Prison Gladiatorial Death Matches

[Tiger Sora]

The day society lets this happen...... I either rise up and lead a revolution against the barbarous nation I reside in.
Or were living in a Mad Max society (Post apocalyptic). And I'm currently engaged in eating soup out of some computer nerds skull.

 

[jimbob123432]

and Nathan Dunlap (murdered 4 people during a robbery).

Er... I'm fine with your other examples, but how is that not fucked up?

As far as I'm aware, Nathan Dunlap just shot 4 people just a robbery. Yeah, it's tragic and malicious, but it's not what I would consider "f***ed up".

 

[Wintermoot]

how about Battle Royalle style it reduces the chance of prisoners using said weapons on the guards.

 

[jimbob123432]

It may not necessarily be entirely cruel, but it most certainly qualifies as unusual punishment.

But wouldn't it eventually become "usual" if it had been around for a while? I mean, solitary confinement was probably called "unusual" when it was first implemented, but now it's the norm for unruly/dangerous prisoners.

The death penalty is a stupid idea on its own, and this is just a fucking stupider way to implement it.

You say "voluntary" but then you put it in a life or death situation. This doesn't make it an option. Almost anyone would try to avoid death. Forcing them to do this is just inhumane. Its horrid.

When did we, as a culture, start awarding people for murder?* We've punished someone for committing a horrible act, how do we then award them for committing more and more horrible acts? That's just stupid.

Some people need to stop taking Spartacus so seriously. Imagine if that guy "fighting for glory" was the same guy who raped and murdered your 5 year old sister? I feel like your romanticizing something that is quite awful here. But the OP has claimed to not be romanticizing it, which just makes me feel like he a closet sociopath who thinks allowing people to kill eachother for their lives is a good idea.... Jigsaw, is that you?

[sub][sub][sub]*miliatary stuff aside that is, I have a whole other bone to pick with the army that I wont go into here*[/sub][/sub][/sub]

Hey, I'm from Canada, so I share the same opinion on the death penalty as you. I just thought I'd post this here as a thought-provoking topic. And, to be fair, a lot of Western culture does award people for murder. "Gangsta" culture and the romanticism surrounding the mafia are two fine, sparkling examples of that.

I propose thusly. Create an ENTIRELY optional fighting league that works until first submission and allow for modern armor and weapons no longer than you are tall. Disarming, pinning or catching an enemy off guard grants victory. Perhaps a points system for hits to the chest and head? Only way i can see this going through.

That's a great idea! Let's train the serial killers and rapists how to fight better!

That could have no negative repercussions at all.

Ummm.... They'd never get out, so I fail to see how this is an issue.

I'll be honest, if two death row inmates want to kill each other, that's fine with me. I'm not gonna lose any sleep over it when one of them dies. BUT, they shouldn't be rewarded, either. Like, if you want to go out by getting shived multiple times by another murder/child rapist, as opposed to frying in a chair, be my guest. Charging money to watch that, though, I think that's pushing the boundaries of what's ethical.

Also: people seem to be missing one crucial element of this hypothetical: THE INMATES WOULD BE ON DEATH ROW. These are not people who would be getting out. They would die in this gladiatorial match, or by getting fried/gassed. They would not leave the prison alive.

I'm not gonna get into a debate on the death penalty, but as long as it exists, this isn't really much of a stretch. People already watch these guys get electrocuted. You're telling me that's somehow better than watching them chop each other's limbs off? It might be a little more gruesome, but you're still watching somebody get killed.

Thank you! I've been waiting for someone to realize that these people are on death row and people can already go and view their deaths .

and then there is the whole problem of successful prisoners becoming social idols. one thing is kids trying to imitate paris hilton or some doped up athlete, but imagine hordes of youngsters admiring and cheering for convicted serial killers and rapists. its appalling.

i can already see the masses cheering the rapist as a hero because of his combat prowess against the serial killer.

Gangsta culture. They already award people who kill and rape, and some children raised around that culture are already being taught to like it. And that's why it would be Pay-Per-View. If kids saw it, it would be the parents'/guardians' fault because they would have to pay for it and allow the kids to see it. Sure, the internet exists, but parents' can install monitoring and blocking software and watch their kids while they're on the computer.

 

[Reaper195]

Because prisoners on death sentance already have their lives long and drawn out enough as it is, and this will probably cost more. Personally, I'm surprised that countries with the death penalty don't just take the person out back, slot them, and be over and done with it. You can try and argue that the injection or whatever is commonly used these days is more humane....but it's not like they deserve the utmost treatment. And I'm certain quite a lot on death row would rather be taken out back and take a shot in the back of the head than spend years in jail waiting for their turn.

