Nintendo Shares Drop the Most in Two Years

[Allspice]

I carry around my phone and my 3DS everywhere. It's not that hard.

Even though it's not about Sony, it's still the same situation so it's pertinent to the discussion. They have their own store that requires you to have their consoles and so does Nintendo. If you want legal access to those games, buy a 3DS/PSV.

You'd need to be a gamer to want those kind of extras though. You wouldn't expect a non gamer to go out of their way to make sure their phone has those things to play games they'd never play, would you? Not to mention the last time I went to get a new phone, I looked specifically for a smartphone that had buttons and none of them did. I don't know if it's just my local store didn't stock them or what but there weren't any.
And yes, you can play turn based games with touchscreens fairly easily, but there is not much else that works very well.

Also, are you saying that carrying around a controller for your phone is easier than having a 3DS/PSV with you? That's not what you're saying, right?

Most gamers invest mostly into their home platform, since for most, this is where they spend most of their gaming time, as opposed to just killing time while on the go.

An outside controller is a hassle, but there are some that actually wrap around tablets and smartphones of standard sizes, making them a but more bulky, but still mobile enough.

If you want to get such a gaming android device, I suggest checking at online stores.

I'm a gamer, and my smartphone seems to do just as well my PSP, GBA, and GBC used to do, so I don't see what extras does a 3DS give me, except eye-strain.

I guess I'm the exception then, I spend quite a bit of time playing my handhelds no matter where I am. I love the games on them just as much as my console and PC games, the time I spend on all of them is about equal. I only muck about with my phone if I have no other option.

How would you use a controller with a phone anyway? Do you hold the phone with one hand and the controller in the other? Prop the phone up on something...?

I guess that's the difference. I don't like using my phone for real gaming sessions, it doesn't work for me. The only things it works for are casual time wasters that get boring quickly. I'd rather stick to handhelds that were made specifically for the purpose of gaming. I can tell that's not a popular opinion and most would rather see handhelds die out completely, but that's how I feel.

 

[WeepingAngels]

I am pretty confused here jeffers.

So the 3DS is in indirect competition with smartphones, tablets and the HD Twins. Right?

So you say that the fact that it's selling more than the HD Twins is an important consideration but that it's selling less than smartphones and tablets (also indirect competition) is not an important consideration.

Also, one minute you are telling us that the 3DS isn't selling as well as the DS because of the recession and gaming sales are down all over but then you are telling us how Pokemon B&W was the fastest selling Pokemon game ever. Which is it?

 

[lacktheknack]

Just drop from the console business already Nintendo , we all want to play your cool franchises, but let's face it, we cant't stand your crappy consoles.

If you were to say "WHO'S WITH ME?" you'd probably get a chorus of particularly embarrassed crickets.

OT: Well, Nintendo DID say they were feeling some pressure. 3DS ought to keep them afloat for a good while, though.

 

[Something Amyss]

Perhaps you'd like to check the sales data and trends for previous Pokemon games then? Because every time a Pokemon game has been released, it's resulted in a huge surge in handheld sales for Nintendo. Black and White sold more in the first 24 hours of release than any prior Pokemon game. You really think the series' debut into 3D, with all the hype and marketing going on atm, won't move units for Nintendo?

But will it move consoles?

Given that they're not making mobiles, no they're not.

I'm sorry, when did they stop making the DS line of mobile gaming devices? Man, they must REALLY be in trouble if they've already dropped even the upcoming 2DS.

Actually, that's not quite true. The smartphone gaming market is in a bit of a quandary, with the majority of games released failing to sell well at all, and a few mega-hits making up the majority of the money. When smartphone users can get Angry Birds and Doodejump, they don't particularly need anything else, which is having a very negative effect on developers trying to release new games. More importantly, Nintendo is making good money on each 3DS game sold (around 30% royalties on third-party games, and 100% on first-party), which at around £30 a pop is good money. The majority of smartphone users will refuse to pay more than 99p for any smartphone game, and that's if they're willing to pay at all.

I love the ability to shift the standard within a single paragraph. Nintendo is doing awesome when you consider one set of factors and mobile gaming is terrible when you compare that to other, different factors.

Given that people for the most part are stupid, ignorant and given wholly to following herd mentality, you'll forgive me if I find a measure of success based on how those same people feel en masse rather underwhelming. Aliens Colonial Marines was number 1 in the sales charts for weeks here in the UK. That's consumer confidence right there, and that was a turd of a game.

Hey, you're welcome to hate people all you want. You can call them stupid all you want. And yet, it's those same stupid people you hate that Nintendo relies on for sales and is beholden to because of investors. You can't extricate Nintendo from people because you don't like them.

But it does show how far you will go to defend Nintendo. You will ignore the very consumer base if it's not convenient to you.

Game reviewers gave GTA IV the best reception of any game in history, despite the game having flaws and problems clear to anyone with a functioning set of thumbs.

And I bet you're as even when Nintendo titles get high aggregates despite flaws and problems clear to anyone with a functioning set of thumbs.

 

[Sean951]

All hail the terrible gaming apocalypse of smart phones? That's what I'm learning from this, and while there are a few I play regularly, over the course of 3 years I have spent maybe $10 combined on apps of all sorts. By comparison, I just spent $300 for the Zelda Wii-U and if I felt the desire and had the money to do so, would also spend a few hundred on the 3DS. I actually had planned to do it over the summer, but a medical emergency took precedence and then I couldn't work for a few months.

 

[NiPah]

The stock market is such a shitty way to gauge success nowadays, given how it runs off hearsay, rumour and generally unsubstantiated info. It's like basing a company's financial success on tarot cards, or tea leaf readings, without the plus side of a decent cup of tea/some pretty pictures.

Be that as it may, not being included in the Nikkei and subsequent stock devaluation is a major blow to the game company and will result in significant changes on the inside. While you may hate the stock market, this is what drives investors to fund the development of those games you love. You have every right to argue the analysts at CLSA are wrong, but their opinions bring billions of dollars (or lack there of) and yours nothing.

Investors aren't going to bet on a horse with a bum leg, you're arguing that the horse can run fine without a bum leg, or hell that it doesn't even have a bum leg in the first place, but those investors disagree.

 

[EvilRoy]

The DS didn't compete against smartphones and tablets and I never said the 3DS is a failure. I object to you saying that the 3DS is outselling it's competition, even though you admit it is competing against smartphones and tablets.

Your words:

How can anyone say that Nintendo has struggled to adapt to smartphones and tablets with a straight face, when the 3DS (Nintendo's product most in competition with smartphones and tablets) has been the best selling games system for months now

I said that it was the Nintendo product most in competition. That is not the same thing as being in direct competition. The PS3 and 360 were the products most in competition with the Wii, but that doesn't mean they were direct competition. In this case, the 3DS is more in competition with smartphones than the PS3, 360 or Wii U are, hence why I put that phrase in my original statement. And yet, despite ostensibly being more in competition with smartphones, and having been repeatedly given a death sentence as a result, the 3DS is not only holding its own, it's outselling all other games hardware.

If you need me to spell it out even further for you: community claims that smartphone market will ensure 3DS dies prematurely, let alone managing to keep up with rest of the gaming hardware industry. 3DS goes on to outsell everything else in the gaming hardware industry.

The reason for that is because, when you actually look at things close up, the 3DS and smartphones serve very different markets, and are thus able to coexist. The 3DS' success is proof of this. The fact it's now selling more per month than the PS3 or 360 should put that argument beyond refute. An unsuccessful system does not regularly outsell the HD twins on a monthly basis.

On the contrary. The failure of the 3DS to outsell the DS is something of a cause for concern, as the number of people who are able to afford a handheld gaming device should have increased since the effective lifetime of the DS. It indicates that not only have those people who originally purchased the DS not upgraded, but that the 3DS is not attracting new customers.

Not really. There's been a global recession since the time of the DS, and people have got less disposable income now. I don't know if you've noticed, but gaming sales across the board have been down for a while now. Until the world economy gets back to pre-2008 levels of stability, you're going to see less demand for luxury products.

More on-point, anyone who really expected the 3DS to outsell the DS is ignorant of how things work in the games industry. The DS is the second best selling system of all time, and only a couple of million separate it from the PS2. That's the result of catching lightning in the bottle. Nintendo released the perfect product at the perfect time, and it caught on in just the right way. The definition of lightning in the bottle is that it's impossible to catch it two times in a row. Once again, the fact that the 3DS is still tracking near the DS, despite the lacklustre world economy, and the original DS' nigh-unassailable position in terms of hardware sales, is not a bad thing. If you're asking Nintendo to better the DS in terms of sales, you're essentially throwing down the gauntlet and demanding they make the best selling system in the history of gaming. That is not something you can plan for. Such things happen because they are released at the right time.

As far as the business world is concerned, if you aren't doing better then you're doing worse. Sony suffered for the PS3 failing to outdo the PS2, as will Nintendo for the 3DS and WiiU failing to outdo their predecessors. That failure will be reflected in their stock prices, and as much as you may personally dislike the stock market, it is the arena in which the success or failure of companies is ultimately decided.

Similarly, the recession has been officially 'over' for some time now. Allowances would be made for reduced company performance during such a time, but the fact that Nintendos stock has begun to dip is indicative of that grace period being over.

 

[Mr.Mattress]

This is exactly why I think Nintendo should go Private (Like Valve): Stocks and Shares are all Short Term, Get-Rich-Quick Schemes that when people don't make money from them, the company fails and Dies. If they were Private, however, Like Valve, then they would no longer worry about what leeches think, and be free to do what they want (And be probably even more profitable).

 

[Aiddon_v1legacy]

This is exactly why I think Nintendo should go Private (Like Valve): Stocks and Shares are all Short Term, Get-Rich-Quick Schemes that when people don't make money from them, the company fails and Dies. If they were Private, however, Like Valve, then they would no longer worry about what leeches think, and be free to do what they want (And be probably even more profitable).

Thing is, Japanese business practices are VERY different from Western ones. In Japan, stockholders tend not to influence decisions much.

 

[WeepingAngels]

Nintendo in a nutshell: Good software, iffy to bad hardware.
They released bad hardware without the software to back it up.
Verdict:
## RELEASE SOME GOD DAMN GAMES AND YOU WILL PRINT MONEY AGAIN, GENIUS ##

and when i say "some games", i mean some good ones, none of this wii sports malarkey.

Wii Sports/Resort was awesome and it sold a whole lot of Wii's. It is the only Wii game I still play.

 

[The Apple BOOM]

Nintendo in a nutshell: Good software, iffy to bad hardware.

Imma let you finish, but no not really.

The hardware with the best failure rate is iffy to bad? Even though I don't have hard numbers in front on me, I can at least say that Red Ring of Death is a well known phrase.

 

[Dragonbums]

They are not releasing enough Mario/Zelda titles fast enough, that's why. I can't believe Nintendo is in such a position despite having some of the most guaranteed-to-print-money franchises/IPs in the world. The production of those games needs to be sped up.

So you would rather they make shit Mario and Zelda games for the sake of speed as opposed to taking 5 years to make a quality addition to the series?

Remind me why people here on the Escapist complain about CoD and Assassins Creed again?

Complaints about CoD/AssCreed are irrelevant to their sales, those games will continue to sell as long as the formula keeps working. Ubisoft even stated they hope to reach AssCreed 10 [http://www.computerandvideogames.com/353193/ubisoft-hopes-to-reach-assassins-creed-10/] as long as the franchise can keep it's annual release cycle up. CoD is in a similar position.

But Treyarch/Activision/Ubisoft aren't in deep shit at the moment, they can afford to take their time. Nintendo have to so something quickly because the further their stocks decline, the harder it becomes to recover. Mario/Zelda is an easy way to recover. They don't have to aim for the stars with those franchises, they just need to utilize their power to print money for now. It's a quick solution to give them a little boost with Wii U sales. Once their stock is in the green, they can start taking more time with higher quality Mario/Zelda reboots & sequels, it'll be just like ol' times.

If you have such an insanely devoted fanbase who will buy anything from your franchise regardless of quality (at this point), you have to put them to use in case of an emergency. This is that emergency.

Nintendo is in no emergency that they have to start releasing crap games.

I'm actually glad that they respect their fans enough to take their time and put out quality titles as opposed to just milking their franchises yearly just to meat short term goal assests.

They have been making some good money anyway with the 3DS and the slew of games that have come out for it. Despite the fact that for nearly 2 years the system was practically as barren as the Wii U is right now.
Not only that, all of the games are quality. Something that is hit and miss with yearly releases. They didn't rush anything out of the gate. They simply bide their time and honed whatever games they had in production and it payed off.

This short term quick fix nonsense has been the end of many studios this gen. But I guess we never learn.

 

[Dragonbums]

[

But will it move consoles?

http://www.siliconera.com/2013/07/18/animal-crossing-new-leaf-sells-over-500000-in-u-s-boosts-3ds-sales/

 

[major_chaos]

Nintendo have made their older games available. It's called the Virtual Console. You can buy older games to play on Wii, 3DS and Wii U, at a fraction of what they'd cost on eBay.

Its a good thing they don't cost much, seeing as you have to rebuy them if your console dies. Really it amuses me just how slow Nintendo is to enbrace this gosh darn newfangled "internet" thing they heard about.

OT: Nintendo saw where the money was and embraced the casual market and told me and my gaming friends to fuck off, so we did. And now Nintendo is finding out that the gimmick loving casual crowd is easily distracted and has already moved on to the next shiny object, leaving them with a console that appeals only the hardest of hardcore fans. Although its never too late, after all the 3DS didn't exactly blow me away at launch, but now it has a fairly decent library, so maybe someday the WiiU will follow that example have more than one worthwhile game.

 

[Strazdas]

as was pointed out, the shares were in a rise recently a lot and thus a drop is to be expected. however that big of a drop wasnt.

Most people do not buy smartphones specifically to game. They just happen to play some games on the phones they already own. Just like how most people don't sign up to Facebook specifically to pay games, they just dabble in it once they already have an account. People who buy the 3DS specifically do so to pay games, and that is a completely different market to the sort of market smartphones are selling to.

Anecdotical evidence i know but very much this. To me gaming on a phone was as much alien as taking a walk on mars. Untill i got gifted a smartphone. now playing some hill climb racing while im on a 3 hour long train ride home has became quite acceptable experience. Though got to admit while i ahvent tried too many games 99% of them seems so utter crap it wouldnt have passed in atari days gameplay wise. even among the touted titles, i tried fruit ninja and though its ridiculous how anyone can like it to begin with. at least angry birds i can understand as a "lets see what i can destroy" thing.
If i were to buy a portable gaming device though, smartphones wouldnt even be on a list.

Nintendo in a nutshell: Good software, iffy to bad hardware.
They released bad hardware without the software to back it up.
Verdict:
## RELEASE SOME GOD DAMN GAMES AND YOU WILL PRINT MONEY AGAIN, GENIUS ##

and when i say "some games", i mean some good ones, none of this wii sports malarkey.

Wii Sports/Resort was awesome and it sold a whole lot of Wii's. It is the only Wii game I still play.

Wii Sports/resort, if we combine the two of them numbers, is the most selling game of all time, ever. but i usually dont. just like i dont count super mario bros. because i dont think its fair to count bundled games, as there are plenty of people who buy the console and dont even play that game, but still counts as sold game for them. I know i dont play those "Free games" i get with my GPU, but they still count it as game sold.

 

[WeepingAngels]

as was pointed out, the shares were in a rise recently a lot and thus a drop is to be expected. however that big of a drop wasnt.

Most people do not buy smartphones specifically to game. They just happen to play some games on the phones they already own. Just like how most people don't sign up to Facebook specifically to pay games, they just dabble in it once they already have an account. People who buy the 3DS specifically do so to pay games, and that is a completely different market to the sort of market smartphones are selling to.

Anecdotical evidence i know but very much this. To me gaming on a phone was as much alien as taking a walk on mars. Untill i got gifted a smartphone. now playing some hill climb racing while im on a 3 hour long train ride home has became quite acceptable experience. Though got to admit while i ahvent tried too many games 99% of them seems so utter crap it wouldnt have passed in atari days gameplay wise. even among the touted titles, i tried fruit ninja and though its ridiculous how anyone can like it to begin with. at least angry birds i can understand as a "lets see what i can destroy" thing.
If i were to buy a portable gaming device though, smartphones wouldnt even be on a list.

Nintendo in a nutshell: Good software, iffy to bad hardware.
They released bad hardware without the software to back it up.
Verdict:
## RELEASE SOME GOD DAMN GAMES AND YOU WILL PRINT MONEY AGAIN, GENIUS ##

and when i say "some games", i mean some good ones, none of this wii sports malarkey.

Wii Sports/Resort was awesome and it sold a whole lot of Wii's. It is the only Wii game I still play.

Wii Sports/resort, if we combine the two of them numbers, is the most selling game of all time, ever. but i usually dont. just like i dont count super mario bros. because i dont think its fair to count bundled games, as there are plenty of people who buy the console and dont even play that game, but still counts as sold game for them. I know i dont play those "Free games" i get with my GPU, but they still count it as game sold.

What percentage of Wii owners do you think didn't play Wii Sports?

 

[Ishal]

They are not releasing enough Mario/Zelda titles fast enough, that's why. I can't believe Nintendo is in such a position despite having some of the most guaranteed-to-print-money franchises/IPs in the world. The production of those games needs to be sped up.

So you would rather they make shit Mario and Zelda games for the sake of speed as opposed to taking 5 years to make a quality addition to the series?

Remind me why people here on the Escapist complain about CoD and Assassins Creed again?

Except that they did do that, what do you think the New Super Mario Bros. games were?

 

[Dragonbums]

They are not releasing enough Mario/Zelda titles fast enough, that's why. I can't believe Nintendo is in such a position despite having some of the most guaranteed-to-print-money franchises/IPs in the world. The production of those games needs to be sped up.

So you would rather they make shit Mario and Zelda games for the sake of speed as opposed to taking 5 years to make a quality addition to the series?

Remind me why people here on the Escapist complain about CoD and Assassins Creed again?

Except that they did do that, what do you think the New Super Mario Bros. games were?

A call back from the original play style of Mario games.

and if I remember correctly they still only come out with one of those games per system.

They had one on the DS, one on the Wii, one on the 3DS, and one on the Wii U. That's at least a 4 year time gap between those two games (depending on release date.) which means that they still take their time making those games. Are they the same? Yeah, but they are anything but churned out and the level designs are as smart and difficult as ever.