Peter Molyneux: Fable III Was a Trainwreck. I'll Never Make my Perfect Game

MazokuRanma

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Sgt. Sykes said:
I really don't have a problem with designers talking about their grandiose plans. Everybody can have drams. Why should game designers be kept quiet? They're creative people. Many of them actually need to talk about their ideas to help them think.

I still believe that the aversion against people like PM for talking too much is a part of the current trend of secrecy and carefulness where nobody actually associated with a game can talk about it and all we get are carefully constructed press releases and trailers.

No thanks. I'll take PM talking passionately about his ideas every day over some soulless marketing hyping bullshit made up by bean counters.
The problem with this level of over-hyping is that it drives people away when the developer fails to deliver. If a developer gets people super excited about features x, y, and z, but then the game only actually ships with part of feature x, people will be understandably upset, especially if they dropped $60 on it at launch.

There's nothing long with a little hype, but you also need honesty, otherwise people lose faith.
 

MazokuRanma

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To be honest, I rather enjoyed Fable 3, but I believe a large part of that was I waited until I was able to get a copy for $10 during an Amazon sale. It's their own fault, though; I paid $60 at release for Fable 2 and the disappoint was tremendous. Fable 2 was when I stopped paying full price for AAA games. I'm not exaggerating when I say that the number of AAA titles I buy on release has dropped to a handful a year solely because of that game, and even then it is only from very specific publishers/developers.
 

Tiamat666

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Dec 4, 2007
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Peter, you need some moderation in both directions. No, Fable III was not the greatest game of all time. But it wasn't a train wreck either. It was a fun, enjoyable game with faults.
 

Rad Party God

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Feb 23, 2010
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Well, I didn't knew about the hype behind the first Fable, I only knew it was a good game and I wasn't dissapointed.

But I definitely heard all the hype he himself created about the third Fable. Admiting his mistakes raises a lot of respect on my part.
 

ExtraDebit

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Fable 3 wasn't perfect but I still loved it. I really hope he continues to dream and try to create that perfect game in his mind so even if he falls short and fails to create that perfect game we will still have a great game like fable 3.
 

ellers07

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Zachary Amaranth said:
ellers07 said:
It's ok, I forgive him. I hope he keeps trying to make that perfect jewel that's in his mind, because it sounds really good! If he can't quite get there at least I'll have some new Fable games to play, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.
I thought MEter Polydeux was out of the Fable business.
Yes, I believe he is. Which is probably for the best I suppose. Fable III was the weakest of the bunch and with the progression of time over the course of the games I'm not sure how far he could really go before Albion hits modern day. Though I suppose that could be interesting too. In any case, I enjoyed the Fable games despite their range of quality.
 

Strazdas

Robots will replace your job
May 28, 2011
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I sort of feel sorry for him because im much the same way. I imagine something that feels great, but i do not have the skills to write/paint/create it in reality and when i try i end up creating some turd. The important part is that he finally admits it, and thats the first step.
 

Trollhoffer

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Peter Molyneux has plenty of flaws, and while his overstatements are among them, I just don't think he's a very good game designer.

Let's take the first Fable into consideration. The whole aesthetic, from the literal art style to the whole storybook mock-up approach, was very charming. The game was nothing if not inviting. But the mechanics, while tight, are almost as shallow as mechanics can be. For instance, combat revolved around a very limited amount of functions, which would be fine if those functions had diverse applications -- but they didn't, and winning combat was a case of finding the square hole for the square peg. And I can't see why Molyneux couldn't see this from the design stage itself, not just the execution.

If one intends to make a game to last the ages, isn't the absolute first thing to perfect going to be the mechanics? A work of digital media can be excellent without mechanics or with few mechanics or even with shallow mechanics, depending on the work (such as The Walking Dead). But a truly excellent game, in the most traditional sense of the word, must have mechanics that are centre-stage in contributing towards the user's experience. Fable's mechanics were indifferent towards itself, so much that another set of real-time RPG interaction mechanics could have been put in and nothing would have been lost.

This is what Peter Molyneux doesn't get, but what defines Shigeru Miyamoto as among the absolute finest game designers of our time. Molyneux has his big ideas and seems to consider them to be perfect upon conception, rather than potentially excellent upon development. Miyamoto, on the other hand, has an excellent understanding of how to iterate on broad concepts to create an excellent end user experience. Their objectives are different -- Molyneux seems to want to express himself to his consumers and for them to thank him for it; Miyamoto wants to create the best experience possible for the consumer base, with his own expressive qualities filling in the gaps left behind.
 

alj

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Nov 20, 2009
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I don't know, he invented dogs you know and they worked out ok.
 

Casual Shinji

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Sgt. Sykes said:
I still believe that the aversion against people like PM for talking too much is a part of the current trend of secrecy and carefulness where nobody actually associated with a game can talk about it and all we get are carefully constructed press releases and trailers.
Well no actually, people have an aversion against Molyneux for presenting us with a bowl of crusty porridge, but claiming it's mana from heaven. It tends to annoy people when you have someone talk like they're some brilliant artist, when really they have no talent at all. See also David Cage.

But then that's likely why he could never shut up about how fantastic his games were going to be; If they were actually good, the footage would've spoken for itself, and he wouldn't have had to sell us on it with his passionate speeches.
 

SonOfVoorhees

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Just seems that Peter Molyneux concentrates more on the minor parts of the game than the game itself. Remember he kept going on about the dog, changing weapons, butler and the hand holding etc and those things were not that great. Between F2 and F3 all he did was add pointless stuff and ignored all the issues people didnt like about F2.

Hopefully a new non-molly Fable will be made and be 100% better, first to get rid of is the stupid farting rubbish and just get the core gameplay perfect before adding stuff.
 

LordMonty

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Jul 2, 2008
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Damn cynical lot in this thread, have a heart the man has dreams and cool ideas and yea most are not quite as magical as he dreamed... but damn it all at least he dreamed and didn't just make CoD74 its so hard to mix the grey and the brown yaknow.
 

Savryc

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Aug 4, 2011
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You know it's a pretty depressing sign of the times when a guy has to apologize for talking passionately about something he had a hand in making. I like Molyneux, he actually seems to enjoy what he does, unlike the by-the-numbers, faceless, soulless, NDA laden nobodies that get rolled out to pass us a few dribbles of sterile info about "Foreigner Shooter 56"
 

michael87cn

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That's the trouble with wanting something done, and having to count on others to make it for you.
 

JediMB

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ScrabbitRabbit said:
He sounds unhappy, though. Wonder if it's all finally getting to him?
Well, he's pretty much at the end of his career. He's said that he's making one last game with 22 Cans (not counting experiments like Curiosity) before he retires.
 

martyrdrebel27

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I thought fable 3 was the best of the series, honestly. And the twist half-ending was brilliant writing, blurring lines between what is good and what is evil. The brother was being evil, but only for good reasons. Then, you can choose to keep your promises and be a good guy, but ultimately screw the people over.

of course, I kept all my promises AND kept everyone alive by having a ridiculous amount of money from being a land baron. I even kept my prices all fair. Not low, but always neutral.