Planescape Torment: Am I doing something wrong?

[Zhukov]

I have frequently heard people referring to Planescape Torment as some kind of monolithic miracle of of RPG design. Several people straight-facedly described it as the best game ever made. So I recently snagged a copy to see what all the fuss was about.

Now, before you mistake this for yet another what's-the-big-deal-this-game-sucks hate thread, let me make something quite clear: I can actually see why people like it.

The setting is really interesting and provides a fresh take on the western fantasy RPG. I really like that it actually seems to be making an effort to be something other than Tolkien Ripoff #5526. I am yet to come across a single bow-toting, forest-dwelling elf or bearded, underground-dwelling dwarf. Also, it allows for plenty of exploration. I appreciate being able to poke around, meeting interesting characters and learning about the setting without the game yanking me about by my nipples every five minutes. Good stuff.
The story and characters are promising. Sure, It loses a few points by starting with my character waking up with amnesia and giving me a wise-cracking sidekick, but it rapidly got better. It's managed to interest me enough that I really want to find out more.

So that's the good stuff. Now here comes my problem...

The gameplay is fucking excruciating.

It feels like I'm trying to play Fallout: Terrible Interface Edition. Inventory management is a pain in the arse. For some reason each character has their own storage slots, so I constantly have to switch back and forth, juggling or dropping items to make sure everything is where it should be.

The combat consists of watching my characters trade stat-based blows with hostile NPCs. But the game never deigns to explain exactly what the various stats actually do. My options consist of "Attack", "Don't Attack" and "Run Like Fuck". Occasionally I get to actually do something by using a healing item or the like, but items and abilities are activated via a horrible little radial menu thing that, nice times out of ten, will cover up my target.

So... my question is: Am I doing something wrong here? Is there something important that I am missing? Does the gameplay ever get better?

I am up to the part where you meet that fellow named Pharod. Like I said, the story is getting good but the gameplay is going nowhere. I am usually quite forgiving in this regard, but there is a finite amount of shit that I am willing to take for the sake of a good story. Is there a way to improve the gameplay? For example, I met a guy who could change my class to thief. Does make the gameplay more interesting?

I would appreciate any advice. It would seem a shame to abandon such a promising game.

 

[Saelune]

Its a DnD game...ya know that right? Planescape is a DnD setting (like Greyhawk and Forgotten Realms).
Though it being Planescape, it is focused on well..extraplanar places and races.

 

[Pipotchi]

Well to be honest you should be doing very little fighting anyways you can get through the mortuary and the Hive section without fighting anybody.

If you use Nameless one, Morte and you have got Dakkon by now then enemies should go down pretty fast

If you dont mind a restart, pile your character points into intel and wisdom rather than strengh or dexterity then you can talk your way out of the fights 9/10 times and just enjoy the story. Also if you have a high constituation your health regenerates so you wont need healing items so much

 

[Zhukov]

Its a DnD game...ya know that right? Planescape is a DnD setting (like Greyhawk and Forgotten Realms).
Though it being Planescape, it is focused on well..extraplanar places and races.

Yup. It says so on the back of the box.

I'm not sure I see your point.

If you use Nameless one, Morte and you have got Dakkon by now then enemies should go down pretty fast

Who's Dakkon? Never met him.

Apart from Morte, the only potential party member I've met so far is some tiefling chick called... Aniya or something. But I only know that because the character index specifically lists her under the same category as Morte and Nameless.

If you dont mind a restart, pile your character points into intel and wisdom rather than strengh or dexterity then you can talk your way out of the fights 9/10 times and just enjoy the story. Also if you have a high constituation your health regenerates so you wont need healing items so much

My character is already heavy on intelligence and wisdom. It doesn't stop random thugs attacking me on every street.

 

[Pipotchi]

Oh and stick with it, after you get past Pharod and find the tomb the story gets so awesome. Twists and turns galore

Oh yeah and go to the tattoo shop in the Hive and get tattoos that boost your con and wis that will help as well. Sell all those copper rings.

