I'm sorry, but how can you be sure?Agent Larkin said:
I mean, the last guy to tell me that in real life was an unemployed drug addict. So excuse me if I take that statement with a grain of salt.
Poll: Your view on parents spanking their children?
- Thread starter Hunter65416
- Start date
I mean, the last guy to tell me that in real life was an unemployed drug addict. So excuse me if I take that statement with a grain of salt.
I'm a well rounded individual who has a much better grasp on right and wrong and his inhibitions then most of my pears.Darkmantle said:
I chalk that up as a win.
poll results bear out the basic facts.
judicious use of spanking is an effective tool in a disciplinary arsenal.
hauling off and hitting your kid at the drop of a hat, or jus beating the hell out of them, will almost definately turn them into a sociopath of some degree.
my grandparets and the catholic grade school both had the dreaded wooden paddles. i only got it once at home and that was enough for me the sheer mention of getting the paddle would settle me down right quick.
i dare say the worst punishment i ever got was in nursery school, where me and my little gang of kids were pulled out of class, put in a seperate room and made to sit there quietly, when i as a 2 year old child, being the smart arse i was continued to talk or w/e the teacher taped my mouth, when the smart smart arse i was took the tape off and continued to disrupt our time out time, she taped my mouth and my hands behind my back and i sat there till school was out i believe.
not that i was wholly undeserving of such a thing, but that being done to a child at school is out of bounds, especially a child of my age at the time.
now days tho the teachers would have sued over such a thing, probably hauled off to jail to boot.
but spanking me at home when i was really out of bounds on something, was wholly warranted imo, especially when i was acting out from my lack of parents and home life, i was a bully in nursery school however, if i have pulled the same stuff with my grandparents i would not have been able to walk for a week. lest that way i had time to sit and wonder why i dd the things i did as a young kid and had a better understanding of bullies than most.
but i strongly disagree with the people say never ever ever spank or your a bad parent, no your a bad parent if you leave you young child home alone, your a bad parent if your work is too important to bother with the kid, your a bad parent if your play is too important to bother with your child, you a bad parent if you haul off and hit them for the smalllest thing, your a bad parent if you haul off and hit the other parent for the stupidest things.
there are a million and one ways to be a bad parent, judicious spanking is not one of them.
judicious use of spanking is an effective tool in a disciplinary arsenal.
hauling off and hitting your kid at the drop of a hat, or jus beating the hell out of them, will almost definately turn them into a sociopath of some degree.
my grandparets and the catholic grade school both had the dreaded wooden paddles. i only got it once at home and that was enough for me the sheer mention of getting the paddle would settle me down right quick.
i dare say the worst punishment i ever got was in nursery school, where me and my little gang of kids were pulled out of class, put in a seperate room and made to sit there quietly, when i as a 2 year old child, being the smart arse i was continued to talk or w/e the teacher taped my mouth, when the smart smart arse i was took the tape off and continued to disrupt our time out time, she taped my mouth and my hands behind my back and i sat there till school was out i believe.
not that i was wholly undeserving of such a thing, but that being done to a child at school is out of bounds, especially a child of my age at the time.
now days tho the teachers would have sued over such a thing, probably hauled off to jail to boot.
but spanking me at home when i was really out of bounds on something, was wholly warranted imo, especially when i was acting out from my lack of parents and home life, i was a bully in nursery school however, if i have pulled the same stuff with my grandparents i would not have been able to walk for a week. lest that way i had time to sit and wonder why i dd the things i did as a young kid and had a better understanding of bullies than most.
but i strongly disagree with the people say never ever ever spank or your a bad parent, no your a bad parent if you leave you young child home alone, your a bad parent if your work is too important to bother with the kid, your a bad parent if your play is too important to bother with your child, you a bad parent if you haul off and hit them for the smalllest thing, your a bad parent if you haul off and hit the other parent for the stupidest things.
there are a million and one ways to be a bad parent, judicious spanking is not one of them.
