On Arty 2D Platformers

[zaratustra]

You know what's ironic? Yahtzee's games were one of the primary inspirations for Eversion.

And indie devs like platformers because they're easy to make. If FPSes were easy to make you'd see arty FPSes.

 

[Unesh52]

Did he say platforming doesn't translate well to 3D movement? What about the team ICO games? Or Assassin's Creed?

I never played ICO but, in Assassin's Creed the platforming works like this: hold a button, press forward and the game does the rest for you. I don't know if the automation counts as a good translation.

I know there're good 3D platforming games like Prince of Persia but, even then, some times the prospect doesn't help.

I don't know, most 2D platformers are limited to 2 button controls. Jump and "interact." The latter may be interpreted many ways, from picking stuff up to talking to NPCs to operating a weapon, but I'd say it rarely contributes to the platforming itself except to "activate switch," with the occasional exception, like LBP's grab button (it's 2D enough! ). The simplicity of AC's control scheme doesn't disqualify it from being classified as a platformer. In fact, by the two button standard, it's very complex.

Also, I don't understand your last statement. What prospect doesn't help what?

The sonic's game in the Genesis era had only one function. Still you have a lot of timing and precise jumps. I'm not saying a game needs it to be good. I just saying this is the "vision" many have of plataformers and the introtuction of the third dimension make part of this lost in translation. Even in the most successful 3D plataformers. What you call plataforming parts in Assassins Creed a lot of people prefer call, parkour parts. Basically because doesn't feel like the other games we used to call plataformers.

I guess that sort of fits with what m64 was talking about. "Classic" platforming, which revolves around precisely timed and positioned jumps, often set to a time limit, doesn't fit well in the 3D model. Which makes 3D platforming, which is more about solving puzzles that just also have you climbing all over them, almost like a completely different genre.

 

[gamepopper101]

Well you can't limit yourselves to just indie developers...sort of. A Boy and his Blob, while a re-imagining, is a very good platformer and I find it very superior to David Crane's creation.

 

[Allan Foe]

I played about halfway through Cave Story. Pretty quickly, the depressing nature of it got to me, especially when a few glances at an online guide revealed that I probably wasn't going to get the good ending. The reasoning? For all things, DECIDING TO TALK TO A CERTAIN NPC AS YOU PASS HIM BY.
It came to the point when so many characters had been killed off, I decided that "saving the world" was a failed task, and so I left the game. Killing the cared-about characters is a good way of giving emotional drive, but when there's not many positives left, there's not much drive left.

Why so serious?!
I can't believe you get depressed so easily! And to think that some people don't accept the Good Ending as "canon" because they consider the Normal one more appropriate... It isn't really a bad ending, just not the best one.

I can't believe Yahtzee didn't mention Eversion.

I can. Believe it, that is.
But seriously, Yahtzee, if you didn't play that one -- GO PLAY, NOW. It's right up your alley.

 

[Katana314]

I played about halfway through Cave Story. Pretty quickly, the depressing nature of it got to me, especially when a few glances at an online guide revealed that I probably wasn't going to get the good ending. The reasoning? For all things, DECIDING TO TALK TO A CERTAIN NPC AS YOU PASS HIM BY.
It came to the point when so many characters had been killed off, I decided that "saving the world" was a failed task, and so I left the game. Killing the cared-about characters is a good way of giving emotional drive, but when there's not many positives left, there's not much drive left.

Why so serious?!
I can't believe you get depressed so easily! And to think that some people don't accept the Good Ending as "canon" because they consider the Normal one more appropriate... It isn't really a bad ending, just not the best one.

You're sort of misinterpretting me. It wasn't like this:
"*Sob* I just can't take it! This is so sad!"
More like this:
"Aaaaaand so now that's Curly, Moe, John, Jim, and the whole TreasureHunter's gang. All dead now. Y'know what? Fuck it. Now I suddenly don't care."

Kind of like how you feel in a Left 4 Dead game when the first three guys have been killed by a surprise Hunter attack coming out of the saferoom, and you just feel like screwing around until you get killed.

 

[Allan Foe]

You're sort of misinterpretting me. It wasn't like this:
"*Sob* I just can't take it! This is so sad!"
More like this:
"Aaaaaand so now that's Curly, Moe, John, Jim, and the whole TreasureHunter's gang. All dead now. Y'know what? Fuck it. Now I suddenly don't care."

Kind of like how you feel in a Left 4 Dead game when the first three guys have been killed by a surprise Hunter attack coming out of the saferoom, and you just feel like screwing around until you get killed.

Well that's a bit difficult for me to understand because out of

Spoiler

4

characters that die in the normal route you only have time to get attached to

Spoiler

Curly.

With others it's mostly "Hello! *5 seconds* Goodbye!", they were nice minor characters but that's about it. Lots of equivalently (in)significant minor charters survive. Even Team Rocket doesn't bite the dust

Spoiler

, they simply remain "eternally screwed".

And what about the girl you (may or may not have) slept with? Don't you care about what happens to her, you monster?

...

You could always just start a new run, you know. The requirement of

Spoiler

skipping the Jetpack 0.8 and the Machine Gun

actually changes gameplay, so it's not like your replays will be absolutely identical.

 

[Crono Maniac]

It is now two o' clock in the morning. I am still playing Shadow of the Colossus. I started playing it for the first time earlier this evening, and I haven't stopped. Thank you for showing me the joys of jumping onto a giant weird bird-thing and stabbing it in the wings until it falls into a lake and drowns. Thank you.

 

[Crono Maniac]

Strike that, four o' clock. I'm beginning to think maybe I should be cursing you and not thanking you.

 

[dogcat]

It's also fairly inarguable that platforming doesn't translate well to 3D movement.

I think every single Super Mario 3D-game would disagree? Banjo-Kazooie series? SMG2 is vastly superior to the majority of 2D platformers ever released.