I just....speak? DK, hard to describe it. It has it's fair share of problems, but I can't complain.
Poll: How Do Multi-Lingual People Think?
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Native English speaker, learning German, but have proficiency.
I try my best not to think in English. Usually practice at the supermarket thinking about what to buy, but I'm not fluent so it can be hard. If it's words I've used a lot, it's not too hard. Just comes to me.
I try my best not to think in English. Usually practice at the supermarket thinking about what to buy, but I'm not fluent so it can be hard. If it's words I've used a lot, it's not too hard. Just comes to me.
Native Greek speaker here, fluent in English and advanced in Japanese. (getting better every day hehe)
I think in a mixture of all 3 languages, with the ratio of the mixture fluctuating based on the activity I'm engaged in. I've been living in the US for over a decade now and the ratio has shifted from its original Greek majority to a more even spread since I don't use Greek quite as much as I used to whereas the other two languages have jumped up. I do still count in Greek though, it feels way more natural to do so, I dunno why, also I contemplate the days of the week in Greek as well. When speaking with my Greek side of the family, I always use Greek, it feels awkward to suddenly speak to them in English (and they don't know japanese lol), which I have to do when non-Greek-speakers are present.
Where I grew up, everyone takes English classes, but it's more of a joke class that isn't granted weight, so most people are pretty terrible at English despite studying it both at cram schools and in public schools since the 4th grade, but my interest in games and anime and so on as well as parental influence (mom's american) enabled me to actually be comfortable enough with English to be able to watch anime in Japanese with English subtitles ever since I was 14 and not miss anything.
As for Japanese, I started studying it when I was 16 with a personal tutor while I still was in Greece and then took classes in college after moving to the US, while also working on it by myself between those times and after. It's so different from both other languages in all aspects but the pronunciation is phonetic which is the exact same in Greek so I had little issue with it. The rest of it was just language immersion and studying. Atm I'm just working on vocab and more kanji slowly as I go along, I'm very comfortable with it but there do come some cases where technical or scientific terms evade me. I'm in that place where if something is voice-acted I understand 95% of what is being said but if it has a lot of writing I may need to look up a kanji here and there. Also, I avoid translating things in the other languages, cause Japanese is full of untranslatable stuff, so I grasp the meaning of it without trying to think of it in another language, which is something that took a while until I was able to do. I don't even know when it happened, I just stopped trying to think of it in the other language cause it just "had meaning" in Japanese.
Finally, when I play a game that's localized, I sometimes try to guess what the original Japanese line was based on the localization, since a lot of times they change things too much. Checking the Jp version of a scene after guessing and finding out if I guessed right is a lot of fun!
I think in a mixture of all 3 languages, with the ratio of the mixture fluctuating based on the activity I'm engaged in. I've been living in the US for over a decade now and the ratio has shifted from its original Greek majority to a more even spread since I don't use Greek quite as much as I used to whereas the other two languages have jumped up. I do still count in Greek though, it feels way more natural to do so, I dunno why, also I contemplate the days of the week in Greek as well. When speaking with my Greek side of the family, I always use Greek, it feels awkward to suddenly speak to them in English (and they don't know japanese lol), which I have to do when non-Greek-speakers are present.
Where I grew up, everyone takes English classes, but it's more of a joke class that isn't granted weight, so most people are pretty terrible at English despite studying it both at cram schools and in public schools since the 4th grade, but my interest in games and anime and so on as well as parental influence (mom's american) enabled me to actually be comfortable enough with English to be able to watch anime in Japanese with English subtitles ever since I was 14 and not miss anything.
As for Japanese, I started studying it when I was 16 with a personal tutor while I still was in Greece and then took classes in college after moving to the US, while also working on it by myself between those times and after. It's so different from both other languages in all aspects but the pronunciation is phonetic which is the exact same in Greek so I had little issue with it. The rest of it was just language immersion and studying. Atm I'm just working on vocab and more kanji slowly as I go along, I'm very comfortable with it but there do come some cases where technical or scientific terms evade me. I'm in that place where if something is voice-acted I understand 95% of what is being said but if it has a lot of writing I may need to look up a kanji here and there. Also, I avoid translating things in the other languages, cause Japanese is full of untranslatable stuff, so I grasp the meaning of it without trying to think of it in another language, which is something that took a while until I was able to do. I don't even know when it happened, I just stopped trying to think of it in the other language cause it just "had meaning" in Japanese.
Finally, when I play a game that's localized, I sometimes try to guess what the original Japanese line was based on the localization, since a lot of times they change things too much. Checking the Jp version of a scene after guessing and finding out if I guessed right is a lot of fun!
I think in English. I'm barely bilingual, and that's incredibly shameful since English is not my native language.
When I read things in my native language, it is possible that I understand it right away yet I can't actually translate it into English. Other times I translate it to English word for word and I don't get it.
When I read things in my native language, it is possible that I understand it right away yet I can't actually translate it into English. Other times I translate it to English word for word and I don't get it.
I speak two languages. Dutch is my first language, and I speak English as well. Reading, writing and listening is easy. Speaking English sometimes still goes a bit awkwardly. I just can't speak English as fast, fluently or eloquently as Dutch. I have a very basic understanding of very simple German and Latin but it hardly amounts to anything useful. I can occasionally understand simple sentences or parts thereof, and that's about it. In the case of German, whatever I do understand is more to do with the similarity of German to Dutch than anything else.
Learning English sort of happened by watching TV and playing videogames. Dutch dubs ussually don't exist (we have subs) and sometimes translations can be so bad, English is simply preferable. (seriously, some gaming companies seem to just use google translate and call it a day) I did follow classes in it but I think I learned very little from them. The teacher wasn't as good at English as half the class already was and I never really learned the other languages I was thaught. I never really learned to speak languages by actively trying to learn them. Latin class was useful because it gave a very thourough explanation of grammar and ways to read, but to my great annoyance I just failed to build up a vocabulary beyond a tiny amount of words.
I ussually think in Dutch, except when speaking, writing, reading or listening English, then it becomes either English or a weird half/half mix. I do find it very easy to switch between the two, sometimes in mid-thought.
At this point I use both English and Dutch daily. The newspaper is Dutch. Most of my internet usage is English. People I meet or speak to is normally in Dutch. Study material is a bit of Dutch but mostly English. My new master will be entirely in English.
Learning English sort of happened by watching TV and playing videogames. Dutch dubs ussually don't exist (we have subs) and sometimes translations can be so bad, English is simply preferable. (seriously, some gaming companies seem to just use google translate and call it a day) I did follow classes in it but I think I learned very little from them. The teacher wasn't as good at English as half the class already was and I never really learned the other languages I was thaught. I never really learned to speak languages by actively trying to learn them. Latin class was useful because it gave a very thourough explanation of grammar and ways to read, but to my great annoyance I just failed to build up a vocabulary beyond a tiny amount of words.
I ussually think in Dutch, except when speaking, writing, reading or listening English, then it becomes either English or a weird half/half mix. I do find it very easy to switch between the two, sometimes in mid-thought.
At this point I use both English and Dutch daily. The newspaper is Dutch. Most of my internet usage is English. People I meet or speak to is normally in Dutch. Study material is a bit of Dutch but mostly English. My new master will be entirely in English.
At the beginning, it is very common to translate in your mind before speaking (I am doing it right now), but after some time I started thinking in English and even began dreaming in English. That is a breakthrough moment, as I felt I became more fluent back then. Once you are in the "right mindset", you can switch pretty much at will...
Still takes me a few seconds to fluently switch from one language to another, and I admire the people that seem to be able to do it on the fly.
Still takes me a few seconds to fluently switch from one language to another, and I admire the people that seem to be able to do it on the fly.
I'm always deeply impressed when a non-native speaker can descipher those Japanese moon runes. Hats off! How long did it take you to understand the basics if I may ask? I took a peek at some of those online tutorials but it looks really difficult.Dreiko said:
My native language is Polish and English is the only other language I speak with any real degree of competency. Given that Polish is a Slavic language, the grammar is quite different and the words don't share common roots, with some obvious exceptions - mostly I'm thinking of terms that have become loanwords in multiple languages, like "radio". Granted, compared to say, most Finno-Ugric languages (at least from my perspective), Polish is not overly complex and while it's not quite as simple as English, which seems to owe much of its popularity to how easy it is to learn and use, the two could still be far further apart. Also, they share a common alphabet, with some minor differences.
I guess I mostly think in Polish, but I do notice myself thinking in English quite often, especially if I imagine myself speaking a foreign language, even if said language is not English. I certainly don't need to formulate my thoughts in Polish before translating them into English, I just form sentences in English and that's that. Curiously, I sometimes end up in a situation where I start a sentence that I hadn't planned out in advance in its entirety and realize the language I'm using does not have an appropriate, accurate word to express what I mean while I'm painfully aware of an obvious matching word in the other language I know.
