Personally, I think BioWare wrote themselves into a corner and simply could not end it with a reasonable victory. Lord of the Rings did a good job setting the stage for why the ring was invincible except for this very small volcano in the heart of Mordor. The quest was challenging, but doable. BioWare never did that with the reapers. At no point in the series did I ever think, wow I really have a shot at beating these guys. 1 reaper pretty much destroyed the entire galactic fleet in ME1, how could we ever possible win against hundreds or thousands of them? Other than assuming they were killbots with a kill count limit, BioWare never created conditions for victory.
In a way, Bioware missed a big opportunity by making Mass Effect 2 about the Collectors and not the Reapers. It gave us an enemy that was tangential to the main quest and didn't raise the stakes in anyway (in more than a few ways, the Collectors are a far less threatening enemy than the Reapers). If they spent the previous game setting the stage for a possible plan to stop the Reapers, this would have been avoided. I guess they made them so all-mighty, they didn't really know how to end them. As it were, it was inevitable that the game would introduce a Deus Ex, but it shouldn't have done it so late...
Mass Effect 3 was flawed, yes, but is it really necessary to continue reminding yourself of why you hate it? Do you take some sort of perverse pleasure from it?
Because if we forget our mistakes then we WILL repeat them. People forgot that EA killed the Ultima series, the last long lasting RPG and we didnt stop them from doing the same to Bioware........we forgot.
Also, if millions of people scream "It burns!! It burns!!" Then someone is bound to check it out. And we can get gems of research like this:
Even our illustrious Bob Chipman got in the act, with not one, not two, but THREE whole episodes (Crass Effect, After Mass, and Mutants and Masses for The Big Picture), of him reaffirming every negative trait and stereotype he has. Little to no research or even playing the entire game, it's no wonder the backlash he received is second only to Heavens to Metroid.
Well, it was obvious since the Heavens to Metroid that he cares about controversy for the sake of making money even his argument doesnt make any damn sense.
Why people still follow him? he failed all gamers in a time of need, a time where games as art could be defended by saying that the audience really care about them but its just the corporate bullshit that keeps making them suck (EA). And yet we are somehow responsible for something that BARELY reasembles art, and its more like a product for mass appeal and nothing else.
True, but it was still better than the original. And if a conclusion born of angry fan denial was better than what the developers came up with then something is wrong.
I disagree. The indoctrination ending isn't better. The most obvious reason is this is supported by flimsy evidence that can easily be dismissed. Any piece of evidence used to support the theory simply has an alternate explanation that, in most cases, is more plausible. The less obvious reason is that the indoctrination theory is neither narratively nor thematically consistent. The game is based upon the notion that choice matters - to rely upon an ending where your character is robbed of choice not only undermines that theme, it is quite literally the story equivalent of telling players to go fuck themselves. Beyond that, the indoctrination theory undermines everything you've done as a player in the third game by making you a pawn of the Reapers. Finally, there is the fundamental problem that there is no mechanism for long distance indoctrination presented anywhere else in the fiction and Shepard simply did not spend the lengthy amount of time around a Reaper or notable reaper artifacts to justify his indoctrination.
Simply put, if Reapers were so easily capable of force indoctrinating a group, they would not rely so heavily upon force of arms to achieve their ends. Combine that with the myriad other problems with the theory and you'll find that this explanation, if more satisfying intellectually is actually a worse ending simply because it is inconsistent.
Except the indocrination theory doesn't rob you of choice. It says: "You are indocrinated. Your choices up to this point will be the standoff to what's going to happen next". Choose the destroy ending? Good you are resisting. The choices you did up to that point will decide the battle and your own fate. Choose the Control? You are falling right into the indocrination. Having a choice at this point depends only on your behavior. The right one will unlock the choice of killing yourself, deactivating Harbinger for a while, giving the fleet time to kill him. If not, you are forced to hack the Crucible, with the knowledge of Harbinger, to send a massive shockwave which doesn't hit the Reapers. Synthethise? You are now the main conscience of a Reaper, and must choose, after hearing Harbinger's speech, to accept your fate or to rebel. Refuse? Everyone dies (unless you did REAL good, but even then they will be mostly in the shit) but the Reapers suffered so many losses that the next cycle will probably be victorious."
No point in here you are deprived of choice, unless your previous choices created that scenario. This theory might not be real, but it's much, much better than whatever ending Bioware could come up with. It's not inconsistent, it's not intelectually inferior. It's not going to happen, but it's better in ever way.
Everybody else has already pointed out everything I hate about the endings. But for me, I didn't completely lose faith in Bioware and Mass Effect until the Ad for DLC after the credits. It was like " Fuck you, and the game you love, give us more money." It was that moment I knew the Bioware I loved, whose games I was always supremely excited for, was dead.
A part of me wants to play Leviathan and Omega and get some of the other DLC for it. But with everything that's happened. Not just the ending but how Bioware/EA handled it...that's what gets me and makes me withhold my money. Not so much the ending (anymore anyways) but merely how Bioware Handled it. A company that people trusted more or less taking the company line and tossing 'artfartic inbertigy' (misspelled on purpose I swear) as a catchall shield to justify their decision. BTW I think it's very telling that right after the ME4 announcement two of the companies founders leave. I don't even hate the ending anymore, I think it's bullocks and a pile of horseshit but I'm just not that angry anymore. and I don't know if I'll ever buy from them again.
I think in the years (if not decades) ahead, ME3 will end up being a watershed moment in video gaming. Essentially, it was something that was inconceivable when it happened (to anyone) and was a moment when an entire industry effectively told its consumers to 'shut up and like it'.
Not one, but several brands were damaged by the debacle. The Juggernaut of the Mass Effect Franchise (as it had been) was ruined. It will continue on but it will never be what it once was or could have been. Bioware's reputation (especially after the Dragon Age fiasco) was obliterated. Then, you have IGN, etc. - and the whole gaming journalism industry - jump on board the sinking ship by not realizing who paid their bills and their reputations suffering in the eyes of their customers.
As an Economist, I found this simply insane - the product of an industry that perpetually saw its customer base as 12-year olds who needed to be told when to be quiet, when many gamers upset with them like me are in our mid-30's. It was protectionism of the gaming industry by the gaming journalism industry which exists to critique them, not to coddle them. It was a moment when gaming companies saw a massive franchise value plummet and reality checks went off all over the industry.
I agree that years from now this will be part of a marketing course. It all comes down to value. Good companies recognize it when they see it and run with what they have instead of trying to manipulate profit by pulling what Bioware tried to pull. Good journalism is a check on what it's supposed to watch instead of being cozy with it and trying to shape its customers perceptions instead of reflect them.
Future game developers and journalists have been warned - their customers do pay their bills, and there are penalties for kicking them and telling them to like it.
It is isn't it? The multiplayer developers were far better at judging their audience. Well that and the part with Mordin.
I sort of want to be happy with Mass Effect 3. Some parts were quite definitely good enough for me to overlook the imperfections. However as someone else said, the last line of the series being "buy more dlc" and the general fiasco that was the ending of the controversy just leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.
Conclusion? It could have been great, but now it can serve as an examples for some things you shouldn't do. Now let us never speak of this again.
You know, at first I was angry. I didn't understand why Bioware would put such shit endings to the entire ME series, and I really didn't understand why my choices affected jack shit when they were supposed to change everything. I also thought the day-one DLC was absolute horseshit, and the ad after the credits was like a kick in the balls. After a day or two, my anger faded into apathy, and a massive amplification of the cynicism that I was slowly building towards the gaming industry anyway.
What I came away with was that money has now truly taken over the entertainment that we love. Yeah, even at the beginning it was partially about money, coders have to feed themselves after all, but now, that is all it's about. I should have seen it coming, as the exact same thing has happened with nearly everything else in the world, but I guess that I still had enough childhood naivety to believe that something so many people loved and had a passion for could rise above the muck of the corporate world that we live in today.
I'm quite conflicted concerning this issue, because as much as i hate the endings, I think it would be a mistake on bioware's part to change it. Not only would they lose even more respect, since that would show that if the fans whine loud and long enough they can get whatever they want, but it would probably have resulted in an even worse ending. When the extended cut was released, i still wasn't satisfied, but i was a definite improvement, since the original ending butchered everything we fought for in the trilogy AND any sequels. With the EC now only the sequels will suffer.
I'm also in the minority in regards to DLC. Of course i despise day one DLC, since that's just content from the game that was cut post-production to milk the fans, but post-release DLC is fine by me. You are in no way obligated to buy it if you don't want to, but if you liked the game and want more than DLC gives you more.
Another un-popular opinion about ME3 that I have is that the actual game DID NOT SUCK. Up until the last 2 minutes i was having a blast with it. It certainly was not up to the level of the previous two, but by no means was it bad or mediocre, it was a good game that was overshadowed by it's predecessors greatness.
Recent releases on bioware's part weren't too popular with the larger community, but i like both ME3 and DA2 (yes, you read that right, i liked DA2) and by no means have I "lost faith in bioware" or think that bioware is "dead" or some butthurt bullshit like that. Mass Effect is and will be my second favorite video game series, and my number one favorite trilogy.
Now i'll fly off to kill some geth in the great multiplayer mode in ME3, and let you haters get back to whining.
I have my own issues with Mass Effect 3, besides the craptacular endings and the internet fights it created. I thought the plot was simple and uninspired (even by Bioware standards), The Crucible was a blatant Deus Ex Machina to the overarching plot, Cerberus went from "Space Illuminati" to The Empire from Star Wars with little to no explanation, TIM is completely bonkers to detriment of the plot, Liara is shilled relentlessly, other characters either prove to be completely useless, annoying, or just plain creepy (here's looking at you EDI). Gameplay feels gutted and half-finished, with a distinct lack of polish. One button does not need to control running, rolling, taking cover, leaving cover, vaulting over cover, and activating a thing. There's little of the gameplay variation from the last games; no hacking minigames, no giant vehicle rampages, and sidequests that are the very definition of tacked on. Fights are very unimpressive and boring, and the Atlas stealing gameplay element is utterly superfluous. And lest I forget the galaxy at war bullshit that required I play multiplayer to see the best ending, effectively damaging the singleplayer with the multiplayer.
The fan reaction to the endings was something have never seen before, and probably will never see again. There are so many different accounts and spins on the story, I could write a book on it.
Agree with everything you said. Mass Effect 3 was easily the most disappointing game of the year for me, and I don't think i'll ever forget it. I'm done with Bioware, not only because of how awful the game is, but because of their reaction. Although, I have to give them some credit, Tuchanka and Rannoch were two of the best missions I've played in a game. But everything else was simply 'meh' to downright insulting to the audience.
It is isn't it? The multiplayer developers were far better at judging their audience. Well that and the part with Mordin.
I sort of want to be happy with Mass Effect 3. Some parts were quite definitely good enough for me to overlook the imperfections. However as someone else said, the last line of the series being "buy more dlc" and the general fiasco that was the ending of the controversy just leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.
Conclusion? It could have been great, but now it can serve as an examples for some things you shouldn't do. Now let us never speak of this again.
I'd say overall the Genophage, and Geth arcs were pretty damn awesome, the one-off misiions that serve to highlight former squadmates are also good. The rest of the story is where it loses me.
I have mixed feelings about ME3. On the one hand, the game had many scenes that I loved: Shooting bottles with Garrus, Mordin curing the Genophage, brokering peace between the Geth and the Quarians, and Admiral Anderson's heartbreaking death scene; and I had a lot of fun zooming around the battlefield as a Vanguard, annihilating enemies with telekinesis-charged punches.
But then, all throughout the game, I kept noticing the flaws: a vastly reduced number of dialogue options (Shepard says eight lines on her own before you can make your first choice, I counted), the sidequests are 90% half-assed fetch quests, Harbinger is a complete non-entity, and the removal of the last remaining elements of exploration left in the series.
I didn't hate the ending with the same vitriol that so many others had. The glowy kid didn't bug me too much since it seemed clear to me that it was a crazy AI that was given too much power, and I could comprehend its reasoning for the purpose of the Reapers, which was basically the same as the Genophage on a much larger scale. But I still couldn't bring myself to actually like the ending because of all the other flaws: Joker fleeing, your crew magically being back on the Normandy, the destruction of the Relays, the moronic Adam and Eve allegory, and how utterly wasted Harbinger's potential was (Not even one line!), just to name a few.
The Extended Cut addressed many of these flaws, and I appreciate the effort, but it was too little too late. I was hoping it would make me say, "Wow, they did it, the new ending is perfect! Everything is wonderful now!" but instead, all it got out of me is what I expected it to get: "Well, I guess it's better." I can't help but wonder how everyone would have reacted if the Extended Cut had been the original ending.
Nowadays when I think about the Mass Effect series, it's with a feeling of weary apathy. I can't bring myself to care about the Leviathan or Omega DLCs because, for good or ill, Mass Effect is over for me. Going back to play the DLC would feel like... I don't know, a lie? I only returned to the game once after beating it, and even then it was only because A) I wanted to see how the Garrus romance story went, and B) I felt like I should experience the Extended Cut endings in the game itself, rather than just watching them on YouTube.
There was a time, not too long ago, when I would look upon an upcoming BioWare release with joy and nothing less than the highest expectations. Mass Effect 2 was the last game they made that even came close to these expectations, EA has corrupted that which I once loved. I have some minor interest in Dragon Age 3, but my hopes are far from up. Because these days, whenever I look at BioWare...
I could understand you until this sentence. You just couldn't resist snatching the low hanging fruit could you?
To think that there are some people who are actually perplexed why the people who didn't like Mass Effect 3's ending resent being called whiners and entitled.
Can't really say, I just picked up the PS3 Trilogy edition, and am just now getting to ME3. That being said, however, I didn't exactly stay out of the controversy or spoilers, so I know a fair bit about it.
So far, for my playthrough, the only feasible possibility is to hit the reset button on galactic civilization, because it's not just about the current cycle's well being, it's about all future cycles as well. There's only four billion subtle references to indoctrination, so doing anything but destroying everything the Reapers are, and what they use to cull, would be a failure.
Of course, all this might change as I play more, and possibly when I play it all again on a different route, and I look forward to seeing how crap the ending is when you're in the series as a whole, but as of now, everything I've seen lines up.
I could understand you until this sentence. You just couldn't resist snatching the low hanging fruit could you?
To think that there are some people who are actually perplexed why the people who didn't like Mass Effect 3's ending resent being called whiners and entitled.
I never dropped the word "entitled", nor would I, since whole the ending fiasco borderline redefined it's meaning, and it's entirely overused. Nor would it be appropriate in this context.
And as you'd know if you would have actually read my comment, that i too hate the endings, and the "haters" was adressed to those who were hating on other aspects of the game just to spite BW. I understand those with genuine arguments, but the people who go like "durr hurr the ending sucks so here's a million other trivial reasons why everyone HAS to hate this game" will get no respect from me. i meant no offence to anyone who does not share that closed minded view.
I'm wondering why I only saw good things being said about the game until people started to play the ending...
I think people were being so simple about it, they thought that a bad ending = bad game.
When people started to say "hold on on a minute, it was still a great game though" the ending people began to try and convince themselves that the game was terrible.
I'm extremely disappointed that the Indoctrination theory wasn't what they went with. I mean...Bioware actually went and set everything up so perfectly...
The indoctrination theory is born of denial. It just leaves us with a non-ending.
If you want to wrap around the incomprehensible minds of the bioware writers I would suggest this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiN8gL40d84
It really is the best 'last look' at mass effect. And he's done ME2 and DA2 as well.
I haven't finished ME3 myself. Maybe that means I shouldn't voice my opinion here. Maybe its a statement on the game all on its own. Maybe I'm going to post anyway.
The gameplay was nothing gripping, and the story was dull (and as I'm sure everyone knows gets worse) so I had no reason to press on instead of calling it quits and booting up the ol' Skyrim again. But the depth to this indoctrination theory is aaaalmost enough to get me to change my mind, which is more than anything else has done.
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