Old social values you could get behind

SacremPyrobolum

New member
Dec 11, 2010
1,213
0
0
I wish we could turn back the clock on inflation. I would be able to live on my saving probably for the rest of my life!
 

Westaway

New member
Nov 9, 2009
1,084
0
0
RAiKE8 said:
Err... Canada very much has a culture. Like. What. I don't even know how to respond to such a statement.
No, it doesn't. I've lived in Toronto, Edmonton and Vancouver. I've traveled the country extensively, including two pan-Canada road trips. There is no such thing as Canadian culture.

RAiKE8 said:
There are certainly positive aspects to religion, but it's also been used as a tool of oppression - a bit too much for my liking. Plus there's the fact that, you know, there's not really any proof for the existence of the supernatural claims that every religion has. As for the last sentence, [citation needed].
I'm not talking about a theocracy and whether or not the religion is actually true is completely irrelevant, as long as people believe in it.
 

Flames66

New member
Aug 22, 2009
2,311
0
0
Tom Roberts said:
Craftsmanship. The idea of planned obsolescence and/or replaceable (rather than repairable) goods is one that can hit the rubbish heap.
I agree with this. Once I buy something I don't expect to have to buy it again a week later. I've taken to making alot of things myself for this reason.

It's also one of the major problems with the new windows operating systems. They haven't even finished Windows 7 yet and they're already planning to release Windows 9. Windows XP was The standard operating system for nearly a decade (still is in many places) and I have no intention of buying an OS newer than Vista for at least that long.
 

Sean Milligan

New member
Sep 15, 2014
4
0
0
"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." If more people treated others the way they would like to be treated, a lot of stuff just clears itself up on its own. Honestly this is all I would like to see, and its a very old principle never seeming to catch on with most people, and very likely never will. But it would be nice to see more of, without any bias toward my own life choices. I respect others freedom to live the life they want to pursue, and defend my own right to do likewise, just as I defend the right for others to make choices I may not agree with... but isn't that the fair way to try and do it? Maybe "Live and let live." fits too some what.
 

BiscuitTrouser

Elite Member
May 19, 2008
2,860
0
41
Westaway said:
But Germany has German culture, and it's the only place in the world where German culture exists.

Diversity means nothing to me. A diverse community is not better off than a homogenous community in anyway.
These two things are in conflict in my mind. I only truly appreciate Malay culture because my flatmate was Malaysian (coming to study here at the age of 20), and we both took the time to talk about our cultures and share our experiences. I wrote her a christmas card in malay and she made me a breakfast traditional to her people. It was really interesting and fun to learn about her people first hand without spending money to go abroad. I tried the food, i learned a tiny amount of the language and i learned about what its like there. That understanding is worth something i think. We related. Shes going to go back to visit or stay forever depending on her choice post-study but she has a story about actually knowing an English person and sharing culture with them. She ate a full christmas roast because our flat threw one.

See why is Germanic culture worth preserving? Because its unique, interesting, vibrant and worth taking the time to appreciate. Which is why living with and forming a dialogue with people from other cultures can be refreshing, i liked being able to share stories about our values, holidays and opinions. That was fun. If you value other cultures then why not value talking to people FROM that culture who can share parts of it with you. Unless by diversity you mean people of that ethnic origin of a different colour who have no real link to it all raised in the same melting pot culture. But talking to natives visiting your native land is a totally different experience. I want to GO to germany rather than just look at pictures of it. Because the people are part of the culture and interacting with them is directly sharing it. Having someone native to Malaysia come here and talk to me, cook me the food her family cooked her that is part of nation, tell me her language, thats not something i can do in a homogenised community.

Of course if by diverse you mean just ticking the rainbow of skin colours yeah, theres no tangible benefit at all. I mean like, diversity that requires you to share stuff about eachother on a personal level.
 

Westaway

New member
Nov 9, 2009
1,084
0
0
BiscuitTrouser said:
Westaway said:
But Germany has German culture, and it's the only place in the world where German culture exists.

Diversity means nothing to me. A diverse community is not better off than a homogenous community in anyway.
These two things are in conflict in my mind. I only truly appreciate Malay culture because my flatmate was Malaysian (coming to study here at the age of 20), and we both took the time to talk about our cultures and share our experiences. I wrote her a christmas card in malay and she made me a breakfast traditional to her people. It was really interesting and fun to learn about her people first hand without spending money to go abroad. I tried the food, i learned a tiny amount of the language and i learned about what its like there. That understanding is worth something i think. We related. Shes going to go back to visit or stay forever depending on her choice post-study but she has a story about actually knowing an English person and sharing culture with them. She ate a full christmas roast because our flat threw one.

See why is Germanic culture worth preserving? Because its unique, interesting, vibrant and worth taking the time to appreciate. Which is why living with and forming a dialogue with people from other cultures can be refreshing, i liked being able to share stories about our values, holidays and opinions. That was fun. If you value other cultures then why not value talking to people FROM that culture who can share parts of it with you. Unless by diversity you mean people of that ethnic origin of a different colour who have no real link to it all raised in the same melting pot culture. But talking to natives visiting your native land is a totally different experience. I want to GO to germany rather than just look at pictures of it. Because the people are part of the culture and interacting with them is directly sharing it. Having someone native to Malaysia come here and talk to me, cook me the food her family cooked her that is part of nation, tell me her language, thats not something i can do in a homogenised community.
You've basically described a best case scenario, and all you got out of it was a second hand cultural experience and a good friend.
 

BiscuitTrouser

Elite Member
May 19, 2008
2,860
0
41
Westaway said:
You've basically described a best case scenario, and all you got out of it was a second hand cultural experience and a good friend.
I had a similar (though not quite as in depth) experience with my bulgarian flatmate too. It wasnt particularly hard to achieve a best case scenario. People coming to live in your country tend to be nervous and open to friendliness. Go say hi, go the extra mile and make them feel welcome, make them a jello or some potato stew or fish and chips or whatever. Represent your culture at its best! They tend to respond quite kindly from my experience. But thats purely personal, maybe im lucky.

You say "All i got" but i value that experience pretty highly. I can understand why you might not, but it isnt fair to say there was "no benefit" when i found a benefit in it. People can and do find benefit.
 

Westaway

New member
Nov 9, 2009
1,084
0
0
BiscuitTrouser said:
Westaway said:
You've basically described a best case scenario, and all you got out of it was a second hand cultural experience and a good friend.
I had a similar (though not quite as in depth) experience with my bulgarian flatmate too. It wasnt particularly hard to achieve a best case scenario. People coming to live in your country tend to be nervous and open to friendliness. Go say hi, go the extra mile and make them feel welcome, make them a jello or some potato stew or fish and chips or whatever. Represent your culture at its best! They tend to respond quite kindly from my experience. But thats purely personal, maybe im lucky.

You say "All i got" but i value that experience pretty highly. I can understand why you might not, but it isnt fair to say there was "no benefit" when i found a benefit in it. People can and do find benefit.
The benefits you found were entirely personal and ignore the fact that multiculturalism on the macro-scale has degenerating results.
 

Fieldy409_v1legacy

New member
Oct 9, 2008
2,686
0
0
I think having a good and wise king rule us for his lifetime would be very much preferable to our popularity contest democracy where any longterm plans can be immediately turfed when the other guy gets elected.

Course having a monarchy rule would be basically flipping a coin every time you get a new King whether they are shit or not. Then theres the whole civil war problem when the crown is disputed.
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
18,863
15
43
Westaway said:
Places like Europe or where ever else do not need multiculturalism because they already have a culture. Canada has no culture, .
hold on a second....who are you to decide who does or doesn't have a culture?

