[P]Federal Court may have just handed 2020 over to Trump already with Electoral College decision.

tstorm823

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Seanchaidh said:
You were wrong before and you're wrong now! Most of the Democrats are Republicans and Trump is a white nationalist.
I don't know about most, but I can agree with some. There are absolutely Democrats who would be Republicans if they lived in a different place, and vice versa. Trump isn't a white nationalist. I'm not gonna say Trump isn't racist, he's definitely old enough to carry on the legacy of a bygone era. But he's been unequivocally against white nationalism.
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
tstorm823 said:
Worgen said:
Democrats in any numbers wouldn't vote for trump unless they were legit stupid as hell. I'm actually surprised any religious people would vote for him considering how he seems to be more willing to use religion as a tool, guess getting trans people out of the military wets your god panties more then I thought it would.
Then apparently a bunch of people were stupid as hell. I personally know a solid dozen politically active, registered Democrats who voted for Trump. I, the Republican, do not vote for Trump. They did. (Hint, they aren't stupid.) And I'm not inclined to consider your opinion of what my opinion should be based on Religion, you clearly don't even care to understand and are taking utterly unrelated cheap shots.

You have to care about the date of a study or else I could just call you an anti-semite because of what the catholic church did to jews long ago. Time matters.
You mean protected them for thousands of years [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church_and_Judaism#Antisemitism]? Why do you think the Jewish people were in the Holy Roman Empire to begin with?

I don't recall ever saying that most engineers couldn't be republican, my point was that you haven't shown data that convinces me of it and I haven't been able to find anything that solidly lists it.
You suggested I was getting my information from Stormfront. You said "I don't feel like this should be that hard to find if its that true." And you ultimately listed as an example of my "multiple lies". You didn't say that most engineers couldn't be republican, but you sure as hell are attacking me for suggesting it.

Both parties were kinda the party of racism but your right, democrats were pretty damn racist back in the day, but after they started with the civil rights stuff, despite the southern democrats resistance, that pretty much solidified them as being better then republicans on it, especially since most of the southern democrats ended up changing to the republican party. I actually remember when this state switched colors in the 90s, before then it was unheard of for republicans to control it, now its solidly gerrymander red.
No, both parties were kinda the party of racism. There's no comparison, not even close. Saying pre-Civil Rights movement parties were both kinda the party of racism would be like saying now that both parties are the party of gun control. There's no equivalence, not even a little. It wasn't a Republican leading the chant of "Segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever!"

No, most of the southern democrats didn't end up changing to the republican party. I'm aware of 2 Democratic politicians that flipped, and I can't even remember the name of the one that wasn't Strom Thurmond. Al Gore senior was a southern Democrat, that family never changed. Robert Byrd never changed. As far as the voters, the south didn't flip until 30-40 years later, as you witnessed firsthand. That's not people flipping parties because of changes in racial politics from the 60s. That's not a flip caused by people rejecting the Civil Rights Act of 1965, that's a flip cause by an entire generation of old racists literally dying and being replaced by... well... being replaced by you. I presume you're not a racist. The south flipped as it got less racist.

You remember when Republicans flipped the state red. Do you really think that happened because they were more racist? Do you really think the Republicans in the 90s and 00s were flipping southern states because they were more racist than they were in the 60s? That just seems like a weird theory to me.

Oh we don't even need to look deep, we can just look at shit trump says.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Trump is a Democrat.
I can understand voting for some republicans, but not trump, anyone who voted for him and calls themselves a dem is a dumbass and I hope those people you know feel suitably bad about it. I take shots at peoples religiosity because its supposed to mean something, they like to hold themselves to a higher morals. For instance, they like to talk about how sacred marriage is then vote for someone with multiple ex wifes and lots of stories about infidelity and such.

Ehh, maybe I was thinking of protestants.

I didn't mean to imply you got it from stormfront, but stormfront came up several times as a top hit when I was trying to find the numbers.

You can tell how much of a democrat trump is because the republican party does everything he wants.
 

tstorm823

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Worgen said:
I can understand voting for some republicans, but not trump, anyone who voted for him and calls themselves a dem is a dumbass and I hope those people you know feel suitably bad about it. I take shots at peoples religiosity because its supposed to mean something, they like to hold themselves to a higher morals. For instance, they like to talk about how sacred marriage is then vote for someone with multiple ex wifes and lots of stories about infidelity and such.

Ehh, maybe I was thinking of protestants.
I'm not even going to put that on Protestants, I don't think that's a fair characterization of any group. There are egocentric jerks everywhere, independent of religious belief, but I don't think religious people as a whole anywhere think they're supposed to hold themselves to higher morals than everyone else. I hold myself to Catholic morality (to the best of my ability), and other people may have different moral codes, but that's a disagreement, not a condemnation. And a failure to act morally isn't a lack of moral code necessarily, nobody succeeds in being the perfect version of themselves. Unless someone believes something is moral good and I believe it a heinous sin, a disagreement in moral code isn't going to bother me. That's between them and their conscience.

Now I do hold the whole marriage thing against Protestants in particular, because they have no right to talk about the sanctity of marriage at all. Martin Luther had some good ideas and some questionable ones, and had he stuck to the good ideas, he may have gone down as a great scholar of the Catholic Church. But in addition to the condemning of the rich trying to buy their way into heaven, Luther also dismissed 5 of the 7 Catholic sacraments, including marriage. And then people like John Calvin used marriage as a bargaining chip to persuade royalty to their side and weaken the power of the Vatican. Marriage isn't an exclusively Christian idea by any means, and it's likely that legal rights and marriage would always have been an entangled as they are now, but the idea of having Christian marriage be a duty of the state is an entirely Protestant idea, and it's based theologically on the idea that marriage isn't a sacrament imbued with the grace of God, but only a nice cultural tradition that can be appropriately handled by governments. And then centuries later, their descendants decided that the government allowing gay marriage violated the sanctity they had insisted didn't exist. Sure, there was some pushback from Catholics as well, who saw things like the Masterpiece Cake Shop coming a mile away, but that's not gay people's fault, that's the Protestants fault for trying to make the secular authorities into religious arbiters.
 

Saelune

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tstorm823 said:
Seanchaidh said:
You were wrong before and you're wrong now! Most of the Democrats are Republicans and Trump is a white nationalist.
I don't know about most, but I can agree with some. There are absolutely Democrats who would be Republicans if they lived in a different place, and vice versa. Trump isn't a white nationalist. I'm not gonna say Trump isn't racist, he's definitely old enough to carry on the legacy of a bygone era. But he's been unequivocally against white nationalism.
You literally just said Trump is a Democrat. That is objectively not true. It only hurts your credibility. You say he is a Democrat when he is literally the leader of the Republican Party, so why should we believe you when you say this other stuff?
 

tstorm823

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Saelune said:
You literally just said Trump is a Democrat. That is objectively not true. It only hurts your credibility. You say he is a Democrat when he is literally the leader of the Republican Party, so why should we believe you when you say this other stuff?
We disagree on a lot. I don't expect you to just believe me. I'm a little irked if I give a reasonable source (or sometimes an unreasonably left-wing source) and people still call me a liar because they dislike my opinions, and I know I've gotten irritated at you personally for asking for evidence and then just dismissing it without consideration anyway, but I'd be more disappointed if you just took whatever I said at face value without question.

So don't just believe me that Donald Trump has been unequivocally against white supremacy:

Forgive the bias of this site, I only care about the video montage [https://news.grabien.com/story-montage-trump-condemns-racism-hatred-white-nationalism-throu]. Trump's spent a lot of time condemning white supremacy. But while I was looking for a video like that, I happened to find this perfect relationship between news and opinion at the top of google.

 

Saelune

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tstorm823 said:
Saelune said:
You literally just said Trump is a Democrat. That is objectively not true. It only hurts your credibility. You say he is a Democrat when he is literally the leader of the Republican Party, so why should we believe you when you say this other stuff?
We disagree on a lot. I don't expect you to just believe me. I'm a little irked if I give a reasonable source (or sometimes an unreasonably left-wing source) and people still call me a liar because they dislike my opinions, and I know I've gotten irritated at you personally for asking for evidence and then just dismissing it without consideration anyway, but I'd be more disappointed if you just took whatever I said at face value without question.

So don't just believe me that Donald Trump has been unequivocally against white supremacy:

Forgive the bias of this site, I only care about the video montage [https://news.grabien.com/story-montage-trump-condemns-racism-hatred-white-nationalism-throu]. Trump's spent a lot of time condemning white supremacy. But while I was looking for a video like that, I happened to find this perfect relationship between news and opinion at the top of google.

If we go by your logic, Trump is a Democrat and not a White Supremacist...so technically you arent defending Republicans.
 

tstorm823

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Saelune said:
If we go by your logic, Trump is a Democrat and not a White Supremacist...so technically you arent defending Republicans.
That's fine. I don't think Democrats are white supremacists either. And prior to the election of Donald Trump, I would have said that the difference between the two parties was 5% policy, 95% rhetoric, they're almost the same thing. Right now, things are a bit weird, because Democrats are espousing some different views than before if it gives the opportunity to call Trump a nazi, but I'm confident we'll get a return to normalcy at some point either during the general or after Trump is out.
 

Seanchaidh

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tstorm823 said:
So don't just believe me that Donald Trump has been unequivocally against white supremacy:
In halting, robotic fashion; his white supremacist supporters are under the impression that he is not sincere in those condemnations. That seems probable given his policies.
 

tstorm823

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Seanchaidh said:
In halting, robotic fashion; his white supremacist supporters are under the impression that he is not sincere in those condemnations. That seems probable given his policies.
His white supremacist supporters are also under the impression that white people are inherently superior and should dominate society, so I'm not inclined to trust their delusions. I am inclined to care about the New York Times giving white supremacists a platform so that they can smear Trump with their garbage.

People associating Donald Trump with white supremacy aren't fighting against white supremacy. They're willing to promote white supremacy to get at Donald Trump. The want Trump to be the embodiment of everything they hate, because they're out for blood, and they don't care if they break society to get it.
 

Saelune

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tstorm823 said:
Seanchaidh said:
In halting, robotic fashion; his white supremacist supporters are under the impression that he is not sincere in those condemnations. That seems probable given his policies.
His white supremacist supporters are also under the impression that white people are inherently superior and should dominate society, so I'm not inclined to trust their delusions. I am inclined to care about the New York Times giving white supremacists a platform so that they can smear Trump with their garbage.

People associating Donald Trump with white supremacy aren't fighting against white supremacy. They're willing to promote white supremacy to get at Donald Trump. The want Trump to be the embodiment of everything they hate, because they're out for blood, and they don't care if they break society to get it.
White Supremacists associate Trump with White Supremacy. If Trump is not a White Supremacist, he needs to prove it. Step 1: Close down his death camps.
 

tstorm823

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Saelune said:
White Supremacists associate Trump with White Supremacy. If Trump is not a White Supremacist, he needs to prove it. Step 1: Close down his death camps.
Trump doesn't have death camps. CBP saves the lives of migrants, it's not killing them.
 

Saelune

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tstorm823 said:
Saelune said:
White Supremacists associate Trump with White Supremacy. If Trump is not a White Supremacist, he needs to prove it. Step 1: Close down his death camps.
Trump doesn't have death camps. CBP saves the lives of migrants, it's not killing them.
They are holding them all as permanent prisoners. That is beyond abuse. Torturing people is not saving lives.