New Elder Scrolls Online Screens Emerge

Andy Chalk

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New Elder Scrolls Online Screens Emerge

More than a dozen new screenshots show off some of the environments that await in The Elder Scrolls Online.

Feast your eyes, as they say, on these 14 new screens that have emerged from The Elder Scrolls Online [http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/#screenshots], Bethesda's upcoming MMO based on its famous RPG franchise.

[gallery=946]

There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market. And without wanting to sound overly alarmist at this early stage, I think that may be a bit of a problem. Going by these screens, The Elder Scrolls Online may suffer from the same issue that plagues the Knights of the Old Republic games: It's set centuries prior to the original source material, yet nothing meaningful has actually changed.

That's not to say that these screens aren't reasonably pretty, or that I think The Elder Scrolls Online will be a sub-par game. I just hope that Bethesda is able to do something more with it than re-hash the previous games in a contrived three-way conflict.

The Elder Scrolls Online is currently expected to come out sometime in 2013.

Source: All Games Beta [http://www.allgamesbeta.com/2012/10/the-elder-scrolls-online-screenshots.html]


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Soviet Heavy

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The common problem of technological stasis in fantasy and science fiction. At least Star Wars has the whole technological dark age thing in its favor.

That doesn't stop me from criticizing Bioware's blatant copypaste Star Destroyers however. And neither will it stop me from doing the same to The Elder Scrolls.

This just looks dull. I think the biggest problem I've had with every ES Online image to date is that the lighting looks awful. It's got this ugly purple hue to it that just makes the sunlight look faded and weak, and it certainly does not help the bland looking textures.
 

Scars Unseen

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I said this game was a bad idea when it was announced, and this certainly doesn't change my mind. Most people that should be the target audience of this game don't want an MMO that vaguely resembles The Elder Scrolls series. They want a TES game they can play online. Unfortunately, early info points to ZeniO going after the same WoW crowd that no one else has managed to pry from Blizzard's cold clutching grip.

Best of luck on that.
 

kajinking

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Just me or does the art style looks way too...soft? Maybe not the best word for it but this looks like a Fable game not Skyrim.
 

jollybarracuda

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I dunno, it all just seems so...souless. They could have really done something unique with the genre, really tried to advance the medium in a meaningful way by having it play like an Elder Scrolls game, but online. I believe with enough ingenuity it could be entirely possible, with some sacrifices to immersion, of course, but it still could have been unique and stood out.

As it stands, it just seems like an average MMO with the Skyrim helmet and some dwarf bots floating around to give a reason to slap the Elder Scrolls logo on it.

I hope im wrong though, TES is a series I very much appreciate and if they could have a successful MMO game to bring in some money and new fans then that would be excellent.
 

omicron1

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Online, off-radar.

Seriously, though, does every MMO these days have to look like a Dreamworks film? There are no EDGES in these screenshots! No grit! No detailwork smaller than a person's thumb!

It's the same problem SWTOR had - like Star Wars, Elder Scrolls games have a definite feel to the artwork - and Playmobil ain't it. Compare the snowy Skyrim-esque screenshot to anything from Skyrim, for instance - the differences are immediate and glaringly obvious. Everything's rounder, smoother, dinkier. Sure, you can say it's stylized - but it's stylized in (in my opinion) the wrong way. Elder Scrolls games are about immersing yourself in the world. This? Looks like it's about immersing yourself in the hotbar.

That's not to say that different art styles are bad - but this one's definitely not overtly good. It just looks like an Elder Scrolls-themed version of Amalur - and I'd had enough of Amalur (and by extension WoW, SWTOR, WAR, and half a dozen other bloom-and-bevel-'em-ups) by the time I reached the swamp region.

(Yes, I'm aware I'm exaggerating somewhat; also that Oblivion had a penchant for very smooth edges, especially on stonework. I much prefer Morrowind's and Skyrim's art styles, though)
 

Andy Chalk

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Why set it centuries in the past? I mean Warcraft stayed in the current date for it's MMO.
kajinking said:
Just me or does the art style looks way too...soft? Maybe not the best word for it but this looks like a Fable game not Skyrim.
If I said I didn't see what you ment, I'd be Lion.
 

Fappy

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The ordinator made me smile, but that's about it. I am really surprised ZeniMax is going through with this after what happened to ToR.
 

blackrave

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Why does every publisher thinks that online is the final frontier, the peak of development and the Holly Grail?
There are settings that are fit for multiplayer, Elder Scrolls isn't one of those settings.
Like I said previously- good luck with that, but I won't play it.
But if it succeeds don't dare to go in Warcraft way- I'm still waiting for Warcraft4
 

Scars Unseen

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DVS BSTrD said:
Why set it centuries in the past? I mean Warcraft stayed in the current date for it's MMO.
The main reason is that -unlike with WoW and Blizzard- TES Online is not being made by Bethesda. Bethesda makes single player Action RPGs. This game is being made by Zenimax Online Studios or, as I like to call them, ZeniO. The game is pretty much set in the past because Bethesda already has plans for the TES series and doesn't need some MMO asshats fucking it up for them.
 

Absolutionis

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kajinking said:
Just me or does the art style looks way too...soft? Maybe not the best word for it but this looks like a Fable game not Skyrim.
I totally agree.

The Elder Scrolls series has thus far been literally gritty. Not 'dark'-themed or anything, but all the characters and locales were believably patched with dirt, dust, and such. The characters were believably worn-looking.

This MMO looks like someone suddenly invented ubiquitous showers and power cleaners... in the past.

It all looks too 'clean' and generic.
 

Mamzelle_Kat

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It looks very... gray.

I agree with pretty much all that's been said so far: doesn't look very different from current MMOs. One of the reasons that drew me to WoW and keeps me there is how distinctive its aesthetic is.

This simply feels bland and generic.
 

Storm Dragon

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From the very beginning, I have had no confidence whatsoever in this game. The first screenshots failed to impress me, and these ones aren't doing anything either.
 

Catrixa

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It took me awhile, but I think I finally know what bugs me about this game (based on what I've heard in news articles about it being standard-MMO-esq). I honestly think a co-op Elder Scrolls would have been a better choice, but I'm not in charge of making games, so what do I know?

I think it all comes down to what I'd want to do in an Elder Scrolls game versus what one does in an MMO. In an Elder Scrolls game, I start as a prisoner of something somewhere sometime (it really doesn't matter, but it seems they've got a theme going on here), but then I am let out/freed by a plot device. I then get to make a character in the world (a snarky thief, or a tanky mage, or a traveling merchant) and do whatever. Like, literally whatever. I can pick up most of the objects in the game (maybe I've rolled a traveling merchant with a goblet obsession, so I've taken up dungeoning in order to have as many different goblets as possible) and don't have to talk to a single NPC to have a meaningful experience. Sometimes I'll do quests, because sometimes I like to have goals, but I've spent hours on just inventory management and keeping the local Draugar population down. The ability to be whoever in a world that may need saving, but that I don't really have to save, is what makes TES fun for me.

MMOs, on the other hand, while still fun, are an extremely directed experience. How I imagine things going: I want to roll an Argonian, so I start in Black Marsh. I do some stuff for a village/area/city a few dozen times, until I am level X, then I move to the next area. Repeat this process until I am max level or high enough to take on the World Bads. I fight them. I win. I roll a new character, or craft, or do some PVP, or whatever they have as end-game content. The experience is entirely directed. I am not making a unique Argonian, I am making the same character as everyone else. Maybe they add in a little bit of choice (maybe it's more story-driven, like TOR) and now I'm making one of, say, 3 possible Argonians. While I don't mean to say this is a bad way of gaming (it's not, I really like MMOs. Even WoW, when people are being tolerable), it isn't what I launch an Elder Scrolls game for. I do not feel like I am roleplaying a character with a unique personality. I feel like I am moving through goal posts to reach the end of the game.
 

Fiz_The_Toaster

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I'm still confused as to why they thought this is a good idea, and I really don't think they understand the MMO space like they think they do.

I'm utterly underwhelmed by these screen shorts, yeah they look pretty, but it just looks...dead to me. There's nothing in them that show how lively the game will be or even the 'character' of the game.
 

Starke

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toobie said:
It reminds me A LOT of Amalur.
Honestly, Amalur looked better than this. It had a clearly designed storybookish aesthetic it was going for. There were nice sharp color contrasts, enemies popped from the environment, and so on. This? This is just kinda there. None of the attention to detail.
 

Hero in a half shell

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kajinking said:
Just me or does the art style looks way too...soft? Maybe not the best word for it but this looks like a Fable game not Skyrim.
I was trying to put my foot on why the aesthetics felt off, but you've got it perfectly.
It actually reminds me heavily of The Old Republics' style. I know they can't have it as graphics intensive as a normal game, because it has to run on crap computers, but it really loses some important atmosphere when the world isn't as breathtakingly real and the textures and polygons are worse.

