Poll: Why do you hate elves?

Chimichanga

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Jun 27, 2009
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I have read only a few posts but not all of them, so much of what I say may have been ninja'd by a previous comment. TL;DR at the bottom.

I hate elves primarily because they are the Mary Sues of Tolkien-esque fantasy. In the strictly Tolkien sense, they are the strongest, fastest, smartest, prettiest, and wisest race above all beyond competition. They are great warriors, deep and insightful masters of poetry and philosophy, master craftsmen, and are all "One with the Earth" in that they know almost all of nature and history's secrets. Oh, and they have fantastically long life spans, if not immortal in some cases. And almost always white.

They are the ideal "Sue" character for white supremacists. I hate Mary Sues and I hate white supremacists. Therefore, I hate elves.

I also hate them for being so god damn prevalent; there is always some kind of elf or elf-like race in EVERY fantasy (Or heck, even in some Sci-fi) themed universes.

Take the whole race-supremacy-thing and the fact that they are over-used and you have a god damned Mary Sue race for every god damned IP considered "fantasy".

For weeaboos, the elves are asian and nearly perfect.

For the uncreative, they are practically the same except that they may be a slightly different color (*COUGHCOUGH"darkelves"COUGHCOUGH*).

For uncreative Sci-Fi writers, they are just elves in space re-labeled as "Aliens".

While I hated almost everything else about Dragon Age, the one thing I did like was how they portrayed elves as disparate and impoverished - not immortal, not the uber-powerful noble warrior/poet/scholar/rogue/archer nerd wish-fulfillment trope they are usually cast as; they are only the Master Race in their own heads and through their own retrospect of their past. Unfortunately, Dragon Age sucked balls IMHO.

Part of it is a deep personal hate for flawless characters. No, being 'Incredibly haughty and elitist to the point of working against them" is NOT a real flaw. Not when it is kept in context of actually being as uber-skilled/strong/smart as is said about them. It's bad writing in general and is indicative of pathetic and desperate wish-fulfillment. The flaws of a character are sometimes the best part of the character if written and implemented properly, so the flawless elf trope annoys me, and the prevalence of every downtrodden fantasy writer amplifies that until I start to get sick.

Of course, it should be no surprise that my interest in character flaw is why my personal favorite in terms of original Tolkien races are the Orcs. Ugly, misshapen, and with varying intelligence, when one of them gets a personality through character development they are almost always more interesting as characters.

TL;DR: I hate flawless "Mary Sues" and their obscene prevalence and over-use in the fantasy genre. I think character flaw is what makes characters interesting and thus why I dislike most elf characters (More like deep and personal hate in a RAAAAGE-rant).

All of this was just to explain my opinion. Why I certainly think my opinions have at least a kernel of truth to them, my intention was not to present them as such.
 

Arkynomicon

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Mar 25, 2011
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Only elves I hate are the badly written ones.

Dwarves on the other hand I find incredibly overrated.

In videogames I love the Dunmer from Morrowind for being racist and jerks just like people in real life.
 

BaronUberstein

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Jul 14, 2011
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Mainly, they're always so arrogant and "perfect". Oh, the ELVES couldn't have caused the problem! Clearly it was the humans or dwarves who messed up! Let's blame everyone BUT the elves!

Then when things go wrong, instead of trying to fix it they just run off, or seal themselves in a time bubble, or refuse to even see that something could possibly hurt them.
 

Brutal Peanut

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Oct 15, 2010
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Actually, I don't hate elves. I don't really 'hate' anything. Lame answer is lame.
 

Lunar Templar

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Sep 20, 2009
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because, like dwarves, they are a lazy cop out race used by incompetents who can't think out something original
 

Scars Unseen

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Axolotl said:
Because they symbolise the least original, most derivative type of fantasy.

You mean religion?
[small]I keed, I keed.[/small]

I don't hate elves, but then I enjoy playing arrogant pricks in D&D.
 

sage42

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Mar 20, 2009
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Because they're stuck-up arrogant pricks, with their heads so far up their asses that it makes even the most pompous nobility look....well......noble. And don't get me started on Elven nobility.
 

Promethax

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Dec 7, 2010
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Elves think they're the best thing ever, completely oblivious to the existence of Orcs.
 

Crazy Zaul

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Oct 5, 2010
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Cos the took over Elswyer so so they can't set the next game there.
Otherwise I like elves. I never liked dwarfs though.
 

Songblade

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Jan 28, 2011
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I played an Elf in D&D... who pretty much didn't give a f#@* about any other race but Elves due to personal reasons... so yeah, elitist sort of fits. But, who cares about humans anyway? MEH.
 

gigastrike

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Crazy Zaul said:
Cos the took over Elswyer so so they can't set the next game there.
Otherwise I like elves. I never liked dwarfs though.
The Elder Scrolls Online is supposed to include all land "from Elswyer to Skyrim."
 

Alssadar

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Sep 19, 2010
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At least in WoW, the Blood Elves are depicted as corrupt arcane fiends who use brainwashing against any opposition and fuel their power off of demon magic (At least, before the sun well, but ignore that). It's very anti-elf than usual, but if you go night elves...
Nonetheless, most elves act superior as an 'elder race' and consider humans to be lowlife, and, as a human, I can't take that shit. It's the same reason I despise the Eldar on many levels: they let (any number here) humans die so that one or two of them can live with their pointy ears and silly magics.
I think they're just jealous of the human reproductive capabilities (as they're always in small numbers), that's why they don't wear as much clothes, to attract any willing human for the act.
 

Mad Sun

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Chimichanga said:
For the uncreative, they are practically the same except that they may be a slightly different color (*COUGHCOUGH"darkelves"COUGHCOUGH*).
Why the hate against Dark Elves? What are you, a white supremacist? :p

Dark elves (and regular elves for that matter) were both a part of classic Norse mythology. Dwarves too, though that was obvious.


To everyone else, the reason that writers choose to use these races is that since they are mythological beings, they are public domain. Tolkien couldn't have copyrighted them because he didn't make them up. He drew them and many other themes from mythologies that few had heard of and synergized them for his modern epic.

Y'know, we've seen Northern and Southern European mythos done to death. I have yet to see one drawing from Asian/Russian/Indian myth. Yes, I know we've seen fantasy anime/manga, but really, most of that is Japanized European fantasy, AKA elves and shit. I want to see one that draws from Asian myth that isn't also written by Japan-fetishists who can't get over the novelty of their own work. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzIrSsGUNEs] Indian and Tibetan myth is a goldmine of ideas, why not dig there now that Europe has all but been mined out?

What do you think, captcha?
"get your goat"
Indeed they do captcha, indeed they do...
 

Eddie the head

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Feb 22, 2012
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I think if they are done right they can be fine. It's not common to do them right though. I can only think of a few that where done right. TES did them I don't want to say right but better then most of course most is like Warcraft. I don't mind Night elves in that game so much they are kind of a cliche but not a horrid cliche. Blood elves in that game are just human under a different name. Dragon Age did it right yeah they where a cliche, but a well done cliche witch is much better then trying different and just screwing up.
 

Ragsnstitches

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Dec 2, 2009
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Saladfork said:
I really hate most elves for a few reasons.

1. They are often used to provide the 'natural' archetypes in a given work (I speak for the trees!), and it has been scientifically proven to be impossible to write environmentalists without being preachy, and I HATE being preached to. This is the same reason why I hate druids.

2. In some works, a certain group (which is, in fantasy, usually elves) is used by the author as an 'ideal society' and uses them as a sort of author insert to present their own views, why they're right, and especially why everybody else is wrong (Paolini's elves are the worst offender of this that comes to mind). This type is apparantly impossible to write as anything but close-minded and arrogant.

There are more, but I can't really articulate them at the moment.
DustyDrB said:
I just groan when people go back to the same old same old Dwarves and Elves. Don't people still like to at least try to create new things? Even if the new race is reminiscent in ways to already established ones, we wouldn't be coming in with any baggage associated with them. We'd have that feeling of discovery all over again. I think writers and artists vastly underestimate that feeling.

Something about phrases like "fantasy trope" and "standard fantasy setting" doesn't sit right with me...
I know you probably got quoted on this a gajillion times, but even within those tropes, there is still room for interesting dynamics.

For example, in the latest TES, it comes to light that the High Elves, who are typically full of themselves in the traditional elven sense, turn Elven supremacists... essentially Elven Nazis. It's interesting as this seems to be the logical progression of race that see's all other races as inferior, it's a wonder why every Fantasy trope on elves usually shows them as a race at the end of its time (the Tolkein Elves).

Then we have the battered and broken elves, who are simply desperate to attain some modicum of their former glory. The Witcher series of books and games deal with this, Blood of Elves making a particular note of it and the games making good use of it as part of the political intrigue. The elves are not only on their last legs as a species, but are persecuted and treated as sub-sentient by most human populations (the dominant species). Where Tolkein made them proud and noble, bowing out when their time had come, Sapdowski(?) depicts them as a feral race, clinging desperately to the world however they can even if that means atrocities and straight up murder.

The Dragon Age series also uses Sapdowskis(?) elves, along with a vague nod to Tolkiens elves (the Daelish).

It's harder to pick out an original take for dwarves. The TES series comes to mind again, what with their version being a race of highly advanced, scientifically driven Elves... adding a steampunk vibe to a fantasy setting. Their lore is a bit weak though, seeing as it just amounts to "They were awesome, but sadly TOO awesome to exist, so they disappeared".

People like the Drunken, stout warrior version of Dwarves... they are an underdog race that doesn't turn their nose up on the upstarts (humans) and mingles with them far better then the High and Mighty elves. This makes them easily relatable and therefore easily incorporated into a story.
 

Brad Calkins

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May 21, 2011
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I don't really hate them, they just feel so over-used, so generic. I can forgive a work for using something generic, if it's still a good work, but it seems elves and bad writing go hand-in-hand.
 

DustyDrB

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Ragsnstitches said:
I know they can play around with the tropes, and even subvert our understanding of them. But I'm saying I want something that feels new. I always like to point out Mass Effect in this regard. All the races were new and unfamiliar. I had no baggage, no baseline understanding. Every conversation with a member of a different race brought this sense of discovery that I haven't experienced in fantasy in...I can't even remember. It was wonderful.