I'm a foster parent and I'd say 99.9% of the kids we've gotten are the types people would say 'need a spanking' however we don't do that at all. Period. In part because we'd lose our license but there are far more effective ways to manage behaviors. Despite what people think time outs and loss of privileges are something a child of 2 and older can easily comprehend. We've gotten kids who hit, bit, spit, threaten to slit our throats in our sleep (5 year old by the way) and we didn't spank them and by the time they left us were picking up toys without being asked and doing fair in school. The only time I'll raise my voice is either when there is immediate danger (watch out for that car!) or when they hurt an animal (we have cats and horses) even then it's followed by our usually procedures.Hunter65416 said:
It's because we set up a lot of structure, consistency, and way for the child to make amends. People often discount those methods because a swat on the rump gets a kid to stop right now (sometimes) but, with the above method eventually your kid won't do the behavior that makes you want to spank them in the first place.
It's really frustrating when we give a kid back to their regular guardian and all our work falls apart in a few weeks because the kids regular guardian doesn't follow the method we used to get the kids back on track even though my wife and I tell them they can call us on the phone to ask for help or we'll babysit if they need a break. (Foster is about helping families not just kids)
It depends on the child. Some children really just need that physical reminder to understand that their actions have consequences, and other children react negatively to spanking. It's a case by case thing.
Spanking is bullying. It really is.
You can argue that it is necessary for the healthy development of a child (you'd be wrong), you can argue that it does no harm (you'd be wrong), and you can argue that there are no other alternatives (you'd be wrong)... but ultimately the pragmatic arguments are made irrelevant when you consider that spanking is just bullying by another name.
Morally, it's just abhorrent. Don't fucking do it.
You can argue that it is necessary for the healthy development of a child (you'd be wrong), you can argue that it does no harm (you'd be wrong), and you can argue that there are no other alternatives (you'd be wrong)... but ultimately the pragmatic arguments are made irrelevant when you consider that spanking is just bullying by another name.
Morally, it's just abhorrent. Don't fucking do it.
Smacking to hurt is not right. Smacking to shock is ok (not hurting).
There are children out there who do the wrong thing, a sometimes a sharp smash over the head or bum is enough to set them straight show something is wrong and helps reinforce who is in charge. The kid will probally cry as expected but it would not be because they are in pain.
Hitting multiple times to enact a large announce of pain in a way to set a child straight is not right.
Or atleast that is what iI think.
There are children out there who do the wrong thing, a sometimes a sharp smash over the head or bum is enough to set them straight show something is wrong and helps reinforce who is in charge. The kid will probally cry as expected but it would not be because they are in pain.
Hitting multiple times to enact a large announce of pain in a way to set a child straight is not right.
Or atleast that is what iI think.
Spanking is certainly okay if used in moderation.
Beating (as in everything worse than a quick slap with the palm of your hand) on the other hand is a definite no and should be (and is, thankfully) illegal.
Beating (as in everything worse than a quick slap with the palm of your hand) on the other hand is a definite no and should be (and is, thankfully) illegal.
Violence is the resort of the unimaginative - and the lazy. There are other means to condition children, which are also doubly effective, and failure to research those means, or failure to recall/invent them, is not a justification for physical abuse. It's disgusting to act your impotence as aggression - moreover, it's meaningless and pre-rational: how do you expect a child to rationalize your worthiness when they age and finally need to, if that's the way you raised them?
Spare the rod, spoil the child...
Don't get me wrong, I'm not a supporter of wanton canings and beatings, I'm just a firm believer in the benefits of the occasional spank. It's just basic operant conditioning... pairing the punishable action with a relatively immediate, memorably painful stimuli will stop a negative behaviour pretty quickly... and kids will generalise the potential for pain to all negative behaviours, and so are more likely to act positively. The advantage of spanking over "sitting in the naughty corner" or whatever people are doing these days is that spanking is more than a mild annoyance - it's pain, which is memorable, and much worse than a 5 minute timeout. Children are more motivated to avoid pain than they are to avoid 5 minutes of silence...
As a child, I was spanked twice, for quite serious infractions. That was it. I learned pretty quickly that whatever I did wrong was bad (this was before I could fully comprehend morality/social acceptance, precisely when spanking is useful). Sure, I eventually realised that morality is stupid and I can lie my way into social acceptance, but for my childhood years those two spankings made me behave perfectly. There was no resulting trauma or psychological damage, no lasting ill will against my parents. The same can be said of my brother (spanked twice) and my sister (three times).
Whereas these days, spanking a child is an egregious error that leads to a child services intervention and a generation of self-entitled twats who were spoiled as children. Because they were spared the rod...
The problem is that it does have a potential to get out of hand/abusive parents may use conditioning as a reason for taking their anger out on their children, etc, and obviously there should be interventions in those cases/should be pretty obvious beforehand, but on a whole I have a positive view of spanking as a form of discipline
Don't get me wrong, I'm not a supporter of wanton canings and beatings, I'm just a firm believer in the benefits of the occasional spank. It's just basic operant conditioning... pairing the punishable action with a relatively immediate, memorably painful stimuli will stop a negative behaviour pretty quickly... and kids will generalise the potential for pain to all negative behaviours, and so are more likely to act positively. The advantage of spanking over "sitting in the naughty corner" or whatever people are doing these days is that spanking is more than a mild annoyance - it's pain, which is memorable, and much worse than a 5 minute timeout. Children are more motivated to avoid pain than they are to avoid 5 minutes of silence...
As a child, I was spanked twice, for quite serious infractions. That was it. I learned pretty quickly that whatever I did wrong was bad (this was before I could fully comprehend morality/social acceptance, precisely when spanking is useful). Sure, I eventually realised that morality is stupid and I can lie my way into social acceptance, but for my childhood years those two spankings made me behave perfectly. There was no resulting trauma or psychological damage, no lasting ill will against my parents. The same can be said of my brother (spanked twice) and my sister (three times).
Whereas these days, spanking a child is an egregious error that leads to a child services intervention and a generation of self-entitled twats who were spoiled as children. Because they were spared the rod...
The problem is that it does have a potential to get out of hand/abusive parents may use conditioning as a reason for taking their anger out on their children, etc, and obviously there should be interventions in those cases/should be pretty obvious beforehand, but on a whole I have a positive view of spanking as a form of discipline
It's a Punishment, it's existence is meant to deter further behavior. Negative Reinforcement, such as just saying "Stop that or I'll ____!" will not work. Children are not, usually, rational. I was an extremely independent and cautious child, and whenever I messed up terribly I got spanked for it. Throw a tantrum in a public place? Smack. Hit my brother? Smack. It's a tool used to inform children that negative actions have consequences. Once a child hits the age of 6 or 7, sympathetic feelings arise more significantly that allow most kids to fully identify what is or isn't bad by their own merit. At this point the child bears significant intelligence to learn from what is around him/her.
Regardless of your view of violence and fear being used as a tool to shape a child, you cannot deny the effectiveness of corporal punishment towards children in the form proposed by the OP.
Prove it. Fear of consequences is what spurs important decisions. "I don't really want to cross the road without looking, what if a car hits me?" That's a decision spurned by fear, in a positive manner. I'm not condoning child abuse, but corporal punishment towards children has spurned generations of responsible, intelligent adults. If I punch a kid in the face, and get smacked for it, I deserve it. I learn I can't hit someone without proper consequences, and the parent can actually expand on that to teach the child a significant lesson about the way the world sees violence.Boudica said:
Regardless of your view of violence and fear being used as a tool to shape a child, you cannot deny the effectiveness of corporal punishment towards children in the form proposed by the OP.
Prove it.DjinnFor said:
It's Punishment. Provided, of course, the parent doesn't execute it every single day of the child's life. That crosses the line into abuse.
The child is learning a lesson. Life has consequences, the actions one takes have consequences. Society only tolerates so much before it cracks down on negative behavior. If I punch someone as a child, and I get a slap for it, good. I learned that I can't hit someone, or it'll come to bite me too. This is a lesson the child carries to adulthood. I can't hit whoever I want, or I'll likely get arrested.
Prove to me this isn't the case. I'm not denying alternative methods exist, but I refuse the notion that all corporal punishment is abuse regardless of how it is executed.
I got spanked. I was a bad kid. I was a terror to my mother and father and when I got really bad, I got popped on the butt. It settled me down right quick. Also the people that disagree with spanking probably don't have kids...or their kids are demon spawn.
Parents spanked me for just about anything they said I did wrong.
I built up a pain tolerance higher than they could dish out and that was about it.
Matters less on the punishment you actually use and more on how the child understands why they're being punished. I learnt why I was being punished and it didn't "set me straight". I was a questioning annoyance to just about everyone who ordered me around and i'm just the same now. All it did was build up a resentment towards my parents that I eventually got therapy for. So i'm not voting in the poll because no answer I agree with is there.
Spanking kids, disciplining them with physical force.... Eh, nobody knows the consequences. You can make children tough, strong, independent good people with the right application, or you can create children with massive intimacy and trust issues which follow them their entire lives. You don't know until it happens.
Children are irritating little bastards, but I have no idea how to get the little bastards to stop without using fear. Normally the fact that I look like Rasputin tends to work better than anything else.
Edit: Oh, and the most notable side effect of the spanking was that if violence or aggression is aimed at me, I tend to fly into something of an unstoppable rage. This wasn't a problem when I was a rake with hair, but now i've got builk and fighting ability i'm genuinely scared of opening someone's throat with my teeth because they've pissed me off. In short, no control over the angry side of me.
I built up a pain tolerance higher than they could dish out and that was about it.
Matters less on the punishment you actually use and more on how the child understands why they're being punished. I learnt why I was being punished and it didn't "set me straight". I was a questioning annoyance to just about everyone who ordered me around and i'm just the same now. All it did was build up a resentment towards my parents that I eventually got therapy for. So i'm not voting in the poll because no answer I agree with is there.
Spanking kids, disciplining them with physical force.... Eh, nobody knows the consequences. You can make children tough, strong, independent good people with the right application, or you can create children with massive intimacy and trust issues which follow them their entire lives. You don't know until it happens.
Children are irritating little bastards, but I have no idea how to get the little bastards to stop without using fear. Normally the fact that I look like Rasputin tends to work better than anything else.
Edit: Oh, and the most notable side effect of the spanking was that if violence or aggression is aimed at me, I tend to fly into something of an unstoppable rage. This wasn't a problem when I was a rake with hair, but now i've got builk and fighting ability i'm genuinely scared of opening someone's throat with my teeth because they've pissed me off. In short, no control over the angry side of me.
It's been a while since I was studying this particular issue, but as I recall most of the scientific studies that I came across suggested that spanking is not only less effective as a disciplinary method, but can be linked to negative effects later in life. As for my personal opinion...I don't have children of my own, so I can't give a parent's opinion on the matter, but I can say that I remember being physically punished as a child on several occasions. In none of these occasions can I remember the reason I was being punished, just my own fear at my parents' anger. However, I'm sure that I must have deserved punishment at the time, and I don't consider my parents to have been abusive (in fact I think they were good parents and only wanted the best for me)... But as far as I can tell, spanking didn't really teach me anything except to fear anger from others.
Where are people getting this notion that spanking turns kids into brutes that hit everything in sight to get their way? I was spanked plenty as a child and for good reason, I hit kids, screamed at teachers, and stole shit. I know damn well that when I was a child I would not understand an adult trying to reason with me and tell me why the things I was doing were wrong, I just knew that i'd get another spanking if did and I stopped.
Later in life I learned why doing all the things I did were unacceptable, but at such a young age? No way in hell. Besides it's a last resort thing not "HE WONT EAT HIS BROCOLLI BEAT HIS ASS!!" And I know people that were punched around and had bruises all over their body, THAT is physical abuse.
Later in life I learned why doing all the things I did were unacceptable, but at such a young age? No way in hell. Besides it's a last resort thing not "HE WONT EAT HIS BROCOLLI BEAT HIS ASS!!" And I know people that were punched around and had bruises all over their body, THAT is physical abuse.
I've seen plenty of newage parents trying to "reason" with their children as if they were adults but they're not. They're just fucking not. To think that spanking or any form of physical discipline stunts their child's intelligence is ludicrous.
Look, I think it's an acceptable punishment but whenever I have a child i'll try other methods of discipline as I know I fucking hated it being spanked. If you hate your parents because they gave you some SPANKINGS every now and then you need to seek help cause it must be something else causing your hatred. Now if you were beat, then i'd understand.
Look, I think it's an acceptable punishment but whenever I have a child i'll try other methods of discipline as I know I fucking hated it being spanked. If you hate your parents because they gave you some SPANKINGS every now and then you need to seek help cause it must be something else causing your hatred. Now if you were beat, then i'd understand.
How many people misbehaved in the 1930s when parents were allowed to beat the living crap out of their children? How many school shootings?Darkmantle said:
Most people that advocate the non-spanking of children either have children that were little hellions when they were small and medicated when older (for ADD they wouldn't have if they got smacked occasionally, trust me, fear is great to help children focus on their studies) or don't have children themselves.