Granted, I live in New Zealand (Which has no death penalty), and I've never been bothered to look it up....but why are people on death row spending so many years waiting? That seems even crueller.

 

[Jadak]

and Nathan Dunlap (murdered 4 people during a robbery).

Er... I'm fine with your other examples, but how is that not fucked up?

As far as I'm aware, Nathan Dunlap just shot 4 people just a robbery. Yeah, it's tragic and malicious, but it's not what I would consider "f***ed up".

Certainly less fucked up than if he'd also made a snack of their corpses or something like that, but whatever... Guess we just draw the line on what constitutes fucked up at different points.

I mean, I'd see your point if it was something along the lines of home invasion gone wrong, where the robber encountered resistance and shit happened, but for a guy that robbed a restaurant and shot some teenagers and some woman for no particular reason in the process? Removing witnesses maybe? Yeah, pretty fucked up.

 

[tombman888]

Good to see i'm not the only one who instantly thought of Death Race.

 

[Dark Knifer]

To put it bluntly, this is a stupid idea. Firstly, why would we condemn people for committing murder and then forcing them to kill each other while the are prisoners? Second, having this for our amusement would twist society and I can guarantee rates of violent crimes would skyrocket if such a thing was allowed.

This idea that "Oh they have nothing better to do, let's make them dance for our entertainment" is horribly cruel. Not meaning to sound offensive, I don't think your friend a sick person or anything like that, just wrong about this one particular thing. Also the comparison to pornography doesn't hold true as sex is not inherently a crime in every culture. Murder usually is though.

 

[thePyro_13]

Because their are massive ethical problems with doing that. Any country which supports that would have to be so socially messed up, that most people would need to be on death row anyway.

Besides, you shouldn't have the death penalty anyway, if it's wrong for them to kill, then it's wrong for you to kill them as well, even more besides, its costs more to kill them than it does to just lock them up and forget about them. Don't pay them any more attention and money than you need too, after all, you can spend that money and time on the 99% of society that are worth keeping around.

I think it'd be better if we has some kind of prison petting zoo, where people who are in prison for life are in an amusement park on display, and people can come and taunt or throw water balloons at them. Or challenge them to video games that we know they're bad at, that'd be fun.

 

[JoesshittyOs]

Really, my concern is that you're allowing prisoners who kill people to... kill more people. Not sure how that's a punishment.

 

[rokema]

Really, my concern is that you're allowing prisoners who kill people to... kill more people. Not sure how that's a punishment.

They'd be usefull to society by providing the populus entertainment instead of just sucking up money, if you look at it objectively, every 100 years or so some things become taboo while others become normal, wouldn't be suprised if some country would have a shot at this.

Hell, I would watch it. I seriously don't give a shit what happens to some prisoner if they want it themselves.

And besides, we still laugh at death and carnage but it's more softcore right now,I have never heard anyone say they play CoD for the story.

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

I propose thusly. Create an ENTIRELY optional fighting league that works until first submission and allow for modern armor and weapons no longer than you are tall. Disarming, pinning or catching an enemy off guard grants victory. Perhaps a points system for hits to the chest and head? Only way i can see this going through.

That's a great idea! Let's train the serial killers and rapists how to fight better!

That could have no negative repercussions at all.

People keep infering that im talking about prisons? As if criminals will be able to afford the gear i just described. I meant general population. This could be a real sport? Christ people where in my post does it say prisoners only? "ENTIRELY" optional. Ill edit it in since its a common mistake.

 

[JoesshittyOs]

Really, my concern is that you're allowing prisoners who kill people to... kill more people. Not sure how that's a punishment.

They'd be usefull to society by providing the populus entertainment instead of just sucking up money, if you look at it objectively, every 100 years or so some things become taboo while others become normal, wouldn't be suprised if some country would have a shot at this.

I understand that it sounds like a great money maker idea, but it's still just doesn't make sense. You're allowing a killer to kill more people. We shouldn't be desensitizing ourselves oven more to that as we already are.

Hell, I would watch it. I seriously don't give a shit what happens to some prisoner if they want it themselves.

And besides, we still laugh at death and carnage but it's more softcore right now,I have never heard anyone say they play CoD for the story.

Hey, I liked CoD's story. It's like a Micheal Bay movie, except you get to play it. Which is a good thing.

