oh no, another of THOSE threads!

[Tanis]

Isn't the lore of TES1/2 in flux because of some timey-wimey wibbly wobbly stuff that happened due to some idiot mages?

 

[Realitycrash]

Reported the OP, simply because his thread-name was uninformative (and thus in violate of the Code of Conduct), and he knew it.
Seriously, I really, really dislike people starting threads that say nothing whatsoever of the subject.

OT: I never even played Skyrim to the end, even though the game wasn't..eh..You know what, if I didn't care to finish the game, how the ending is really doesn't matter. Or the plotholes.

 

[Krantos]

in Oblivion they didn't hear about who they were going to kill from their clients directly. The go between was the night mother

The DB in Skyrim operate like a standard run of the mill assassin's guild. They don't follow the five tenets and have no contact with the night mother...

...at least not in the beginning...

 

[NeoShinGundam]

IN DC comic's The Legion of Super-Heroes, the villain Persuader http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persuader_%28comics%29 has an axe that can cut ANYTHING; even the pull of GRAVITY!!!!

 

[K1CKER]

Did you people even play the game ?

The Dark Brotherhood HAD THAT CORPSE MOTHER THING, who could hear someone performing the RITUAL from her coffin, and she would tell the assassins who to kill. THEY DIDN`T HEAR ANY FUCKING RUMORS OR HAD SPIES.

Seriously, are you posting without even having a clue about what`s happening ? Do you need me to explain The Matrix to you too ? Do you know what planet are you on ?

 

[TheVioletBandit]

The problem is the Skeleton Key's powers are kept in check for Nocturnal. No one will be able to unlock the true potential of the key without being disintegrated or something like that. So people just settle for what it is; a master lockpick

Even as a key that will just open any lock it's fucking awesome. I would probably be caught and behind bars within a week if I had that key, but I would still give one of my testicles for it.

 

[TheVioletBandit]

The skeleton key is probably just another expansion on the whole CHIM thing.

What is the CHIM thing?

 

[Bruenin]

Did you people even play the game ?

The Dark Brotherhood HAD THAT CORPSE MOTHER THING, who could hear someone performing the RITUAL from her coffin, and she would tell the assassins who to kill. THEY DIDN`T HEAR ANY FUCKING RUMORS OR HAD SPIES.

Seriously, are you posting without even having a clue about what`s happening ? Do you need me to explain The Matrix to you too ? Do you know what planet are you on ?

That was in oblivion... the night mother didn't show up in Skyrim for a while and even then they didn't have a listener, so no one could pass on the missions. They had to get there contracts from rumors, that's why they say you stole their kill when you handled the kid in Windhelm. You may have played the game but you didn't pay enough attention you become the listener but the dark brotherhood in Skyrim was there for a while before you were. The first lady you meet in the Dark Brotherhood explains all this to you. Did you even pay attention?

 

[Whoatemysupper]

The skeleton key is probably just another expansion on the whole CHIM thing.

What is the CHIM thing?

From my understanding, CHIM is the player's knowledge of being in a game and changing the world to shape his own desires all in canon with console commands and mods. If you want to be more vanilla, you can interpret it as the player becoming enlightened and aware of objects previously unknowable (Strategy guides and quest wikis).

 

[artanis_neravar]

Did you people even play the game ?

The Dark Brotherhood HAD THAT CORPSE MOTHER THING, who could hear someone performing the RITUAL from her coffin, and she would tell the assassins who to kill. THEY DIDN`T HEAR ANY FUCKING RUMORS OR HAD SPIES.

Seriously, are you posting without even having a clue about what`s happening ? Do you need me to explain The Matrix to you too ? Do you know what planet are you on ?

that corpse only communicated with the player, and only after you had been in the guild for a while.

 

[MPerce]

Huh, by one of THOSE threads I was expecting ponies and the obligatory flame-war that accompanies that subject.

Curses. I will have to find my evening lulz elsewhere...

 

[TheDrunkNinja]

For example, Daggerfall had dragon hatchlings that you could fight, yet later games stated that dragons had been extinct for centuries

Because they have.

Skyrim is set 500 years after Oblivion which is set in the 3rd era that lasted 433 years (with Daggerfall being set near the start).

So by the time Oblivion came around, Dragons were near enough extinct.

Leap forward 500 years after that and they are all gone.

All the games were not set in the same timeline. No where near in fact.

Sorry to play the fanboy here, but I'm quite sure the events of Skyrim are only 200 years after Oblivion.

Barring that, I was also sure that the Dragon War which nearly caused them all to go extinct took place in the Merethic Era which was 38,000 years before Alduin returned in Skyrim. But like I said, the dragons were only close to extinction. Those that died were entombed in the dragon mounds dotting Skyrim's landscape, but the rest were scattered and chose to live in remote locations.

So, technically Skyrim's lore on dragons is still consistent continuity-wise since it's entirely possible for dragons to appear in Daggerfall. Not to say their continuity isn't fucked in other ways.

 

[Lugbzurg]

Let's not forget some other games out there that don't seem to get their plotholes pointed out nearly as hard. Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 comes to mind. Just watch Yahtzee's review. You'll get it. http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/5006-Call-of-Duty-Modern-Warfare-3

But, that isn't even close to the vast amount of paradoxes, plotholes and inconsistencies that plague Sonic Generations. For some different reasons (but a lot of the same), I think it might be worse than that '06 thing.

