PC Gaming Alliance Talks PC/Console Crossover

[Andy Chalk]

PC Gaming Alliance Talks PC/Console Crossover

PC Gaming Alliance [http://www.pcgamingalliance.org/en/index.asp] President Randy Stude recently spoke out about the future of gaming on the PC, how PCs and consoles may someday intersect and the fallacies of blaming all your problems on piracy.

In a new interview posted at GamePolitics, Stude made some interesting predictions about the future of gaming, not least of which is a crossover with consoles that will see future PCs include console compatibility. "The guts of every console should tell you that the capability is there for the PC to act as the central point for all the consoles," he said. "If you bought a PC and as part of that equation you said, Okay, when you're on the phone with Dell [http://www.dell.com/], "Hey, Dell, on this PC, this new notebook I'm buying, can you make sure it has the PlayStation 4 option built into it?"

"Why shouldn't that be the case? [Sony [http://www.sony.com] is] certainly not making any money on the hardware," he continued. "I mean, can't they create a stable enough environment to specify that if Dell's going to sell that notebook and say that it's PlayStation 4 [compatible] that it must have certain ingredients and it must meet certain criteria? Absolutely they could do that. Are they going to do it? I don't know. I predict that they will. I predict that all of the console makers over time will recognize that it's too expensive to develop the proprietary solution and recognize the value of collapsing back on the PC as a ubiquitous platform."

Stude also called the idea of publishers abandoning the PC platform because of piracy as "ridiculous," saying, "If someone wants to leave the PC market, we'll miss you. We'll watch with admiration as your titles ship in a diluted fashion without a whole lot of game play innovation, at least until you copy the innovation that occurs on the PC. Well find the great games on PC and we'll play those."

"I've heard people say, well, we're just not going to publish this title for PC gaming because it's in a state of disarray or because of piracy or whatever," he added. "Okay, fine. Do what you want. If you're not going to release the C&C Red Alert 3 [http://endwargame.us.ubi.com/] instead of EndWar. You blew it."

He admitted that the complexities of the "PC ecosystem" sometimes make it difficult for console developers to properly port their games to the PC, and said that one of the goals of the PCGA is to establish a "minimum starting point" for PC gaming. "We want the hardware OEMs and the game publishers to support that guideline and to advocate the experience of gaming on the PC at a stable starting point, something will last a couple years and then move on to the next [standard]," he said. He also noted that the PCGA is discussing a logo for gaming-ready PCs, saying, "If there needs to be a logo then we'll probably have a logo, but we haven't made that determination yet."

GamePolitics' full interview with Randy Stude, touching on other topics including the impact of here [http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-vista/default.aspx].


Permalink

 

[Nimbus]

I'm not convinced. Why would anyone need to "make sure it has the PlayStation 4 option built into it" when most console games are poor compared to the PC alternatives.

 

[sirdanrhodes]

Computers... with consoles built in... I like this future...

 

[Avatar Roku]

...aren't consoles, in a sense, already PCs?

 

[Skrapt]

They are in a way as they are built on optimized versions of older computer hardware. Though I think the line is a little blurred because of the different programming languages that are usually console specific.

I like what Randy Stude is saying, but I think it's a bit of a fairy tale. I know people on both parts of the computer and console divide and many would not accept that the other is a viable gaming platform (myself belonging to the former group!). It would be nice at some point in the future for consoles and computers to merge, however I think that would require an Apple-esque totalitarian control over hardware and software to work. As the main reason for consoles performance is that developers get the time to learn the hardware inside, out and learn how to squeeze every little bit of power out of it. Whereas they do not get that luxury with computers, as by the time you've spent 6 months learning to develop for the latest graphics cards, a plethora of new ones will have arrived on the market.

 

[Asehujiko]

Hehe. Soon pc's can play console games too but consoles stil won't be able to play pc games. Victory draws near my mouse&keyboard brethren!

 

[Dectilon]

...aren't consoles, in a sense, already PCs?

Isn't the PC already a console?

Console just means platform, you know...

 

[Dudemeister]

...aren't consoles, in a sense, already PCs?

Isn't the PC already a console?

Console just means platform, you know...

Aha!
You just blew some minds!