Also, have you seen Death Race? Terrible movie, but still kinda shows what that would be like.

 

[Sampler]

Snuff films are illegal, this would constitute as such, therefore you're asking the legal system to do something illegal?

The reasons they're illegal not-with-standing.

 

[RatRace123]

It would be worth it if there was a huge elaborate obstacle course and a funny announcer.

And my ethical, morality based side is telling me that it's a bad, fairly inhuman idea.

Side note, anyone else think FOX would be the channel that picks it up? Y'know to fill the timeslot before American Idol.

 

[CaptainKarma]

I always thought the reason we had prisons was that we weren't monsters.

Hahaha. I take it you aren't American? There's no contradiction there.

 

[Superbeast]

Given the very wide and numerous reasons that Roman society went off the gladiatorial games (and the fact that there is compelling evidence that the desensitisation to violence and bloodshed brought about but such spectacles were a large aspect in the acceptance of social disorder throughout both Republic and Empire)...fuck no, this is not a good idea.

Aside from history telling us it may not be a smart move, there are also other aspects to consider. You say that this is to bring in money for the prison system, and would be on a pay-per-view basis. That it is only for death-row inmates. If we go with that being acceptable for a minute (which I am obviously of a contrary viewpoint); what happens if the ratings are great and the show is pulling in a lot of money, but there aren't enough death-row inmates to meet demand? As an extension to this, if this is a source of funding for the prison system I can see the government making cuts to prison funding (as the short-fall is made up by the viewings - which makes it counter-productive anyway), which would then make this type of thing essential to keep prisons running - so are you going to either attempt to have more people convicted of death penalty-worthy crimes (or even extend what classifies as such), or open it up to long-term (but non-death row) inmates?

To be honest, I think this suggestion, and the implications thereof, says far more about your friend than anything else (and shows a staggering amount of ignorance with regards to history). If you are able to dehumanise prisoners to that extent then I feel that you might need to be seeking therapy, else this psychopathy extends to other members of the human population.

 

[AngloDoom]

My friend brought this up today: why don't countries with the death penalty offer inmates the opportunity to fight in gladiatorial-style death matches? Each time you fight, if you win, you get to live for a bit longer, maybe with some perks a la Deadman Wonderland. I asked him about the ethical issues with it, but he reminded me that participation was voluntary . He also added that prisons might be able to make some extra money by offering Pay-Per-View versions of the matches on TV or the internet.

Now, I'm not sure if I agree with him, but I do see where he's coming from. The prisoners in question are going to die either way, so why not give them the option to die in battle? What does everyone else think of this?

EDIT: I posted this just as a general question of opinion. This was not dreamt up by me, but rather posed to me by one of my friends and I wanted to know what people outside of my little circle thought.

EDIT 2: I discussed some of the responses here with my friend who originally posed this question, and he had this to say:
"For all the "ethical" problems people keep bringing up, they are fair. However, most things are only "ethical problems" until society accepts it as normal. Pornography was seen as unethical until the vast majority of Western society agreed that it was no longer a problem. If this is implemented, then after a few years of it being the norm, the people that will point out the ethical problems with it will be in the minority. This is just the natural next step after MMA fighting."

Personally, I'd think it'd be better suited for prisoners on Death Row used for something like medical testing, rather than gladiator battles.

I mean, even if they are willing or whatever, it's pretty barbaric to have two people fight to the death for the sake of amusement. It's pretty bad to subject another human to medical testing too, but gladiator battles is weird because of the idea of families gathered around their TV watching two individuals bludgeon each other to death with pipes.

 

[Combustion Kevin]

I do love me some armed combat, but only as long as we don't have to kill anybody for it.

confusing? maybe, but it's great excercise and the sheer depth of armed martial arts would make for some excellent matches.
maybe we need to look into reenactment or LARP (without the magic bollocks).

 

[Doom-Slayer]

-snip

Ignoring the ethical issues, I see a fairly big problem...why would prisoners -want- to fight to the death? You need to give them a motive or incentive, ie some actualy reason to fight. The thrill of the fight is all well and good, but then if they DO survive they have to go through pain and agony from possible wounds they may of taken. That doesnt seem good enough. The main problem I see is when you start introducing rewards for winning, where the prison is essentially rewarding murderers and theives for doing MORE killing. Thats going to have a huge societal effect.

Then what...underground fighting etc..oh suddenly randoms are commiting crimes to get into jail so -they- can get some of these rewards. Even ignoring the ethical issue of having people fight to the death youve got a few problems with the concept itself.