Canada DOES have a culture, its only because to you its so similar to American culture you assume its culturless...you assume its the [I/]default[/I] kind of like how americans say they "have" no accents because in their minds American in the boring default

kind of like Australia...you ask some people they'd say we don't have a culture, we do, we have an ex-british colony western first world culture with a few variations here and there....sure some people find it unremarkable compared to the quaintness of Europe or the much more varied culture of America....because were an incredibly young country that came from a "pre-set" place

but to assume we have no culture at all is the very definition of anglo-centrism
 

Westaway

New member
Nov 9, 2009
1,084
0
0
Vault101 said:
Westaway said:
Places like Europe or where ever else do not need multiculturalism because they already have a culture. Canada has no culture, .
hold on a second....who are you to decide who does or doesn't have a culture?
As a born and raised Canadian who has lived in three cities and traveled the country widely, I can very easily declare Canada has no discernible or practical culture. If you're aware of some magical culture I've never encountered but lives on in the hearts and minds of all Canadians, feel free to explain it to me. I love this country, but it's culturally destitute.
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
18,863
15
43
Westaway said:
As a born and raised Canadian who has lived in three cities and traveled the country widely, I can very easily declare Canada has no discernible or practical culture. If you're aware of some magical culture I've never encountered but lives on in the hearts and minds of all Canadians, feel free to explain it to me. I love this country, but it's culturally destitute.
but you DO have a culture

you just don't find it particularly remarkable because something eastern seems "exotic"

no it doesn't have 1000's of years of history and its not distinct from other 1st world western countries...but its still a culture
 

Westaway

New member
Nov 9, 2009
1,084
0
0
Vault101 said:
Westaway said:
As a born and raised Canadian who has lived in three cities and traveled the country widely, I can very easily declare Canada has no discernible or practical culture. If you're aware of some magical culture I've never encountered but lives on in the hearts and minds of all Canadians, feel free to explain it to me. I love this country, but it's culturally destitute.
but you DO have a culture

you just don't find it particularly remarkable because something eastern seems "exotic"

no it doesn't have 1000's of years of history and its not distinct from other 1st world western countries...but its still a culture
No, it doesn't. You have absolutely no understanding of the topic at hand. Canadian culture does not exist. You're just having a hard time wrapping your head around the idea of a nation not having a culture at all, but it exists and its name is Canada. Have you even been here before? I seriously get the impression you haven't, but if you have and considered the trip to be culturally enriching I'd love to hear about it.
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
18,863
15
43
Westaway said:
No, it doesn't. You have absolutely no understanding of the topic at hand. Canadian culture does not exist. You're just having a hard time wrapping your head around the idea of a nation not having a culture at all, but it exists and its name is Canada. Have you even been here before? I seriously get the impression you haven't, but if you have and considered the trip to be culturally enriching I'd love to hear about it.
did you read what I said or are you just saying things?

I said Canada has a culture

I didn't say it was unique or interesting but its a culture

I don't know what a cultureless society would look like...I'd think maybe some post-human future where were all plugged into a 24/7 bliss machine and we don't create art or have social hierarchy's anymore
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
18,863
15
43
Westaway said:
I said that was incorrect and asked you for proof.
Canada was settled by I think the French and British, both French and English are the main languages spoken there, if I assume correctly it is predominantly Caucasian in population, you live in first world standards the reason being its one of the many country's we classify under the "west" which due to a ton more reasons is a more developed nation, while culturally very similar to America the accent is noticeable in its pronunciation of words like "out" it is known for ice hockey maple syrup and a stereotype of people being incredibly polite

how is this not a culture?
 

Therumancer

Citation Needed
Nov 28, 2007
9,909
0
0
Dirty Hipsters said:
People in the past sucked. Lots of racism and bigotry, sexism, etc. You name it, societies of the past persecuted people for it (and still do in some cases). Still, it wasn't all bad, and there are some social values that we've lost due to "progress" that I wouldn't mind seeing a revival of, like for example the old Victorian adage that "children should neither be seen nor heard."

I hate other people's children. They're loud, they're annoying, and they ruin everything. Airplanes? Children make them hell. Restaurants? If there's a child in there you will not get a peaceful meal. Movies? There's always some shitty parents who decide to bring their toddler to the theater and then act surprised when the little bastard can't sit still and be quiet for 2 hours.

I really wouldn't mind if "children should neither be seen nor heard" made a comeback.

What about the rest of you? Any old social values that you miss and wish would be revived?
Well, honestly I wouldn't be against a regression to an old school 1950s mentality and set of ethics on a lot of things, though I understand why that isn't practical. Of course I suppose by the standards of these forums that's a typical right wing attitude. ;)

To be honest, one thing I'd like to see is a lot more social intolerance. A lot of people tend to think of that as being racist or whatever, but it's actually the opposite, since I believe people, regardless of their ethnicity are the same and capable of the same things, which means you can expect everyone to fit into society. Right now I think one of our biggest problems is social paranoia which has largely come about because too much "tolerance" has lead to the police and society being entirely reactive rather than proactive and too many freaks and wierdos walking the streets. We live in an environment where you'll say run into left wing youth who will both praise diversity and tolerance, and speak about disliking law and order, and the police, but at the same time will make it quite clear they are worried about walking the streets at times since "it's a crazy world out there" without ever taking not of the irony. While bad things of course did happen decades ago, and probably more than we know of because of the lack of current information technology, the bottom line was people were a lot more social and not afraid to walk around their neighborhoods. One of the reasons why video games have come into dominance with the youth is arguably because today it's not safe for kids to go outside like it used to be through a lot of the country. I don't buy into the whole "Grand dad" hype about days when people didn't lock their doors, but at the same time I doubt people felt the need to have multiple locks on every door. Also pretty much every neighborhood seems to always have a fairly recent rape, murder, or home invasion story which cultivates this (meaning stuff that happened and was covered at least locally), which of course wouldn't have gone unnoticed in the 1950s where people did talk to each other the same way if it had been going on like it is now, which it isn't. Truthfully I've never been a big believer in "diminishing crime rates" which seem to be a political tool, as people continue to become more paranoid every year, rather than less so, of course then again everyone being paranoid might also be part of what is diminishing the crime rate (ie if you stop letting your kids out there are less kids to victimize, if you've got scads of locks on your door break ins and invasions become less likely, etc...).

It's one of those cases where I sort of weigh left wing ethics against right wing principles and sort of come down more on the right wing side, because while all this tolerance is great in a textbook sense, when it serves to make people LESS free it becomes counter productive.

I'll also say that while the economy had adjusted to the idea of two incomes so it is unlikely to happen, I very much do believe that one parent should be "stay at home" when kids are involved. That doesn't strictly have to be the woman, but I tend to think things work out better that way for reasons of nurturing... but some guys can do the job too. I personally think that breaking up the "traditional family" is one of the big reasons why we've seen so many broken human beings turned loose on society in recent years, which contributes to the freaks above far more than race. As nice as it is to say how families with "two working parents" made things come together, in many cases it fails, and truthfully despite many people touting those success stories, you hear far more failures when freaks are eventually brought down and inevitably the whole story turns to having one parent, or two that were not around. Sometimes this thing can work, but it's a craps shoot. In many cases "making it work" with two working parents involves the kid becoming a "latchkey kid" (a kid who comes home and spends part of the day all by themselves) and not having anything bad happen to him. The cases where it failed... well that joins the statistics...

So yeah, basically I'm in favor of more pro-active policing, keeping wierdos off the streets, and kids having two parents, one of whom is at home with them. While these things cannot always happen, and I understand that, I think society does not put in enough effort to even try to make that the case anymore.
 

Samsont

New member
Jun 11, 2009
172
0
0
Old social values? Alright, women should all be property, those dumb bitches should know when the MAN is the superior gender. All defective retard children need to be killed before they grow, gotta keep our society clean and all. All blacks need to be enslaved, they're getting far too free-thinking if you ask me. Oh oh oh, and and we need to go back to a feudal system where the nobles crush the poor and generally make their lives a living hell to further their own gains! Who's with me?

But in all seriousness here, the only thing I'd like to return to would be an Ancient Greek/Roman societal opinion on what people should strive for, that the mind and the body are together, and all we should want to be is a better human, not some lofty magical perfect angel that nobody has ever achieved the status of. That'd be nice. ( Minus all the sexism though, that was less nice )
SacremPyrobolum said:
I wish we could turn back the clock on inflation. I would be able to live on my saving probably for the rest of my life!
I see what you did there, old "values".