 

[Chaos Marine]

*Snip*
It's not--the FPS and Third Person Shooter and Adventure/Action and Platforming genres are console genres. Period. The majority of people prefer those games with a gamepad whether their first console was a PS3 or an Atari 2600, and there was a gap in their--okay, my--console ownership between the Sega Genesis and the PS2 they got to play God of War.
*Snip*

You're a moron. FPS games do not belong on consoles. They're horrifically imbalanced to the player giving him the ability to soak up insane damage and autoaim. No skill or sense of accomplishment whatsoever. Where as with the PC, most FPS games, you get hit maybe three or four times on the normal difficulty settings or one or two on the hard settings and you're dead. When you fight your way through a dozen or several foes each as capable as killing you as you are them, the sense of satisfaction is immense. Don't you dare assume otherwise. FPS games will always be a PC genre far more than anything.

 

[Lt. Sera]

Through virtualization, it would be doable to build the console as just a software shell. It would be interesting to see and be all shades of awesome.

 

[Chaos Marine]

I disagree. FPS games will always be a PC genre, just because a mediocre game like the Halo series was a console success doesn't mean it's better on a console than a PC. Comparatively speaking, the grade of FPS games on the PC often exceeds the scope of console games though I will admit that console FPS games are closing the gap in everything but controls. After playing UT3 on the PS3 and having it for the PC myself, playing the UT3 was horrifically slow in comparison. In the PC version, you predict and fire and make your kill within a literal split second or you're as dead as dirt. In the PS3 version, you can take a full second to consider what weapon to use before letting the auto aim do most of the work for you.

That is not how FPS games are meant to be played. Playing with demi-god mode (You can still die after all, adding in several stone of lead to your body weight of course)and letting the auto aim do all the work. But I repeat myself. But it bears repeating. FPS games are a PC market. Always has been and always will be.

 

[Joeshie]

It's not--the FPS and Third Person Shooter and Adventure/Action and Platforming genres are console genres. Period. The majority of people prefer those games with a gamepad whether their first console was a PS3 or an Atari 2600, and there was a gap in their--okay, my--console ownership between the Sega Genesis and the PS2 they got to play God of War.

You disappoint me Cheeze. I've always pegged you as an intelligent poster, but claiming FPS as a console genre? Tisk, tisk.

Most people like playing FPS on a gamepad because that's all they have ever played with. I'd say that 80-90% of most people who have played FPS on consoles have never even touched an FPS on a computer. How can they possibly have a preference when they have only tried one of the two options?

FPS will always remain a PC genre due to the more natural and fluid controls of the mouse over the crappy analog. Not to mention, mods have always been more linked to the FPS genre more than any other types of games have. But despite this fact, you argue that we need to focus on the modability of games on PC (a large majority have been done on FPS), but then argue that FPS is a console genre.

Way to fail buddy.

Note: I'm not suggesting that FPS shouldn't be played on consoles, just that the strengths of the PC lend themselves to the FPS genre more than the strengths of consoles do. Kind of like how the analog lends itself more to racing games than mouse/keyboard does, but you can still enjoy a racing game on your PC.

 

[Ancalagon]

The console-in-a-PC thing has already been done:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amstrad_Mega_PC

...albeit not very well.

 

[Andy Chalk]

This is probably a good time to mention that as of the end of November, Garry's Mod has reportedly earned something just north of $3.1 million. I'd say mods are alive and well among FPS fans on the PC.

And I guess you'll have to add me to your growing list of "PC fundamentalists" because your comment about shooters being a console genre is just stunningly wrong. Controllers lack the speed and precision of a mouse, and without the aiming assistance that most console shooters have (and PC shooters do not) console gamers would suffer a virtually immeasurable disadvantage.

I see your point (I think): The average sideways-hat-wearing slackjaw prefers the controller to a mouse/keyboard combo despite its inherent disadvantages, because it's less intimidating. But that in no way means it's a better setup, it just means that the effort to popularize gaming has gone entirely into consoles. Insisting that FPSs are "console genres" is way off the mark.

 

[Nimbus]

You can't argue that a console is better because of controllers. That can't even come into the argument, because PCs have both keyboard and mouse, and controller setups, whereas you can only have a controller with consoles.

 

[Bagaloo]

Oh dear...and we've decended into PC vs Console fanboyism.
Personally I don't particularly mind what format I'm playing on, both have their advantages and disadvantages. One thing I will say is that I tend to buy more games for the PC because they are often significantly cheaper. I don't understand how a machine that was built only for gaming (consoles) are so much more expensive to buy games for.

 

[Chaos Marine]

*Snip*

What PC gaming needs is to get rid of all the fundamentalists who think converting people to the mouse and keyboard is what PC gaming needs

I've been playing games on the PC (Coming from the Megadrive or Genesis to Americans to the PC) and the very first FPS game I played was Zero Tolerance. I thought it was awesome. I then played Doom on my very first PC. A Dell Dimension L500. After that, I swore never again and have been building my gaming machines ever since. Zero Tolerance and Doom are very alike and I didn't really consider them that different. Then I played Quake and I got into the Hexen series. By Hades, after playing with a mouse, realising how awesome it was, I couldn't get over how great it felt to be able to look around and blow monsters and humans apart with near pin point accuracy. I went back to playing Zero Tolerance during a visit home to my grandparents (I took the Megadrive since I couldn't lug the PC with me) and after about ten minutes I just couldn't play it any more.

Civ and EU and Sins are all doing very well. PC gaming is doing just fine--it's just not able to compete in the genres you want it to compete in. The *worst* thing the PC world can do is look on this as the moral crusade people like you four do. That's only going to lead to them throwing away money. I can't stress the realism of Stardock here enough, about "looking at the market as a business not about trying to be "cool".":
http://draginol.joeuser.com/article/303512/Piracy_PC_Gaming

I'm sorry, are you trying to compare the worldwide sales of consoles to PCs?
http://www.destructoid.com/pc-gaming-not-really-dead-after-all-31138.phtml

Anita Frazier, an industry analyst for the NPD Group, a market research firm, noted that in the first two months of 2007, domestic retail sales of PC games reached $203 million, a 48 percent increase over the $136.8 million in the period a year earlier. She noted that these figures do not include revenue generated by PC game sales online, or online subscriptions to play PC games.

Because there's no good reason to think that the majority of them will probably feel the same way me and the majority of my friends, who were all playing games on the computer before even DOOM came out--that it's just more fun on a console.

That's a matter of taste and there's also no accounting for the taste of some.
*Snip*

If anything, the FPS has probably seen the biggest decline in the percentage of fans interested in modding, because the FPS has grown so wildly in popularity among the kind of people who just aren't the type to know how to install a mod, let alone tinker with it themselves.

Yet there are countless thousands of mods for countless thousand PC games.

You really think you're going to get the average Halo playing Bro to care about the gravity gun and hitboxes and Garry's Mod?

Do you even *want* to?

You're right on both counts there. I have had some interesting conversations with people on Xbox Live. My ears still ring with the word fag which never ceases to surprise me with how often someone can insert it into a single sentence. This also is a very telling cause of why it's better on the PC. Most PC gamers (I'm not going to even pretend to be deluded enough to consider every PC gamer mature) are far more level headed than console gamers, look at the 0arguments between MS and Sony fanboys. Go into any random 360 or PS3 game server and suck at it. You'll get called every insult imaginable and fag more than anything else. Do likewise on the Pc and you'll get a few who'll call you an idiot or a moron but the majority will help you out and offer tips and so forth.

In either case though, playing an FPS on a controller simply doesn't not equate to what a FPS should be played like.

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

And I guess you'll have to add me to your growing list of "PC fundamentalists" because your comment about shooters being a console genre is just stunningly wrong. Controllers lack the speed and precision of a mouse, and without the aiming assistance that most console shooters have (and PC shooters do not) console gamers would suffer a virtually immeasurable disadvantage.

And now I rush to Cheez's defense.

The gamepad does not have an advantage over the mouse, but it does have an advantage over the keyboard. Think not in terms of "analog vs mouse" but in "analog vs WASD." I don't want to meet the person who will argue that analog loses the latter battle.

And as a point of interest. The Orange Box for the 360 has no auto-aim and I didn't miss it.

 

[Joeshie]

And now I rush to Cheez's defense.

The gamepad does not have an advantage over the mouse, but it does have an advantage over the keyboard. Think not in terms of "analog vs mouse" but in "analog vs WASD." I don't want to meet the person who will argue that analog loses the latter battle.

And as a point of interest. The Orange Box for the 360 has no auto-aim and I didn't miss it.

The difference between WASD and the analog is nowhere as big as the difference between the analog and mouse. Also, your movement in FPS isn't nearly as important as aiming is, thus lessen the impact of the small gap between WASD and the analog even more. And even when movement is important to the FPS (such as UT or Quake), which platform are those games on? Oh yes, they are on PC.

Also, there is this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIW9-whnRD4&feature=related

You are exactly the kind of people I was thinking of when I wrote:

What PC gaming needs is to get rid of all the fundamentalists who think converting people to the mouse and keyboard is what PC gaming needs

Did I ever say that you couldn't enjoy FPS with a console or that people needed to play their games with a mouse and keyboard? Nope, not at all. In fact, I specifically stated that playing an FPS on a console with a gamepad was perfectly fine, just as playing a racing game on your computer with a mouse and keyboard is perfectly fine. My original point was that the controls of a PC lend themselves much better to the FPS genre than a controller, much like the mouse and keyboard lends itself better to the RTS genre more than a controller. I would appreciate it if you didn't throw words into my mouth Cheeze.

Because there's no good reason to think that the majority of them will probably feel the same way me and the majority of my friends, who were all playing games on the computer before even DOOM came out--that it's just more fun on a console.

I have known plenty of PC gamers who have inevitably moved onto consoles from PC for a variety of reasons (cost of maintaining a PC, lack of different games on PC, complexity of PC), but one thing they will almost always tell me is that they really miss playing their FPS with a mouse and keyboard. Many of them will tolerate a controller, but most of them would prefer a mouse and keyboard.

This isn't something that is widely debated among the gaming community. A large amount of console gamers will simply tell you straight up that the keyboard and mouse is simply better than analog sticks. It's pretty much assumed among the gaming community that the mouse/keyboard is better for FPS. Of course, that doesn't mean it will stop you from enjoying an FPS with a gamepad.

Bullshit. The most modable game I have ever encountered was UMS II. I remember designing two entire sets of armed forces using that game.

That's super fantastic that ONE game was very super-moddable, but when you think of mods, what do you think about? Counter-Strike, custom maps, Team Fortress, DOOM, and a slew of other mods that have inevitably been based off of FPS games. No doubt that other games have impressive modability such as Oblivion or UMS II, but that doesn't make their modding as widespread as the FPS genre has it.

The issue is that the people interested in mods overlap with the people interested in FPSes to a much lesser extent than they did before, because all the new FPS fans are, I think, not the type to mod.

Yes, because most of the new FPS fans don't even know what a mod even is. The closest most new FPS fans have to modding is Halo 3 and even then, that's just the tip of the iceberg of what true modding can accomplish.

You seem to have this idea that because a group of people only know one type of way to enjoy a game (be it with a gamepad or without modding), then they would automatically hate the other side of it or have no interest in it (with a keyboard and mouse or with modding). I know tons of people who were really excited at the prospect of being able to play UT mods on their PS3.

If anything, the FPS has probably seen the biggest decline in the percentage of fans interested in modding, because the FPS has grown so wildly in popularity among the kind of people who just aren't the type to know how to install a mod, let alone tinker with it themselves.

You are right, it has seen the biggest decline because many more people now-a-days are getting into FPS via console rather than PC. Even if they were potentially interested in modding, they can't be interested in it if they have never been introduced to it, could they?

You really think you're going to get the average Halo playing Bro to care about the gravity gun and hitboxes and Garry's Mod?

Do you even *want* to?

No, I don't think the average frat player would care and I don't necessarily want them to care. However, I think both you and I know that there are still plenty of people out there who play FPS on consoles that would be interested in, at the very least, downloading mods. I mean, people will fucking pay $2.50 for fucking horse armor or other insane amounts of money just for a little customization. I would think that people like that would be interested in free small mods which also allow for a degree of customization.

 

[Joeshie]

Face it--the worst fanboys in the world are PC FPS people. Not PC people, just the PC FPS crowd. Now, would you stop giving the rest of us a bad name by acting like you've got anything to do with the rest of us? See, when we think "intimidation" from a PC game, it has to do with that time we tried to play Gary Grigsby's Pacific War, and kind of laugh at people who choose that word for using a mouse and keyboard to twitch an aiming reticule around a screen.

Oh come off it. You aren't acting much better in this thread. I can't help but feel that it's because your unhappy that FPS has always had a stronger widespread popularity on PC than your strategy games have had.