Neverwinter Nevermore

[The Madman]

I've always been in the minority that prefers Neverwinter Nights 2 over the first, but that's also because I've always been more of a fan of singleplayer than multiplayer and as even the article points out; the singleplayer in the first NWN game was mediocre at absolute best.

Still if there's one thing that's ensured NWN 1 and 2 both always have a place on my hard drive it's the community modules. I've had more memorable and fun singleplayer rpg experience from those various modules than I have from any full-blown AAA rpg in years. And that the community for both NWN 1 and 2 continue to thrive and produce new content is testament to how good the games are as well as just... well, let's be honest here, how poorly the majority of newly released rpg support any sort of fan content.

Pity so few seem to know about the community however. Brilliant module like The Maimed God's Saga or Misery Stone I've always thought deserved more attention, they and many many others really are fantastic pieces of work.

 

[Gather]

Neverwinter Nights 1 and 2 still make a profit; a small one but it's a profit. Through word of mouth of these unique experiences friends and casual onlookers buy the game to see what all the fuss is about. While it is highly unlikely; interacting with the world to the level of depth NWN series offers can be such a captivating experience. Making unforeseen changes to the game world or actually becoming a "big bad" are two things that are almost impossible in the modern day MMO.

 

[Caffiene]

Just reinstalled NWN the other day, in anticipation of a particular NWN persistent world server some friends are just about done creating.

Sigh. I wish NWN2 hadnt so completely missed the point of the multiplayer.

The article mirrors my own thoughts. There just hasnt been an RPG with that degree of freedom since, and its a real shame. The way I phrase it is that everybody rushed headlong towards the profits they saw in MMOs... and completely forgot to look at simply "MOs". We have multiplayer, but only on a tiny scale - nowhere can you find a multiplayer RPG that will allow you to have 32 / 64 / 100 players. You play 2 or 3 person co-op, or play an MMO with thousands of strangers - those are your options.

Many of the mechanics that make up the appealing aspects of NWN seem to have become inextricably linked in the minds of developers with MMOs, when theres actually no need for it to be that way. "Persistent" play is seen as an MMO trait - you log in and the world is already happening around you; play continues round the clock after you leave, and the world keeps turning - but all it really needs is a basic server app with a small database system to save player variables, not some vast MMO server farm. More than a few players - we see it all the time for simple round based FPSs, and the communities that can be formed around them. Ive seen plenty of Call of Duty and Team Fortress servers which allow dozens of players at a time, where the players get to know each other; they hang out on forums and discuss up-coming ranked/clan matches, coordinate when theyre going to be online to catch up, and generally have a common community - you can drop in to the server at any time of day and see somebody you know. Again, theres no reason that needs to be unique to an MMO, yet for RPGs thats the only place youre going to find that situation.

It saddens me... its almost enough to get me to try and develop my own game along those lines, but I know how big of a task building an RPG is (especially solo).

 

[LackofCertainty]

I still play on the Neverwinter Nights persistant world servers from time to time. Prisoner's of the Mists. (PotM for short) is still my favorite by far. Gothic horror, heavy rp, with around 20 players online during the "bad hours," of EU/AU time zones. Active updates from devs to this day.

It's a shameless plug, but PotM deserves it. nwnravenloft.com for anyone who's interest I've sparked


And for anyone who's curious about how much the community has contributed to the game over the years, just take a look at CEP. (the Community Expansion Pack for NwN) It's sitting at around a Gig now, and it's packed full of... okay this is sounding too shameless even for me, but it's pretty darn amazing if you ask me.

 

[Ramith]

Antiworld for life!

 

[Madgamer13]

Greets!

I used to play on several NWN persistant worlds, true. The article is right about the sheer complexity of the multiplayer, all the worlds I played on were completely different from eachother in both in-game systems, lore and function.

I've played as a half-dragon, a heavily armoured arch-bishop of rightious death, a druid, a warlock, several vampires, a fallen angel and my greatest pride, but also greatest shame, a catgirl demon that shifts genders between herself and her captive host.

Oh the years I spent, the stories I've written, most of them lost with the passing of the NWN worlds. While I know many still exist and have players, I just dont have the will to form such stories and play in such worlds, not now, not after losing so many characters I have invested in.

Sure, I do ocassionally write the odd story nowdays, but never daily updates like I did years ago for these worlds.

Unfortunately for me, indulging in nostelgia with NWN now would only remind me of the years past and make me very sad, knowing that such games really are no more with the way gaming is developing.

 

[Joos]

<- made the NWN horse system.

You're welcome.

Thanks mate.

Funny I should read this article while I'm installing NWN2 to rejoin my old buddies at ALFA [http://www.alandfaraway.org/] again after a lengthy hiatus. ONWARDS!!!

 

[vxicepickxv]

Oh so that's what people mean when they say they love Neverwinter Nights. I played through the single player campaign a year ago and thought it was dull as sh*t. I had heard the multilayer aspect was what made it good. but I never realized the scope of it.

I'm almost a little curious to check it out now, is it still alive? Is it still any fun?

The game is I think 10 bucks at Gog.com, and there are still several multiplayer servers available.

I'm going to go ahead and plug 12 Dark Secrets, which I am a DM on.(It wouldn't be proper for me as a DM not to plug it). I started playing on that server late 2005 or early 2006 because it wasn't a PVP server. The servers(yes it sounds odd, but the game world is so large it's mapped over 3 servers) are still up and running, and the code does the best it can to overcome RAM limitations imposed by a 32 bit game system, and other limitations that were added via patches.

 

[Ross Tuddin]

I never played the first NWN and when i di buy the NWN2 the only way to get it to run was i had to physically disable the sound card on my computer. I never got more than an hour into the game as not having sound really spoils an experience for a game.

 

[The Random One]

Not to be 'that' guy (or kid more likely).

But the only game that has done the same giving up servers and multiplayer content creation to fans while not asking money beyond initial purchase is Minecraft.

Although admittedly not an RPG out of box. Many modders are busy inserting those systems.

Yeah, that's the problem, isn't it? There was a time when a dev could put a toolkit for creating new worlds in their game system and it would just be another bullet point, just a cool thing for the hardcore fans. Nowadays we only have Minecraft, a world where you need tens of mods to turn it into anything other than a pointless faffing around simulator, and while the mod support is admirable it does mean that there is no central game you can work on, mods can enter in conflict, and you need to understand programming to do anything anyone will notice, unless you're wasting time by creating a giant sculpture that can only be seen on a computer.

We used to get excited because we could create brand new things, now we get excited because we can slap blocks together. We embrace less and less freedom - magic crayons made of shit [http://www.bogost.com/writing/shit_crayons.shtml] - because the alternative is developers locking out mods so that they can sell you four weapons for fifteen dollars.

How far we've come.

 

[edos63]

This was the first RPG I ever played. Now I'm obsessed with the genre.

 

[Evil Smurf]

I love retro gaming, I bought Sid Meier's Alpha Centuri + expansion pack on ebay and love it heaps. I always had it on my computer, but lost the discs D:

 

[TallanKhan]

Im still very fond of Neverwinter Nights. It was far from a perfect game but it was a game that always tried, and where you could tell the developers had really pushed the enevelope to deliver an experience. Maybe it was wishful thinking but i felt like it really mattered to BioWare that i enjoyed the experience, not just that i brought the game and thats something that has been sorely lacking in recent titles across the industry.

 

[Albino Boo]

Yeah, that's the problem, isn't it? There was a time when a dev could put a toolkit for creating new worlds in their game system and it would just be another bullet point, just a cool thing for the hardcore fans. Nowadays we only have Minecraft, a world where you need tens of mods to turn it into anything other than a pointless faffing around simulator, and while the mod support is admirable it does mean that there is no central game you can work on, mods can enter in conflict, and you need to understand programming to do anything anyone will notice, unless you're wasting time by creating a giant sculpture that can only be seen on a computer.

We used to get excited because we could create brand new things, now we get excited because we can slap blocks together. We embrace less and less freedom - magic crayons made of shit [http://www.bogost.com/writing/shit_crayons.shtml] - because the alternative is developers locking out mods so that they can sell you four weapons for fifteen dollars.

How far we've come.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/browse/?appid=72850&browsesort=toprated

Hmm there seems to be 9610 entries there.

http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/categories/

Even if all the files on steamworkshop are duplicated there that is still another 9128 entries there.



http://fallout3.nexusmods.com/mods/categories/


http://dragonage.nexusmods.com/mods/categories/


Pretty sure modding RPGs is alive and well

 

[Blarkuntvhite]

I actually spent a lot of time playing Half-Life 2: Deathmatch because of the role-playing maps that some servers used. After a while you start making friends, and enemies.

It wasn't quite the experience described here, but it still felt special.

 

[Kahani]

Instead, modern MMOs have hewed to the example set by Blizzard's wildly popular and profitable World of Warcraft. That game, released in 2004, sent shockwaves through Neverwinter Nights' comparatively pint-sized online community. Those who investigated the realm of Azeroth returned describing a slickly professional space teeming with endless players and quests. The experience was diligently policed and controlled. There was none of Neverwinter Nights' barely bridled chaos; in World of Warcraft, any such dynamism was developer-produced.

So, how exactly is this different? A small number of people create a world that a bunch of other people play in. It's exactly the same as for NN, except done by professionals instead of hobbyists. I think where you go wrong is in calling WoW a single world. Sure, WoW is, but WoW is equivalent to just one of the mods for NN. If you want something different then you just play a different game, just as you could with NN. Far from taking anything away, MMOs are simply the logical extension of what people were trying to do themselves with the limited tools NN had to offer.

 

[Blood Brain Barrier]

Damn, this has once again reminded me how much Bioware has declined. Everyone should stop buying anything from Bioware until they make Neverwinter Nights 3, or something similar.