The big problem that drove me away from my (really brief) time playing TOR was the absolute static nature of the worlds, nothing changed right down to the positions of enemies, because everyone you defeat or interact with has to also be open to every other player to interact with them. Nothing changes, and that kills the world faster than anything else. I know that the Elder Scrolls doesn't exactly have a good track record with a dynamic world, but at least it tries, at least there are some indications of change in the world. I haven't seen an MMO achieve that yet.

I'll keep track of it, maybe even give it a chance when it comes out, but my hopes aren't high.
 

Woodsey

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Both KotORs always felt quite noticeably different to me. TOR far less so. Yeah, they had the Sith Empire versus a Republic, but there was a greater mythology around that - stuff like the Mandalorian Wars - which differentiated it greatly.

Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I'm still confused as to why they thought this is a good idea, and I really don't think they understand the MMO space like they think they do.

I'm utterly underwhelmed by these screen shorts, yeah they look pretty, but it just looks...dead to me. There's nothing in them that show how lively the game will be or even the 'character' of the game.
There was an interview from one of the lead devs who said that nothing could be innovated within the genre anymore. Quote is in the first question:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/06/25/eve-online-devs-on-dayz-elder-scrolls-online-and-whatd-make-them-quit-the-games-industry/

So that's inspiring.
 

DugMachine

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There is too much Daystar in this thread. MY HEAD IS SPINNING

OT: Hmm seems like they're going for that gritty but cartoonish look? I'll probably try it out once it's out as I've been looking for a new MMO that's not GW2 or WoW
 

Fiz_The_Toaster

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Woodsey said:
Both KotORs always felt quite noticeably different to me. TOR far less so. Yeah, they had the Sith Empire versus a Republic, but there was a greater mythology around that - stuff like the Mandalorian Wars - which differentiated it greatly.

Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I'm still confused as to why they thought this is a good idea, and I really don't think they understand the MMO space like they think they do.

I'm utterly underwhelmed by these screen shorts, yeah they look pretty, but it just looks...dead to me. There's nothing in them that show how lively the game will be or even the 'character' of the game.
There was an interview from one of the lead devs who said that nothing could be innovated within the genre anymore. Quote is in the first question:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/06/25/eve-online-devs-on-dayz-elder-scrolls-online-and-whatd-make-them-quit-the-games-industry/

So that's inspiring.
Even though it sounds like every interview I've read about innovation.

Having said that, I hope they can pull it off since I'm assuming they're putting in a ridiculous amount of resources into the game. Maybe I just don't see why it has to be an MMO, but how knows? Maybe I'll be wrong and it will what the genre needs, but for now I just don't see it.
 

remmus

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meh, said it before, say it again, the instant it was made clear combat is going to be the same, boring select, auto-attack combat system that this genre seamed cursed with, it lost any semblance of being Elder Scrolls.
 

Odjin

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That had to happen. Oblivion had been a step backwards turning into a mediocre game. Skyrim totally fall into the bottomless put of crapiness so the next move could be nothing else than worse than worse... and it is. It's a astonishing you can trash and destroy the TES franchise more than they did with Skyrim and Oblivion but that really is even worse than Skyrim. They should have finished off TES after Oblivion to spare us from watching a good franchise turn into a pool of poo. I don't know what's the bigger pity, how they destroyed TES with Skyrim and this MMO or the Bethesthards not standing up for their franchise and boycotting crappy sequels as a true fan should do. So I'm afraid there will be enough Bethesthards to drag this crap MMO along. ¬.=.¬
 

dragongit

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oh jeez... please tell me that isn't what the Argonians look like. My god they look horrid. I'm just saying I'd never touch one if I picked up the game, and I love Argonians in the other Elder Scrolls. Way to really design something unappealing.
 

DTWolfwood

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looks like skyrim with a bit of Kingdoms of Amalur.

looking forward to more info.
 

LordNerevar

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DugMachine said:
There is too much Daystar in this thread. MY HEAD IS SPINNING

OT: Hmm seems like they're going for that gritty but cartoonish look? I'll probably try it out once it's out as I've been looking for a new MMO that's not GW2 or WoW
ever tried EVE?
 

DugMachine

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LordNerevar said:
DugMachine said:
There is too much Daystar in this thread. MY HEAD IS SPINNING

OT: Hmm seems like they're going for that gritty but cartoonish look? I'll probably try it out once it's out as I've been looking for a new MMO that's not GW2 or WoW
ever tried EVE?
Let me correct myself haha. I want that style with the swords and magic. So like WoW and GW2 but.. not GW2 and WoW if that makes sense?

EVE is spaceships and what not amirite?
 

Akexi

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I just really don't get the feel of a TES game from these screens. I know the game is being developed by Zenimax and not Bethesda and all, but it really shouldn't be all that hard to try.
 

scw55

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Game mechanics is what I care about. Aion have tried making things pretty and failed. Rift tried mixing talent trees and still exists.
TESO will have to pull a Guild Wars 2 to have a chance at doing well. I.E. be better than WoW in many different ways.

In a way, Guild Wars 2 is the new bench mark. So surpass GW2.

TESO isn't helped by the fans of the series not being MMO players.
 

Exterminas

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scw55 said:
TESO isn't helped by the fans of the series not being MMO players.
The Warcraft Franchise wasn't an MMO series either, unless you count tower defense and Starcraft with orcs.

I see some potential in this, since the biggest problem that I had with Guild Wars 2 was the lack of some sort of narrative or interesting lore. None of these millions events were remotely interesting on a story side of things.

And story is what keeps people playing your MMO. It can even be a silly story like that of WoW, but it works. Ever since SWTOR MMOs have tried using so called story missions to tell their narratives. This is folly, in my opionion, since story and gameplay should not be kept in seperate areas of the game (Hello Guild Wars 2!) but instead should be a union.

WoW might be pretty dry on ideas by now, but you can still tell what each area's story and theme are. I dare you to do the same for Guild Wars 2.

A compelling setting, like that of TES, can very well carry a MMO.
 

Elberik

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Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market.
That's because Elder Scrolls is generic fantasy, just like Halo is generic SciFi and CoD is generic FPS. It's the IP, the logo, that matters. Like t-shirts: T-shirt are identical in structure & functionality, all that matters is what is printed on them.
 

Andy Chalk

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Absolutionis said:
kajinking said:
Just me or does the art style looks way too...soft? Maybe not the best word for it but this looks like a Fable game not Skyrim.
I totally agree.

The Elder Scrolls series has thus far been literally gritty. Not 'dark'-themed or anything, but all the characters and locales were believably patched with dirt, dust, and such. The characters were believably worn-looking.

This MMO looks like someone suddenly invented ubiquitous showers and power cleaners... in the past.

It all looks too 'clean' and generic.
The past in the elder scrolls series was "better" in terms of standard of living, it was like a golden age of magic and learning (Right after Tiber Septim's time) that slowly deteriorated. I'm still holding out hope for this one, we have no idea what the gameplay will be like yet and I personally think these screens look really nice.
 

Chronologist

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I'm actually pretty optimistic about this game. From what I can see from screenshots, it keeps pretty close to the aesthetic of other Elder Scroll titles. I never cared much whether Skyrim was "gritty" or not, I'd rather the designers favor an art style that's compatible with the engine rather than throw in fake-looking "gritty" effects like the blood from the Dragon Age games.

I'm hoping that the game keeps with the lore and general gameplay of previous TES titles, and with established canon. I'm personally hoping that the game will allow first-person perspective, and maintain the dual-wielding system from Skyrim (linking left and right hands to specific spells or items). A good first-person MMO that's not an FPS would be wonderful.

Even if it's not exactly what I'm looking for, I'l still check it out. The Elder Scrolls is a lot more than just "Generic Fantasy Setting", there's a wealth of information about the world, and numerous defining qualities. The titular Elder Scrolls are a really cool concept, and there's a lot of thought put into the mythos.

I think people should give Elder Scrolls Online the benefit of the doubt, at least until it comes out. I think it'll distinguish itself in the MMO genre.
 

Blindrooster

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Looks like another MMORPG. That's cool. Anyways, I'll be playing skyrim and it's DLC until a true successor comes out to Skyrim. Hope this doesn't hurt Bathesda.
 

Oro44

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Well, at least you can tell that its Elder Scrolls. The first batch of screenshots were utterly generic. However, I can't help but feel that this might be another TOR situation where you have a game that would have been perfectly fine not being an MMO.
 

Starke

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Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Woodsey said:
Both KotORs always felt quite noticeably different to me. TOR far less so. Yeah, they had the Sith Empire versus a Republic, but there was a greater mythology around that - stuff like the Mandalorian Wars - which differentiated it greatly.

Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I'm still confused as to why they thought this is a good idea, and I really don't think they understand the MMO space like they think they do.

I'm utterly underwhelmed by these screen shorts, yeah they look pretty, but it just looks...dead to me. There's nothing in them that show how lively the game will be or even the 'character' of the game.
There was an interview from one of the lead devs who said that nothing could be innovated within the genre anymore. Quote is in the first question:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/06/25/eve-online-devs-on-dayz-elder-scrolls-online-and-whatd-make-them-quit-the-games-industry/

So that's inspiring.
Even though it sounds like every interview I've read about innovation.

Having said that, I hope they can pull it off since I'm assuming they're putting in a ridiculous amount of resources into the game. Maybe I just don't see why it has to be an MMO, but how knows? Maybe I'll be wrong and it will what the genre needs, but for now I just don't see it.
You might have that a bit jumbled. The interview was with EVE devs, the interviewer asked them for their input on something the TESO lead designer said.
 

kodra

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Good trolling. 10/10.

For those who didn't catch the joke, the idea that Dwemer technology needing to look "older" doesn't make sense within the lore, because the Dwemer had died out prior to the start of TES:O. That being said, it wouldn't make any sense for Dwemer technology to look "Older" in this game since the Dwemer haven't been around to improve it.
 

Andy Chalk

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omicron1 said:
Online, off-radar.

Seriously, though, does every MMO these days have to look like a Dreamworks film? There are no EDGES in these screenshots! No grit! No detailwork smaller than a person's thumb!

It's the same problem SWTOR had - like Star Wars, Elder Scrolls games have a definite feel to the artwork - and Playmobil ain't it. Compare the snowy Skyrim-esque screenshot to anything from Skyrim, for instance - the differences are immediate and glaringly obvious. Everything's rounder, smoother, dinkier. Sure, you can say it's stylized - but it's stylized in (in my opinion) the wrong way. Elder Scrolls games are about immersing yourself in the world. This? Looks like it's about immersing yourself in the hotbar.

That's not to say that different art styles are bad - but this one's definitely not overtly good. It just looks like an Elder Scrolls-themed version of Amalur - and I'd had enough of Amalur (and by extension WoW, SWTOR, WAR, and half a dozen other bloom-and-bevel-'em-ups) by the time I reached the swamp region.

(Yes, I'm aware I'm exaggerating somewhat; also that Oblivion had a penchant for very smooth edges, especially on stonework. I much prefer Morrowind's and Skyrim's art styles, though)
It's because cartoonish art styles are easier to do and run better on a wider array of systems. Why do you think all of those crappy bargain bin jrpgs all use the exact same art style so that you can't ever tell them apart?

EDIT: at any rate I have a far more interesting question for you. Will the game feel like an entire world that blends seamlessly together with most of the loading done in the background (World of Warcraft)? Or will they take the ToR/GW2 approach and cut the entire Elder Scrolls world into chunks sectioned off by loading screens that completely destroys your belief that it is indeed one large world?
 

Starke

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Elberik said:
Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market.
That's because Elder Scrolls is generic fantasy, just like Halo is generic SciFi and CoD is generic FPS. It's the IP, the logo, that matters. Like t-shirts: T-shirt are identical in structure & functionality, all that matters is what is printed on them.
Yeah... no.

Especially not with SciFi. You can't stick the Pillar of Autumn, the Enterprise, the Millennium Falcon, and the Litany of Fury next to one another and pretend that they're "all the same." Sci Fi involves a lot more than just a logo. And no one in their right mind can take Mass Effect, Halo, and Dead Space, look at all three games and say they're all the same with a different logo on the cover.

Shooters, you might have a point there, if the franchises themselves didn't have distinct identities. Call of Duty tends to be a conspiracy/action movie kitchen sink, the Medal of Honor reboot tried to be serious business, Battlefield Bad Company went for the Comedy Action movie theme, and that's just the prominent military franchises.

Even so, there's actually a fair amount of diversity among the games that aren't simply trying to be the next Call of Duty.

Fantasy, you might almost have a point. A lot of fantasy these days draws from either Tolkien or Robert E. Howard (and in print, there's also a heavy influence from C.S. Lewis). Except, of course, Tolkien was going for some lost age of Medieval Briton, while TES was aiming for a fall of the Roman Empire setting. Oblivion didn't convey it very well, but Morrowind and Skyrim certainly did. The screenshots above? Not so much.
 

Adam Jensen_v1legacy

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They need to go back to Morrowind aesthetics and mystical atmosphere. This looks too generic and familiar. Find a way, guys. Make it happen.
 

Eridani74

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LINKS!!!
Part 1 [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/eso-media-event/]
Part 2: Combat [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/combat-in-teso/]
Part 3: Gameplay [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/gameplay-impressions/]
Part 4: Interview with Game director and creative director [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/interview-matt-paul/]
Part 5: Interview with lead PVP designer [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/interview-brian-wheeler/]
 

Tanakh

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Eridani74 said:
LINKS!!!
Part 1 [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/eso-media-event/]
Part 2: Combat [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/combat-in-teso/]
Part 3: Gameplay [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/gameplay-impressions/]
Part 4: Interview with Game director and creative director [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/interview-matt-paul/]
Part 5: Interview with lead PVP designer [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/interview-brian-wheeler/]
Ohhh, that PvP seems interesting indeed. This is a weird game, named Elder Scrolls but reminds me more of DaoC or GW 2, that is, a lot of it is PvP focused.... no wonder people around here are cold to it.

Edit: Ohh god! Climbing walls might be back! Drool. No class specific is fail... but whatev.
 

Fiz_The_Toaster

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Starke said:
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Woodsey said:
Both KotORs always felt quite noticeably different to me. TOR far less so. Yeah, they had the Sith Empire versus a Republic, but there was a greater mythology around that - stuff like the Mandalorian Wars - which differentiated it greatly.

Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I'm still confused as to why they thought this is a good idea, and I really don't think they understand the MMO space like they think they do.

I'm utterly underwhelmed by these screen shorts, yeah they look pretty, but it just looks...dead to me. There's nothing in them that show how lively the game will be or even the 'character' of the game.
There was an interview from one of the lead devs who said that nothing could be innovated within the genre anymore. Quote is in the first question:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/06/25/eve-online-devs-on-dayz-elder-scrolls-online-and-whatd-make-them-quit-the-games-industry/

So that's inspiring.
Even though it sounds like every interview I've read about innovation.

Having said that, I hope they can pull it off since I'm assuming they're putting in a ridiculous amount of resources into the game. Maybe I just don't see why it has to be an MMO, but how knows? Maybe I'll be wrong and it will what the genre needs, but for now I just don't see it.
You might have that a bit jumbled. The interview was with EVE devs, the interviewer asked them for their input on something the TESO lead designer said.
What I meant was that every single talk about innovation I've seen has been about the same thing, so them talking about what some dev said about it really means nothing to me since all I've seen of the game is screenshots.
 

BoredWalker

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Oh, for the love of- why were most of the screenshots taken at night? These remind me of Amalur; which is fine by itself; but that cartoony artstyle needs two things to pop: color variation and good lighting. These have neither; it's monocolor slurry as far as the eye can see. If this is how the final product looks, I'll be very disappointed in the entire development team.
 

Folji

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remmus said:
meh, said it before, say it again, the instant it was made clear combat is going to be the same, boring select, auto-attack combat system that this genre seamed cursed with, it lost any semblance of being Elder Scrolls.
Actually, and thankfully, they took the time to listen to the community and decided to rework the control scheme because of how incredibly old-fashioned it to have ability-based auto attack combat. The current setup is a lot closer to the core Elder Scrolls series, or MMOs like DCUO or TERA.

Facing towards an enemy engages a soft targeting system, which highlights the target?s profile with a red outline. Alternatively, the player can hard lock onto a specific target in order to focus their attacks on a critical foe. Fans who has played Skyrim on the PC will be immediately familiar with the basics of combat. Left clicking activates your basic melee attack, while holding the left mouse button charges a power attack. Power attacks do not cost Stamina to use, however they are slower to execute. Additionally, they feature some context sensitive elements, inflicting additional effects depending on your target?s state. Holding the right mouse button engages active blocking, slowly draining stamina in order to intercept enemy attacks with a weapon or shield. While in active block mode, the player can shield (or weapon) bash by left clicking to interrupt enemy spell casting or to break free of crowd control effects.
 

Monoclebear

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Sep 29, 2010
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Why do they have to make this? I want a Elderscrolls Co-op game, not some shitty MMO.
 

Starke

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Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Starke said:
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Woodsey said:
Both KotORs always felt quite noticeably different to me. TOR far less so. Yeah, they had the Sith Empire versus a Republic, but there was a greater mythology around that - stuff like the Mandalorian Wars - which differentiated it greatly.

Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I'm still confused as to why they thought this is a good idea, and I really don't think they understand the MMO space like they think they do.

I'm utterly underwhelmed by these screen shorts, yeah they look pretty, but it just looks...dead to me. There's nothing in them that show how lively the game will be or even the 'character' of the game.
There was an interview from one of the lead devs who said that nothing could be innovated within the genre anymore. Quote is in the first question:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/06/25/eve-online-devs-on-dayz-elder-scrolls-online-and-whatd-make-them-quit-the-games-industry/

So that's inspiring.
Even though it sounds like every interview I've read about innovation.

Having said that, I hope they can pull it off since I'm assuming they're putting in a ridiculous amount of resources into the game. Maybe I just don't see why it has to be an MMO, but how knows? Maybe I'll be wrong and it will what the genre needs, but for now I just don't see it.
You might have that a bit jumbled. The interview was with EVE devs, the interviewer asked them for their input on something the TESO lead designer said.
What I meant was that every single talk about innovation I've seen has been about the same thing, so them talking about what some dev said about it really means nothing to me since all I've seen of the game is screenshots.
Yeah, I'm sorry, I actually misread your original post too. Honestly, I haven't seen anything from the game that encouraged me, and the dev saying "nothing more to innovate" is kinda the final nail for me.
 

Elberik

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Starke said:
Elberik said:
Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market.
That's because Elder Scrolls is generic fantasy, just like Halo is generic SciFi and CoD is generic FPS. It's the IP, the logo, that matters. Like t-shirts: T-shirt are identical in structure & functionality, all that matters is what is printed on them.
Yeah... no.

Especially not with SciFi. You can't stick the Pillar of Autumn, the Enterprise, the Millennium Falcon, and the Litany of Fury next to one another and pretend that they're "all the same." Sci Fi involves a lot more than just a logo. And no one in their right mind can take Mass Effect, Halo, and Dead Space, look at all three games and say they're all the same with a different logo on the cover.
*had to look up what the Litany of Fury was*
I am taking about the visuals, since all we have are pictures. Those ships you listed, they are all big ships (i would never put the Millennium Falcon next to the Pillar of Autumn, maybe a Star Destroyer though). Mass Effect and Halo are different types of games, obviously. It's the visuals, you could put Issac Clarke next to Commander Shepherd & there'd be no evidence to say they were from different universes. The Normandy could buzz DS9 & no one would think it out of place unless they had previous knowledge of Mass Effect & Star Trek lore.

The Elder Scrolls is a generic fantasy setting. Medieval era tech, dragons, magic, & some humanoid and/or bestial creatures from Celtic/Gaelic/Scandinavian folklore.
 

Fiz_The_Toaster

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Starke said:
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Starke said:
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Woodsey said:
Both KotORs always felt quite noticeably different to me. TOR far less so. Yeah, they had the Sith Empire versus a Republic, but there was a greater mythology around that - stuff like the Mandalorian Wars - which differentiated it greatly.

Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I'm still confused as to why they thought this is a good idea, and I really don't think they understand the MMO space like they think they do.

I'm utterly underwhelmed by these screen shorts, yeah they look pretty, but it just looks...dead to me. There's nothing in them that show how lively the game will be or even the 'character' of the game.
There was an interview from one of the lead devs who said that nothing could be innovated within the genre anymore. Quote is in the first question:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/06/25/eve-online-devs-on-dayz-elder-scrolls-online-and-whatd-make-them-quit-the-games-industry/

So that's inspiring.
Even though it sounds like every interview I've read about innovation.

Having said that, I hope they can pull it off since I'm assuming they're putting in a ridiculous amount of resources into the game. Maybe I just don't see why it has to be an MMO, but how knows? Maybe I'll be wrong and it will what the genre needs, but for now I just don't see it.
You might have that a bit jumbled. The interview was with EVE devs, the interviewer asked them for their input on something the TESO lead designer said.
What I meant was that every single talk about innovation I've seen has been about the same thing, so them talking about what some dev said about it really means nothing to me since all I've seen of the game is screenshots.
Yeah, I'm sorry, I actually misread your original post too. Honestly, I haven't seen anything from the game that encouraged me, and the dev saying "nothing more to innovate" is kinda the final nail for me.
Oh it's cool, I thought I wasn't clear since I did type that in a hurry. >.>

I haven't actually seen that quote before until the other poster linked it to me, and I'm glad I did. That kind of quote always scares me and makes me not even bother with what they're doing since nothing good comes out of something like that.
 

chozo_hybrid

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As long as it doesn't do a Warcraft and still let us get more of the core Elder Scrolls games, I see no problem with this. Still waiting for my next Warcraft RTS.
 

The Rogue Wolf

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WHAT THE SWEET MERRY HELL DID THEY DO TO MY ARGONIANS?!

...ahem.

dragongit said:
oh jeez... please tell me that isn't what the Argonians look like. My god they look horrid. I'm just saying I'd never touch one if I picked up the game, and I love Argonians in the other Elder Scrolls. Way to really design something unappealing.
Yeah, very much this. They looked better in Morrowind, for Sithis's sake.

omicron1 said:
Seriously, though, does every MMO these days have to look like a Dreamworks film? There are no EDGES in these screenshots! No grit! No detailwork smaller than a person's thumb!
They're probably using lower-poly models and trying to make up the difference with shaders and texture effects. You can get away with things in a single-player game that will hurt an MMO, insofar as graphics go.

I'm not holding out a lot of hope for this one. I won't condemn it outright, but I won't exactly mark the release date on my calendar either.
 

Starke

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Elberik said:
Starke said:
Elberik said:
Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market.
That's because Elder Scrolls is generic fantasy, just like Halo is generic SciFi and CoD is generic FPS. It's the IP, the logo, that matters. Like t-shirts: T-shirt are identical in structure & functionality, all that matters is what is printed on them.
Yeah... no.

Especially not with SciFi. You can't stick the Pillar of Autumn, the Enterprise, the Millennium Falcon, and the Litany of Fury next to one another and pretend that they're "all the same." Sci Fi involves a lot more than just a logo. And no one in their right mind can take Mass Effect, Halo, and Dead Space, look at all three games and say they're all the same with a different logo on the cover.
*had to look up what the Litany of Fury was*
I am taking about the visuals, since all we have are pictures. Those ships you listed, they are all big ships (i would never put the Millennium Falcon next to the Pillar of Autumn, maybe a Star Destroyer though). Mass Effect and Halo are different types of games, obviously. It's the visuals, you could put Issac Clarke next to Commander Shepherd & there'd be no evidence to say they were from different universes. The Normandy could buzz DS9 & no one would think it out of place unless they had previous knowledge of Mass Effect & Star Trek lore.

The Elder Scrolls is a generic fantasy setting. Medieval era tech, dragons, magic, & some humanoid and/or bestial creatures from Celtic/Gaelic/Scandinavian folklore.
Of course, where this started was about substance and structure, not just visual aesthetics. So, while you're right, you could stick the Normandy next to DS9 and say it looks the part, the underlying philosophy of the settings are incompatible, even with the Normandy basically being a reskinned Defiant.

Even the Shepard/Clarke thing sort of underlines the issue, both at a visual and a thematic level. Shepard is (usually) presented with sleek top of the line military hardware, everything has a circular aesthetic to it. It's a bit worn, but it's still high end. That aesthetic carries over into the setting as a whole.

Clarke in contrast was aesthetically designed to look like, well, power tools. That's the fundamental aesthetic, which informs most of Dead Space's visual identity. The problem is, of course, that that fundamentally goes deeper as well.

The real disparity between the settings is that Mass Effect is a world where the designated hero comes along to save you, while Dead Space is a world where everyone dies horribly. You can stick them next to one another and say "sure, they could be in the same universe", but the fundamental identities of their universes are incompatible.

Now, fantasy tends to be less clear cut. There isn't a lot of reasons you couldn't turn Conan the Chimerian loose on Thedas or Tamriel and call it a day, but at the same time, TES and Dragon Age aren't really compatible settings either. Even when the aesthetics mesh, the underlying philosophies conflict.
 

Andy Chalk

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The biggest problem I have with the game is the aesthetics, it doesn't even look like an ES game, they just took WoW's graphical style and thought that would be best.

Come on, people want detail and grit!

I know cartoon-y aesthetics age better but still...
 

omicron1

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Devoneaux said:
It's because cartoonish art styles are easier to do and run better on a wider array of systems. Why do you think all of those crappy bargain bin jrpgs all use the exact same art style so that you can't ever tell them apart?
Honestly, aren't we to the point by now that we can handle more realistic artstyles? Skyrim itself can run on 2005 (optimized, of course, but still) hardware, and the graphics on things like SWTOR and TESO are of equivalent polycount/shader-count/texture-size to something like Skyrim as is. They're just rounded off (which, incidentally, is always a higher-poly-count procedure than otherwise!) - as though they believe their average player age is ten.
 

kouriichi

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I have 4 problem with this right now.

The Ordinator mask look like Abraham Lincoln. &#3232;_&#3232;
The Argonians are beyond hideous, they are literally the worst rendition of argonians ive ever seen.
The graphics style is nothing Elder Scrolls, its like they are shooting to impress the WoW crowd or something with this look. Why, does nearly every western MMO out there, have to look like this?I would rather it look like morrowind then this.
The big bone skeleton thing in the 3rd picture? That thing.... is just dreadful. Im sorry, but its like they weren't even trying to fit TES with it. You have these great scenery plans, and good armor and weapon design, and you have this.... thing.

Ive been playing TES longer than i can remember, we're talking since i was old enough to talk, walk, and murder things in a videogame. And short of the nice looking axe the Argonian in the 7th picture is wielding, nothing here excites me for an MMO. Maybe more screens will popup in the future, and change my mind, but until then this is a failing project to me. Im sorry if this is coming off mean or rude, but i had super high hopes when they announced it, having always been a die hard TES fan (I have owned every recent TES game on both consoles and PC, including skyrim, and all the DLC with them), but they just havent released anything to say, "This isnt going to die like every other MMO released, AND were butchering TES while we soak up the money".
 

Starke

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Tanakh said:
Eridani74 said:
LINKS!!!
Part 1 [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/eso-media-event/]
Part 2: Combat [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/combat-in-teso/]
Part 3: Gameplay [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/gameplay-impressions/]
Part 4: Interview with Game director and creative director [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/interview-matt-paul/]
Part 5: Interview with lead PVP designer [http://tamrielfoundry.com/2012/10/interview-brian-wheeler/]
Ohhh, that PvP seems interesting indeed. This is a weird game, named Elder Scrolls but reminds me more of DaoC or GW 2, that is, a lot of it is PvP focused.... no wonder people around here are cold to it.

Edit: Ohh god! Climbing walls might be back! Drool. No class specific is fail... but whatev.
The Dark Age of Camelot vibe might be because their lead PvP dev and game director are both DAoC alums.
 

I.Muir

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It was already condemned to failure in my mind
It will not survive just like every other mmo that accountants think should work but it just won't
The only thing it could have done was interfere with the creation of other elder scrolls games and that is it
 

Tanakh

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Starke said:
The Dark Age of Camelot vibe might be because their lead PvP dev and game director are both DAoC alums.
Yep, was posted here a long time ago. Funny thing no one knew who that lead director was, and there was a bunch of QQ about the proyect, even more than here -.-

If they make assassins the only class who can climb walls, then I am in!

Edit: And I do get why the fans of TES here are not that pleased. It just irks me that they say "ToR clone" or "WoW clone", if they knew a little bit about the lead devs they would know the game might suck, but at least will not be what they say.
 

bliebblob

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Sep 9, 2009
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Some of those actually look really good by mmo standards methinks. As for the genericness, haven't all elder scrolls games been sort of generic looking? (Except maybe morrowind) You just don't notice because the lore and the gameplay are what set it apart.

Conclusion: I reserve judgement until I see gameplay.
 

synobal

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Art style looks remarkably boring, but I do like the recreation of Classic TES locations.
 

Seneschal

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Jun 27, 2009
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omicron1 said:
Online, off-radar.

Seriously, though, does every MMO these days have to look like a Dreamworks film? There are no EDGES in these screenshots! No grit! No detailwork smaller than a person's thumb!

It's the same problem SWTOR had - like Star Wars, Elder Scrolls games have a definite feel to the artwork - and Playmobil ain't it. Compare the snowy Skyrim-esque screenshot to anything from Skyrim, for instance - the differences are immediate and glaringly obvious. Everything's rounder, smoother, dinkier. Sure, you can say it's stylized - but it's stylized in (in my opinion) the wrong way. Elder Scrolls games are about immersing yourself in the world. This? Looks like it's about immersing yourself in the hotbar.

That's not to say that different art styles are bad - but this one's definitely not overtly good. It just looks like an Elder Scrolls-themed version of Amalur - and I'd had enough of Amalur (and by extension WoW, SWTOR, WAR, and half a dozen other bloom-and-bevel-'em-ups) by the time I reached the swamp region.

(Yes, I'm aware I'm exaggerating somewhat; also that Oblivion had a penchant for very smooth edges, especially on stonework. I much prefer Morrowind's and Skyrim's art styles, though)
I don't think you're exaggerating that much, especially if we take all the Korean MMOs and file them under "stylized, clean, with dinky details." They all have the same tone, if not the same style. I've always wondered whether there's an inherent limitation in visual design of a large online game that makes everything look 8 years out of date and suited for ages 5 and above, or do the designers spontaneously grow a brain tumour where their imagination should be. Maybe it's a Blizzard-concocted curse. Either way, Guild Wars 2 seems to be averting the trend a little.
 

Gennadios

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Exterminas said:
WoW might be pretty dry on ideas by now, but you can still tell what each area's story and theme are. I dare you to do the same for Guild Wars 2.
It's really not all that hard, read the flavor text on the various hearts and do a couple of dynamic events and you get a pretty good idea of what the major players in the region are trying to accomplish.

In addition to that, Guild Wars 2 has 2 at the end of it. Meaning it's a sequel. Won't help people unfamiliar with the original, but there's a heaping ton of lore all over the place. Familiar towns and temples that have since fallen into ruin, grave stones of henchmen and famous NPCs and so on.

What GW2 did was assume that the vast majority of players don't care and just made that stuff subtle. The only way to get a wall of text to explain what you're seeing is to check the wiki, which really isn't that different from being whacked over the head with a 3 paragraph quest log.
 

lancar

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I don't suppose we can pray to whatever Deadra might be listening to make Bethesda stop producing this?

Seriously, enough with the goddamn MMO's! Take those art assets, spruce them up and recycle them into the next singleplayer Elder Scrolls instead. I don't want more generic MMO's to die brutally at WoW's onslaught, I don't want to see Bethesda waste truckloads of money on a game that'll never achieve the popularity or success of the other TES games, and I certainly DON'T WANT TO PLAY IT!

For the love of god, please stop!
 

KeyMaster45

Gone Gonzo
Jun 16, 2008
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Okay guys real funny. Now put the Guild Wars 2 screen shots away and give us the actual TES online screen shots.
 

Andy Chalk

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Scars Unseen said:
I said this game was a bad idea when it was announced, and this certainly doesn't change my mind. Most people that should be the target audience of this game don't want an MMO that vaguely resembles The Elder Scrolls series. They want a TES game they can play online. Unfortunately, early info points to ZeniO going after the same WoW crowd that no one else has managed to pry from Blizzard's cold clutching grip.

Best of luck on that.
Yep, I was really excited when I first heard about ESO, I had visions of "fantasy Star Wars: Galaxies"; a proper high-quality modern sandbox MMO replete with skill-based levelling, player housing and so forth.

Instead we're getting yet another generic WoW-clone with a new IP crudely pasted over the top. How many companies have to shat out these horrible ripoffs before the industry will accept that the concept has failed? I mean shitbiscuits, Warhammer: Age of Reckoning alone should have been enough to convince them of that, but then it's a symptom of a modern, publicly-traded entertainment industry where mollifying investors with knob-all knowledge of the sector is more important than anything else.
 

TheSapphireKnight

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Sigh, I can't stand your typical MMO gameplay so right from the beginning I didn't care. Am I against multiplayer in general for TES? No but not in MMO form.

I would absolutely love to run around and explore a territory or two(hopefully all of Tamriel eventually) with one or MAYBE two of my buddies. I would never want to run around with strangers but with two friends I know I can't think of anything better than exploring a TES with a few friends.
 

karoliso

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Exterminas said:
And story is what keeps people playing your MMO. It can even be a silly story like that of WoW, but it works.
I'll jump in here and disagree. You do not need to cram in a story into an MMO for people to play it. In fact, most MMO's have horrible stories, but that does not stop millions of people from playing them. Why? It's because the two main reasons why people play MMO's are gameplay and social interactions.

In these games, people forge their own stories by interacting with people within the game. I put forward that it's emergent narratives and/or gameplay that make MMO's special, not stories and lore written by the developers.

My most memorable moments playing MMO's like LOTRO, Lineage 2 and Guild Wars 2, were ones involving interactions with people. Stories of Guild feuds, traitors and friendships were all by-products of giving us (the players) a set of tools and letting us experiment within the boundaries set by the game.

Case in point: http://www.facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1220094&p=38145935&viewfull=1#post38145935
 

Techno Destructo

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I think I'll follow Yahtzee's view on a game and expect it to be shit. If it's not, then I can at least be surprised when it doesn't make my hard drive want to hurl itself into the closest sharp object around.
 

lacktheknack

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Jan 19, 2009
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I think this game could use a new "Warp In The West" to spice things up. As an added bonus a "Warp In The West" would work very well in an online game, what with it being the only kind of even to drop-kick continuity off the planet and make every player choice contribute to the madness.

I'd play it if it did that.
 

Elberik

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Starke said:
Elberik said:
Starke said:
Elberik said:
Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market.
That's because Elder Scrolls is generic fantasy, just like Halo is generic SciFi and CoD is generic FPS. It's the IP, the logo, that matters. Like t-shirts: T-shirt are identical in structure & functionality, all that matters is what is printed on them.
Yeah... no.

Especially not with SciFi. You can't stick the Pillar of Autumn, the Enterprise, the Millennium Falcon, and the Litany of Fury next to one another and pretend that they're "all the same." Sci Fi involves a lot more than just a logo. And no one in their right mind can take Mass Effect, Halo, and Dead Space, look at all three games and say they're all the same with a different logo on the cover.
*had to look up what the Litany of Fury was*
I am taking about the visuals, since all we have are pictures. Those ships you listed, they are all big ships (i would never put the Millennium Falcon next to the Pillar of Autumn, maybe a Star Destroyer though). Mass Effect and Halo are different types of games, obviously. It's the visuals, you could put Issac Clarke next to Commander Shepherd & there'd be no evidence to say they were from different universes. The Normandy could buzz DS9 & no one would think it out of place unless they had previous knowledge of Mass Effect & Star Trek lore.

The Elder Scrolls is a generic fantasy setting. Medieval era tech, dragons, magic, & some humanoid and/or bestial creatures from Celtic/Gaelic/Scandinavian folklore.
Of course, where this started was about substance and structure, not just visual aesthetics. So, while you're right, you could stick the Normandy next to DS9 and say it looks the part, the underlying philosophy of the settings are incompatible, even with the Normandy basically being a reskinned Defiant.

Even the Shepard/Clarke thing sort of underlines the issue, both at a visual and a thematic level. Shepard is (usually) presented with sleek top of the line military hardware, everything has a circular aesthetic to it. It's a bit worn, but it's still high end. That aesthetic carries over into the setting as a whole.

Clarke in contrast was aesthetically designed to look like, well, power tools. That's the fundamental aesthetic, which informs most of Dead Space's visual identity. The problem is, of course, that that fundamentally goes deeper as well.

The real disparity between the settings is that Mass Effect is a world where the designated hero comes along to save you, while Dead Space is a world where everyone dies horribly. You can stick them next to one another and say "sure, they could be in the same universe", but the fundamental identities of their universes are incompatible.
My issue was in regards to:

Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market.
All we have right now are pictures. Still images out of context. The same things we originally had for every single video game ever made. It's a bit early to be making remarks on whether or not a game will be innovative or at the very least "good". Skyrim looks like generic fantasy, same as Mass Effect looks like generic SciFi. It's not until you actually play them that you can make an assessment.
 

Andy Chalk

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Scars Unseen said:
I said this game was a bad idea when it was announced, and this certainly doesn't change my mind. Most people that should be the target audience of this game don't want an MMO that vaguely resembles The Elder Scrolls series. They want a TES game they can play online. Unfortunately, early info points to ZeniO going after the same WoW crowd that no one else has managed to pry from Blizzard's cold clutching grip.

Best of luck on that.
This is pretty true. I think the TES should remain single player, but I wouldn't be opposed to a sort of TES experience that was an MMO - just as long as it doesn't replace the main, single player series.

But this is just a WOW clone.

With that being said, I personally am impressed with the results. They've done a good job of blinding previous elder scrolls flavor with their own art direction. Sure it could be more "edgy" or original, but I like it... though it's certainly not going to win any awards.

Now, if only it looked like the game was going to be good.......
 

Andy Chalk

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Nov 12, 2002
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Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here
I think this pretty much sums up the entire game if it turns out as "generic MMORPG" as it's feared to be.
 

Saegrim

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I still want to know more about the gameplay. I could care less about the screenshots-gimme gameplay details. Is it gonna be traditional Elder Scrolls based, or am I going to be playing with a hotkey piano and grinding for days on end?
If they go traditional Elder Scrolls based but also put in something like Rifts in Rift, and the player base has to go to war with Daedra or something, I'd fork over cash for it.
 

oldirtymongrrel

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I'm not sure, I will give it a go but I'm not into MMOs,I would rather they got started with a Elder Scrolls 6 with co-op, a friend can play as a merc. Just hope this doesn't damage the series.
 

scw55

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Exterminas said:
This is folly, in my opionion, since story and gameplay should not be kept in seperate areas of the game (Hello Guild Wars 2!) but instead should be a union.

WoW might be pretty dry on ideas by now, but you can still tell what each area's story and theme are. I dare you to do the same for Guild Wars 2.
Plains of Ashford; Defending against the Flame Legion and Undead
Queensdale; Defending against Bandits
Caledon Forest; Defending Against the Nightmare Countrt
Metrica Province; Defending Against the Inquisition
Wayfarer Foothills; Defending against the Sons of Svanir
Diessa Plateau; Defending against the human sepratists
Kessex Hills; Defending against Centaurs and Bandits
Brisban Wildlands; Defending against the Inquisition, Nightmare court and bandits
Snowden Drifts; Defending against Sons of Svanir
.
.
.
.
Then when you get to the straights of devastation, narrative rears its head and from then on your have dynamic events where you are trying to claim the land.

Why must you get to 65 to get to this point? Because it's an MMO. You can't spread intense narrative across 80 levels. So they focus on the last 15. There are no quests at all at this level and your exp gain must come from exploration or participating in the assault.

Don't think the zones in WoW had a strong narrative for each zone. It was the narrative which I listed above in GW2's. A lot of defending against certain factions. What WoW had was violent distinctions in aesthetics for each zones. WoW came from the land of whackiness; TBC. Guild Wars 2 is more grounded in realism with regards to their landscapes (if you ignore giant crystals).

What will kill TESO is awful game play. You have many games now that offer large Co-Op which allows you to play with a small community of friends and the gameplay is good. Why would you want to play an MMO with worse gameplay and play with people who you don't want to play with?

Having a subfee won't help either.
 

Andy Chalk

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AW Yeah!

Who's prepared for another utter failure of a shitty hot-key MMO?

I know I am!
 

Starke

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Elberik said:
My issue was in regards to:

Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market.
All we have right now are pictures. Still images out of context. The same things we originally had for every single video game ever made. It's a bit early to be making remarks on whether or not a game will be innovative or at the very least "good". Skyrim looks like generic fantasy, same as Mass Effect looks like generic SciFi. It's not until you actually play them that you can make an assessment.
My issue was in regards to:

Elberik said:
That's because Elder Scrolls is generic fantasy, just like Halo is generic SciFi and CoD is generic FPS. It's the IP, the logo, that matters. Like t-shirts: T-shirt are identical in structure & functionality, all that matters is what is printed on them.
Now, I'll grant you that TESO does look suspiciously like some bog standard fantasy MMO, and that's a serious cause for concern. Especially given that there are design elements that have been abandoned or mutilated in those screenshots. But, what I was responding to was that all fantasy, all scifi and all shooters were just "labels on a t-shirt," they're really not.
 

Li Mu

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Andy Chalk said:
That's not to say that these screens aren't reasonably pretty, or that I think The Elder Scrolls Online will be a sub-par game. I just hope that Bethesda is able to do something more with it than re-hash the previous games in a contrived three-way conflict.

I really don't understand why Escapist writers are struggling with the fact that Bethesda are NOT making this game. Zenimax Online Studios are.
Pretty much every article about this game has talked about Bethesda being the ones who are making this game.

It would be the same as saying that Half Life; Opposing Force was made by Valve, or that Call of Duty was made by Activision, or that Fable 3 was developed by Microsoft.

Come on guys, you're supposed to be Games Journalists, you should surely know and understand the difference between a developer and a publisher.

Here's an example; Dawn of War 2 is a great game. It was 'developed' by Relic Entertainment. Now just to clear up any confusion; developers are the people who are making the game. They're the ones who put together all the coding and pretty artwork and make the whole thing run.

Dawn of War 2 was 'published' by THQ. This means that THQ are in charge of funding the game, distributing, localization and advertising it. (And in EA's case, rush the thing out the door before it's finished)

Oddly, nobody gets confused about Dawn of War 2. Everyone knows that Relic rocks as a dev and that THQ are pretty good when it comes to publishing. So why you're all struggling with TOS;OL is beyond me. But perhaps I should clarify a little more.

So in this specific case, Bethesda are allowing Zenimax to use their intellectual property, giving them some vast sums of money and will be distributing the game.

Zenimax are the ones 'developing' the whole game. See, they 'develop' and that's why we call them 'developers'. Funny that, eh?
 

Dandark

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lancar said:
I don't suppose we can pray to whatever Deadra might be listening to make Bethesda stop producing this?

Seriously, enough with the goddamn MMO's! Take those art assets, spruce them up and recycle them into the next singleplayer Elder Scrolls instead. I don't want more generic MMO's to die brutally at WoW's onslaught, I don't want to see Bethesda waste truckloads of money on a game that'll never achieve the popularity or success of the other TES games, and I certainly DON'T WANT TO PLAY IT!

For the love of god, please stop!
Bethesda are not making this, they have nothing to do with this, it's Zenimax online who is doing this, they are owned by Zenimax, the same company who owns Bethesda.

bringer of illumination said:
AW Yeah!

Who's prepared for another utter failure of a shitty hot-key MMO?

I know I am!
I could be wrong but from my understanding of what a "hot key" mmo is, this isn't one as they scrapped that to go with a new combat system.


OT: I seem to be in the minority who actually likes the look of this =/
It isn't getting my that excited but it does look like it could be fun and im happy enough with the art style, if they can make the character building and gameplay fun and interesting then I would enjoy this.

I still won't touch it untill they get rid of the subscription fee though.
 

evilneko

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Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market.
Par for the course for TES. Vanilla be thy name. Maybe with a few sprinkles here and there, but vanilla nonetheless.
 

ViciousTide

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UMM, i don't see the MMO aspect in these screenshots, they look like Skyrim to me.

Unless you have 16 V 16 in real time battle like War of Roses is doing, you won't be creating a new genre in the MMO sphere. I want to issue a general command/order to 1000 players, and they try to achieve this order and then add additional troops to the battle or order to fire arrows from those 200 players.

You could make a 500 V 500 MMO game with 3D spheres with a sword and arrow and minecraft graphics, and it would be the best most funniest game around.

Focus on the Human Network/ MMO Game play aspects. We have felt souless for the last 3 RPGs, and no guilt shooting an arrow to the NPC's knee, then shouting him off the ledge. I want to here someone shouting back, " NOOOO!!".
 

kodra

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Based on the various articles circulating the blogosphere from folks who have actually played a early version of the game, cries of this being "Just a WoW Clone" seem very similar to all of the cries that "Half Life is just another DOOM clone".
 

Rblade

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that dremora looks bad ass.

other then that you can't really say anything about this aside from the fact that making a MMO is risky business no matter how you spin it.

The thing this game has going for it over say, TOR, is that it makes much more sense to have a huge amount of high power fantasy hero's running around. Aswell as having a credible source of powerfull but lore approved enemies because of stuff like the deadra and dragons being a thing. So you won't have just NPC's or stuff you pull out of your collective arse.
In that regard it is more on a similar ground as guild wars and WoW.

add to that a gigantic fanbase and I wouldn't write this off
 

Matthew Ostman

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I know I shouldn't let myself get excited about this game... but damn if shot #6 isn't giving me some serious morrowind nostalgia...
 

Playful Pony

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Hmm, well I do know that although I've been a big fan of TES series for a very long time, this game is not for me. I'm not an MMORPG fan though, I've never gotten very far in WoW, and the same goes for games such TERA, TOR and Perfect World... Although I very much enjoy the lore of TES, that's not what draws me into the series. It's the entertaining gameplay, good presentation, interesting quests and compelling storylines. Just being a TES game isn't enough to draw me in!

Not what I'd want, clearly not ment for me or similar people. What I'd want is a TES with a small multi-player component, something like Boderlands drop-in coop feature. Just scale the dificulty a bit and/or add some more enemies to Skyrim and we'd have the time of our life... If they really do intend to kill WoW with this one, by having the same questing and combat system... You idiots X3.

kajinking said:
Just me or does the art style looks way too...soft? Maybe not the best word for it but this looks like a Fable game not Skyrim.
I'm getting the same feeling, though I too cannot really put words on whats wrong with the look of this game... It doesn't look right, is all I can say for sure X3.
 

joeman098

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This makes me so sad I hope they stop making this or overhaul the whole project. No one wants elder scrolls WoW. Now an elder scrolls online with the normal twitch elder scrolls combat thats something i want. Not press some buttons tab target some stuff collect loot =(
 

snave

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What I fear is that this will ultimately mess up the single player game series. As it stands, basically all of the lore in the franchise can be recapped by blazing through a bunch of single-player games. Specifically, four games, as Arena was mostly retconned apart from the blurb on the back of the box. And heck, that's such a minimal amount in the grand scheme of things, that they've pretty well managed to sum it up in books, in game.

Now look at Warcraft. If they were to launch another non-MMORPG in that universe... well, it would work because their MMORPG playerbase is so utterly, devastatingly huge. Uhm. Anyway, the point is, World of Warcraft is the majority of the Warcraft franchise's lore. So you've alienated any non-WoW players away from any hypothetical future single player installments. Again, in WoW's case, this isn't a dealbreaker, but if we simply assume that the Elder Scrolls Online doesn't fare too well, but fares well enough to maintain itself, then, in that case, it is. I'd even go as far as to say it is potentially disasterous to the main single player series' playerbase.

This is also the same reason why sequels that jump genre boundaries are also a certified Bad Idea.

My personal hope is that they'll can this project and rejig the work thus far into a more open, co-op and online enabled side project. Perhaps ongoing and episodic (kinda like how The Secret World really should have been).
 

SajuukKhar

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joeman098 said:
This makes me so sad I hope they stop making this or overhaul the whole project. No one wants elder scrolls WoW. Now an elder scrolls online with the normal twitch elder scrolls combat thats something i want. Not press some buttons tab target some stuff collect loot =(
There is no tab targeting in TESO.

In fact the game's control scheme is exactly like skyrim's with the exception being you cant swing your sword unless your aiming reticule is over a valid target.
 

Schizocorpse

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I'm really looking forward to this game, haters can suck it, see you at launch.

captcha 'always there'

At least captcha is supportive.
 

Eridani74

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snave said:
What I fear is that this will ultimately mess up the single player game series. As it stands, basically all of the lore in the franchise can be recapped by blazing through a bunch of single-player games. Specifically, four games, as Arena was mostly retconned apart from the blurb on the back of the box. And heck, that's such a minimal amount in the grand scheme of things, that they've pretty well managed to sum it up in books, in game.

[snip]

This is also the same reason why sequels that jump genre boundaries are also a certified Bad Idea.

[snip]
It's not a sequel, it's a prequel which implies that it won't add any major details to lore only fleshing out tangential details as nothing has been mentioned about the events of TESO in the single player games other than "stuff happened here".

Not to mention that Bethesda Game Studios has taken care to make all entries in the series stand-alone lore-wise. It isn't necessary to play the old games to enjoy one of the new ones and that will apply to the MMO and the following single player games as well.
 

Odjin

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Eridani74 said:
snave said:
What I fear is that this will ultimately mess up the single player game series. As it stands, basically all of the lore in the franchise can be recapped by blazing through a bunch of single-player games. Specifically, four games, as Arena was mostly retconned apart from the blurb on the back of the box. And heck, that's such a minimal amount in the grand scheme of things, that they've pretty well managed to sum it up in books, in game.

[snip]

This is also the same reason why sequels that jump genre boundaries are also a certified Bad Idea.

[snip]
It's not a sequel, it's a prequel which implies that it won't add any major details to lore only fleshing out tangential details as nothing has been mentioned about the events of TESO in the single player games other than "stuff happened here".

Not to mention that Bethesda Game Studios has taken care to make all entries in the series stand-alone lore-wise. It isn't necessary to play the old games to enjoy one of the new ones and that will apply to the MMO and the following single player games as well.
Not correct. TES-Lore matched up until Oblivion... then it got RetCon-Fucked up in the worst possible way. Up to then the main stories had been (albeit often crappy) standalone but in a consistent with TES-Lore. Then they all fucked it up. The only positive point on this MMO is that if it is prior to TES games they can't include the RetCon Fuck-up they did on Skyrim as this would horribly break the existing (and established) TES-Lore.
 

Zenn3k

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So much hate.

I'm generally interested in this game, I haven't played a good fantasy MMO since I quit WoW when Vanilla ended (first expansion). I'm an old Everquest veteran, and this game kinda reminds me of EQ in a good way.

I'll likely buy it and at least try it. The P2P doesn't put me off, as EVERY MMO I've ever tried has been P2P. TES is fairly recognizable for me, so I have a grasp on the history and the plot.

Also, I'm betting the end game involves killing gods, and thats always a fun idea :)
 

IamLEAM1983

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Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I'm still confused as to why they thought this is a good idea, and I really don't think they understand the MMO space like they think they do.

I'm utterly underwhelmed by these screen shorts, yeah they look pretty, but it just looks...dead to me. There's nothing in them that show how lively the game will be or even the 'character' of the game.
It's a profit deal attempt. ZeniMax's shareholders aren't all gamers, and they're probably going "You know this... World of Craft of... War, thing the kids play? That makes money, right? So let's make that with our own IP!"

As with The Old Republic, I'm fairly sure it'll fold within the first year and default to freemium. That's despite the sheer fanbase of the Elder Scrolls series. People tend to like and love Tamriel and its constituents because it's a place that can be explored at one's own pace. A single-player MMO with a single fee attached to it. I'm not sure they'll make the jump to an MMO all that easily.

Plus, underlining the fact that this is just an attempt is the fact that this is made from a different team altogether. Elder Scrolls Online doesn't seem like it will bother the production status of whatever comes next - either Fallout 4 or Elder Scrolls VI.
 

Fiz_The_Toaster

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IamLEAM1983 said:
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I'm still confused as to why they thought this is a good idea, and I really don't think they understand the MMO space like they think they do.

I'm utterly underwhelmed by these screen shorts, yeah they look pretty, but it just looks...dead to me. There's nothing in them that show how lively the game will be or even the 'character' of the game.
It's a profit deal attempt. ZeniMax's shareholders aren't all gamers, and they're probably going "You know this... World of Craft of... War, thing the kids play? That makes money, right? So let's make that with our own IP!"

As with The Old Republic, I'm fairly sure it'll fold within the first year and default to freemium. That's despite the sheer fanbase of the Elder Scrolls series. People tend to like and love Tamriel and its constituents because it's a place that can be explored at one's own pace. A single-player MMO with a single fee attached to it. I'm not sure they'll make the jump to an MMO all that easily.

Plus, underlining the fact that this is just an attempt is the fact that this is made from a different team altogether. Elder Scrolls Online doesn't seem like it will bother the production status of whatever comes next - either Fallout 4 or Elder Scrolls VI.
I don't expect it to last longer than that either, and the cynical side of me totally thinks it's a cash grab.

If I remember right, I think they said they were gonna make it because the fans have been wanting an Elder Scrolls MMO for a while, so they're doing them a solid with this game. I'm not sure that's a good idea since it's a single player game and I have no idea how they're gonna translate that in a MMO genre.

I would imagine that a different team would be working on this, and I would assume that someone from the production team that has worked on TES would look in just to see if they're close to what the single player game is supposed to be.
 

Do4600

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I'm not sure I can say anything about this until I see the UI. Screen shots are nice but it's the mode of gameplay that will make or break this game for me, not the art style. A UI provides vital clues into that mystery.
 

Piorn

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So I heard it's going to have a skill bar and basic mechanics like classic MMOs?
Because that doesn't sound like an Elder Scrolls game to me.

Just saying, mechanics don't make an MMO, Multiplayer does. Just Look at Dark Souls.
 

Jezzascmezza

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Can't say I'm a big man of the slightly cartoonish style, but I do like the variety in the landscapes presented. It'd be cool if this was set across the entirety of Tamriel.
 

Kinguendo

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To be fair, The Elder Scrolls does bounce around the centuries quite a bit already. Skyrim is centuries after the events of Oblivion and there is barely any mention of your actions in Oblivion in Skyrim, the only one I can remember is when you summon Lucien LeChances ghost and he mentions "someone" he knew when he still lived.
 

I.Muir

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What a waste of millions of dollars that could be spent making good video games

Too bad they the greedy bastards want a game with a continuous payment system and cash shops
 

Li Mu

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Kinguendo said:
To be fair, The Elder Scrolls does bounce around the centuries quite a bit already. Skyrim is centuries after the events of Oblivion and there is barely any mention of your actions in Oblivion in Skyrim, the only one I can remember is when you summon Lucien LeChances ghost and he mentions "someone" he knew when he still lived.
True, but would it really make sense for characters to keep refering to something which happened before most of them were born? I don't wander around saying to friends, "Hey, remember when Cyrus, ruler of Persia in 550BCE, was killed fighting the Massagetae tribe beyond the river Oxus?" Nobody gives a shit about that.
I guess in the same way that the Skyrim characters wouldn't give a shit about some crap which happened 200 years before they were born.


It is, however, mentioned in quite a few ingame books.
 

Kinguendo

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Li Mu said:
Kinguendo said:
To be fair, The Elder Scrolls does bounce around the centuries quite a bit already. Skyrim is centuries after the events of Oblivion and there is barely any mention of your actions in Oblivion in Skyrim, the only one I can remember is when you summon Lucien LeChances ghost and he mentions "someone" he knew when he still lived.
True, but would it really make sense for characters to keep refering to something which happened before most of them were born? I don't wander around saying to friends, "Hey, remember when Cyrus, ruler of Persia in 550BCE, was killed fighting the Massagetae tribe beyond the river Oxus?" Nobody gives a shit about that.
I guess in the same way that the Skyrim characters wouldn't give a shit about some crap which happened 200 years before they were born.


It is, however, mentioned in quite a few ingame books.
I wouldnt expect all of them to talk about it... but scholars? Quest givers? Given the dragon situation and the events at the end of Oblivion it seems somewhat apt to mention it.

Also, Tamriel is incredibly isolated. There are many other continents with intelligent life on them and Tamriel does NOT engage with them at all, their entire world news is about their own continent and the Oblivion event was the most significant event to happen to them in a looooong time and is the reason for the tensions that caused the Civil War in Skyrim... it is not some random trivia, its relevent yet it doesnt get a mention. Ignorance of information is alive and well in the people of Skyrim... there is no reason to suspect that the people would be more enlightened if you went even further back in their history.
 

LordNerevar

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yes EVE is like if a Space Sim and MMO had a kid :)

Also yeah I would kill for a fantasy MMO that brought something new to the table and wasn't WoW or GW. From what I have seen GW2 does mix things up a bit, but it will be a while before we some true innovation in the genre.
 

LordNerevar

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DugMachine said:
LordNerevar said:
DugMachine said:
There is too much Daystar in this thread. MY HEAD IS SPINNING

OT: Hmm seems like they're going for that gritty but cartoonish look? I'll probably try it out once it's out as I've been looking for a new MMO that's not GW2 or WoW
ever tried EVE?
Let me correct myself haha. I want that style with the swords and magic. So like WoW and GW2 but.. not GW2 and WoW if that makes sense?

EVE is spaceships and what not amirite?
yes EVE is like if a Space Sim and MMO had a kid :) It differentiates itself from other MMO's through use of unique game mechanics as well as the most player freedom in the genre and perhaps in all of gaming itself.

Also yeah I would kill for a fantasy MMO that brought something new to the table and wasn't WoW or GW. From what I have seen GW2 does mix things up a bit, but it will be a while before we see some true innovation in the genre.

EDIT: I accidentally posted the above post without quoting and i don't know how to remove it. lol
 

Andy Chalk

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evilneko said:
Andy Chalk said:
There's admittedly not much to see here and if it wasn't for the presence of the Ordinator, the Centurion Sphere and the guy in the Nord helmet, they'd be entirely indistinguishable from just about every other generic fantasy MMO/RPG on the market.
Par for the course for TES. Vanilla be thy name. Maybe with a few sprinkles here and there, but vanilla nonetheless.
What games were you playing, because they weren't the same ones as me. Oblivion might have been a bit on the "high-fantasy LotR-alike" side of things, but you'll have to remind me what was so "vanilla" about Silt Striders, Bonemold Armour, Spanish-sounding jungle- and desert-dwelling gypsy tiger people, Dragon-slaying via bellowing their own language at them, steampunk Elves, cockney daemon-worshipping Elves, and a world history that is equal parts Viking, Imperial Roman, and Japanese Shogunate?
 

LongMuckDong

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My main question is how does the combat hold up compared to GW2... I get *bad* shivvers when they describe the combat as 'very Elder Scrolls like' as the combat in the Elder Scrolls has always been it's weakest point, even in Skyrim.

GW2's dodge/fast pace aoe-ranged targeting/tactical combos are great.. if ESO can at least match GW2 in the combat (or even a tiny bit worse, since it's Elder Scrolls after all..) I'll buy it day one.

Now, if they pull a buy AND sub release.. then it will be a wait and see how it pans out perhaps.. it would make more sense for them to drop a Buy and Cash Shop like Anet's style IMO.. the inertia going back to paying a sub would be too much for me for sure.
 

likalaruku

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Sounds like someone woke up on the smarmy side of the bed this morning.

This is one of the ::checks list:: six MMORPGs I'm looking forward to next year. Since I play almost nothing but RPGs, I'm not as hard to please. My primary concern is whether or not it has a story to it & whether or not there will be giant mushrooms.
 

Vicarious Reality

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Oh god, someone please tell me that Skyrim does not use the same third person camera angle as Fallout NV and this game
So bloody unintuitive
At least in the witcher i could switch sides when i got bored

I see now that it does look squishier than normal beth games, rather small difference
Disssturbing, seeing how games got all unnaturally blurry and soft looking around -04
Reminds me of that CGI monster movement thing movies do where they move disturbingly smoothly

Water and lava looks great, not the flames coming out of that fat daedroth though

What is that skeleton robot thing supposed to be? wtf
 

OpticalJunction

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Well I'm impressed. The screenshots look quite lovely. I agree with the poster who said gameplay mechanics are more important though, and that guild wars 2 has set the bar. They need to somehow surpass or at least equal GW2 in terms of intuitive design.