Your are right though combat is dull and inventory is painful but the juice is worth the squeeze

 

[Saelune]

Its a DnD game...ya know that right? Planescape is a DnD setting (like Greyhawk and Forgotten Realms).
Though it being Planescape, it is focused on well..extraplanar places and races.

Yup. It says so on the back of the box.

I'm not sure I see your point.

Your first paragraph made it seem like this was not apparent to you. Particularly the first line "The setting is really interesting and provides a fresh take on the western fantasy RPG. I really like that it actually seems to be making an effort to be something other than Tolkien Ripoff #5526."

 

[MasterV]

Well OP, as Saelune says, it's a game based on the D&D ruleset. In ye olde days, ALL CRPGs (Western RPGs is not a valid term in my book, they're computer RPGs) were like that. People were used to it and didn't even notice what you mention.

A new player, used to the friendliness and simplicity of the menus and interface of newer CRPGs will find it complicated. No two ways about it. So, unfortunately, live with it, or stop playing it if bothers you too much. Also get the mod to increase the game resolution. It looks amazing in HD resolutions.

 

[Danceofmasks]

Don't bother fiddling with the gear. Most of it is useless.
If you can find tattoos to bump some characters' strengths to 19+, then cool.

As for combat, I usually spec mage, and let the party autoattack unless there's a threat.
Then I blat it.

 

[thenamelessloser]

Its a DnD game...ya know that right? Planescape is a DnD setting (like Greyhawk and Forgotten Realms).
Though it being Planescape, it is focused on well..extraplanar places and races.

Yup. It says so on the back of the box.

I'm not sure I see your point.

Other D and D computer games have similar aspects such as each character having their own inventory.

Tip: You can use items in the inventory screen as often as you like. It almost breaks the combat.

I never bothered playing a thief in Planescape: Torment, you're going to get a thief party member soon who can do everything a thief does I think. Best off playing as fighter or mage I think.

Tip: The thief party member can sneak past monsters and when they leave the area your whole party does.

Also, maybe play the game on easy so combat goes faster. I Never found the combat in Torment that boring though, besides a secret dungeon that is needed to be done to get a secret party member.

Also, make sure to use the floating skull's taunt!

 

[The Madman]

Nah, you're not doing anything wrong at all. Planescape: Torment has by far the weakest combat of any of the Infinity Engine games, and in terms of actual gameplay is just an overall poor experience especially when compared to todays standards. It's more tolerable if you're a fan of DnD, but then then you're dealing with a poor and badly implemented version. I wouldn't say it's terrible, but it's not particularly fun either.

The games redeeming factor is the story. You're still very, very early in the game actually and it genuinely does improve by leaps and bounds as the game goes on, weaving an elaborate plot that's unparalleled by most games even today. Even that 'comic sidekick' as you call him, Morte, has a few twists and turns to him character wise. You might be surprised to learn there's more to him than sassy back-talking and lewd jokes.

Personally I find games like Baldur's Gate 2 to be superior experience overall because they provide a better balanced experience, with interesting and entertaining combat as well as a compelling story and cast of characters. But that said Planescape: Torment does have the better plot, no denying that. So if it's story you're after and you've a little patience, Planescape: Torment is more than worth continuing with and might just end up becoming one of your favourites as well once the full story has begun to unfold.

 

[veloper]

TS should have listened more carefully then.

I've never heared of anyone who praises the combat in PS:T. The combat is shit.

What's unique about the game is that the story is actually pretty decent.
This is the game our resident storyfags at the Escapist should play, because unlike their precious Bioware RPGs, the story isn't mediocre in planescape.
The setting is different for a change, the theme holds an actual message and you can't predict the ending, after seeing just the opening.
If more games had a story on par with PS:T, the plays games for the story people might actually have a point.

 

[xorinite]

Dakkon, meet him at the smouldering corpse bar. Combat will become immensely easier with that githzerai in your party and hes also got a lot of interesting backstory and more importantly knows more of yours.
The engine and combat in particular is painfully bad, but if you can stick with it, you will end up with something awesome that you won't soon forget, that is if you like compelling stories.

 

[thegrimfandango]

If you stick with the game, you'll get a lot more gameplay that doesn't involve fighting. I just turned the combat down to easy and am hammering my way through it because I'm rubbish. I have tried to get the hang of spells etc, but they're all tucked away in the radial menu and I keep forgetting what half of them do without looking at my spellbook.
Morte's taunt is great, especially against spellcasters. This skill can be levelled up by learning insults by annoying certain people.
Honestly, as someone else said, you're very early in the game: the story gets a lot more interesting, and you'll get more space to explore soon enough. If you hate combat I will give you one tip that'll soon make sense in the game when you go on a task for Pharod: Go with the Drowned Nations, not to the rat warren (at first anyway)
And stick with an Intelligence/Wisdom/Charisma build to get max dialogue and most chance of avoiding fights.

EDIT: See this link also for a list of Mods/Fixes that are recommended. http://www.gog.com/en/news/mod_spotlight_planescape_torment_mods_guide/

 

[DazZ.]

I just started playing this week, and I have fortunatly had no issues with the combat. I'm not saying it's good combat gameplay at all, but it has never really got in the way. I'm just engrossed in exploring and talking to people rather than fighting.

I have installed 2 mods, one being widescreen and another being a UI to compliment this new higher res, I haven't had issues with the inventory either but I wouldn't know if that's the mods or not.

 

[Vault101]

Ive thoroly enjoyed the little Ive played so far but Im taking it slow

but yeah I CAN see the brilliance, I guess its jsut personal really, I was rather underwhelmed by S.T.A.L.K.E.R. (not that I gave ti much of a chance) anyway when ever I play it I keep feeling sad that it doesnt have modern graphics as the awsomeness of that would truly make my mind explode

pluss I have a little trouble with the amount of text

I guess all I can say is stick with it, I mean like I said you dotn have to love somthing to see what others see in it

I
I would appreciate any advice. It would seem a shame to abandon such a promising game.

 

[Continuity]

The gameplay is fucking excruciating.

No its not, its just a question of what your expectations are. This is a D&D game, if you don't like D&D then you almost certainly wont like it either.

It feels like I'm trying to play Fallout: Terrible Interface Edition. Inventory management is a pain in the arse. For some reason each character has their own storage slots, so I constantly have to switch back and forth, juggling or dropping items to make sure everything is where it should be.

So... its a bad idea to have each character carrying their own stuff? How? Anyway, once again: this is a D&D game, if you don't like D&D you probably wont like it either.

The combat consists of watching my characters trade stat-based blows with hostile NPCs. But the game never deigns to explain exactly what the various stats actually do. My options consist of "Attack", "Don't Attack" and "Run Like Fuck". Occasionally I get to actually do something by using a healing item or the like, but items and abilities are activated via a horrible little radial menu thing that, nice times out of ten, will cover up my target.

What were you expecting? this is classic RPG were talking about here, not mass effect. And once again, this is a D&D game, if you don't know how D&D works you are likely to be confused by the mechanics - they don't bother to explain them in any great detail because 9/10 of the people playing the game are D&D players already. And yes I hate the radial menu to, but its a small blemish on the game as a whole.
As for what your character is able to do, well as part of the plot of planescape torment you wake up not knowing anything about yourself so you start as the base generic character of fighter which is intentionally bland and simple (not intentionally from plancescape torments point of view but from D&D 2nd eds point of view) - so to cut this short find yourself another class (you can mix and move between classes without penalty so don't worry about making a mistake, you might want to start with a few levels of fighter to get your hitpoints up but then change class to something more interesting).

So... my question is: Am I doing something wrong here? Is there something important that I am missing? Does the gameplay ever get better?

It doesn't stop being D&D if thats what you're asking, but if you really need a helping hand I suggest you arm yourself with a walkthough, if only to get yourself started properly. Its very easy to blight your gameplay experience by creating a shit character if you don't know what you're doing (and you obviously don't) if you don't want to do that then at least take this piece of advice

Spoiler

start the game with maximum wisdom

.
"Does the gameplay ever get better?" the war cry of every "what's-the-big-deal-this-game-sucks hate thread", I thought you weren't going there? ;-)

I am up to the part where you meet that fellow named Pharod. Like I said, the story is getting good but the gameplay is going nowhere. I am usually quite forgiving in this regard, but there is a finite amount of shit that I am willing to take for the sake of a good story. Is there a way to improve the gameplay? For example, I met a guy who could change my class to thief. Does make the gameplay more interesting?

So you've just started in other words. Sink another 30 hours into the game and then make a decision. Your call if you're prepared to do that. Like I said before, if you're going to give up at least have a go at it armed with a walk-through before you do, might give you the kick start you need to get going.

 

[GiantRaven]

No its not, its just a question of what your expectations are. This is a D&D game, if you don't like D&D then you almost certainly wont like it either.

I don't think liking D&D is a prerequisite for liking the gameplay in Planescape: Torment. I thoroughly enjoy a good bit of D&D and I found Plancescape's combat to be an exercise in complete and utter tedium.

 

[Zhukov]

Whoops! Looks like I insulted someone's baby.

So... its a bad idea to have each character carrying their own stuff? How?

Because it creates utterly needless fiddling when using the inventory.

For example, just say I have two characters with full inventories and I want to take an item from one character and give equip it to another (a common situation). The process would go as follows:
1) Select receiving character.
2) Get receiving character to drop item.
3) Select giving character.
4) Move desired item from giving character to receiving character.
5) Select receiving character.
6) Equip desired item.
7) Retrieve dropped item.

For comparison, here is how would I do the same thing in Dragon Age's nice shared inventory:
1) Select receiving character.
2) Double-click desired item.
3) Done.

What were you expecting? this is classic RPG were talking about here, not mass effect. And once again, this is a D&D game, if you don't know how D&D works you are likely to be confused by the mechanics - they don't bother to explain them in any great detail because 9/10 of the people playing the game are D&D players already.

What kind of excuse is that? So... the game is eclusively for DnD players?

Well, the would certainly explain why this kind of game is rapidly going the way of the dodo.

Huh. Now I just feel like playing Mass Effect: Actual Gameplay again.

It doesn't stop being D&D if thats what you're asking, but if you really need a helping hand I suggest you arm yourself with a walkthough, if only to get yourself started properly.

It's not so much a case needing a helping hand. The gameplay isn't hard or challenging. Just dull. I was kind of hoping that the game might introduce some new elements or something.

So you've just started in other words. Sink another 30 hours into the game and then make a decision. Your call if you're prepared to do that.

HAHAHAHAHAhahahahahaheheheheheheee... hehehee... heh.

30 hours. Ha!

No game gets 30 hours to impress me. It gets maybe three. Five max. The fact that Planescape Torment has got significantly more than that out of me says a lot about the quality of its story and setting.

 

[Continuity]

No its not, its just a question of what your expectations are. This is a D&D game, if you don't like D&D then you almost certainly wont like it either.

I don't think liking D&D is a prerequisite for liking the gameplay in Planescape: Torment. I thoroughly enjoy a good bit of D&D and I found Plancescape's combat to be an exercise in complete and utter tedium.

Fair enough, but I didn't really say it was a prerequisite for liking planescapes combat, just that if you're not onboard with D&D in the first place then you're even less likely to get on with PT in general, or at least thats what I meant and the combat is a part of that, as a D&D player I was quiet happy with the combat mechanics because I understood them and expected them to be as they are.

However the important point here is that the game isn't about combat or action, yes it contains combat but that's not what makes the game good.