As a matter of fact, if you look on Zero Punctuation, you'll see the pointing out of gobs more games that made way less sense than we ever saw in the ending of Mass Effect 3. At least that game had "Space Magic"!

 

[TheVioletBandit]

The skeleton key is probably just another expansion on the whole CHIM thing.

What is the CHIM thing?

From my understanding, CHIM is the player's knowledge of being in a game and changing the world to shape his own desires all in canon with console commands and mods. If you want to be more vanilla, you can interpret it as the player becoming enlightened and aware of objects previously unknowable (Strategy guides and quest wikis).

Okay, thanks for the information.

 

[Westaway]

I thought the first two game's lore was non canon.. I mean, Cyrodil was only the Imperial City.

 

[K1CKER]

Did you people even play the game ?

The Dark Brotherhood HAD THAT CORPSE MOTHER THING, who could hear someone performing the RITUAL from her coffin, and she would tell the assassins who to kill. THEY DIDN`T HEAR ANY FUCKING RUMORS OR HAD SPIES.

Seriously, are you posting without even having a clue about what`s happening ? Do you need me to explain The Matrix to you too ? Do you know what planet are you on ?

That was in oblivion... the night mother didn't show up in Skyrim for a while and even then they didn't have a listener, so no one could pass on the missions. They had to get there contracts from rumors, that's why they say you stole their kill when you handled the kid in Windhelm. You may have played the game but you didn't pay enough attention you become the listener but the dark brotherhood in Skyrim was there for a while before you were. The first lady you meet in the Dark Brotherhood explains all this to you. Did you even pay attention?

yeah well I probably should have quoted the person I addressed that to and explained more, but I`m tired of explaining obvious things.

anyway what you said is not relevant to what I was saying and I really don`t feel like explaining more

good night

 

[userwhoquitthesite]

At least your game never decided to make every possible ending to the second game canon at once, and let you sort out the mess.

To be fair, that was absolutely brilliant in a pants-on-head dumb kind of way. I got immense enjoyment out of the "wat wat wat" levels of it...

Oh no, I think its awesome, but it's still bad writing. So far, there is no explanation for TWITW other than "shit happens, its magic, yo!" which is my point. But yes, personally, I think magical clusterfuck is a great way to tie the two games. Hell, maybe that's why you have no idea why your are in your situation in Morrowind. You just had the first bit of your life erased!

And the dark brotherhood just doesn't make sense. Okay, so there is only ONE group of assassins left in tamriel, fine. Obviously they only operate in skyrim, right? except they don't. It specifically mentions that they still operate in most of the provinces, with the havewave that they hear about people performing the ritual that used to summon them. This is impossible. Unless they have an incredibly expansive network of spies in every town and hamlet, they aren't going to hear that someone wants them from across the continent. news of a murder (attempted or otherwise) isn't going to spread that far. If they DO have that powerful spy network, they are powerful enough to have other assassin centers besides the one in skyrim.
There are tons of little things throughout the game that either contradict established continuity, or don't make sense with the in game information. Hell, each entry in the series has its own continuity/logical weirdness.

Well for the Dark Brotherhood thing maybe it's magic or something? I mean, it is fantasy so anything's possible really.

As for plotholes, well with a game the size of Skyrim that's just inevitable.

I didn't get around to doing much with the brotherhood in Skyrim, but in Oblivion they didn't hear about who they were going to kill from their clients directly. The go between was the night mother I think (might have been sithis) who was pretty much getting prayed to with the black sacrament. So if they were hearing who to kill from some daedra, then they could be getting contracts from outside of Skyrim.

The Night Mother isn't there to give them directives anymore, After the Champion left Cyrodil, a new listener was chosen, and they in turn were killed during the war with the Aldmeri Dominion. There hasn't been one since then. Thats WHY the brotherhood has fallen on such hard times. Also, someone DID meet the client, the night mother told the listener f the contract, the listener told the speakers, who would then send someone to negotiate the contract or go themselves.

 

[Austin Howe]

Snip.

PPFF!!!! 8's was worse, WAY worse.

and lets not forget all those NES games that ended with 'good job'

To be fair, Final Fantasy VIII's ending was a little hard to follow in terms of what events were taking place (I eventually understood it), but it was much more conclusive and satisfying. I actually love the shit out that ending.

 

[Lunar Templar]

Snip.

PPFF!!!! 8's was worse, WAY worse.

and lets not forget all those NES games that ended with 'good job'

To be fair, Final Fantasy VIII's ending was a little hard to follow in terms of what events were taking place (I eventually understood it), but it was much more conclusive and satisfying. I actually love the shit out that ending.

honestly, only way i get it is while applying the 'squall is dead' theory to it, and thats the whole game, not just the ending

 

[Austin Howe]

SNIP!

The way I generall outline it is this: After Ultemecia dies (revealing the StableTimeLoop), Time Compression begins to fall apart. After which Squall becomes stuck in transportations between eras. Remember that Laguna said that the way everyone would escape that would be embracing the memories of each other and essentially putting faith in a literal PowerOfFriendship(TM). At first, Squall cannot do this, but in his last, and most decisive victory, he does, after being presented (unexplainedly, admittedly) with the possibility of life without Rinoa. (Basically, the timestream pulls a strawman on him.) That sorta scares him straight, and then he begisn remembering his friends and Rinoa, and is able to return to his time. In true tradition, immediately after that confusing shit is when we get the real happy ending. (FFIX did this same thing 2 years later, except that whole confusing part of the cinematics in FFVIII is the entire final dungeon in FFIX.)