I guess I mostly think in Polish, but I do notice myself thinking in English quite often, especially if I imagine myself speaking a foreign language, even if said language is not English. I certainly don't need to formulate my thoughts in Polish before translating them into English, I just form sentences in English and that's that. Curiously, I sometimes end up in a situation where I start a sentence that I hadn't planned out in advance in its entirety and realize the language I'm using does not have an appropriate, accurate word to express what I mean while I'm painfully aware of an obvious matching word in the other language I know.
stroopwafel said:
Not sure what you define as "basics" but I had the regular alphabets down in 2 weeks of 2.5 hours of repeated writing a day and two 3-hour tutoring sessions per week (filled like two entire notebooks with it) and then basic grammar in like...2 months or something? Though you have to kinda take into account all the language immersion I did throughout that time on my free time as a means of entertainment which is very hard to quantify so I'm not sure if I'm answering your question accurately (or if I even can give you a precise answer hehe).
I'm the kind of learner where if I like something I become fully immersed in it and live and breath it so if you do that with a language you learn it on an intuitive level more so than as a skill. I'm not good about remembering rules and spelling for one, and my handwriting is ugly as sin due to mild dyslexia, but Japanese ideograms don't have spelling, they have stroke-order, and that works with my brain on an intuitive level way better than western spelling (which uses various different letters for the same sound that change arbitrarily) ever did.
Ideograms have intrinsic meaning you see so when I ask "why is this letter not the right one?" the answer is "this kami is the letter for god, the kami you need is the letter for hair" and you can see a visual clue of that fact in the letter itself, whereas in the other languages the answer is "that's just how it is cause of the way language evolved arbitrarily, fuck you" which clashes with my intuitive learner style and becomes a meaningless task at memorization which bores me into failing at it.
I kinda figured it was Dutch. I think it's the double "o" in your username. Supposedly, Dutch is the easiest language for English speakers to learn, but those v/g/h words always throw me for a loop.stroopwafel said:Yeah, I think English is great b/c it's very flexible. My native language is Dutch. Probably a language that is impossible to pronounce when you're a native English speaker.
Anyway, I can see what you mean about flexibility. Dutch and English are pretty similar, along with German, but being monolingual, I've never had the opportunity to compare the actual usages of other languages in context.
Well, you've convinced me. I need to finish learning German then move on to Dutch!
I'm truly fluent in only two, my native Croatian[footnote]I could add Serbian, Bosnian and apparently even Montenegrin into the mix but that would be cheating since they are basically the same language, the Serbo-Croatian. Just don't tell that to the nationalists, they'll throw a hissy fit.[/footnote] and English. I studied some French (DELF A2) and Hungarian back in high school but that faded away a bit. I also self-studied some Russian enough to have a simple conversation, buy some matches or sing the whole Katyusha by heart.
Anyway, I do sometimes think in English, for example, while writing this. I also prefer the ICT stuff in English because back in the '90s when I started to learn about computers everything was in English and there were absolutely no translations. They only started doing that recently and frankly, it's pissing me off. I can barely find my way around Croatian Windows, let alone anything more complex.
When I read books, I read them in either the original language (if I understand it) or translated directly into Croatian. Unfortunately, many Croatian editions are translated from English or German translations, so in that case I prefer the direct English translation since it's closer to the original.
Anyway, I do sometimes think in English, for example, while writing this. I also prefer the ICT stuff in English because back in the '90s when I started to learn about computers everything was in English and there were absolutely no translations. They only started doing that recently and frankly, it's pissing me off. I can barely find my way around Croatian Windows, let alone anything more complex.
When I read books, I read them in either the original language (if I understand it) or translated directly into Croatian. Unfortunately, many Croatian editions are translated from English or German translations, so in that case I prefer the direct English translation since it's closer to the original.
I know a couple with kids - Mom only speaks to her kids in English, Dad only speaks in Swiss German.
Near as I can tell, those kids think in a terrifying mishmash with self-developed grammar.
Near as I can tell, those kids think in a terrifying mishmash with self-developed grammar.
That's a good explanation, thanks for posting! I'm very much an intuitive learner myself as well. For example I have a fairly easy time learning languages, history, social science etc. but have a hard time learning math. I really need to visualize or intuitively understand something, and that's a hard thing to do with numbers. Learning Japanese is something I always wanted to do though so I think I'll probably give it a try.Dreiko said:
Good luck! You're right, stroopwafel is a distinct Dutch caramel waffle. Me favorite.Ironman126 said:I kinda figured it was Dutch. I think it's the double "o" in your username. Supposedly, Dutch is the easiest language for English speakers to learn, but those v/g/h words always throw me for a loop.stroopwafel said:Yeah, I think English is great b/c it's very flexible. My native language is Dutch. Probably a language that is impossible to pronounce when you're a native English speaker.
Anyway, I can see what you mean about flexibility. Dutch and English are pretty similar, along with German, but being monolingual, I've never had the opportunity to compare the actual usages of other languages in context.
Well, you've convinced me. I need to finish learning German then move on to Dutch!
Native German here, though I learned it and Polish at the same time. I moved to Canada as a kid where I was surrounded by English, and obviously had to learn it quickly. Since then, I consider it my native language and think primarily in English.
I also took courses in French, Spanish, and Chinese. I definitely wouldn't consider myself very fluent in them, though. Maybe one day.
I also took courses in French, Spanish, and Chinese. I definitely wouldn't consider myself very fluent in them, though. Maybe one day.
I think in english when speaking/communicating in english and german pretty much most other times. I think that comes mostly from learning comprehension. You start out by formulating your speech in a language you know and then translate but when you are comfortable enough with a language you can just directly formulate what you want to say in that language and think in it as well.
If you want to learn other languages the best way I found is to just jump into the water and consume some entertainment in that language. Preferably books but tv-series and movies are allright as well.
I used to be terrible in english with pretty bad notes in school. One big, fat Harry Potter book later, because I couldn't wait for the year it usually took to translate them, and I was able to read and comprehend english no problem.
If you want to learn other languages the best way I found is to just jump into the water and consume some entertainment in that language. Preferably books but tv-series and movies are allright as well.
I used to be terrible in english with pretty bad notes in school. One big, fat Harry Potter book later, because I couldn't wait for the year it usually took to translate them, and I was able to read and comprehend english no problem.
I know three languages fluently, being English, Dutch and Frisian. I know bits of German, French and Greek and Latin, but not very much. In any case the former three are the only ones in which I think and speak and I can go from one to the other without noticing it. In fact very often I sort of wake up from a stream of thought and I think "I have no idea what language I was thinking in just now" That thought usually but not always comes in Frisian, the first language I learned.
I think this is pretty common for other people who are fluent in more than one language(and use them all often) right?
I think this is pretty common for other people who are fluent in more than one language(and use them all often) right?
This is a very interesting topic, because I have been thinking about it a lot.
Russian is my mother tongue, however, as I am in an English-speaking country, I find myself using it more and more. To the point where I stopped thinking in Russian and started thinking in English. I sort of wonder if it will have any long-term consequences to my thinking process.
Russian is my mother tongue, however, as I am in an English-speaking country, I find myself using it more and more. To the point where I stopped thinking in Russian and started thinking in English. I sort of wonder if it will have any long-term consequences to my thinking process.
Swedish is my native language, and I know English fluently. I also know some German, though not a lot.
My thinking tends to be divided based on what I'm currently occupying myself with; if I'm watching a movie in English, then I tend to think in English. If it's in Swedish, that's what I think in. If the circumstances are neutral, I tend to think in pure Swedish, often with archaic word. When I speak however, a lot of anglicisms, English words and "swedishified" English words tend to work their way in. Together with some otherwise archaic words, it can sometimes leave my speech somewhat disjointed...
My thinking tends to be divided based on what I'm currently occupying myself with; if I'm watching a movie in English, then I tend to think in English. If it's in Swedish, that's what I think in. If the circumstances are neutral, I tend to think in pure Swedish, often with archaic word. When I speak however, a lot of anglicisms, English words and "swedishified" English words tend to work their way in. Together with some otherwise archaic words, it can sometimes leave my speech somewhat disjointed...
I think in English when I write in English. I'm fluent enough in it that I can do so. I'd almost say I can speak it as well as any native speaker, though I do have a few problems with pronunciation here and there. In fact even in daily life I often start thinking in English rather than Dutch because overall I prefer the English language over my native Dutch.Saelune said:
Grammatically, Dutch is fairly similar to English. Though there are also quite a few differences. It's a bit of a mixed bag.Saelune said:
Can't really think of examples at the moment, just woke up. ^^;;In daily life I generally speak Dutch to other people. Though when I'm with friends who also play games we mix it up. Mostly Dutch, but then we want to say something that can be better expressed in English so we do that.Saelune said:
My native language being Dutch, I sometimes get asked questions about how you say English words or sentences in Dutch. Which I always find quite fun to do. Also, I did have to 'learn' other languages at school. Namely German and French. And I'd like to learn Japanese or Chinese. But I pretty much suck at learning any language except English for some reason. English just came naturally to me. As I speak/write it fluently, but couldn't tell you the first thing about grammatical rules or anything like that.Saelune said: