Poll: Is featuring rape in a game going too far?
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Your typing about the victims being women, but I think it's important to keep in mind that heterosexual and homosexual(and any other sexual orientation)are/have been victims of rape as well. Just something that I think should be pointed out.ResonanceGames said:
of course rape should be banned! all forms of sex should! now let's all go out and shoot some dudes. then after we shoot some dudes, maybe we could hop in a car and run over people! or go out drinking and shoot some more dudes. or just beat the shit out of them with household objects.
Having rape as a plot point in a game is fine: like any other adult topic it just depends on context. I'm playing Red Dead Redemption at the moment and rape has just cropped up (one of the baddies in Mexico is a serial rapist) and alongside the other adult themes it fits just fine.
In actual fact I think the episode of The Sopranos where Dr.Melfi gets raped is one of my favourites of the whole series: the drama in that scene where she contemplates getting revenge by using Tony to murder the rapist for her is very powerful. And I think games have the potential to elicit that kind of emotion, if done right.
However, I really have no interest in playing a game where the protagonist rapes anybody (in-game). I get heavily invested in entertainment: I'm the kind of guy who when reading a book is deaf to the world, and I can't get through an episode of The Office without squirming in acute empathy. If I had to play through the act of rape in-game I would be very disgusted.
In actual fact I think the episode of The Sopranos where Dr.Melfi gets raped is one of my favourites of the whole series: the drama in that scene where she contemplates getting revenge by using Tony to murder the rapist for her is very powerful. And I think games have the potential to elicit that kind of emotion, if done right.
However, I really have no interest in playing a game where the protagonist rapes anybody (in-game). I get heavily invested in entertainment: I'm the kind of guy who when reading a book is deaf to the world, and I can't get through an episode of The Office without squirming in acute empathy. If I had to play through the act of rape in-game I would be very disgusted.
I never said games encourage or create behavior. Hell, it might even discourage it. But still, can you honestly tell me that rape is something you would want a player character to engage in? It just doesn't seem right to me. I'm okay with it as a story device, as an event in the game. It does happen after all; no one can act blind to its existence. But I just can't get behind allowing the player character to rape another. Even if it is "just a game".KaizokuouHasu said:
I could get all moral and expand further, but I think the point is mute. Personally, I wouldn't be for it as an in-game action. Not that I would denounce that game as Satan's second coming or some stupid shit. I might even take a look at the game to see I was wrong and it isn't that big a deal. But from where I'm sitting now, I just don't think it is any good as an in-game action. And I'll have you know, this seat is rather comfy. There is a particularly enjoyable pillow on it.
It's all about the context. Lot's of movies use rape tastefully as a plot device, I see no reason why games couldn't do the same.
sort of unrelated, about DND but it ties back I promise!
In our dnd game this week a large part of the conflict centered around the near rape of one of the characters (who's player was absent). When our party arrived at the scene, the man who had been flirting, and stalking, our psion (mind wizard) was standing naked in front of a bed where the, fully clothed, psion lay unconscious.
He started to try to explain himself, and our paladin and the rest of the lawful good party started to listen. My character runs in last sees everything and cuts the rapist off mid word with a war hammer ("I see what? ok I am gonna use a daily). I crited and crushed his head. There was a brief silence and the start of a protest by the rest of the party, my character put his hammer away and untied the near rape victim. Turns around and looks at the party and simply says "no."
It was a dark dark moment in the game that actually allowed for a lot of character development. My character is egotistical, cocky, and long winded, usually more than willing to talk so that he can show off. He is also neutral and impassive to most things that do not allow him to show off or serve his goals, but in this session I got to show he had real lines that could not be crossed.
Story wise rape was a great choice by our DM, and created an emotional and somber game (which never happens). If for story than I don't see why any subject should be off the table...
In our dnd game this week a large part of the conflict centered around the near rape of one of the characters (who's player was absent). When our party arrived at the scene, the man who had been flirting, and stalking, our psion (mind wizard) was standing naked in front of a bed where the, fully clothed, psion lay unconscious.
He started to try to explain himself, and our paladin and the rest of the lawful good party started to listen. My character runs in last sees everything and cuts the rapist off mid word with a war hammer ("I see what? ok I am gonna use a daily). I crited and crushed his head. There was a brief silence and the start of a protest by the rest of the party, my character put his hammer away and untied the near rape victim. Turns around and looks at the party and simply says "no."
It was a dark dark moment in the game that actually allowed for a lot of character development. My character is egotistical, cocky, and long winded, usually more than willing to talk so that he can show off. He is also neutral and impassive to most things that do not allow him to show off or serve his goals, but in this session I got to show he had real lines that could not be crossed.
Story wise rape was a great choice by our DM, and created an emotional and somber game (which never happens). If for story than I don't see why any subject should be off the table...
Notice how I specifically referred to Rapelay to avoid exactly this red herring that I knew someone would throw out.Volf99 said:
Yes, people other than women have been raped. I'm pretty sure everyone knows that.
I think it should be allowed, but just as I can't think of a movie touching on the subject in a meaningful manner that I might see, I doubt I will ever find a game about it that I will play.
The biggest issue I see with this is that I don't think they could enforce the age rating it would deserve, and that it might therefore have to be banned.
The biggest issue I see with this is that I don't think they could enforce the age rating it would deserve, and that it might therefore have to be banned.
As long as this idea does not progress any farther, I'm fine. 'Cause if I hear that there's a rape game, and I have to tap X to not get boned in the a$$. I'm going to be pissed.
Not any more than in books or film.
It should be handled in a tactful way, unless you are trying to make a point by being untactful.
It should be handled in a tactful way, unless you are trying to make a point by being untactful.
I bet that'll go down well when the absent player gets back:Freeze_L said:
'Hey I couldn't make it last week, what happened?'
'Oh, nothing much. Your character got assaulted, trussed up and very nearly raped. No biggie.'
'Oh... Cool.'
Not specifically, I'm simply a long time defender of free speech and crusader against political correctness in the media. I believe in unfettered expression in fantasy so to speak. Having been around the issue a lot I have a lot of solid information from which to base arguements.Volf99 said:
Typically the arguements I run into are things like people screaming about the "tree rape scene" in the original "Evil Dead"... which wasn't all that, but it was kind of freaky if you weren't expecting it given the way it was done, and shocked a lot of people. My basic arguement is that as it was a horror movie, if this scene shocked people and made the uncomfortable that is the point... if that's not what your watching for, why the heck are
you watching a horror movie?
The whole rape fantasy thing is a side issue, usually coming down to the issue of slavery within games and such. Slaver traders and the slave trade always being presented as something to be fought against, which in many cases doesn't really do justice to the fantasy of societies where it is supposed to be integral. This raises questions about how one can handle such things. The fantasy relationship between say a Sheikh and his Concubines/Harem Girls can form a stereotypical foundation for such things beyond say beating 12 year olds bloody in a salt mine. Sure that might be going on somewhere but part of storytelling is what you focus on for the purposes of your story.
Such things don't bother me, but I don't seek them out either. I also tend to think that they are all around us, it's just that most people tend to forget that when making arguements about this stuff. Hence the points about romance novels, vampire fiction, etc... Most people run into it but then try and dismiss it as "well, that's differant" when argueing about something like video games, or themselves not wanting to admit it due to fear of being thought a freak.
I don't think every "M" rated game needs to have graphic sex, rape, and other assorted stuff in it, I just think that shying away from it or intentionally avoiding creations where such things might come up is a mistake.
But yeah, at the same time while that's not a major area of interest for me in of itself, I'm hardly a prude despite generally being on the right side of the political spectrum.
I'm curious how many people who have responded so far have every actually dealt with a rape victim in their life? It is incredibly damaging, so is witnessing a murder for that matter but normally in the course of a game the player character has the chance to defend themselves, whereas rape leaves the victim pretty much powerless.
If used as a plot point or to add layers to a character then implied or strongly implied would probably do better than actually showing the scene. To be able to play the rapist though, personally I find it a little unsettling but like others have said, we can commit genocide for no reason. I think it may be to do with the murder of NPCs isn't personal, there is no personal or emotional attachment to destroying a bunch of 1s and 0s. Rape is personal, it's all about dominating the victim and being in control.
Basically, if handled right then no not at all too far. if thrown in for shits and giggles then, well it still needs to be handled right...black screen and struggle sounds maybe?
Probably asking a bit much from COD though.
If used as a plot point or to add layers to a character then implied or strongly implied would probably do better than actually showing the scene. To be able to play the rapist though, personally I find it a little unsettling but like others have said, we can commit genocide for no reason. I think it may be to do with the murder of NPCs isn't personal, there is no personal or emotional attachment to destroying a bunch of 1s and 0s. Rape is personal, it's all about dominating the victim and being in control.
Basically, if handled right then no not at all too far. if thrown in for shits and giggles then, well it still needs to be handled right...black screen and struggle sounds maybe?
In all seriousness that could be really compelling. especially if you want to bring up issues like homosexuality in the regs and women on the front line. needing the other members of your squad to have your back in any confrontation so you can't tell anyone.Zaul2010 said:
Probably asking a bit much from COD though.
As a select few have stated, there is _no justifiable reason_ for the player to commit rape other than to prove they are evil (there's plenty of other ways), or for simple jollies from torturing/humiliating someone. Likewise, as was also stated, murder can justified in several ways, mainly self defence.
There's another thing that I'm not sure was brought up, so I will. When you kill someone in your average video game, they die pretty quickly and the suffering isn't really an issue because of how fast they die. Whether it was due to a shot to the head, having parts blown off, or what have you.
When you rape someone, you're not killing them, it doesn't end quickly, and the entire act is about making someone suffer for your own pleasure.
I personally do not think we need rape in video games as gameplay. If, as has been stated repeatedly, it's handled _very well_ in the storyline or via context, it might be okay. But seriously, look at the game industry today (hell, look at most media) and you'll soon realize they're not ready for such a responsibility. The average internet user probably would get off on raping someone, which just makes me feel more disgusted about Humanity in general...
I dunno, maybe it's because I've always had deep rooted, seething hatred for the act of rape and those who would commit it willingly. Also, I did actually check out RapePlay, and the fact that the player eventually makes them _enjoy_ it is probably worse. It's like the developers knew it was sketchy territory and decided to include a save where the women are already submissive and do whatever with smiles on. Kinda made me sick.
There's another thing that I'm not sure was brought up, so I will. When you kill someone in your average video game, they die pretty quickly and the suffering isn't really an issue because of how fast they die. Whether it was due to a shot to the head, having parts blown off, or what have you.
When you rape someone, you're not killing them, it doesn't end quickly, and the entire act is about making someone suffer for your own pleasure.
I personally do not think we need rape in video games as gameplay. If, as has been stated repeatedly, it's handled _very well_ in the storyline or via context, it might be okay. But seriously, look at the game industry today (hell, look at most media) and you'll soon realize they're not ready for such a responsibility. The average internet user probably would get off on raping someone, which just makes me feel more disgusted about Humanity in general...
I dunno, maybe it's because I've always had deep rooted, seething hatred for the act of rape and those who would commit it willingly. Also, I did actually check out RapePlay, and the fact that the player eventually makes them _enjoy_ it is probably worse. It's like the developers knew it was sketchy territory and decided to include a save where the women are already submissive and do whatever with smiles on. Kinda made me sick.
It is going to be so much fun out of game...EvilPicnic said:
Psion:"So what happened?"
DM:"well..."
Psion:"Seriously what happened?"
DM:"Well its kinda hard to explain but..."
Paladin: "You almost got @!#!ing raped that's what happened."
Psion: "No really what happened last week."
Ranger: "well you see sometimes bad things happen to good people."
Psion: "are you kidding me I miss one session and my character gets raped!"
Me: "almost raped, I killed the guy!"
DM: "also that pit fiend and those angels from the time before that, kinda destroyed the city."
Psion:"... one week I was gone one week."
DM: "anyways moving on..."
Being able to rape characters? Not ok.
Depicting a rape in a cutscene or something else you can't actively participate in? Ok.
Well, not OK. More like more acceptable than active participation in one (or several) ALA "Rapelay".
If movies can and be called "art" then why can't games?
Depicting a rape in a cutscene or something else you can't actively participate in? Ok.
Well, not OK. More like more acceptable than active participation in one (or several) ALA "Rapelay".
If movies can and be called "art" then why can't games?
I can think of many movies that featured a violent rape scene without the actual sex being shown. I can think of a few books that did the same. Perhaps the most in your face example is gangster rap where Ive heard songs about a singer violently raping a woman while he was pimping her out. Why would video games be exempt from that when other mediums have done it?
While it can be done I will add that it shouldnt be done. The violation of the human body by any means is a horrendous crime that leaves lasting mental trauma in the individual. Having that depicted in any medium just seems to be in bad taste but thats purely my opinion
While it can be done I will add that it shouldnt be done. The violation of the human body by any means is a horrendous crime that leaves lasting mental trauma in the individual. Having that depicted in any medium just seems to be in bad taste but thats purely my opinion
this and I've seen a review about it (by benzie on that guy with the glasses) it really doesn't seem that bad as it was made out to be I mean it's not like it was very graphic plus I heard the rapist gets killed in one of the endings so it's not completely in the rapist's favorteh_Canape said: