Old social values you could get behind

norashepard

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Mar 4, 2013
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Propriety! I swear, like, obviously I don't want the associated misogyny and rigid social classes, but I would not mind having to wear specific garb and refer to everyone as "my lord/lady" or by really long obnoxious names like "His Efficacy, Bill Nye of Washington, Purveyor of Science". That and bowing and curtseying is just plain fun imo.

Plus a whole lot of concepts from the ancient Arab world that were forcibly destroyed by European conquerors. Reading up on some of them, it really makes me wonder how humanity got so off track, when they clearly had a lot of things figured out from the start.
 

maidenm

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Jul 3, 2012
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Most "old" values are stuff I look at with scorn. Compleate and utter scorn. The idea that a nucelar family would be better than a divorced family is laughable to me (my grandpa always says his parents stayed together to show their kids what a unhappy marriage looked like) and the notion that purity or chasity was good makes me want to have an orgy.

That being said, there is one thing I'd like to see again. Old fashioned apprenticeship. No education? No problem! Dumb as a bag of nails? Learn what you need and little else! Are you ready to be a proffesional? Create your masterpiece to prove it!

Sure, you might spend 10 years learning how to treat a hammer, but you'll be darned good with that hammer in the end!
 

San Martin

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Jun 21, 2013
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Wandering_Hero said:
San Martin said:
Wandering_Hero said:
Men and women as equals, in both rights and to be expected of them. if its unacceptable for a man to do something it should be unacceptable for a woman to do something. If a woman acts unethically, they should be treated the exact same way as a man who did something unethical. A woman should be expected to stand on her own merits, as a man who can. Their is no weaker gender, especially on the internet. Those who claim to stand for social justice can hold woman to that justice as well as men. harrasmanet is not ok, no matter which gender or faction is doing it. Also practice what you preach.

Man Suffragette Feminism is way better than this modern joke
You sound like something straight out of 9gag. I honestly don't know where people get these twisted ideas about feminism.

OT: as fun as it is to get all nostalgic about the past, I think the general atmosphere of tolerance and progress in my part of the world is about as good as we've had so far, and there don't spring to mind any old values I'd like to see return.
Whats wrong with expecting both genders to be held to equal standards?

I'm just wondering who would defend Quinn and that "gamers are dead lol" person if the genders were reversed. Gender shouldn't affect morality.

Theres no need to coddle people unless you truly believe in the idea of a weaker sex.

Its wrong for people to harass quinn, and its wrong for quinn and her followers to harass people.
Sorry for the slow reply.

To clarify, I'm not accusing you of being sexist. We both want equal treatment for everyone. What I'm saying is that feminists do too, with only a handful of exceptions, and I see no good reason to think otherwise.
 

San Martin

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Jun 21, 2013
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Westaway said:
San Martin said:
Westaway said:
It's probably about time religion made a comeback in the West. I'm irreligious. Also, multiculturalism has no place outside of settler nations such as Canada/USA/Brazil.
Can I ask why to both of these? To me, religion seems like a bad thing and multiculturalism a good thing, so it's interesting that you think differently.
Multiculturalism acts in direct conflict with a national identity. That is why even in settler nations, a melting pot social structure is preferable to multiculturalism. It also creates an environment of mistrust within communities, as proven by a recent Harvard study.

Places like Europe or where ever else do not need multiculturalism because they already have a culture. Canada has no culture, therefor multiculturalism in a [flawed] way fills that void. But Germany has German culture, and it's the only place in the world where German culture exists. You only dilute that culture when you import thousands of immigrants and tell them it's okay to retain their previous culture instead of assimilating. There is nothing inherently positive about multiculturalism or diversity, and I say that as a student of the University of British Columbia- one of the most diverse communities on Earth. I have friends from very literally all around the world, but I do not value them because of that. I value them because they're good friends. Diversity means nothing to me. A diverse community is not better off than a homogenous community in anyway.

As for religion, it is a platform for self improvement which bonds communities and offers a solid moral backbone. The modern zeitgeist is confusion and nihilism.
Though it's not central to your argument, I would strongly disagree that American countries (such as Canada) lack their own culture by now!

However, overall I see your point, though I think a little diversity is a good thing to help make sure a society doesn't stagnate. But I agree that problems arise when people of distinct nations and entirely differing moral codes end up living in close proximity.
 

newfoundsky

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Feb 9, 2010
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Entitled said:
Purity culture.

Well, I would prefer a more gender-neutral version of it, where women don't get singled out with slut-shaming like they always were and are. But in principle, I would prefer it if everyone would be encouraged to keep their pants on.
That's exactly why the hippies did the thing and those are a group I rather not see make a come back. War losin' little pot smokin.... *mutters incoherently*

I would like to see the LAbor Movement make a come back.
 

Qizx

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Feb 21, 2011
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krazykidd said:
I'm black so nothing really. I got the short end of the stick there . Society hasn't been kind to us for about 2000 years, give or take.
I mean I don't think he meant you have to go back, he meant take ONE aspect of the past. IE: I wouldn't like any of the shit that happened to me/my family back in the 40's and 50's but I wouldn't mind the Glamor of Flying making a comeback.
 

Hazy

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Jun 29, 2008
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krazykidd said:
I'm black so nothing really. I got the short end of the stick there . Society hasn't been kind to us for about 2000 years, give or take.
Instantly reminded me of this.



I don't care what social values we need to adopt to get rid of Swag kids, but for the love of god, I get behind anything that works towards getting rid of them.
 

Robert B. Marks

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Jun 10, 2008
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I'm rather fond of the feminism of Mary Wollstonecraft:

Equality for one half of the human race, without dragging down the other half.

Such a simple idea, and so fair. Just raise everybody up to the same level. Everybody gets to start from the same place, and meritocracy takes over from there.

And that idea comes to us from the year 1792.
 

Flames66

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Aug 22, 2009
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Witty Name Here said:
treat women respectfully, offer an umbrella/coat to them whenever they need it.
I disagree with this. I use bringing the appropriate clothing as a gauge of someones common sense, a large dedermining factor in whether I can get on with them. If the circumstances went something like "Blimey, the weather changed quickly, I don't have anything to handle this sudden torrential rain", I might respond by offering aid. Otherwise I expect that at some point in the future I will be this person:


OT: I am a man of my word and I expect everyone I encounter to be the same.
 

Westaway

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Nov 9, 2009
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San Martin said:
Though it's not central to your argument, I would strongly disagree that American countries (such as Canada) lack their own culture by now!

However, overall I see your point, though I think a little diversity is a good thing to help make sure a society doesn't stagnate. But I agree that problems arise when people of distinct nations and entirely differing moral codes end up living in close proximity.
I didn't say all American countries had no culture. I said Canada had no culture. It doesn't. I've lived here my whole life in three different cities and have traveled it extensively. There is no Canadian culture. Other American countries have created their own countries, but in most cases they've eliminated/subjugated the original population/culture. I care a lot more about cultures with long histories. England, Tibet, etc, which are at risk.

I don't think there's any reason to think diversity prevents stagnation.
 

Robert B. Marks

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Westaway: Canada has its own culture - I've lived here my entire life too. I've also traveled to England and the United States, and it's not hard to see just how different both are to Canada.

When you live in a place, you're immersed in the culture - it's normal for you. You have to get out of the country just to see how different it is from everybody else.
 

AnarchistFish

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Jul 25, 2011
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Uriel_Hayabusa said:
I feel that some parts of society have become entirely too sympathetic towards criminal behavior, to the point that certain criminal actions will be blamed on things like poverty or racism or a crappy childhood or something else that's ''out of that person's control''. The way I see it, anyone who blames outside factors for their criminal actions is only looking for excuses.

David Draiman, the lead singer of Disturbed (a band I don't particularly like, by the way) said something about this subject that perfectly encapsulate my feelings:

''The minute that you start blaming everything around you for why somebody loses their goddamn mind is the minute that everybody comes up with an excuse to be a maniac''

Source:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOCP-nQvPzg
David Draiman has always been a moron
 

ninjaRiv

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Aug 25, 2010
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Being a classy gentleman! Holding doors open and all that shit! I don't think it's that popular, any more; letting women onto a bus or through a door first seems like an alien concept to some people.
 

gagagaga

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Aug 17, 2013
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Westaway said:
San Martin said:
Westaway said:
It's probably about time religion made a comeback in the West. I'm irreligious. Also, multiculturalism has no place outside of settler nations such as Canada/USA/Brazil.
Can I ask why to both of these? To me, religion seems like a bad thing and multiculturalism a good thing, so it's interesting that you think differently.
Multiculturalism acts in direct conflict with a national identity. That is why even in settler nations, a melting pot social structure is preferable to multiculturalism. It also creates an environment of mistrust within communities, as proven by a recent Harvard study.

Places like Europe or where ever else do not need multiculturalism because they already have a culture. Canada has no culture, therefor multiculturalism in a [flawed] way fills that void. But Germany has German culture, and it's the only place in the world where German culture exists. You only dilute that culture when you import thousands of immigrants and tell them it's okay to retain their previous culture instead of assimilating. There is nothing inherently positive about multiculturalism or diversity, and I say that as a student of the University of British Columbia- one of the most diverse communities on Earth. I have friends from very literally all around the world, but I do not value them because of that. I value them because they're good friends. Diversity means nothing to me. A diverse community is not better off than a homogenous community in anyway.

As for religion, it is a platform for self improvement which bonds communities and offers a solid moral backbone. The modern zeitgeist is confusion and nihilism.
Err... Canada very much has a culture. Like. What. I don't even know how to respond to such a statement.

There are certainly positive aspects to religion, but it's also been used as a tool of oppression - a bit too much for my liking. Plus there's the fact that, you know, there's not really any proof for the existence of the supernatural claims that every religion has. As for the last sentence, [citation needed].
 

giles

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Feb 1, 2009
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ninjaRiv said:
Being a classy gentleman! Holding doors open and all that shit! I don't think it's that popular, any more; letting women onto a bus or through a door first seems like an alien concept to some people.
Hm I disagree. Being born with a vagina is not an accomplishment worthy of my recognition. I let older, sickly or pregnant people through first because they should take priority on seats and are slower than average.
I will naturally find a standing position rather than occupying a seat when I sense the train might be crowded because I'm in sublime physical condition, but I can't show respect to someone based on gender alone. Feigning respect out of politeness to people who don't deserve it takes away from all of the people you genuinely respect.
 

Weaver

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Apr 28, 2008
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Monogamy is still a thing, right? That's how I like my relationships anyways.
 

ninjaRiv

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giles said:
ninjaRiv said:
Being a classy gentleman! Holding doors open and all that shit! I don't think it's that popular, any more; letting women onto a bus or through a door first seems like an alien concept to some people.
Hm I disagree. Being born with a vagina is not an accomplishment worthy of my recognition. I let older, sickly or pregnant people through first because they should take priority on seats and are slower than average.
I will naturally find a standing position rather than occupying a seat when I sense the train might be crowded because I'm in sublime physical condition, but I can't show respect to someone based on gender alone. Feigning respect out of politeness to people who don't deserve it takes away from all of the people you genuinely respect.
But... Vaginas are all that matters...

But obviously, all the people you mentioned should get preferential treatment. Doesn't mean letting a lady through a door first or helping her with her bags isn't a nice thing to do. Don't get me wrong, I try to be nice and polite to EVERYONE but the whole "gentleman" thing always seemed like a good idea to me.
 

CaitSeith

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Respect and trust on real science and real scientists. Anyone can search about cosmic rays in the Internet and declare he knows more about rocket science than NASA.
 

Tom Roberts

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Mar 1, 2010
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Craftsmanship. The idea of planned obsolescence and/or replaceable (rather than repairable) goods is one that can hit the rubbish heap.