Poll: DnD/Pathfinder class questions.

[Ninjamedic]

So I'm about to start my first campaign in Pathfinder and I'm set on playing a sorcerer. However, as I was browsing the pathfinder SRD, I came across the Magus [http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/magus] class, and became a little curious as whether to dual-class a Sorcerer/Magus or play a Magus for my next character. I'm probably going to end up being a damage dealer in combat, (yep, I'm a Pyromaniac). Would it be worth dual-classing?

 

[LordVikingofFire]

Just take plenty of Save or suck spells, damage dealing is fine and all, but if you want to be an effective sorcerer you take spells that do effects rather than direct damage. Go with Sorcerer since it is easier to play than a magus since you just need to keep track of how many spells you cast. What level are you playing at?

 

[Ninjamedic]

What level are you playing at?

First I guess, I was thinking about save/suck spells, but I'm afrais I'll end up as "the guy who casts de-buffs then tells the others "kill those mooks please"", plus, I'm a bit of a pyromaniac. Since there is a bard in our group I was thinking he would be the buff/de-buff caster.

The straight-up Sorcerer seems to be the more powerful class, so from the perspective of min-maxing, it wouldn't be worth dabbling in Magus levels when the Sorcerer will have more free access to the higher spell levels. That said, the d8 hit dice may make things somewhat easier if you're not a particularly experienced player, but a good spellcaster should have enough solutions to improve defences.

Taking a level in a seperate class wouldn't come back to haunt me would it?

 

[Chronologist]

It depends on what you want your character to do. You say you want to deal lots of damage, and in that case, the Sorcerer is probably the best bet. However, the Magus is also effective at fighting enemies using a one-handed weapon and touch spells, and depending on your level could do a fairly respectable amount of damage, while having better saves and armor class.

Ultimately, you'll find the Sorcerer is really good at having a variety of damage, buff, debuff, and utility effects at her fingertips, but with little defense capability. The Magus is a tougher class, but they lack the damage output and versatility of the Sorcerer.

I'd advise playing a Sorcerer, if only because they are a Core class and probably easier to run. Personally, if this is your first campaign ever, I'd advise you learn your class features very well before you play, especially if you're starting above level 1. It can get a little complicated keeping track of everything, and a few minutes of forethought before the game (and thinking fast on other player's turns in combat) will lead to a more fun gaming experience.

Best of luck!

 

[LordVikingofFire]

First I guess, I was thinking about save/suck spells, but I'm afrais I'll end up as "the guy who casts de-buffs then tells the others "kill those mooks please"", plus, I'm a bit of a pyromaniac. Since there is a bard in our group I was thinking he would be the buff/de-buff caster.

Consider this. You are alone/charge/jumped with/by a monster who is immune or resistant to fire (I assuming you'll be taking fire elemental path since you state yourself as a bit of a pyromaniac.) What would happen if you only have direct damage spells: You get horribly wounded or die quite easily since your scorching ray won't hurt it one bit. Now granted you will most likely have magic missile too.

Save-or-Suck spell scenario: As above, but now you cast sleep on it. The creature is now helpless. The rogue/fighter goes over and stabs it, slits throat, whatever. It is now dead. Sleep is a broken spell beyond reasoning. Even more so now that it does a 10-feet burst. High Will Save? Ray of Enfeeblement, suddenly the monsters are not that strong. Another fun spell to have fun with is Disguise Self, a spell that keeps on giving.

Taking a level in a seperate class wouldn't come back to haunt me would it?

Depends on whether you want full casting or not? I want full casting myself, and with right spell selection you will rule the roost.

As the previous post mentions, careful spell-selection is the tricky part of playing a sorcerer. I play wizards or Clerics since I get a ton of spells with plenty of uses. Between picking Hate or Fireball, I would always go with Haste because of the many many bonuses that spell provides. Plus you get to attack twice in one round. That is awesome. But if you want to play a pyromaniac, go for it! Have fun with your character either way!

 

[Ninjamedic]

Consider this. You are alone/charge/jumped with/by a monster who is immune or resistant to fire (I assuming you'll be taking fire elemental path since you state yourself as a bit of a pyromaniac.) What would happen if you only have direct damage spells: You get horribly wounded or die quite easily since your scorching ray won't hurt it one bit. Now granted you will most likely have magic missile too.

Save-or-Suck spell scenario: As above, but now you cast sleep on it. The creature is now helpless. The rogue/fighter goes over and stabs it, slits throat, whatever. It is now dead. Sleep is a broken spell beyond reasoning. Even more so now that it does a 10-feet burst. High Will Save? Ray of Enfeeblement, suddenly the monsters are not that strong. Another fun spell to have fun with is Disguise Self, a spell that keeps on giving.

In that case, would it be a good idea to have a few splash weapons as a backup?

 

[dyre]

One of the things that saddens me about D&D is that save/suck spells are so much more powerful than damage spells. I've wanted to play a video-game style blow-shit-up sorcerer, but I never get to

 

[Smiles]

If you are playing pathfinder the save/suck spells aren't as op as they are in 3.5 dnd. also sleep is no longer overpowered because it only effects 4 hit dice in pathfinder, which means you can put to sleep four lvl one dudes, 2 lvl 2 dudes or one lvl four dude and anything higher than that is unaffected.

I'd say go with straight up sorcerer, its a super fun class and pretty easy to play.

 

[Amnestic]

One of the things that saddens me about D&D is that save/suck spells are so much more powerful than damage spells. I've wanted to play a video-game style blow-shit-up sorcerer, but I never get to

Meh. Warmage is considered Tier 4 which works well in most group. You can go straight blasty if you want, with a few utility spells as reserve if shit hits the proverbial fan.

If you are playing pathfinder the save/suck spells aren't as op as they are in 3.5 dnd. also sleep is no longer overpowered because it only effects 4 hit dice in pathfinder, which means you can put to sleep four lvl one dudes, 2 lvl 2 dudes or one lvl four dude and anything higher than that is unaffected.

I'd say go with straight up sorcerer, its a super fun class and pretty easy to play.

Sleep [http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/sleep.htm] only affects 4HD of creatures in 3.5.

Save/suck are still OP in Pathfinder though. Paizo really dropped the ball when it came to balancing the casters like they said they would.

 

[Ninjamedic]

Save/suck are still OP in Pathfinder though. Paizo really dropped the ball when it came to balancing the casters like they said they would.

This is annoying me a little, I narrowed my choices of Lv1 spells down to Burning Hands, Grease, Magic Missle, Magic Weapons, Sleep and Ray of enfeeblement, There is a Bard and Necromancer in our group, so I'm stuck as to what spells I should go for. I'm also considering carrying a few flasks of acid/alchemist's fire as splash weapons.

 

[Amnestic]

Save/suck are still OP in Pathfinder though. Paizo really dropped the ball when it came to balancing the casters like they said they would.

This is annoying me a little, I narrowed my choices of Lv1 spells down to Burning Hands, Grease, Magic Missle, Magic Weapons, Sleep and Ray of enfeeblement, There is a Bard and Necromancer in our group, so I'm stuck as to what spells I should go for. I'm also considering carrying a few flasks of acid/alchemist's fire as splash weapons.

That's...a lot of 1st level spells. With those, I assume you're going Magus to start with? Sorc only gets 2 at first (not 2+ChaMod either).

By the look of the Magus, it looks like a Wizard version of the Duskblade. Should be pretty 'balanced' in so much as I expect it to be around the midpoint for where classes are balanced, but I've not actually seen it in play so that's mostly conjecture from just a glance over the class itself.

Don't multiclass them though. Go straight Magus or straight Sorcerer. If nothing else, Magus is Int and Sorc is Cha. Being MAD* makes players mad.

[sub]*Multiple Attribute Dependent/Dependency[/sub]

 

[Ninjamedic]

That's...a lot of 1st level spells. With those, I assume you're going Magus to start with? Sorc only gets 2 at first (not 2+ChaMod either).

I'm going with a sorcerer, easier to start with, but I'm still stuck with what to choose.

 

[Amnestic]

That's...a lot of 1st level spells. With those, I assume you're going Magus to start with? Sorc only gets 2 at first (not 2+ChaMod either).

I'm going with a sorcerer, easier to start with, but I'm still stuck with what to choose.

At 1st level? Grab a crossbow and take Grease and Ray of Enfeeblement. Your spell options are very limited as a sorcerer you really want stuff which you won't replace with higher level spells. Things like Burning Hands and Magic Missile will be more than covered by your allies. Grease is crazy OP (due to forcing balance* checks) and Ray of Enfeeblement doesn't ever really lose its shine.

*Acrobatics in Pathfinder.

 

[Ninjamedic]

At 1st level? Grab a crossbow and take Grease and Ray of Enfeeblement. Your spell options are very limited as a sorcerer you really want stuff which you won't replace with higher level spells. Things like Burning Hands and Magic Missile will be more than covered by your allies. Grease is crazy OP (due to forcing balance* checks) and Ray of Enfeeblement doesn't ever really lose its shine.

*Acrobatics in Pathfinder.

What if I picked Draconic as a bloodline?

 

[Amnestic]

At 1st level? Grab a crossbow and take Grease and Ray of Enfeeblement. Your spell options are very limited as a sorcerer you really want stuff which you won't replace with higher level spells. Things like Burning Hands and Magic Missile will be more than covered by your allies. Grease is crazy OP (due to forcing balance* checks) and Ray of Enfeeblement doesn't ever really lose its shine.

*Acrobatics in Pathfinder.

What if I picked Draconic as a bloodline?

My answer doesn't change. You get Mage Armour (which is nice) at 3rd but that doesn't change your initial spell selection. Draconic isn't exactly optimal (why are they trying to turn the d6, poor BAB sorc into a fighter? Power attack as a bonus feat? The fuck Paizo, really?) but you're playing a primary spellcaster so that really doesn't matter.

 

[Ninjamedic]

My answer doesn't change. You get Mage Armour (which is nice) at 3rd but that doesn't change your initial spell selection. Draconic isn't exactly optimal (why are they trying to turn the d6, poor BAB sorc into a fighter? Power attack as a bonus feat? The fuck Paizo, really?) but you're playing a primary spellcaster so that really doesn't matter.

Right then, should I still keep a few flasks with me just in case?

 

[Amnestic]

My answer doesn't change. You get Mage Armour (which is nice) at 3rd but that doesn't change your initial spell selection. Draconic isn't exactly optimal (why are they trying to turn the d6, poor BAB sorc into a fighter? Power attack as a bonus feat? The fuck Paizo, really?) but you're playing a primary spellcaster so that really doesn't matter.

Right then, should I still keep a few flasks with me just in caes?

I'd suggest things like Tanglefoot Bags over flasks of damaging stuff primarily. You've got allies to throw out most of the damage. You're far more effective as a contributing party member when you're stopping the enemy from doing anything.

At 1st level though, a single Grease spell can change the entire face of an outcome (Hell, at 20 it can too...), so really I wouldn't worry about equipping yourself to the teeth for everything. Take it easy, learn as you go.

 

[Ninjamedic]

I'd suggest things like Tanglefoot Bags over flasks of damaging stuff primarily. You've got allies to throw out most of the damage. You're far more effective as a contributing party member when you're stopping the enemy from doing anything.

At 1st level though, a single Grease spell can change the entire face of an outcome (Hell, at 20 it can too...), so really I wouldn't worry about equipping yourself to the teeth for everything. Take it easy, learn as you go.

Thanks, its nice to be still able to get advice here without being insulted for it, this is going to change my plans but I'm still going to have a few fire based tricks (mostly for Role-playing a pyromaniac), would having a necromancer in the group change my tactics much?