Pair rape and Murder a girl. Then confess in WoW.

[Rolf]

This is why we need death sentence. They will sped some years in prison and then they can get out and do it all over agian.
They deserve death and not the quick painless kind.

 

[Ando85]

This is why the death penalty should be enforced everywhere for every crime. The human race has gotten far too ignorant from all the freedom it has had. Exactly the reason why everything has taken a turn for the worst, too much freedom.

I agree with you somewhat. I wouldn't go as far as saying every crime deserves death. I'm not going to advocate death to anyone who runs a red light or breaks the speed limit. Say sawing someones hands off for stealing. Sounds harsh, but knowing the consequences it would deter a lot of would be criminals.

I knew someone who got sentenced for several months in prison for some domestic violence incident. Of course he was only in there a week or two due to parole. It seems no one actually has to serve the time they are originally given.

Back to the topic at hand I don't think these kids should ever see the light of day again. Sure, they are mentally unstable obviously, but that is no excuse to brutally murder an innocent person for shits and giggles.

 

[hotsauceman]

I would sincerely hope you're wrong there, those two don't deserve to see daylight ever again. (By which I mean a life in prison)

They deserve to spend a hell of a long time there though. 15-20 years at least, assuming they show remorse and learn to control their anger.

Finally, Someone who realizes that crime isnt black and white. That sometimes there are circumstances that the criminal cannot control.
Granted what they did was wrong and they deserve some hard time but from the sound of this these are no ordinary rapists, These are people with deep underlying psychological conditions that may have been exacerbated by social conditions.

If a person cannot control themselves, and such lack of control results in brutal rape and murder, can you still call it a person? There are no cures for this kind of action. Prison will only exacerbate the issue, and an asylum will just pump them full of drugs and ridiculous therapy that it will only fuck their mind even more. If not, then they'll just go dormant again until the worse half surfaces again.
So you want them to live and have a chance of committing this crime again? This wasn't spur of the moment, this was premeditated, to the point that they tried to get a second person in on this. There is no hope here, they need to be put down rather than soak up tax payer money (if that's how it works in Canada).

You say as if i think what they did wasnt wrong, Im not saying that, Im saying something happened to those kids to make them like that and they need help NOT just throwing them away and tossing the key.

 

[syclone]

People who rape and kill minors should be killed immediatlly, I hope when they are both in prison the inmates do something similar to what they did to that poor girl. I hope the rot in a jail cell.

P.S I have just seen a picture of one of the guys and he has a very punchable face.

 

[Cactoos]

It really isnt. The world isnt black and white. A murder is not the same in every circumstance. If I was defending my loved ones from some rabid killer I would not hesitate in taking his life. This act would not cost me any bad conscience. And I do not think anyone doing something like this should be punished in the least. In a war, its kill or be killed. While I abhor war, I would go into it with the mindset that its me or them. I would expect to be killed and would defend myself accordingly.

The act of these two boys comes nowhere even close to anything I've mentioned. There is no justification for this. I do not wish the death penalty as a punishment for them, there is no worthy punishment. I do not wish it because I hate them, and I do not find it morally satisfying. I just think that we live in a society. And even if its values are not the same all over the world, there are a lot of similarities. These two have done something that is simply not defensible. It cannot be paid for with money or years spent behind bars. They have changed the world for the worse in the most horrible way. The only response I can think of is that acts like that are simply not welcome in ANY kind of circumstance or setting. They do not belong in society. They are a bad weed and should be plucked out. Simple as that. For some deeds there can be no redemption.

Death penalty isn't punishment.
It's revenge.

What you're saying is very true, but also very idealistic.
Where do you imagine drawing the line?
Let's say, murderers and rapists get the death penalty. And child molesters, those guys deserve it too.

Oh, but what about mistakes? I mean, it's not like innocent people aren't imprisoned. But that can be turned around. Death, as it turns out, can't.

Death penalty isn't not used to protect the rapists, murderers and child molesters.
It is not used to protect the innocent. You and me.

OT: Hopefully they'll get the maximum sentence. I'm guessing Canada is similar to Finland in that matter, so it won't be too much, say 20 years tops (12 years would be the maximum in Finland though).

Revenge is not an act, it is a state of mind. If we issue the death penalty it does not have to be revenge.

I imagine drawing the line more or less where you say: Murderers, rapists and child molesters.

I see your argument used all the time: What if he didnt do it? Well, you know what? In some cases there is no doubt. I'm not a bloodthirsty barbarian that wants to kill everyone because YAY DEATH PENALTY. If there is doubt, life in prison seems more decent. Or even freedom, depending on the doubt. But sometimes...there is no doubt. Like the terrorist in Norway. In these cases I see no reason to not remove them from this world.

And Finland? 12 years max? Really? That seems a mockery of justice to me. How can people respect the laws if this is how they treat the world? I do not understand it.

And yet still somehow Finland manages to be one of the countries with the smallest criminality rates in the world. What that shows is that the answer to increased law-breaking isn't harsher sentencing. It's better education. And more giving-a-crap, which I'm sure could have prevented the discussed case from happening.

You like to think that the justice system is somehow fair on all fronts. Judges aren't always trustworthy and, most of all, the justice system is still extremely flawed. You know what I mean. Even on the escapist there's been hundreds of topics discussing enraging cases of wrongful sentencing.

I like to think that the lack of death sentence is a way of somewhat acknowledging these flaws. And, quite frankly, I don't think death penalty is a viable option without some kind of a universally just sentencing system. That is to say, the death penalty will never, ever be a viable option.

