Prostitution - Illelgal, why?

Reaper195

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Aside from a few countries in the East, and maybe Europe, the US is the only country I know of that has completely outlawed prostitution (With the exception of Neveda, or some place in Nevada). It's got something to do with mixing Politics and religion together. I don't really know...or care. The day I pay for sex will be the day Bungie release Halo 4, in which Master Chief crosses over to the Buffy Universe and starts shooting vampires with guns that fire Penn & Teller: Bullshit and grenades that explode by sending deadly rays of sunshine and rainbows in all directions.

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xmetatr0nx said:
Not sure, its legal in New Zealand for some reason. Its just one of those things that the government decided on a long time ago and hasnt bothered to revise it. Maybe for public decency? Or something like that.
Yay! Another Kiwi!
 

Barbarian Bystander

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Sep 14, 2009
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Um, sorry in advance if this is too long...

I believe making prostitution legal would add a financial element to what people generally believe should not be a financially motivated decision, i.e. it affects the validity of consent. I believe that under certain circumstances, monetary compensation could very well be considered coercion. The law probably prohibits the sale of one's body for much the same reasons it would prohibit the sale of one's body parts - it creates a socio-moral dilemma where the poor have a financial incentive to what may be a disenfranchising enterprise, and the wealthy benefit, widening or perpetuating the gap between rich and poor and their relative standards of living.

Example: As it stands, if a Wealthy Person A needs a kidney, he has to go on the waiting list just like everyone else - egalitarian system (which isn't to say that the system is without flaws and loopholes open for exploitation, but the system certainly aims for equal opportunity to vital resources). Now, if it were legal for people to sell their organs, Wealthy Person A could just find any John Doe in dire enough straits and pay for a new kidney, no waiting necessary. Now, call me crazy, but something about that picture seems a little off. Depending on how much a kidney goes for in a society where organ selling is legal, John Doe is either up a little money or a lot of money, but he is definitely out of a kidney and his life expectancy just took a dip. Now, one might argue that John Doe's dire straits may lead him to selling his kidney on the black market anyway, where none of this is regulated, etc. However, I believe that the purpose of government is to improve people's quality of life/standard of living, otherwise we wouldn't have it, and selling his organs doesn't really improve John Doe's quality of life - it improves Wealthy Person A's. I'm not saying selling one's body and selling one's body parts are equivalent enterprises, but I do believe there are similarities worthy of consideration.

Ideally, jobs that take more training, education, and expertise pay more - a return on an investment. Vice-versa, low-paying jobs typically have minimal entry requirements - you don't need a degree in microbiology to sell shoes. If prostitution, an occupation with few requirements above legal age, the absence of STDs, were legalized and widely accepted, it would be seen as an easy way to come across immediate cash, without the long-term investments of an education. The poor and uneducated, most in need of immediate cash, would have more incentive than those better off financially, to enter a job with minimal requirements, such as prostitution, perpetuating their impoverished and disenfranchised status.

There's another problem in officially recognizing sex as a business - it becomes just that, a business, subject to supply, demand, and competition. If all prostitutes are subject to the same government stipulations, then it really becomes a question of how much "bang" you can get for your buck (cheap pun, I know). And as people have pointed out - you can get it, more or less, for free with enough effort. How does that work out economically, when the competition's rock-bottom prices are actually no prices at all? I'm not saying that there wouldn't still be customers (in which case prostitution wouldn't exist to begin with - sex is free right now), I'm just wondering what the far-reaching effects of thinking of sex like that would mean for the human psyche in the future. The legalization of prostitution would commodify sex and publicly sanction that commodification. Somehow, that just seems wrong to me.

Now, one might argue that sex, dating, marriage, etc. are already commodified, with dates, drinks, and jewelry amounting to bribery. Well, I happen to think that's wrong, too. It seems society still has a long way to go before it's made real progress from the days where marriage was a much more literal market, as Jane Austen (1775-1817) and Anne Sexton (1928-1974) pointed out.

In closing, prostitution may be the world's oldest profession, but maybe that makes it more of a relic than a classic (and oh my goodness, I just approached this topic essay-style, didn't I? Right down to the conclusion. College has dug its claws into me and dug in deep).

Edit: Ah, sorry. Fixed the line breaks. You're right. It looks cleaner.

Also, I'm going to manually quote here for the sake of saving space: "As for your argument I think that really sex has too much attached to it for it to ever become a viable alternative to getting and education. In reality it's likely to be much closer to acting really, you have to be talented at it and there will only ever be minor demand. I doubt the prostitution industry will ever be able to support a large number of prostitutes so it wont ever be seen as logical to throw away your education at the slim chance you might be able to find an opening." - That Guy Ya Know

I think you make an interesting point about the viability of widespread prostitution. But I wonder what demand is right now (I really have no idea) and whether it would go up or down if prostitution were legalized. Pornography seems to be a big industry...
 

That Guy Ya Know

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Sep 9, 2009
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Barbarian Bystander said:
Um, sorry in advance if this is too long...
I believe making prostitution legal would add a financial element to what people generally believe should not be a financially motivated decision, i.e. it affects the validity of consent. I believe that under certain circumstances, monetary compensation could very well be considered coercion. The law probably prohibits the sale of one's body for much the same reasons it would prohibit the sale of one's body parts - it creates a socio-moral dilemma where the poor have a financial incentive to what may be a disenfranchising enterprise, and the wealthy benefit, widening or perpetuating the gap between rich and poor and their relative standards of living.

Example: As it stands, if a Wealthy Person A needs a kidney, he has to go on the waiting list just like everyone else - egalitarian system (which isn't to say that the system is without flaws and loopholes open for exploitation, but the system certainly aims for equal opportunity to vital resources). Now, if it were legal for people to sell their organs, Wealthy Person A could just find any John Doe in dire enough straits and pay for a new kidney, no waiting necessary. Now, call me crazy, but something about that picture seems a little off. Depending on how much a kidney goes for in a society where organ selling is legal, John Doe is either up a little money or a lot of money, but he is definitely out of a kidney and his life expectancy just took a dip. Now, one might argue that John Doe's dire straits may lead him to selling his kidney on the black market anyway, where none of this is regulated, etc. However, I believe that the purpose of government is to improve people's quality of life/standard of living, otherwise we wouldn't have it, and selling his organs doesn't really improve John Doe's quality of life - it improves Wealthy Person A's. I'm not saying selling one's body and selling one's body parts are equivalent enterprises, but I do believe there are similarities worthy of consideration.

Ideally, jobs that take more training, education, and expertise pay more - a return on an investment. Vice-versa, low-paying jobs typically have minimal entry requirements - you don't need a degree in microbiology to sell shoes. If prostitution, an occupation with few requirements above legal age, the absence of STDs, were legalized and widely accepted, it would be seen as an easy way to come across immediate cash, without the long-term investments of an education. The poor and uneducated, most in need of immediate cash, would have more incentive than those better off financially, to enter a job with minimal requirements, such as prostitution, perpetuating their impoverished and disenfranchised status.

There's another problem in officially recognizing sex as a business - it becomes just that, a business, subject to supply, demand, and competition. If all prostitutes are subject to the same government stipulations, then it really becomes a question of how much "bang" you can get for your buck (cheap pun, I know). And as people have pointed out - you can get it, more or less, for free with enough effort. How does that work out economically, when the competition's rock-bottom prices are actually no prices at all? I'm not saying that there wouldn't still be customers (in which case prostitution wouldn't exist to begin with - sex is free right now), I'm just wondering what the far-reaching effects of thinking of sex like that would mean for the human psyche in the future. The legalization of prostitution would commodify sex and publicly sanction that commodification. Somehow, that just seems wrong to me.

Now, one might argue that sex, dating, marriage, etc. are already commodified, with dates, drinks, and jewelry amounting to bribery. Well, I happen to think that's wrong, too. It seems society still has a long way to go before it's made real progress from the days where marriage was a much more literal market, as Jane Austen (1775-1817) and Anne Sexton (1928-1974) pointed out.

In closing, prostitution may be the world's oldest profession, but maybe that makes it more of a relic than a classic (and oh my goodness, I just approached this topic essay-style, didn't I? Right down to the conclusion. College has dug its claws into me and dug in deep).
I hate to seem picky but line breaks inbetween paragraphs can make what seems like a large wall of text into much more manageable chunks.

As for your argument I think that really sex has too much attached to it for it to ever become a viable alternative to getting and education. In reality it's likely to be much closer to acting really, you have to be talented at it and there will only ever be minor demand. I doubt the prostitution industry will ever be able to support a large number of prostitutes so it wont ever be seen as logical to throw away your education at the slim chance you might be able to find an opening.
 

FROGGEman2

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Mar 14, 2009
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In Australia, it is legal.

...I think...

Mainly because, although many countries deny it, they are Christian and don't want to go against the ties of Christian marriage.
 

bug_chaser

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Mar 15, 2009
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/way late to the thread

I just got back from spending a week in Amsterdam and, I gotta tellya, the prostitutes there seem a lot more comfortable and safer than the ones in America.

Caveat: I've never bought (rented?) a prostitute in either location so I can't say for absolute sure. But I've driven by enough of them hanging out on cold corners at night, scared of their pimps and the law, to think the ones who work where it's legal are safer and happier.

As for prostitution being degrading: to quote Penn and Teller, "BULLSH!T." Lots of people have jobs that have unpleasant aspects, and most of them don't pay as well. I couldn't personally handle having sex for money, which is why I picked a different line of work. Trafficking is wrong in any industry but this tends to support the argument for legalization: migrant workers are trafficked and exploited pretty terribly too, by way of example.
 

Julianking93

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Epifols said:
Julianking93 said:
Society does not say sex is good. The US society highly supports christian views and morals and sex falls into that catigory.
Julianking93 said:
well, sir, it is my humble opinion that you have things backwards in the US. Things have changed from the last 10 or 20 years but in truth, Christian values dominate America. This is why I was taught that my penis is dirty and will taint anything it touches except underwear.
The US goes through the motions of being a Christian country, sure. But about 9 out of 10 "Christians" I see live completely without God. And since the term society refers to everything around us, not just the theoretical aspect of the predominant believes, the application of them has to be taken into account. And the fact is that the vast majority of people starting from the teens are either having sex or are trying to. It's pretty much a "fuck whoever you want, get married 5 times in your lifetime" fest
I never said that second thing you. That's someone else.

As for your post, yes people do that, but its looked down upon. Haven't you noticed how much people freak out when they see a pregnant teenager or a teenage couple with a baby? It still happens, but its looked down upon by society.

And, no its not a "fuck whoever you want, get married 5 times in your lifetime fest"
 

Aerodyamic

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MaxTheReaper said:
Probably because quite a few whores are forced into it or are drug addicts and doing it to support a coke habit.

Which is to say, if you want to decrease the property values where you live, make prostitution legal there.
Making LOW CLASS prostitution legal would drop property rates; the high-priced call-girls downtown don't seem to have that sort of negative effect, although THEY hang out in front of government buildings.

They made it illegal because a giant Sky Fairy and his Jewish Zombie Son said that you're only supposed to boink if you want to make babies. True story.
 

brainfreeze215

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It does make sense in a modern context that a legal and regulated prostitution business would probably work as long as measures were taken to avoid the spread of disease (requiring regular tests from prostitutes, tests from customers, and requiring the use of protection), but laws against prostitution have been around for a long time, long enough that it has this taboo about it.
 

Spacelord

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I am reminded of the wise rhetoric of the late George Carlin:
"Selling is legal. Fucking is legal. Why isn't selling fucking legal?"
 

Zersy

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JanatUrlich said:
I think brothels should be legal. Selling yourself on the streets can be very very dangerous, but if it's in a safe environment, I see no problem with it
Agree with the brothel idea ! and prostitution is illegal because ............ the goverment is run by over opiniated idoiots ?

naaaaa.
 

Housebroken Lunatic

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Ultratwinkie said:
1. no. just guessed the lawmakers' motives on that one. they are not really the "think this out" type. they rather think it halfway and make sure its budget friendly. its REALLY hard to think out a lawmaker's logic as they only really see the big issues and not the tiny side effect that can fuck shit up.

2. true, shit changes, then again, i wasn't implying it couldn't. it would take a lot of prodding before it could change.
1. Of course, which is why the people should show that it isn't pleased with the lawmakers half-assed logic when passing laws. Public outcry and speaking out against laws which are obviously illogical, hypocritical and just plain stupid is the way to go.

There's no reason to just accept laws which doesn't make any sense. If everybody did that, then you wouldn't have modern democracy, because the french peasants wouldn't have taken part in the french revolution, they would have just stayed in line and kept on being abused by the aristocracy and their un-democratic laws.

So if you like democracy and equal rights, don't accept laws which clearly violates them.

2. Then prod away! Not by actively engaging yourself in the matter (if you don't feel like it that is), but by simply refuse to swallow the bullshit laws passed by half-assed moron politicians. If you don't want to risk going to jail then do not break these laws unecessarily, but don't just agree with them simply because they are laws at the moment. Laws change, as do the culture. The least you can do is trying to think of ways and share those ways with others as to make them better (or at the very least, logical and reasonable and non-hypocritical).
 

Housebroken Lunatic

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Labyrinth said:
As it stands most prostitutes (80% or more, if memory serves) want out. They're abused by johns and pimps, addicted to drugs to escape their situation and despised by a society who are the only help they could ever get. It doesn't help that the average age of entry is something like 14.
Exactly, because society has made it illegal. It could be different, but apparently society likes seeing sex workers (volontary or the drug fiends just feeding their addiction) be abused by johns and pimps and be without any rights what so ever.

Simply becaue it "looks bad" and it is something to be "ashamed" of. Society prefers to bury it's head in the sand an pretend that girls aren't being abused in the most horrible way imaginable.

The way I see it, anyone IN FAVOR of keeping all forms of prostitution illegal, LIKES/WANTS some women to be raped, beat up and killed. It is you who want to keep civil rights away from sex workers. You are evil. You are what's wrong with society. SHAME ON YOU! : )
 

Labyrinth

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Oct 14, 2007
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Housebroken Lunatic said:
Exactly, because society has made it illegal. It could be different, but apparently society likes seeing sex workers (volontary or the drug fiends just feeding their addiction) be abused by johns and pimps and be without any rights what so ever.

Simply becaue it "looks bad" and it is something to be "ashamed" of. Society prefers to bury it's head in the sand an pretend that girls aren't being abused in the most horrible way imaginable.

The way I see it, anyone IN FAVOR of keeping all forms of prostitution illegal, LIKES/WANTS some women to be raped, beat up and killed. It is you who want to keep civil rights away from sex workers. You are evil. You are what's wrong with society. SHAME ON YOU! : )
What it comes down to is the underlying belief that a whore warrants her situation.
 

Pyro Paul

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US Stance-
Prostitution is indicitive of Slavery, where the goods of one individual (pimp) is acctually other individuals, rather than any particular service they provide. because of this it is firmly stated as Illegal in the united states.