Oh sweet baby Jesus no, burn AI to the ground, humanity can't be trusted with it

Chimpzy

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Agema

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It's not being paid for with taxpayer money. Funding is private from banks and such. That said, you might end up right after all when this scheme fails and the culprits are suitably rewarded with government bailouts
Given it's a private initiative, this could be a business plan that has been in the works a long time and they've just rolled it out via Trump as a way to curry favour.

If it really has been stitched up last minute with some political meddling, chances are higher it'll be one of those plans that they can readily back out of, go slow, and generally leave to die after an outlay that's a miniscule fraction of the initial promise. If that's the case, no-one would ever really notice: no big announcement, no headlines, just a vague memory that once some company said that they would do something.
 

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The world is freaking out about Deepseek, a new Chinese AI with backing from the Chinese government. Nvidia stock price dropped like a rock with the biggest market loss in history losing nearly $600 billion in value.

And I'm sitting here going "it's about fucking time." Nvidia is massively overvalued. AI is massively overvalued.

CEOs are throwing money at it and drooling at the prospect of replacing all of their employees with AI. No more lunches or bathroom breaks, or work-life balance, or sexual harassment lawsuits, the AI will do it all! meanwhile AI can't do basic math, can't tell you how many Rs are in the word strawberry, and constantly makes up fake information. And the more AI content there is on the internet the worse AI becomes because it gets trained on AI content becoming more and more subpar. The whole thing only works when there's human work for the AI to copy, steal, and exploit. Brilliant.
 
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Agema

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The world is freaking out about Deepseek, a new Chinese AI with backing from the Chinese government. Nvidia stock price dropped like a rock with the biggest market loss in history losing nearly $600 billion in value.

And I'm sitting here going "it's about fucking time." Nvidia is massively overvalued. AI is massively overvalued.
Yep.

I am fascinated that this Chinese outfit appears to have similar capability at much lower cost and processing requirements. I cannot help but wonder if the US tech titans are flabby: given vast investment resources, they haven't needed to be efficient, because they can just hose money at everything. Chinese developers, with lower budgets and facing chip bans / restrictions and other limitations, have had to be smart rather than employ brute force.

It's a real smack in the face for the US tech industry. If they're more expensive and can't do better, then it's just a matter of time until they're history.

CEOs are throwing money at it and drooling at the prospect of replacing all of their employees with AI. No more lunches or bathroom breaks, or work-life balance, or sexual harassment lawsuits, the AI will do it all! meanwhile AI can't do basic math, can't tell you how many Rs are in the word strawberry, and constantly makes up fake information
And this is the painful thing. AI companies to a certain extent have literally no interest in whether their product does the job better: they're going to lobby to have businesses replace their staff with AI just so they can make money. They certainly have no interest in what the cost is for the people their product replaces.

And the more AI content there is on the internet the worse AI becomes because it gets trained on AI content becoming more and more subpar. The whole thing only works when there's human work for the AI to copy, steal, and exploit. Brilliant.
Yes, this is the fascinating thing. Studies suggest that LLM AIs may end up destroying themselves; as they increasingly create content, later LLMs will increasingly be trained on content generated by earlier LLMs, and each generation of output becomes more degenerate than the the last. Having a "pre-LLM" database will become crucial, and finding a way to weight that in training to prevent degeneracy.
 

Chimpzy

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OpenAI says it has found evidence that Chinese artificial intelligence start-up DeepSeek used the US company's proprietary models to train its own open-source competitor.
The San-Francisco-based ChatGPT maker told the Financial Times it had seen some evidence of "distillation", a technique used by developers to obtain better performance on smaller models by using outputs from larger, more capable ones. This allows them to achieve similar results on specific tasks at a much lower cost.
"We know [China]-based companies — and others — are constantly trying to distil the models of leading US AI companies," OpenAI added in a statement. "We engage in countermeasures to protect our IP, including a careful process for which frontier capabilities to include in released models, and believe as we go forward that it is critically important that we are working closely with the US government to best protect the most capable models from efforts by adversaries and competitors to take US technology."
One person close to OpenAI said that distillation was a common practice in the industry and highlighted that the company offers developers a way to do this using its own platform, but said: "The issue is when you are doing it to create your own model for your own purposes."
OpenAI is currently battling allegations of its own copyright infringement from newspapers and content creators, including lawsuits from The New York Times and prominent authors, who accuse the company of training their models on their articles and books without permission.
Lol. Lmao even. AI tech bros complaining about being stolen from is never not funny.

 

Casual Shinji

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The world is freaking out about Deepseek, a new Chinese AI with backing from the Chinese government. Nvidia stock price dropped like a rock with the biggest market loss in history losing nearly $600 billion in value.

And I'm sitting here going "it's about fucking time." Nvidia is massively overvalued. AI is massively overvalued.

CEOs are throwing money at it and drooling at the prospect of replacing all of their employees with AI. No more lunches or bathroom breaks, or work-life balance, or sexual harassment lawsuits, the AI will do it all! meanwhile AI can't do basic math, can't tell you how many Rs are in the word strawberry, and constantly makes up fake information. And the more AI content there is on the internet the worse AI becomes because it gets trained on AI content becoming more and more subpar. The whole thing only works when there's human work for the AI to copy, steal, and exploit. Brilliant.
Yeah, but they'll make money off of it so long as the scam persists. And once the bubble bursts they find a new one to inflate.

And the billionaires lived happily ever after.

The End.
 

Agema

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Lol. Lmao even. AI tech bros complaining about being stolen from is never not funny.
Yep. It's right up there with pocketing zillions in public money (grants, subsidies, tax rebates, piggy-backing off publicly funded research) and then demanding we bow down before their entrepreneurial genius.

Of course, I think Altman's point isn't actually about copying, it's more fundamental, about asserting the superiority of OpenAI's technology. What he's saying is that DeepSeek could only get there by hitching a tow on OpenAI, thus its accomplishment is superficial rather than substantive - and therefore investors are still best off backing him.

OpenAI is currently battling allegations of its own copyright infringement from newspapers and content creators, including lawsuits from The New York Times and prominent authors, who accuse the company of training their models on their articles and books without permission.
So, interesting one. Authors were quite pleased that the publishing industry fought back against AI for using their books as training. Except it turns out that publishing companies have been pushing new contracts regarding AI. We have to remember that business is inherently about screwing everyon else for money, and that's how publishers feel about authors, too. It seems that publishing firms don't actually want to defend the ability of human authors to make a living from being ruined by AI-generated content, it's that they want to be the ones who control and profit from the AI-generated content that ruins the ability of human authors to make a living.
 
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Chimpzy

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Of course, I think Altman's point isn't actually about copying, it's more fundamental, about asserting the superiority of OpenAI's technology. What he's saying is that DeepSeek could only get there by hitching a tow on OpenAI, thus its accomplishment is superficial rather than substantive - and therefore investors are still best off backing him.
Are they tho? If I was an investor I would be interested in knowing, if DeepSeek managed to create an ostensibly better, more efficient product using less resources in the way they did, then why didn't OpenAI do the same, them being so cutting edge and innovative and all?

But that may be giving investors too much credit.
 

Agema

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Are they tho? If I was an investor I would be interested in knowing, if DeepSeek managed to create an ostensibly better, more efficient product using less resources in the way they did, then why didn't OpenAI do the same, them being so cutting edge and innovative and all?

But that may be giving investors too much credit.
Imagine that a new web search engine ("Blob") worked by putting searches through Google, DuckDuckGo, etc. and then applying an algorithm to refine their collective outputs to provide to the end user. It might be a better result for the user, but actually most of the work is being done by the other search engines. Without access to the other search engines, "Blob" would be pretty much useless. The implication therefore is that DeepSeek is only any use because it's used OpenAI to do lots of the work, and thus without OpenAI, it's a bust.

OpenAI however can't do the same itself, because this model works by piggy-backing off someone else's hard work... as OpenAI is the one doing the hard work, it's got no-one to piggy-back.

Presumably, OpenAI could make a parallel "light" AI and train it off their main AI to achieve the same as DeepSeek - with lower resource cost. However, presumably that would also retard the development of their main AI, because then it's no longer being used to collect inputs and generate outputs to drive development.

* * *

One might argue it's not so bad if AI ends up as there being sort of core, "heavy" AIs doing the main development, and then a load of "light" AI interfaces that use these as a springboard to create faster, better, less resource-intensive consumer output. But you'd certainly expect those "light" AIs to make agreements and pay the "heavy" AIs for providing so much of the background work. Just like many think any AI developers should pay human creators for the content used in their programming.
 

Chimpzy

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Agema

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I know that it's hardly big news for AI to spout bollocks, but I just I thought I'd share this one Google's gifted me because I'm not allowed to turn the AI function off from my search settings:

Probably the best known drug with an X in its name is "ecstasy"
 
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XsjadoBlayde

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Hey it's something by some people and something by some people is immeasurably better than nothing by nobodies.

now got nobodies by marilyn manson stuck in head n was gonna include track before remembering all the sex creep stuff. don't do sex crimes ppl, it destroys any legacy you hope to leave. and it's super easy to not do them too! look...I'm not doing them right now!
Artists release silent album in protest against AI using their work

25 February 2025

Getty Images / Shutterstock A split picture of Annie Lennox, Kate Bush and Damon Albarn

Getty Images / Shutterstock

(Left to right) Annie Lennox, Kate Bush and Damon Albarn have all backed the silent album protest

More than 1,000 musicians - including Annie Lennox, Damon Albarn and Kate Bush - released a silent album on Tuesday in protest at the UK government's planned changes to copyright law, which they say would make it easier for AI companies to train models using copyrighted work without a licence.

Under the new proposals, AI developers will be able to use creators' content on the internet to help develop their models, unless the rights holders elect to "opt out".

The artists hope the album, entitled Is This What We Want?, will draw attention to the potential impact on livelihoods and the UK music industry.

All profits will be donated to the charity Help Musicians.

"In the music of the future, will our voices go unheard?" Kate Bush said in a statement.

A public consultation on the legal changes closes later on Tuesday.

The album - also backed by the likes of Billy Ocean, Ed O'Brien of Radiohead and Bastille's Dan Smith, as well as The Clash, Mystery Jets and Jamiroquai - features sound recordings of empty studios and performance spaces, demonstrating what the artists fear is the potential impact of the proposed law change.

The tracklisting for the record simply spells out the message: "The British government must not legalise music theft to benefit AI companies."

Various Artists The tracklisting on the back cover of the album carries a message: The British government must not legalise music theft to benefit AI companies.

Various Artists - The tracklisting on the back cover of the album by Various Artists carries a message

The government is currently consulting on proposals that would allow AI companies to use material that is available online without respecting copyright if they are using it for text or data mining.

Generative AI programmes mine, or learn, from vast amounts of data like text, images, or music online to generate new content which feels like it has been made by a human.

The proposals would give artists or creators a so-called "rights reservation" – the ability to opt out.

But critics of the plan believe it is not possible for an individual writer or artist to notify thousands of different AI service providers that they do not want their content used in that way, or to monitor what has happened to their work across the whole internet.

A spokesman for the Department for Science, Innovation and Technology (DSIT) said in a statement on Tuesday that the UK's "current regime for copyright and AI is holding back the creative industries, media and AI sector from realising their full potential - and that cannot continue".

"That's why we have been consulting on a new approach that protects the interests of both AI developers and right holders and delivers a solution which allows both to thrive.

"We have engaged extensively with these sectors throughout and will continue to do so."

They added that "no decisions have been taken" and "no moves will be made until we are absolutely confident we have a practical plan that delivers each of our objectives."

'Disastrous for musicians'

Imogen Heap, Yusuf aka Cat Stevens and Riz Ahmed have also backed the silent album release as well as Tori Amos and Hans Zimmer.

Composer Max Richter, another of the artists involved in the album, noted how the plans not only have an impact on musicians but "impoverish creators" across the board, from writers to visual artists and beyond.

In 2023, UK music contributed a record £7.6 billion to the economy.

Organiser of the silent record, Ed Newton-Rex, said the proposals were not only "disastrous for musicians" in the UK but also "totally unnecessary", as the country can be "leaders in AI without throwing our world-leading creative industries under the bus".

He said the new record showed that "however the government tries to justify it, musicians themselves are united in their thorough condemnation of this ill-thought-through plan."

Singer-songwriter Naomi Kimpenu added: "We cannot be abandoned by the government and have our work stolen for the profit of big tech."

She said the plans would "shatter the prospects of so many emerging artists in the UK".

Pictures of several national newspapers carrying a wrap-around ad for the Make It Fair Campaign

Tuesday's national newspapers carried a wrap-around advert for the Make It Fair Campaign

In January, Sir Paul McCartney told the BBC the proposed changes to copyright law could allow "rip off" technology that might make it impossible for musicians and artists to make a living.

In a letter to The Times, published on Monday, signatories including Sir Paul, Lord Lloyd Webber and Sir Stephen Fry said that changes to the law will allow big tech to raid the creative sectors.

They were joined by the likes of Bush, Ed Sheeran, Dua Lipa and Sting in opposing plans to change copyright laws.

On Tuesday, the UK's creative industries launched a campaign to highlight how their content is at risk of being given away for free to AI firms.

The Make it Fair campaign, which includes wrap-around adverts in national newspapers, is urging people to write to their MPs to object to the government's plans.
is it me or are BBC articles spacing out their paragraphs in tweet lengths these days? am going to actively avoid looking that up so the doubt remains a kind of Schrödinger's comfort