 

[tzimize]

It really isnt. The world isnt black and white. A murder is not the same in every circumstance. If I was defending my loved ones from some rabid killer I would not hesitate in taking his life. This act would not cost me any bad conscience. And I do not think anyone doing something like this should be punished in the least. In a war, its kill or be killed. While I abhor war, I would go into it with the mindset that its me or them. I would expect to be killed and would defend myself accordingly.

The act of these two boys comes nowhere even close to anything I've mentioned. There is no justification for this. I do not wish the death penalty as a punishment for them, there is no worthy punishment. I do not wish it because I hate them, and I do not find it morally satisfying. I just think that we live in a society. And even if its values are not the same all over the world, there are a lot of similarities. These two have done something that is simply not defensible. It cannot be paid for with money or years spent behind bars. They have changed the world for the worse in the most horrible way. The only response I can think of is that acts like that are simply not welcome in ANY kind of circumstance or setting. They do not belong in society. They are a bad weed and should be plucked out. Simple as that. For some deeds there can be no redemption.

Death penalty isn't punishment.
It's revenge.

What you're saying is very true, but also very idealistic.
Where do you imagine drawing the line?
Let's say, murderers and rapists get the death penalty. And child molesters, those guys deserve it too.

Oh, but what about mistakes? I mean, it's not like innocent people aren't imprisoned. But that can be turned around. Death, as it turns out, can't.

Death penalty isn't not used to protect the rapists, murderers and child molesters.
It is not used to protect the innocent. You and me.

OT: Hopefully they'll get the maximum sentence. I'm guessing Canada is similar to Finland in that matter, so it won't be too much, say 20 years tops (12 years would be the maximum in Finland though).

Revenge is not an act, it is a state of mind. If we issue the death penalty it does not have to be revenge.

I imagine drawing the line more or less where you say: Murderers, rapists and child molesters.

I see your argument used all the time: What if he didnt do it? Well, you know what? In some cases there is no doubt. I'm not a bloodthirsty barbarian that wants to kill everyone because YAY DEATH PENALTY. If there is doubt, life in prison seems more decent. Or even freedom, depending on the doubt. But sometimes...there is no doubt. Like the terrorist in Norway. In these cases I see no reason to not remove them from this world.

And Finland? 12 years max? Really? That seems a mockery of justice to me. How can people respect the laws if this is how they treat the world? I do not understand it.

And yet still somehow Finland manages to be one of the countries with the smallest criminality rates in the world. What that shows is that the answer to increased law-breaking isn't harsher sentencing. It's better education. And more giving-a-crap, which I'm sure could have prevented the discussed case from happening.

You like to think that the justice system is somehow fair on all fronts. Judges aren't always trustworthy and, most of all, the justice system is still extremely flawed. You know what I mean. Even on the escapist there's been hundreds of topics discussing enraging cases of wrongful sentencing.

I like to think that the lack of death sentence is a way of somewhat acknowledging these flaws. And, quite frankly, I don't think death penalty is a viable option without some kind of a universally just sentencing system. That is to say, the death penalty will never, ever be a viable option.

I more or less completely agree with you. In general I think punishments in the legal system is flawed in so many ways. For example, if you rob a bank (and you dont shoot someone...) and get caught...you should work off the debt. Jail is pointless in many cases. Let the criminal pay off his debt to society and the bank in the literal sense. Same for stealing in a store, etc.

If you destroy something, you have to work to pay for it. The government can take a certain amount of your income until you're free of debt.

In my opinion, a lot of crime should be dealt with this way. And if people cant hold a normal job, slave labor. If you owe society a debt after doing crime, it should be within societys rights to put you to work doing whatever it needs. Pick up trash of the streets, chop firewood whatever.

With crime that cannot really be put a price on, violence etc...prison is better. And with bad enough violent crimes. Death. And again you go to wrongful sentencing. I am only for the death sentence when there can really be no doubt. And these cases DO EXIST. These are the cases I am talking about. If there can be even a sliver of a doubt. Prison/slave labor for life.

 

[blindthrall]

Read article, what a tragedy...

Why did that chick even hang out with those guys in the first place? She was cute.

If you want a genuine answer to the question, read the linked article, it's rather thourough. Long story short though, she was an absolute sweetheart who was far too trusting for her own good and those guys were part of her social circle and she had started getting close to them following a breakup with one of their friends.


While we are it, people should read the article first before making knee jerk reactions such as calling for them to be tortured for the rest of their lives or whatever, reading the article makes you realize the main perpetrator was a ticking time bomb due to several fun factors such as....
-Being the son of a serial killer/rapist who sexually assaulted and raped a 16 yr old girl, foreshadowing?
-Never having been interviewed or psychologically followed over his fathers actions, he never talked about this with anyone beyond "he understood what he did", interpret that however you want.
-All this was during his early childhood, again the child was never seen or treated for any of this, these issues were allowed to grow and influence an expanding mind, tainting it
-The troubled signs continued into adolescence with substance abuse, participation in risky activities and petty crime (a stepping stone to more violent and hardcore activities) and a growing interest in violent porn at an age where his hormones were starting to become really strong....

Yeh, I could go on, but you all get the picture. This guy was almost a hopeless case from the start but we can't say this was a random lunatic, all the signs were there and this could have been prevented had measures been taken at a young age when the child was clearly disturbed and could have been pushed towards being a more positive individual or left to be dragged down by the burdens given by the father. Then again hindsight is a wonderful thing, and I have no clue to what extent social services were involved with this kid, if they were at all.

I'm left more wondering about the guys friend who doesn't have these excuses though.

RIP Kim for what it's worth...

So PreCrime then? That solution is worse than the problem. This kid probably could have just talked his way out of therapy...it's not hard to do.