making them very small extremely frequently. This could make distinguishing buttons and movements rather difficult, and draws more attention away from the actual story. Also, what was that when he started walking around and all those little bubble windows popped up? that looks really awkward and complicated to manage, as well as being very aesthetically unappealing and overall not very fun.
Overall the concept as a whole seems like it's not for me, but the way that it's executed doesn't even begin to make up for it.
This was my opinion before I watched the video the second poster presented, which adds to my quips about it. In a story driven game you would want your game to have good voice acting and be aesthetically appealing (see MGS4) but this game has neither. All of the characters in that little section sounded horrible, and the lack of background music or detail made everything very dry and dull. The mouth movements look extremely awkward. The animations seem very detailed, but some of them look a bit too smooth, slow, and and unnatural, and movement in these instances looks very weak and dinky, like in GTA4.
As far as the actual gameplay goes, it looks fucking horrible, even by quicktime event standards. first of all, ALL the QTE buttons are the same color. And they vary in size, making them very small extremely frequently. This could make distinguishing buttons and movements rather difficult, and draws more attention away from the actual story. Also, what was that when he started walking around and all those little bubble windows popped up? that looks really awkward and complicated to manage, as well as being very aesthetically unappealing and overall not very fun.
Overall the concept as a whole seems like it's not for me, but the way that it's executed doesn't even begin to make up for it.
I really enjoyed the 1st 2/3rds of Farenheit (Indigo Prophecy) and so I'm buying this simply because of that.
I'm getting it. It piqued my interests. I've never played a game like it before; so I am very interested in playing it.
They don't necessarily have to have better stories.Pimppeter2 said:
However they usually do because video games must work the story around game play mechanics or at least be, in some way (even minimally) interactive.
Movies are a completely passive experience. You're strapped in and taken for a ride, start to finish. This allows the whole direction of the movie to be dedicated to perfecting narrative, writing, screenplay and acting.
Also movies can be based on mature subject matter without too much fear of being financially unsuccessful. Whereas games that do not include some kind of shooting, high speed driving, professional level sport and such do run that risk.
Think of it this way, a game about a white collar worker performing tedious everyday tasks until he or she has a mental breakdown would probably be terrible and almost certainly fail in terms of sales. However off the top of my head I can think of several decent movies (based on professional critical reviews and in terms of sales) that turn the mundane life/breakdown into a clever critic of middle class America.
That's not to say video games cannot make clever observations or convey a more subtle message than simply, "war is bad" or "arms races are dangerous". It's just that playing such hypothetical games would more than likely, be boring as all hell.
I'd rather not make a whole new post just to respond to someone's comment, especially when it's very close to my original post. I don't see what's so confusing about it.blue_guy said:
What exactly are you referring to with this comment? I don't recall Yahtzee talking about Heavy Rain for any significant amount of time. I do know that he occasionally mentioned Indigo Prophecy, and people do say that both of the games are very similar. So are you accusing people of judging Heavy Rain based on what Yahtzee said about Indigo Prophecy?starfox444 said:
Regardless, I didn't get my opinion form Yahtzee. I got it from my own observations of the articles and trailers about the game.
What exactly is new about Heavy Rain? I haven't seen much of anything I would consider to be truly innovative. The player's ability to interact with the game seems very limited, and the few available choices don;t seem to have much impact on the ultimate outcome of each situation. Other games have let players do this and had decent gameplay to back it up. If this is Heavy Rain's main focus, it needs to do a lot better than what I have seen.Mr.Black said:
Though maybe I am unaware of certain aspects of the game. Could you elaborate on what you find to be "new"?
My worry about the game is that it looks like it might descend into the "choose your own adventure" realm. If the developers find a way to make sure all the branching storylines still adhere to a central theme, then the game will truly be revolutionary. Otherwise it's just a high-tech version of that crap I used to read when I was 10.
The game is interesting and could be pretty revolutionary.
My main concern is that the gameplay is a huge deal of QTE. Think a QTE sequence that lasts hours. I can see why a concept like that could end in a poorly designed game, gameplay-wise... Like a new generation/more adult version of Dragon's Lair or the old FMV games.
My main concern is that the gameplay is a huge deal of QTE. Think a QTE sequence that lasts hours. I can see why a concept like that could end in a poorly designed game, gameplay-wise... Like a new generation/more adult version of Dragon's Lair or the old FMV games.
I still don't see how it's an issue. All one needs to do is scroll down a bit to see where I got the quote from. And I try to avoid making short posts when it's unnecessary, out of personal preference.blue_guy said: