Nolan Calls Marvel-Bashing Quote "Inaccurate" - Update

MovieBob

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Nolan Calls Marvel-Bashing Quote "Inaccurate" - Update


Did the Dark Knight director take a cheap shot at the competition while promoting Interstellar?

Update: BuzzFeed News is reporting [http://www.buzzfeed.com/adambvary/christopher-nolan-denies-marvel-studios-dig] that a quote attributed to him in a Guardian profile about the Marvel Studios superhero productions not being "real films" because of their post-credits codas does not reflect his real views on the subject: "The quote is inaccurate," the Interstellar filmmaker reportedly told BuzzFeed, after clarifying that "I would never say someone else's film isn't 'a real film.'"

Elsewhere, Badass Digest (one of the many sites along with this one to run stories based on the quote) points out [http://badassdigest.com/2014/11/05/christopher-nolan-the-quote-is-inaccurate/] that the Guardian quote is actually an out of context second-hand account of Nolan's words on the matter from Zack Snyder.

Original Story: Christopher Nolan may have left the superhero movie scene behind (he's not listed as a producer of any further DC Comics properties after distinguised competition. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/escape-to-the-movies/7521-Man-of-Steel]

In a lengthy Man of Steel. [http://www.theguardian.com/film/2014/nov/04/-sp-christopher-nolan-interstellar-rebooted-blockbuster] According to Nolan, his response was:

"A real movie wouldn't do that."

Ever since the original Iron Man ended with a "secret" scene wherein Nick Fury goofing around [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/escape-to-the-movies/1604-Avengers-Assemble] have been a staple of the Marvel Cinematic Universe; while Nolan's superhero adaptations (encompassing the Dark Knight Trilogy and the first Man of Steel) were frequently positioned as a "dark and gritty" alternative in the fandom press.

At this time, there has been no indication as to whether Nolan's particular distaste for such scenes will continue to carry over into the post-Man of Steel DC Universe films, [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/138059-DC-Announces-Wonder-Woman-Green-Lantern-6-Other-Films-Through-2020] including Zack Snyder's Dawn of Justice and Justice League features which take place directly after the Superman reboot.


Sources: The Guardian [http://www.buzzfeed.com/adambvary/christopher-nolan-denies-marvel-studios-dig]


[http://www.escapistmagazine.com/movies-and-tv/]

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RicoADF

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Eh the title of this article is a bit misleading, he didn't specify Marvel Films but rather the scene/clip idea which other film companies do as well now a days, and to be honest while I like those clips I can't be against Nolan having a different opinion.

Then again I don't find comic movies as anything special (their often good movies don't get me wrong just not special) so I wouldn't care if he was targeting comic movies specifically.
 

Sniper Team 4

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I like Marvel's movies better than the ones Nolan did. I'm sorry, but his were just too dark and depressing for my tastes. Having those little stingers at the end are always something I look forward to because a lot of the times, they're the best part of the movie. Or at least the best joke.

I supposed the first Batman movie had it's own version of this when the Joker's card was revealed at the end of the movie...
 

Covarr

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Seeing as these movies are often just advertisements for each other (particularly the first Captain America and Iron Man 2), and seeing as these post-credits bumps are always just ads for future Marvel movies, I can definitely see where he's coming from.

On the other hand, his involvement in Man of Steel makes it difficult to take anything he says about superhero movies seriously.

P.S. Thanks
 

Bedinsis

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Didn't Batman Begins end with Commissioner Gordon finding a mysterious calling card of a new criminal? The joker from a standard deck of cards?
 

RJ 17

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Covarr said:
and seeing as these post-credits bumps are always just ads for future Marvel movies
Indeed, I'm still looking forward to Marvel's little known hero Shawarma Man to make his theatrical debut! :p
 

elvor0

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Bedinsis said:
Didn't Batman Begins end with Commissioner Gordon finding a mysterious calling card of a new criminal? The joker from a standard deck of cards?
End of the movie though, not end of credits, plus that actually happened in Batman: Year One

OT: Yeah get over yourself Nolan, just because you made some crime movies that you decided to call Batman, two of which were a bit shakey at best, and a shaky Superman movie, I don't think you can really decide what constitues a "real" movie.

Sniper Team 4 said:
I like Marvel's movies better than the ones Nolan did. I'm sorry, but his were just too dark and depressing for my tastes. Having those little stingers at the end are always something I look forward to because a lot of the times, they're the best part of the movie. Or at least the best joke.

I supposed the first Batman movie had it's own version of this when the Joker's card was revealed at the end of the movie...
Ugh, tell me about, I like dark and gritty, but Noalns movies are so dark and depressing even the sodding Joker can't crack a joke.
 

Lethos

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I feel like you're extrapolating a lot here. But any excuse to go after a guy who's films you don't like, right?
 

Dark Knifer

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I find it weird how so many people want to discredit something by not saying it real. Why can't you just say Ï don't like this"instead of Ï don't like this so its not a 'real' thing".

Seems pointless and factually incorrect.
 

Ukomba

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Hey Nolan, "Why so serious?"

The doesn't bode well for the DC 'true movies'.
 

josemlopes

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SHOTS FIRED!
OH SNAP!
OH NO YOU DIDN'T!
BURN!







Yeah, lets not take this over proportion please
 

EssThree

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I dig the hell out of Nolan's films to the point of bordering on fanboy territory. But man, that was really a childish thing to say.

Some books have teasers for the next entry in their series at the end, does that make them not real books?
 

Adam Jensen_v1legacy

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He didn't mean that in the literal sense. You have to understand that some of these directors can be really eccentric. Nolan has his own ideas about what shouldn't go in a movie. Tarantino is the same way. I think he just meant that post-credit scenes are dumb. And I tend to agree.
 

Shamanic Rhythm

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I think Bettridge's law of headlines applies to this one.

If someone asks me when I'm cooking dinner to make spaghetti carbonara with cream and I say 'Real spaghetti carbonara is not made with cream', that is not in any way equivalent to making a public statement that takes a swipe at anyone who does make it with cream.
 

senkus

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Adam Jensen said:
He didn't mean that in the literal sense. You have to understand that some of these directors can be really eccentric. Nolan has his own ideas about what shouldn't go in a movie. Tarantino is the same way. I think he just meant that post-credit scenes are dumb.
This exactly. I can't wrap my head around why MovieBob would make this a story... except that he is now in the clickbait* business.

*I mean the bad type, if you were going to link me to this No Right Discussion [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/no-right-answer/9704].
 

Shoggoth2588

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To that, I would tell Nolan that a Batman movie wouldn't involve Batman quitting being Batman under any circumstance. I don't see Batman taking the time out to draw his insignia on a wall in lighter-fluid when he could be using that same time to save the city. Otherwise, his opinion is his own and I don't really care.
 

Aiddon_v1legacy

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No, no he didn't; the producers the article mentioned said Marvel. Nolan just said that post-credits scenes like that are stupid. And he's right
 

sirjeffofshort

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Why would he care if anyone stays through the end of the credits? His name is first. Speaking for myself and a lot of friends in the industry, I know these scenes as well as their many variations (blooper reels over the credits in a comedy movie etc.) started as a clever bonus for fans willing to sit through the credits. Nobody actually reads them, obviously, we all know that, but for the people that pour themselves into these films, on some levels as much as some of the more visible players, it's a huge sign of respect when people sit through the few seconds their name is on screen, even if its for superficial reasons.

Personal crusades aside, I think Nolan's opinion is fairly narrow minded and worded in a way that it was definitely supposed to sting someone. He could have just said that he doesn't like stingers, or that he doesn't feel like it would fit well in the movies he's trying to make. That's fine, that's an artistic decision I can respect, but he specifically chose to phrase it in a way that would hurt someone. Maybe Marvel, maybe not, but you don't just tell a story like that, in the way he did (assuming the reporting is totally accurate), without wanting someone to feel the hurt of your words. Kinda childish if you ask me.
 

Ticklefist

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Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
 

Neurotic Void Melody

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This is a silly headline. Are you trying to get a rise out of Marvel fans?
I like both styles of superhero movie so it makes no difference. Any member of the creative industry has specific tastes and ideas. Surely this is some stirring of the fanboy shit pot, and i think we all know who has to lick the spoon this time...
 

V4Viewtiful

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Aiddon said:
No, no he didn't; the producers the article mentioned said Marvel. Nolan just said that post-credits scenes like that are stupid. And he's right
Why? It doesn't take away from a movie it can be important for fun or just a reward for sticking around which people do after credits anyway.

You know what's also stupid? Tints. Why who cares doesn't need an answer.

That sentence isn't true but that's what the opinion of PCS being "stupid" amounts to. Some of the best movies have those scenes and to speak in such a general term for a director of his caliber is insulting.

I shcaky cam is stupid too but it can be used to great effect, same with this.
 

Atmos Duality

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ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
Well yeah, every movie is a manufactured product.
I don't see too many naturally occurring motion pictures. (though that'd be some surreal shit if they did)

Even so, Marvel's recent films are still far more palpable than the half-digested pigshit that was Man of Steel and Green Lantern. Good God, I can't believe I let myself get roped into watching that garbage.
 

V4Viewtiful

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ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
With that logic MOS is the is Fine Dinnig with toddlers, a pretentious mess.
 

Ruisu

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You know what this article title is missing? Something like a lot of "?????!!!!!!1111!!!". That would bait even more people to rage about DC movies and Nolan. Ugh.
 

Vigormortis

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Lethos said:
I feel like you're extrapolating a lot here. But any excuse to go after a guy who's films you don't like, right?
Of course he is. He has some personal vendetta against Nolan and isn't above using needlessly misleading headlines to get a rise out of Marvel fans.

If there's one thing the "clique" of this forum loves to hate just as much as #GamerGate, Steam, Call of Duty, and DC Movies, it's Christopher Nolan.

Nolan was asked about post-credit stingers; notably in the context of stingers designed to be ads for out-of-series films. And in that context, I partly agree with him. He probably could have worded his comment a bit better, but I understand what he was trying to say.

He by no means said Marvel's current crop of films aren't real films.

This is just low, Bob. You're better than this.
 

lacktheknack

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Covarr said:
Seeing as these movies are often just advertisements for each other (particularly the first Captain America and Iron Man 2), and seeing as these post-credits bumps are always just ads for future Marvel movies, I can definitely see where he's coming from.
We're getting another Howard the Duck movie? Oh, for the love of-
 

Ticklefist

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Atmos Duality said:
ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
Well yeah, every movie is a manufactured product.
I don't see too many naturally occurring motion pictures. (though that'd be some surreal shit if they did)

Even so, Marvel's recent films are still far more palpable than the half-digested pigshit that was Man of Steel and Green Lantern. Good God, I can't believe I let myself get roped into watching that garbage.
V4Viewtiful said:
ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
With that logic MOS is the is Fine Dinnig with toddlers, a pretentious mess.
Yeah I'm not really nuts about the DC movies either. I just think it's funny how we stopped caring that our dumb summer action movies were still in fact dumb summer action movies the moment they began featuring the cartoon characters of our youth.
 

SKBPinkie

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No. No, he fucking didn't, and you know he didn't.

Stop posting POS clickbait bullshit.
 

V4Viewtiful

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Vigormortis said:
He by no means said Marvel's current crop of films aren't real films.
\but the statement was general enough to hit the Marvel films with no actual explanation. It's to broad a statement to make of a film technique mostly used by (in a certain way) his competitors. And even if it wasn't maybe some other director should tell Nolan that films that uses filters like blue, orange and grey aren't films? It amounts to the same thing.
 

PunkRex

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I admit maybe Bob's stretching things a bit but it's still an odd thing for Nolan to say, in fact I'd go as far as to say it was rather arrogant.
 

RealRT

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Real movies, for one, put their title cards before the movie, not after.
Why the hell does his opinion really matter? It's been obvious for years that Nolan, while not a bad filmmaker (I enjoyed Inception quite a lot) can't make a comic book movie even if his life depended on it. The fact that he had Goyer write scripts for his Batman movies and Man of Steel only serves to support this.
 

SonOfVoorhees

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Being that the last Batman movie was shit, you wonder why he has the balls to insult other hero movies? Personally i wonder if he is trying to distant himself from them to look like he is a "proper serious" director.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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It'd be nice if they stopped trying so hard to make a wheel square and just leave the damn fiction mostly intact instead of trying to inflict their bad fan fiction on us all....
 

deathbydeath

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ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
Boom, roasted. And pretty much accurate.

OP: Bob, stop reading into that too much; it doesn't really matter. Nolan isn't the type of person who buys tickets for the MCU films*, and this isn't half as scathing as what people like Confused Matthew [http://confusedmatthew.com/matthews-marvel-madness.html] have (rightly) said about the enterprise. I would stop generating clickbait, but it feels sort of hollow since I did indeed click on it and am writing this comment. Whatever, keep on doing what you do I guess.

tl;dr: Just because Christopher Nolan made good superhero movies and doesn't care for bland ones doesn't mean you have to freak the fuck out.

*- The Michael Bay Audience[sup]TM[/sup] is. (Oh snap!)
 

Vigormortis

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V4Viewtiful said:
\but the statement was general enough to hit the Marvel films with no actual explanation. It's to broad a statement to make of a film technique mostly used by (in a certain way) his competitors. And even if it wasn't maybe some other director should tell Nolan that films that uses filters like blue, orange and grey aren't films? It amounts to the same thing.
Except...no it wasn't. It was a specific response to a very narrow question.

Bob and other Marvel fans are taking umbrage over nothing. They're looking for a reason to lash back at a comment that wasn't targeted at them.

Try reading the actual interview and not Bob's interpretation of it. You'll better understand what it was Nolan was getting at.
 

drkchmst

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Marvel movies are largely too formulaic and are taking too long to get to the climactic infinity gauntlet nonsense. Also the real thanos of titan would never push pawns to get his infinity stones but rather do it himself. End comic book guy rant.
 

V4Viewtiful

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Vigormortis said:
V4Viewtiful said:
\but the statement was general enough to hit the Marvel films with no actual explanation. It's to broad a statement to make of a film technique mostly used by (in a certain way) his competitors. And even if it wasn't maybe some other director should tell Nolan that films that uses filters like blue, orange and grey aren't films? It amounts to the same thing.
Except...no it wasn't. It was a specific response to a very narrow question.

Bob and other Marvel fans are taking umbrage over nothing. They're looking for a reason to lash back at a comment that wasn't targeted at them.
I agree on the question but not the answer, I wouldn't want him to adopt a Marvel style (i like variety) but "real movies don't do that" seems like a overstatement. What is a "Real Movie"? if it's so ridged. But then text rarely conveys tone. Maybe he was joking? or being facetious, if so the writer sucks.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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Click bait is click bait.

Lethos said:
I feel like you're extrapolating a lot here. But any excuse to go after a guy who's films you don't like, right?
My thoughts exactly. Bob will take a pot shot at DC every chance he gets, even if he has nothing to go on. Which is most of the time.
 

LysanderNemoinis

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While I feel it was a little snipe at Marvel, but also something blown way out of proportion, I can kind of agree. In my not so humble opinion, superhero movies (Nolan's included) are to film what Call of Duty is to games: Formulaic, guaranteed hits that require little effort on the creators' or the audience's part. And now we can add constantly churning out at a yearly rate to the comparison pile. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go down into my bunker and wait out several shitstorms at once.
 

Hawki

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LysanderNemoinis said:
While I feel it was a little snipe at Marvel, but also something blown way out of proportion, I can kind of agree. In my not so humble opinion, superhero movies (Nolan's included) are to film what Call of Duty is to games: Formulaic, guaranteed hits that require little effort on the creators' or the audience's part. And now we can add constantly churning out at a yearly rate to the comparison pile. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go down into my bunker and wait out several shitstorms at once.
Unfortunately, unlike CoD, saying anything bad about the MCU is akin to sacrilige. Heck, it's arguably even more bloated than CoD because CoD at least keeps itself to one installment per year.

Anyway, I'd say more, but, well, what else is there to say about the MCU that hasn't been said already? "Ugh." That's all I feel inclined to say about it now. :(

Edit: After skimming through the article, I have to ask, why is this even a thing? The article is about Interstellar. Out of everything the article discusses, a single line is what Movie Bob picks up on to make an article here? Is the Marvel-DC rivalry so shallow that this is what it's come to? Granted, I'm not a superhero fan - I'll like a superhero movie based on whether it's good or not, not whatever its continuity may be, so I'm not one to comment but...seriously?
 

Vigormortis

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V4Viewtiful said:
I agree on the question but not the answer, I wouldn't want him to adopt a Marvel style (i like variety) but "real movies don't do that" seems like a overstatement. What is a "Real Movie"? if it's so ridged. But then text rarely conveys tone. Maybe he was joking? or being facetious, if so the writer sucks.
Could be. And I agree. As I'd said earlier, I kind of agree with his sentiment, but I think he might've been able to word it better.
 

Kajin

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Christopher Nolan can get over his dark and gritty self.
 

Something Amyss

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Master Taffer said:
Well, that's certainly a snotty response.
Eh. I think it as funny. Possibly even just attempted as a bit of humour.

And this is from someone not too impressed with Nolan overall.
RJ Dalton said:
By "real movie" I assume he means "movie I have any interest in making."
When Is he going to make a real movie?
 

ritchards

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Real Movies should not get a tag scene... and, unrelatedly, Man of Steel also didn't have one...
 

Imperioratorex Caprae

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He may not have thought it was tasteful, or perhaps he's pissed he didn't do it first... We're talking comic book movies anyway, they are what they are. I love them and the stingers get me every time because they're little tidbits for hardcore fans. Its not like Marvel did it first either, there are a few non-Marvel movies that do this.
 

Fox12

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ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
Pretty much this. I have no great love for the artificial, production line, anti art nature of modern cinema. It's emberasing, and frankly, I can't blame someone for taking umbridge with modern Hollywood. These movies are getting old.

Nolan knows what he's talking about. Real directors don't add post credit scenes. Real directors rip off satoshi kon and win tons of academy awards. Just ask aronofsky.

....

Ok, so maybe Nolan isn't the best person to make this criticism.
 

LarsInCharge

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Vigormortis said:
Lethos said:
I feel like you're extrapolating a lot here. But any excuse to go after a guy who's films you don't like, right?
Of course he is. He has some personal vendetta against Nolan and isn't above using needlessly misleading headlines to get a rise out of Marvel fans.

If there's one thing the "clique" of this forum loves to hate just as much as #GamerGate, Steam, Call of Duty, and DC Movies, it's Christopher Nolan.

Nolan was asked about post-credit stingers; notably in the context of stingers designed to be ads for out-of-series films. And in that context, I partly agree with him. He probably could have worded his comment a bit better, but I understand what he was trying to say.

He by no means said Marvel's current crop of films aren't real films.

This is just low, Bob. You're better than this.
I know this is a little off-topic but...

Escapist... hates... Steam...???????

One of the biggest hideouts for the PC MASTER RACE on the entire internet (which isn't easy, mind you)... hates Steam...

THE SITE THAT VOTED VALVE AS DEVELOPER OF THE YEAR SO MANY TIMES... hates... Steam...

 

Li Mu

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Who cares? Well, except Bob. Marvel fanboi of the century. "Grrr...someone didn't accord enough praise to Marvel or Whedon...dat makes me maaaad!"
Upon which, Bob puts on his Hulk fists and stomps around his apartment shouting, "BOB SMASH!"


But, to answer your intial question, "Did Christopher Nolan Say Marvel Films Are Not Real Movies?"
No. No he didn't. Misleading the masses, Bob; you Marvel loving Ilya Ehrenburg. He clearly didn't say anything of the sort.
Actually, comparing Bob to Ilya Ehrenburg is misleading in itself, since Ehrenburg was actually skilled at what he did. I'd say that Bob is the Escapists very own Glenn Beck.

Bob's a total hack writer.
 

martyrdrebel27

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You jelly brah? Do we need to send you to the jelly school? The Nolan Batman movies were top notch, but from everythin else I've seen, dc can't make a movie universe, it a decent non-Nolan movie. Just my infallible opinion though.
 

Platypus540

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I don't think people should take this one too seriously. First of all by "real movie" he probably meant "serious" or "artsy" movie, and second it doesn't sound he was being completely serious, just making a jab at a type of movie other than what he likes to make.
 

RavingSturm

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I wouldnt take his comment seriously the same way I dont take Hollywood seriously. I kinda agree with the opinion of Marvel movies being shallow though. The dance number and human chain crap they pulled in GotG really broke the camel's back for me.
 

RedDeadFred

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Pretty sure he's just saying that he doesn't like putting what are essentially commercials at the end of his movies. Also, he doesn't force you to sit through the credits. I don't think he means that they aren't actually real movies, just that real movies shouldn't do it.

Edit: Also, seeing as this thread seems to be devolving in a certain direction, I'd just like to remind everyone that it is perfectly reasonable to like both Marvel and DC movies. Holy shit, right?! Get this, I really liked Nolan's Batman trilogy (the first two especially), but I also like a lot of the Marvel movies (Guardians of the Galaxy is my favourite so far).

Why do so many of you feel the need to either like the dark Nolan films, or the more lighthearted Marvel films? It's okay to enjoy both from time to time! I know I'd get tired if I only watched one type of superhero movie. Maybe that's just me...
 

RavingSturm

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deathbydeath said:
ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
Boom, roasted. And pretty much accurate.

OP: Bob, stop reading into that too much; it doesn't really matter. Nolan isn't the type of person who buys tickets for the MCU films*, and this isn't half as scathing as what people like Confused Matthew [http://confusedmatthew.com/matthews-marvel-madness.html] have (rightly) said about the enterprise. I would stop generating clickbait, but it feels sort of hollow since I did indeed click on it and am writing this comment. Whatever, keep on doing what you do I guess.

tl;dr: Just because Christopher Nolan made good superhero movies and doesn't care for bland ones doesn't mean you have to freak the fuck out.

*- The Michael Bay Audience[sup]TM[/sup] is. (Oh snap!)


Confused Matthew got it right imho. if you hate kissing ass and being treated like shit, Hollywood's not the place for you.
 

katsabas

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I can't be mad at the guy, I have seen Inception at least 30 times (hell, I am watching it right now) and I have reenacted the pencil scene for my friends quite often. He just comes from a different school of storytelling, can't blame him for having an honest opinion. What somebody here said about spaghetti is the closest comparison I can think of.

Edit: Come to think of it, the term 'real movie' is an extremely volatile and subjective one, Once Upon A Time in America forced Leone to retire because it got shit on through cuts and bad reviews back in the day and now people consider it a masterpiece. Change, then some more change and then change again.

Fox12 said:
ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
Pretty much this. I have no great love for the artificial, production line, anti art nature of modern cinema. It's emberasing, and frankly, I can't blame someone for taking umbridge with modern Hollywood. These movies are getting old.

Nolan knows what he's talking about. Real directors don't add post credit scenes. Real directors rip off satoshi kon and win tons of academy awards. Just ask aronofsky.

....

Ok, so maybe Nolan isn't the best person to make this criticism.
Oh but there is still artsy cinema out there but looking for this kind of cinema at Hollywood is sort of pointless. If art is what you want, try european and especially french cinema. And when you get sick of that, you will go back to Hollywood and so on and so forth. It's a phase. And a cycle. Try The Untouchables, it's awesome.

Marvel may be part of an industry that loves making things blow up but they have managed to create cinema properties from nothing, most people never knew Thor even existed. Compared to artsy cinema in Europe, low budget films never take chances and always play it safe. Me, I like a franchise that shakes things up and introduces the next big thing all the time. I can only see the same film about romance, disability and drug abuse one too many times.

RedDeadFred said:
Why do so many of you feel the need to either like the dark Nolan films, or the more lighthearted Marvel films? It's okay to enjoy both from time to time! I know I'd get tired if I only watched one type of superhero movie. Maybe that's just me...
Maybe it's because some people feel that being in the middle is like like driving into the middle wall between two tunnels. I try to have Shadowcat in the backseat with me.
 

Uriel_Hayabusa

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I'm with Nolan on this one. Never understood the need for a scene (or two) after the end credits, especially if it's important. I mean: if it's so important why ''hide'' it there?

The fact that some hardcore Marvel-fans are butthurt over a harmless potshot is just a nice extra.

Funny how it goes, though. Nolan used to be something like a hero to geeks what with The Dark Knight and its widespread acclaim. I guess Nolan lived long enough to see himself become the villain...
 

orangeapples

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I can see where he is coming from. If they wanted people to see it they would have put it in the movie before the credits. There is nothing wrong with them as they are harmless. The only issue is that theater workers hate it as the credits is normally when they go in to attempt to clean the theater.

Before it was a small number of people who would stay to the end to get their money's worth. I typically stayed to the end because I'm not fond of traffic so I wait for the credits to end and then I don't have to walk in the sea of people trying to leave and there is not a lot of people in line for the restroom. But now it seems like every movie I go to half the theater stays because they don't want to miss out.

Credits bonuses were always kinda nice for the people who want to sit through it, but it wasn't a punishment for the people who did not stay. It was stuff like behind the scenes footage, or a blooper reel.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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LarsInCharge said:
I know this is a little off-topic but...
OP is already widely off-topic. The whole "news" is misconstrued from an article about Nolan's new movie Interstellar. Bob decided to misquote the guy because bait gets clicks and he never loses a chance to badmouth DC on the flimsiest of excuses.

I bet you he'll make it a point to have some sort of backhanded attack on Nolan - even the tiniest, littlest comment - when he talks about Interstellar on Friday.

Zachary Amaranth said:
When Is he going to make a real movie?
He's already made 10 very real movies and earned 3 very real Oscar nominations along the way. Granted most of his movies that aren't Batman-related rely on some sort of narrative hocus pocus to elevate themselves above the average blockbuster. Memento is told backwards, Prestige has unreliable narration, Inception is a Chinese box of continuums... but I think he's a very good director. He's ambitious, he comes up with his own scripts for his own projects and is always pushing some sort of new ground. And Interstellar, for all its pretense, is a very good movie. Probably his most personal and humane too.
 

DrOswald

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ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
I would compare them to a Costco pizza. Manufactured on an assembly line, sure, but damn do they hit the spot.

Uriel_Hayabusa said:
I'm with Nolan on this one. Never understood the need for a scene (or two) after the end credits, especially if it's important. I mean: if it's so important why ''hide'' it there?

The fact that some hardcore Marvel-fans are butthurt over a harmless potshot is just a nice extra.

Funny how it goes, though. Nolan used to be something like a hero to geeks what with The Dark Knight and its widespread acclaim. I guess Nolan lived long enough to see himself become the villain...
Nolan kept on doing the job well past he was interested in it. Batman Begins and Dark Knight were projects that, at the very least, he was interested in. Dark Knight Rises and Man of Steel were Nolan being paid enough money so his name could be on the poster. And I can respect that. He wanted a net worth of $150 million so he sold his name to the highest bidder. And that is fine. I would certainly do the same thing in his place.

But if he wanted respect as a serious artist he should have either been more choosy about his projects or he shouldn't have phoned it in. You don't get to make Dark Knight Rises and then make snide quips about how you make "real" movies. Or rather you can do it, but it makes you an ass.
 

Dark Knifer

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RedDeadFred said:
I'd just like to remind everyone that it is perfectly reasonable to like both Marvel and DC movies. Holy shit, right?!
I agree with this sentiment but I think people naturally go to either direction because that's what they enjoy.

For me, I prefer the nolan movies because they had drama whereas the marvel movies seem to be heavily action based. It's fine to like either but I think this might be a rare cause where people just go towards what they like instead of an us vs them mentality. Except moviebob for some reason, who seems to be the only one going on and on about how terrible dc movies, including the batman trilogy are.

I dunno, maybe there is more hosility then I realized *reads thread* ...
 

newwiseman

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I for one have always enjoyed end credit bits. It's an intelligent way to get people to stay through the credits, I also like what marvel has done with them. Using them as the first teaser for the next movie is brilliant.
 

ascorbius

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I like waiting through the credits for my Post Credits treat.

It reminds me just how many people it took to provide my entertainment.
A really good Anti-Piracy tactic in my view.
 

Gordon_4_v1legacy

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I can respect that post-credit stingers aren't the way Nolan likes to makes movies, it's just not his style. Marvel makes it work and honestly most of them would be awkward 'ends' to any of the movies they've been in so it's their trademark. A little flourish at the end of the signature.

What I can't respect is the notion of 'real films don't do that'. That is elitist horseshit that honestly, I thought a man like him would be above.
 

Scarim Coral

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You know what a real director wouldn't do? Talked shit to another rival films to yours behind their back than face to face!

Is he really still butthurt about it? First it was that complain about the Avenger movie scene and now this!
 

jhoroz

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Man, I was never a fan of Movie Bob, but I didn't think the day where he would resort to making click-bait articles would actually come.
 

lord canti

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I just want movies to be enjoyable. I couldn't care less what it's actually about as long as it's done well, the acting is good, and it makes me feel something that isn't anger over a stupid decision made by the director.
 

WWmelb

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Gordon_4 said:
I can respect that post-credit stingers aren't the way Nolan likes to makes movies, it's just not his style. Marvel makes it work and honestly most of them would be awkward 'ends' to any of the movies they've been in so it's their trademark. A little flourish at the end of the signature.

What I can't respect is the notion of 'real films don't do that'. That is elitist horseshit that honestly, I thought a man like him would be above.
I read the entire article, which was a really good read.

However, it really didn't come across the way this article represents.

It seemed to me that what was said when asked was "A real movie wouldn't just take what's popular in other movies and use it".

The entire tone of the article is so different to this one that it doesn't come off as a jab at all in my opinion.
 

RavingSturm

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I wish Marvel would tone down all the in movie advertising for other movies they have in the pipeline. They should just focus on one movie at a time and focus on its stand alone quality rather than forcing the meta-narrative about the infinity gauntlet. Putting stuff at the end of the movie is ok but if its just some guys goofing off its not really worth the time to wait out all the credits imho.
 

Something Amyss

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Johnny Novgorod said:
He's already made 10 very real movies and earned 3 very real Oscar nominations along the way. Granted most of his movies that aren't Batman-related rely on some sort of narrative hocus pocus to elevate themselves above the average blockbuster. Memento is told backwards, Prestige has unreliable narration, Inception is a Chinese box of continuums... but I think he's a very good director. He's ambitious, he comes up with his own scripts for his own projects and is always pushing some sort of new ground. And Interstellar, for all its pretense, is a very good movie. Probably his most personal and humane too.
Yeah, but I said real movie. None of those count.
 

Lono Shrugged

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That was quite a leap in logic there Bob. I cannot disagree strongly enough.

I can only be satisfied in the fact that you are not a journalist because that is the most click bait weasel words headline I have seen in ages. I only clicked on it to see if it was as tabloid as I suspected.

I think I will stick to entertainment news sites from now on.
 

jhoroz

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Wow nice one Guardian. You guys should collaborate with IGN for future poorly presented journalistic click bait articles. While I don't think Nolan is the second coming of Christ, the number of people who keep trying to twist and "dig up dirt" for every minor thing he says is pathetic. The resentment and envy is disgusting.
 

Uriel_Hayabusa

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DrOswald said:
Nolan kept on doing the job well past he was interested in it. Batman Begins and Dark Knight were projects that, at the very least, he was interested in. Dark Knight Rises and Man of Steel were Nolan being paid enough money so his name could be on the poster. And I can respect that. He wanted a net worth of $150 million so he sold his name to the highest bidder. And that is fine. I would certainly do the same thing in his place.

But if he wanted respect as a serious artist he should have either been more choosy about his projects or he shouldn't have phoned it in. You don't get to make Dark Knight Rises and then make snide quips about how you make "real" movies. Or rather you can do it, but it makes you an ass.
So he phoned it in with a movie or two, big deal. Work isn't always fun, that's the world of grown-ups for you. And even if he took a potshot at Marvel (which seems to have been a misquote), so what? Lords knows every other wiseass (wannabe) movie reviewer with a (video)blog has made fun of him for all sorts of things (''Hey guys, notice that Christian Bale's Batman voice sounds kind of forced and weird?'')
 

Lono Shrugged

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jhoroz said:
Wow nice one Guardian. You guys should collaborate with IGN for future poorly presented journalistic click bait articles. While I don't think Nolan is the second coming of Christ, the number of people who keep trying to twist and "dig up dirt" for every minor thing he says is pathetic. The resentment and envy is disgusting.
The headline does not belong to the Guardian. The quote was cherry picked by Bob and put into the context we see it.
 

jhoroz

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Lono Shrugged said:
jhoroz said:
Wow nice one Guardian. You guys should collaborate with IGN for future poorly presented journalistic click bait articles. While I don't think Nolan is the second coming of Christ, the number of people who keep trying to twist and "dig up dirt" for every minor thing he says is pathetic. The resentment and envy is disgusting.
The headline does not belong to the Guardian. The quote was cherry picked by Bob and put into the context we see it.
Did you read the update? I said nothing about headlines. Nolan specifically stated that the quote from the profile the Guardian wrote up on him was inaccurate.
 

viscomica

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Zachary Amaranth said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
He's already made 10 very real movies and earned 3 very real Oscar nominations along the way. Granted most of his movies that aren't Batman-related rely on some sort of narrative hocus pocus to elevate themselves above the average blockbuster. Memento is told backwards, Prestige has unreliable narration, Inception is a Chinese box of continuums... but I think he's a very good director. He's ambitious, he comes up with his own scripts for his own projects and is always pushing some sort of new ground. And Interstellar, for all its pretense, is a very good movie. Probably his most personal and humane too.
Yeah, but I said real movie. None of those count.
Care to elaborate?
To say "a real movie" is very ambiguous. What is a real movie in your book?
 

Something Amyss

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viscomica said:
To say "a real movie" is very ambiguous.
I think you just made my point.

Well, the point I wouldn't have made if Johnny didn't take a quip seriously (ironically, one that came right after defending Nolan).
 

Lono Shrugged

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jhoroz said:
Lono Shrugged said:
jhoroz said:
Wow nice one Guardian. You guys should collaborate with IGN for future poorly presented journalistic click bait articles. While I don't think Nolan is the second coming of Christ, the number of people who keep trying to twist and "dig up dirt" for every minor thing he says is pathetic. The resentment and envy is disgusting.
The headline does not belong to the Guardian. The quote was cherry picked by Bob and put into the context we see it.
Did you read the update? I said nothing about headlines. Nolan specifically stated that the quote from the profile the Guardian wrote up on him was inaccurate.

Haha, well if Bob can change the headline to something a bit less sensational then I guess I can change my comment.
 

SonOfVoorhees

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Sniper Team 4 said:
I like Marvel's movies better than the ones Nolan did. I'm sorry, but his were just too dark and depressing for my tastes. Having those little stingers at the end are always something I look forward to because a lot of the times, they're the best part of the movie. Or at least the best joke.

I supposed the first Batman movie had it's own version of this when the Joker's card was revealed at the end of the movie...
Damn, i was going to mention that Joker card thing. :) I dont think Man of Steel had one as they had nothing to show off, but BvS will have one as they need to show other heroes. An a post credit is easy especially if what they are showing is not connected to the movie your watching. An it helps set up characters to be shown later and helps build their movie universe and create buzz especially as each hero movie isnt in its own self contained world.
 

Fox12

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katsabas said:
You see, I feel the opposite, haha. I enjoy the occasional guardians of the galaxy, and those films have their place. I'm just a little tired of getting eight of those a year. I don't see why we can't have the occasional art film thrown in for flavor. We certainly used to, and I think les mis showed it can be done successfully. Occasionally I'll give smaller foreign art pieces a try, but funnily enough, they're a mixed bag. Many of them come across as pretentious, not because they're artsy, but because they're poorly made.

Out of curiosity, have you seen paprika? It's the film that gave Nolan the original idea for inception. You may enjoy it, though its got a different style of mind bending, and it can be a little bit more surrealist. It's a very colorful, funny film, and you may recognize some of the homages that Nolan made to it if you liked inception.
 

Baresark

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While I do think that Nolan is a stuck up little brat, he didn't take shots of the Marvel films specifically, a lot of other movies have done that. Though, that said, it would not be his first shot at the Marvel movies, I would like to remind everyone who is defending what he said. His distaste for the MCU is very evident.

Edit: I loaded this page last night and then failed to comment, so I did this morning, completely missing the update.

There you go, he said he didn't even say it and he wouldn't call someone else's film not a film. Though, he would call someone else's film a bad film (my words).
 

K12

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I feel sorry for Nolan here. It's totally OK to not like the post-credit reveal thing and he clearly didn't mean to be insulting in his comment.

It's annoying how careful people need to be nowadays. One throwaway comment that wasn't really meant to mean anything becomes a headline.
 

DrOswald

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Uriel_Hayabusa said:
DrOswald said:
Nolan kept on doing the job well past he was interested in it. Batman Begins and Dark Knight were projects that, at the very least, he was interested in. Dark Knight Rises and Man of Steel were Nolan being paid enough money so his name could be on the poster. And I can respect that. He wanted a net worth of $150 million so he sold his name to the highest bidder. And that is fine. I would certainly do the same thing in his place.

But if he wanted respect as a serious artist he should have either been more choosy about his projects or he shouldn't have phoned it in. You don't get to make Dark Knight Rises and then make snide quips about how you make "real" movies. Or rather you can do it, but it makes you an ass.
So he phoned it in with a movie or two, big deal. Work isn't always fun, that's the world of grown-ups for you. And even if he took a potshot at Marvel (which seems to have been a misquote), so what? Lords knows every other wiseass (wannabe) movie reviewer with a (video)blog has made fun of him for all sorts of things (''Hey guys, notice that Christian Bale's Batman voice sounds kind of forced and weird?'')
Like I said, I don't mind that he phoned it in and I don't mind that he took the money. Whatever. That is what they paid for and that is what he gave them. I have no beef with Nolan on that point. The problem is when he starts criticizing people for doing the same thing he is doing. That is where the hypocrisy starts. That is an ass thing to do, and doing it makes him a bit of an ass. Well, frankly, saying it at all would make you an ass, but then at least you would have some reason to fall back on of why the comment is valid.

But that's all academic. Even if Nolan did say something to that effect it appears it would have been behind closed doors with his expectation that the remark would never be made public. That is a very different situation in my opinion. Being rude behind closed doors about someone who will never hear what you are saying is like punching a pillow. It is basically venting steam, perfectly acceptable behavior. Kinda wish Movie Bob had taken the time to actually read his source and report accurately. Bit of a dick move Bob. I get really tired of having to fact check everything I read.
 

V4Viewtiful

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So it seems it was out of context or tone afterall, I'm glad. No respect lost.
but how could they not follow up on that?
 

V4Viewtiful

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RavingSturm said:
I wish Marvel would tone down all the in movie advertising for other movies they have in the pipeline. They should just focus on one movie at a time and focus on its stand alone quality rather than forcing the meta-narrative about the infinity gauntlet. Putting stuff at the end of the movie is ok but if its just some guys goofing off its not really worth the time to wait out all the credits imho.
It's a comic book movie, it's probably the first time one of those even attempted to emulate a comic book narrative.

And PCS in marvel films are only Easter eggs they aren't supposed/don't have to be essential or important, just fun.

Why is that so hard to grasp?
 

RavingSturm

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Sorry but it really gets stale if you do it all the time. Why is THAT so hard to grasp?
 

Knoxy

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deathbydeath said:
and this isn't half as scathing as what people like Confused Matthew [http://confusedmatthew.com/matthews-marvel-madness.html] have (rightly) said about the enterprise. )
I have no idea where the proper outlet to direct criticism of this guy's stuff is, there doesn't seem to be a comment section, so I'm just gonna throw this up here.

That was an unashamedly awful piece. I've been trying to source some heartfelt criticism of Marvel's ongoing enterprise for some time, but I think I might stop if this is the standard I can expect.

I'm sorry that this is being directed at you, random guy on the internet, I bear you no ill will. The only thing I would say is that, in my honest opinion, I don't think you should link to that video, it diminishes you (as it would anyone else) by association.
 

Aiddon_v1legacy

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Fox12 said:
Out of curiosity, have you seen paprika? It's the film that gave Nolan the original idea for inception. You may enjoy it, though its got a different style of mind bending, and it can be a little bit more surrealist. It's a very colorful, funny film, and you may recognize some of the homages that Nolan made to it if you liked inception.
Nope; Nolan had actually been writing the script for close to a decade, long before the anime adaptation of Paprika was even conceptualized. He was more influenced by stuff like The Matrix and Dark City. Nolan hadn't even SEEN the movie before Inception began filming
 

Vigormortis

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LarsInCharge said:
You misread my post. I didn't say the entirety of this site feels that way.

Note what I said:
"If there's one thing the 'clique' of this forum loves to hate..."

I never implied that everyone felt that way. I was referring to a contingent of posters who, legitimate or not, tend to behave in a very contrarian manner. If a thing is popular amongst people they don't associate with, that thing is considered worthy of their contempt.
 

DrOswald

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Knoxy said:
deathbydeath said:
and this isn't half as scathing as what people like Confused Matthew [http://confusedmatthew.com/matthews-marvel-madness.html] have (rightly) said about the enterprise. )
I have no idea where the proper outlet to direct criticism of this guy's stuff is, there doesn't seem to be a comment section, so I'm just gonna throw this up here.

That was an unashamedly awful piece. I've been trying to source some heartfelt criticism of Marvel's ongoing enterprise for some time, but I think I might stop if this is the standard I can expect.

I'm sorry that this is being directed at you, random guy on the internet, I bear you no ill will. The only thing I would say is that, in my honest opinion, I don't think you should link to that video, it diminishes you (as it would anyone else) by association.
Confused Matthew is in a league of his own when it comes to bad criticism. He manages to combine and maximize pettiness, dismissiveness, and irrationality into one mass of horrible criticism which he then brings home with his own brand of self assured arrogance that not only is it impossible he is wrong, but that it is impossible that anyone else could have a different but valid opinion. You can search high and low across the internet and it is going to be very hard to find another critic as horrible as Confused Matthew.
 

WarpedLord

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elvor0 said:
Ugh, tell me about, I like dark and gritty, but Noalns movies are so dark and depressing even the sodding Joker can't crack a joke.
I'm a little behind in the conversation... but in the looong history of the Joker, isn't the end of "Killing Joke" the only time he's ever actually told a joke?
 

Sanunes

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Lono Shrugged said:
That was quite a leap in logic there Bob. I cannot disagree strongly enough.

I can only be satisfied in the fact that you are not a journalist because that is the most click bait weasel words headline I have seen in ages. I only clicked on it to see if it was as tabloid as I suspected.

I think I will stick to entertainment news sites from now on.
The Escapist probably changed the title, they have done that for other articles on The Escapist. If you look at the main article its url generally will show the real title. Shamus Young had something similar happen to one of his pieces of Shadow of Mordor.

"138406-christopher-nolan-says-marvel-style-post-credit-stingers-not-real-movies-in-guardian-profile" Is what I believe MovieBob had for his original title.
 

Shamanic Rhythm

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MovieBob said:
Elsewhere, Badass Digest (one of the many sites along with this one to run stories based on the quote) points out [http://badassdigest.com/2014/11/05/christopher-nolan-the-quote-is-inaccurate/] that the Guardian quote is actually an out of context second-hand account of Nolan's words on the matter from Zack Snyder.
Anyone with some basic reading comprehension skills could have figured this out by reading the Guardian article. Pretty shoddy journalism that your original article didn't even moot this point before running with the interpretation that allows you to crucify Nolan as arrogant.
 

Olas

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Shamanic Rhythm said:
MovieBob said:
Elsewhere, Badass Digest (one of the many sites along with this one to run stories based on the quote) points out [http://badassdigest.com/2014/11/05/christopher-nolan-the-quote-is-inaccurate/] that the Guardian quote is actually an out of context second-hand account of Nolan's words on the matter from Zack Snyder.
Anyone with some basic reading comprehension skills could have figured this out by reading the Guardian article. Pretty shoddy journalism that your original article didn't even moot this point before running with the interpretation that allows you to crucify Nolan as arrogant.
I have to defend Bob here, which trust me, is the last thing I'd expect to be doing, because the Guardian article really does make it appear that Nolan said that. For reference here's the entire paragraph verbatim.

The Guardian said:
He noticed something interesting in the studio's reception to Batman Begins, which he had purposefully given the biggest possible scale, with locations as far flung as the Himalayas and a climax involving the detonation of Gotham. Despite this, what he heard was "Well, is it really big enough?" He realised that scale in movies was itself something of an illusion. For the sequel, The Dark Knight, he actually scaled down from the original, setting the film almost entirely in Gotham, which he then proceeded to open up with storytelling and cinematography modelled on Michael Mann's Heat, which was set in Los Angeles, but shot in such a way as to make it seem as rangy as the wild west. Nolan's movie took over a billion dollars. "The Batman movies - that take, that tone - came out of nowhere," said director Zack Snyder, who first met Nolan on a Warner Bros plane heading to a film industry convention in Las Vegas and leapt at the chance to direct a similarly toned Superman reboot, Man Of Steel - for which he studied, at Nolan's request, test footage from White Sands, New Mexico, to get a sense of how objects behave at high velocity. When the studio asked if Snyder would add a comedy coda ending, in the style of Marvel, Nolan's reply was "A real movie wouldn't do that."
If it isn't supposed to be implied that Nolan said those exact words with that exact meaning, it's very hard for me to understand how else it could be interpreted. If the entire quote was made up or inaccurate, then okay, but Bob could hardly be expected to know that.

Now of course MovieBob's decision to zoom in a single one-off quote from a long interview and draw unrealistic implications from it, then write an entire news story about it in a way that frames Nolan and Marvel comics as enemies of some sort should certainly be questioned; but I don't think you could argue that he factually misrepresented the quote from the article.
 

Shamanic Rhythm

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Olas said:
I have to defend Bob here, which trust me, is the last thing I'd expect to be doing, because the Guardian article really does make it appear that Nolan said that.
Only if you take it at face value, which is exactly what a good journalist should not be doing.

If it isn't supposed to be implied that Nolan said those exact words with that exact meaning, it's very hard for me to understand how else it could be interpreted.
Forget what they imply. Look at what they report and whether it seems fair to interpret it as a back handed dig at Marvel.

Let me pick some holes in the Guardian account for you. We're told the studio asked Snyder to add a comedy coda ending. There's indication of whether or not Nolan was present for that request or whether he was asked separately by Snyder. There's even some ambiguity as to who he made that remark to - was it Snyder or someone else? It's also unclear whether or not the "in the style of Marvel" was the Guardian embellishing the account for the benefit of the reader, as opposed to paraphrasing the studio's request, which changes the context of his remark greatly if you're accusing him of making a dig at Marvel. It's also not conveyed exactly how the request was put to Nolan: did they emphasize the comedic nature of the coda, or did they emphasize the idea of it working as a teaser for a subsequent film? All this stuff could potentially influence what is a fair interpretation of Nolan's remark.

If the entire quote was made up or inaccurate, then okay, but Bob could hardly be expected to know that.
He should be expected to recognise when there's not enough contextual information to draw as aggressive a conclusion as he did. Hell, even making mention of a potential alternative viewpoint would have been good.

Now of course MovieBob's decision to zoom in a single one-off quote from a long interview and draw unrealistic implications from it, then write an entire news story about it in a way that frames Nolan and Marvel comics as enemies of some sort should certainly be questioned; but I don't think you could argue that he factually misrepresented the quote from the article.
I argued nothing of the sort. I pointed out that he gave no thought or consideration to whether or not this was an official or secondhand account of Nolan's words, he neglected to consider any context that might have allowed it to be interpreted as just an off hand statement of opinion rather than a direct dig at Marvel. Woeful journalism.
 

Fox12

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Aiddon said:
Fox12 said:
Out of curiosity, have you seen paprika? It's the film that gave Nolan the original idea for inception. You may enjoy it, though its got a different style of mind bending, and it can be a little bit more surrealist. It's a very colorful, funny film, and you may recognize some of the homages that Nolan made to it if you liked inception.
Nope; Nolan had actually been writing the script for close to a decade, long before the anime adaptation of Paprika was even conceptualized. He was more influenced by stuff like The Matrix and Dark City. Nolan hadn't even SEEN the movie before Inception began filming
Really? I'm tempted to call shenanigans on that, but, my former joke aside, the films are quite different. I don't really have a reason to think Nolan is lying, and even if he was, he did an original spin on the concept. Still, the shot by shot similarities are astounding. It may be coincidence, but it's a strange one.

Either way, their both great films.
 

elvor0

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WarpedLord said:
elvor0 said:
Ugh, tell me about, I like dark and gritty, but Noalns movies are so dark and depressing even the sodding Joker can't crack a joke.
I'm a little behind in the conversation... but in the looong history of the Joker, isn't the end of "Killing Joke" the only time he's ever actually told a joke?
Well that was wrongly worded. "be silly" would perhaps be more apt to what I wanted to say.
 

Lono Shrugged

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Sanunes said:
Lono Shrugged said:
That was quite a leap in logic there Bob. I cannot disagree strongly enough.

I can only be satisfied in the fact that you are not a journalist because that is the most click bait weasel words headline I have seen in ages. I only clicked on it to see if it was as tabloid as I suspected.

I think I will stick to entertainment news sites from now on.
The Escapist probably changed the title, they have done that for other articles on The Escapist. If you look at the main article its url generally will show the real title. Shamus Young had something similar happen to one of his pieces of Shadow of Mordor.

"138406-christopher-nolan-says-marvel-style-post-credit-stingers-not-real-movies-in-guardian-profile" Is what I believe MovieBob had for his original title.
Funny you mention that. I saw that article after reading this one. Interesting to see that the terrible click bait titles are not the responsibility of the writer. It explains an awful lot. To be honest though, the tone of the article was a bit wrong-headed IMO
 

Sonic Doctor

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Fox12 said:
ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
Pretty much this. I have no great love for the artificial, production line, anti art nature of modern cinema. It's emberasing, and frankly, I can't blame someone for taking umbridge with modern Hollywood. These movies are getting old.

Nolan knows what he's talking about. Real directors don't add post credit scenes. Real directors rip off satoshi kon and win tons of academy awards. Just ask aronofsky.

....

Ok, so maybe Nolan isn't the best person to make this criticism.
If by "artificial, production line, anti art nature of modern cinema" you mean, incredibly awesome because they are a build up of a comic universe into a movie universe that stays as true as possible, close to 100%, to the comics that they are being based on(which is what comic fans want to see), then yeah, they are that and I'm all for it.

End credit scenes are great, and a great way to get in a last joke and link that movie to what is coming next, without having to arbitrarily shove it into the plot in the middle of the movie.

I for one would love to see Hollywood take less of an artistic license when it comes to doing movies based on established and popular works. I can't stand it when word comes out that some popular book or other media I and many others like is getting a movie, and they hype it up that it is based on the book/media, that fans should be excited, blah blah blah, but then when it comes out, it turns out that some bullshit director and writers thought it would be good to change tons of stuff, stories, and characters, because by their vision, to them it works better. Forever pissing off the people they should have been making the movie for, and the ones that their advertising was targeting. For such movies, it would have been more appropriate if the advertisements went like this:

"For the people that didn't read it. For the people that just don't care about faithful movie adaptions that stay true to the story/work and doesn't change stuff around. For people that just go to movies to see a new movie. It's "title of popular book/comic/show" the movie."

The only people that I see that don't like the Marvel films, are people aren't fans of Marvel(DC fans that are mad that DC is crap when it comes to making faithful and well made DC property movies, people that aren't into comics and don't get why the Marvel movies work so well and are expertly crafted with care.

If anything, I'd call Marvels movies more artistic than movies by makers that try to put their own vision onto a property, because it takes real skill to stick with what is important to the franchise and craft a movie universe that matches the universe that it is based on.

Fans of books and comics want to see pure and faithful movies. Their bane are the people that stupidly say, "well if you wanted it to be like the book/comic, then you should read the book/comic again." The people that say such a thing miss the point entirely. We've already read it, so what we want to see is exactly what we read, but movie form, because it gives us another media to enjoy the exact same thing.

I'd actually call a movie adaption where the director and writers took horrible artistic liberties with it(changing things), manufactured and production line, because most of the time they do it because they have it in their heads that, "Well the average movie goer that doesn't know the original work would like this better and it will make the movie more popular than if I stayed near 100% true to the original work".

The reason Marvel movies are so popular is that they are catering to what the fans want, which is staying true to the source material, and not changing things because, "the average movie goer wouldn't understand it." Basically, the way they stay true to the source material is so well done that the good average movie goer likes it because it is so well made.

The Marvel fans love the end credits scenes, and they stay after the credits specifically for them, so that is one of the reasons Marvel keeps doing them. The sign of a real director is that of one that does things that makes the fans of the property happy.
 

Sonic Doctor

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RavingSturm said:
Sorry but it really gets stale if you do it all the time. Why is THAT so hard to grasp?
Here in lies the problem with what you said. To Marvel Fans, the people that know and/or have read comics, it doesn't get stale. We want to know what Marvel is planning next and even what they have planned after that, and after that, and after that.

We love all the stingers in the end credits that give hits at the plot of the next movie, or even at things that hint at things that won't come down the line until several movies later.

It is done in comics and it is how comic books work. It is the reason Marvel comic book movies work so damn well and are so successful. They listen and know what the fans want, and they give it to them.
 

RavingSturm

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Sonic Doctor said:
RavingSturm said:
Sorry but it really gets stale if you do it all the time. Why is THAT so hard to grasp?
Here in lies the problem with what you said. To Marvel Fans, the people that know and/or have read comics, it doesn't get stale. We want to know what Marvel is planning next and even what they have planned after that, and after that, and after that.

We love all the stingers in the end credits that give hits at the plot of the next movie, or even at things that hint at things that won't come down the line until several movies later.

It is done in comics and it is how comic books work. It is the reason Marvel comic book movies work so damn well and are so successful. They listen and know what the fans want, and they give it to them.

Dont one-fit size and generalize. I read comic books and I find what Marvel has been doing in the movies to be annoying.
 

Fox12

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Jun 6, 2013
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Sonic Doctor said:
Fox12 said:
ticklefist said:
Marvel movies are just a manufactured product. The McDouble of the movie industry.
Pretty much this. I have no great love for the artificial, production line, anti art nature of modern cinema. It's emberasing, and frankly, I can't blame someone for taking umbridge with modern Hollywood. These movies are getting old.

Nolan knows what he's talking about. Real directors don't add post credit scenes. Real directors rip off satoshi kon and win tons of academy awards. Just ask aronofsky.

....

Ok, so maybe Nolan isn't the best person to make this criticism.
If by "artificial, production line, anti art nature of modern cinema" you mean, incredibly awesome because they are a build up of a comic universe into a movie universe that stays as true as possible, close to 100%, to the comics that they are being based on(which is what comic fans want to see), then yeah, they are that and I'm all for it.

End credit scenes are great, and a great way to get in a last joke and link that movie to what is coming next, without having to arbitrarily shove it into the plot in the middle of the movie.
My problem with modern cinema is the corporate nature of film production, which, incidentally, is the same problem I have with the comic book industry. There's no room for creativity. Storytellers are heavily monitored, and have few creative liberties. Film makers are told what stories they're allowed to tell. The characters aren't allowed to grow, develop, or change. Iron man will never get married and have a family. He'll never really grow as a person. None Of the characters will ever experiance an end to their story. Furthermore, there are no stakes. Iron man can't die. He has four more movies in production. Neither can anyone else. They'll continue until the actors move on, then the company will find someone else. If a character does die, they'll just bring them back in two weeks. Evuwntually people will tire of superheroes, and they'll stop making as many movies. The universe will come to an unceremonious end.

There's no arc to these stories. There's no beginning, middle, or end. There's always just another one, and another one, until the audience loses interest. This isn't just marvel, or superheroes. This is all of Hollywood. All I want are more films with substance. I want more films like Forest Gump, of The Godfather. Why do you think the original watchmen was a big deal? It had depth, and it had intelligence, and it had consequences. We need more stories like that, in comics and in film.
 

Arcane Azmadi

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MovieBob said:
"The quote is inaccurate," the Interstellar filmmaker reportedly told BuzzFeed, after clarifying that "I would never say someone else's film isn't 'a real film.'"
Dude, hate to break it to you, but it's pretty disingenuous of you to claim you would "never say that" when you just said EXACTLY that. We have the quote right there: "A real movie wouldn't do that." That's like randomly punching someone in the face then when asked why you did it saying "What are you talking about? I'd NEVER randomly punch someone in the face!"

Respect for Nolan: -50 points
 

Signa

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I can understand where the original comment came from. As a director, tacking on extra footage after the credits is rather out of place. It has separated itself from the rest of the story, and even production by being after the point where the projectors should be shutting down in the theater. It's in direct opposition of at least one interpretation of the art of film, and I see no problem to be against its practice.

That said, as an audience member, I usually like them. Either they do something cool, left out, or advertise what's coming up for this universe's timeline. It's also a bit of a reward for sitting through the boring credits.
 

Hawki

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Sonic Doctor said:
If by "artificial, production line, anti art nature of modern cinema" you mean, incredibly awesome because they are a build up of a comic universe into a movie universe that stays as true as possible, close to 100%, to the comics that they are being based on(which is what comic fans want to see), then yeah, they are that and I'm all for it.

End credit scenes are great, and a great way to get in a last joke and link that movie to what is coming next, without having to arbitrarily shove it into the plot in the middle of the movie.

I for one would love to see Hollywood take less of an artistic license when it comes to doing movies based on established and popular works. I can't stand it when word comes out that some popular book or other media I and many others like is getting a movie, and they hype it up that it is based on the book/media, that fans should be excited, blah blah blah, but then when it comes out, it turns out that some bullshit director and writers thought it would be good to change tons of stuff, stories, and characters, because by their vision, to them it works better. Forever pissing off the people they should have been making the movie for, and the ones that their advertising was targeting. For such movies, it would have been more appropriate if the advertisements went like this:

"For the people that didn't read it. For the people that just don't care about faithful movie adaptions that stay true to the story/work and doesn't change stuff around. For people that just go to movies to see a new movie. It's "title of popular book/comic/show" the movie."

The only people that I see that don't like the Marvel films, are people aren't fans of Marvel(DC fans that are mad that DC is crap when it comes to making faithful and well made DC property movies, people that aren't into comics and don't get why the Marvel movies work so well and are expertly crafted with care.

If anything, I'd call Marvels movies more artistic than movies by makers that try to put their own vision onto a property, because it takes real skill to stick with what is important to the franchise and craft a movie universe that matches the universe that it is based on.

Fans of books and comics want to see pure and faithful movies. Their bane are the people that stupidly say, "well if you wanted it to be like the book/comic, then you should read the book/comic again." The people that say such a thing miss the point entirely. We've already read it, so what we want to see is exactly what we read, but movie form, because it gives us another media to enjoy the exact same thing.

I'd actually call a movie adaption where the director and writers took horrible artistic liberties with it(changing things), manufactured and production line, because most of the time they do it because they have it in their heads that, "Well the average movie goer that doesn't know the original work would like this better and it will make the movie more popular than if I stayed near 100% true to the original work".

The reason Marvel movies are so popular is that they are catering to what the fans want, which is staying true to the source material, and not changing things because, "the average movie goer wouldn't understand it." Basically, the way they stay true to the source material is so well done that the good average movie goer likes it because it is so well made.

The Marvel fans love the end credits scenes, and they stay after the credits specifically for them, so that is one of the reasons Marvel keeps doing them. The sign of a real director is that of one that does things that makes the fans of the property happy.
Okay, I have to disagree with most of what you said.

-When it comes to adapting a work, I'd rather the adaptation place precedence on actually being good than aping the original work to a T. Off the top of my head, Jackson's LotR trilogy and Starship Troopers are example. Both, especially the latter, take many liberties/leave stuff out from the original work. But they manage to be good films in their own right. Imagine if LotR (the film) followed the books to the letter - songs about nothing, even more walking around, etc. As much as I like the LotR books as well, they'd be terrible on film if followed exactly. Game of Thrones is another example. The show's the show, the books are the books. I enjoy both. But I would never hold it to the show to follow the books exactly.

So no, I can't call Marvel's movies "artistic." Not if their stated goal is trying to follow a different medium and replicate it. And if they are, why are they marketing these films to the general public? There are plenty of comics I've enjoyed, and while superhero genres aren't among them, I'd never insist that the filmakers bow down to what I want. What I'd expect them to do is make the movie they want to make, and let me decide. To use an example, I like the Tintin books. I saw Secret of the Unicorn. The movie took liberties with the source material, and compressed more than one Tintin book into the same work. Did that annoy me? No. Because the movie was still a good one. It was true to the spirit of the original work, but succeeded on its own terms. I could recommend that film to anyone based on the premise of it being a good film, able to say that they don't need to be familiar with the source material to enjoy it. I cannot say that for any MCU movie. I can't comment on faith to the source work/lack of it, but I can say that "no, I can't recommend you these films, because I don't think they're particuarly good." And if the producers are placing conformity to the original work bar actually making a film, then I suppose that's one reason why. That, and the production line schedule.

-And one more thing...don't say "comic book fans want this." I'm not that big of a comic reader, but I've read quite a few. I've managed to enjoy some superhero films on the basis of them being good films, not tie-ins for whatever universe they may or may not be part of. Believe it or not, there are many comics outside the superhero genre, and comics not created by Marvel or DC. You mention that the sign of a real director is one that makes the fans of the property happy. To which I can only say, "no." The sign of a real director is one who has the balls to stick to their own vision, work within that vision, and try and deliver a good movie. I do not want to be kow-towled to when seeing an adaptation. I want to see a movie. Hopefully a good movie. But I will decide for myself whether it's a good movie or not based on the quality of the work itself.
 

endtherapture

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To be honest, I get Nolan's point. A movie should be a stand alone movie, not a franchise. The most talked about parts of the Marvel movies are the stuff after the credits.

You should be able to go into a movie and enjoy it from minute 1 to the last minute with no prior knowledge of the character or the mythos of the story, they should be stand alone experiences. Nearly ever single one of Nolan's movies (exception maybe to TDKR) do it.

The Dark Knight had an amazing ending, miles above any marvel one so far, and it didn't have to tease a sequel before, that movie stood on its own, and as much as people here hate Man of Steel, so did that film. A sequel could never be made and it is still a great experience. ame can't be said of the Marvel films because of all the teasing they do.