PSA: Ubisoft is Revoking Far Cry 4 CD-Keys From 3rd Party Re-sellers - Update 2

[jayzz911]

TLDR: wasnt credit card fraud, they just want more of your money.

Mmm...except that it was.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx

Just sayin'.

hmm didn't know Nvidia did credit card fraud. Since i've seen a lot of people complaining about the coupon that came with their graphics card being revoked, must mean that they commited credit card fraud. Or maybe Ubi likes bullshitting people.

 

[Vigormortis]

hmm didn't know Nvidia did credit card fraud. Since i've seen a lot of people complaining about the coupon that came with their graphics card being revoked, must mean that they commited credit card fraud. Or maybe Ubi likes bullshitting people.

Or maybe we can leave the conspiracy theory nonsense behind and look at this objectively.

What's more likely?

Ubisoft AND EA are conspiring together to get Ubisoft to somehow make more money on Farcry 4? (even though the game and all other Ubisoft titles have been pulled from Origin as a result of the credit card fraud, and Ubisoft is likely more than well aware that they will lose money over this either way.)

- or -

There was either a mistake in the keys being revoked or a lot of people are lying about the method with which they received their copy of the game so as to cover up their less than scrupulous buying practices?

The former is James Bond level of ludicrous. The latter is more inline with something one might see in reality.

 

[direkiller]

hmm didn't know Nvidia did credit card fraud. Since i've seen a lot of people complaining about the coupon that came with their graphics card being revoked, must mean that they commited credit card fraud. Or maybe Ubi likes bullshitting people.

Or maybe we can leave the conspiracy theory nonsense behind and look at this objectively.

What's more likely?

Ubisoft AND EA are conspiring together to get Ubisoft to somehow make more money on Farcry 4? (even though the game and all other Ubisoft titles have been pulled from Origin as a result of the credit card fraud, and Ubisoft is likely more than well aware that they will lose money over this either way.)

- or -

There was either a mistake in the keys being revoked or a lot of people are lying about the method with which they received their copy of the game so as to cover up their less than scrupulous buying practices?

The former is James Bond level of ludicrous. The latter is more inline with something one might see in reality.

In this case it's about half of both, the consumers are not at fault here they thought they were getting legal keys from a legitimet re-seller. The re-sellers, who are steping up and giving refunds, are the ones to blame.
http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx

Ubi is not the first people to do this(steam has done this for a while), it's just this is the largest one so far.

 

[Vigormortis]

In this case it's about half of both, the consumers are not at fault here they thought they were getting legal keys from a legitimet re-seller. The re-sellers, who are steping up and giving refunds, are the ones to blame.
http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx

Ubi is not the first people to do this(steam has done this for a while), it's just this is the largest one so far.

[sub]I actually linked to that article earlier. [/sub]

This is assuming every person who purchased from G2A and Kinguin didn't know the less the scrupulous nature of those sites.

I personally know a number of people who use those sites regularly and are more than well aware of the often sketchy sources from which those sites get their keys.

Some people may have been legitimately scammed by this fiasco, but I'd wager at least as many knew what they might be getting into and wound up getting a bite in the ass.

That said, I'm not blaming the consumers. I'm laying blame squarely on the resellers and the person or persons that bought the fraudulent keys using stolen credit cards.

 

[Vigormortis]

Or, and I'm not saying this is the case in this instance, though I doubt that it doesn't have an influence, both EA and UBIsoft have a strong interest in dissuading consumers from using third-party sellers, since they both have their own sales platforms?

And if that's your definition of ludicrous, presumably you've never seen Moonraker. Or any Bond film ever. Like the one with the guy who had diamonds in his face.

Which might be believable, if EA and Ubisoft hadn't pulled Ubisoft's entire catalog of titles from Origin.

Trying to persuade consumers to buy from official retailers only is pretty much undermined by removing your products from those retailers.

Besides, you can still buy copies of Ubisoft games from Amazon, GMG, Ebay, etc, and they aren't blanket revoking keys from those resellers.

This fiasco is a case of fraudulent purchases made from stolen credit cards. Nothing more.

 

[Korzack]

Another month, another Ubisoft based fiasco. And guess who has to suffer the worst of it. Normally I'd be inclined to give the publisher benefit of the doubt, when I remember how shameless the likes of G2A are in terms of self-promotion. Same time, the amount of DRM they shove in customers' faces on a daily basis, they should be able to keep a better track on the people who do buy legit keys from them, and the fact they clearly haven't just shows that in my logic at least, they don't know what they're doing. How long until they revoke Steam or GMG keys, to the point where Uplay's the only spot you can buy their crap from?

 

[Strazdas]

I still think it's a shitty thing to do to customers, I'm not saying that all of them are legit and trying to scam or whatever but they're punishing people who are in some way trying to legit-ly buy the game. They could have just pirated it and instead they're trying someway to buy it, they just don't want to pay their regional bullshit prices, so this will likely be the straw that makes them just go pirate the game anyway.

Ubisoft and battling pirates, they do it wrong every, single, time.

Shitty to custumers? perhaps. Its a fair thing to do though. a key was stolen (bought by stolen CC info that issued chargeback afterwards), so the key is returned to the owner. If you bought a stolen item your item will get confiscated. you can demand a return from a thief, but a thief isnt always willing to give it. so dont buy items from thieves. its a risky business and this time it got caught.

I do agree that Ubisoft is awful at battling pirates.

how are customers supposed to know who is and isn't legit? Somehow I bet it's not always easy to tell. If anything they should fine the ones selling the keys, why the customers?

A passing glance is enough to tell G2A is not legit.

Also why wouldnt it be costumers problem? If i steal your car and then sell it to somone, do you expect it to not be confiscated if im caught? because thats what happened here. keys were stolen.

Ubisoft nowhere said they were stollen.

Except that they did http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx

And yeah, steam has done this too, not that long ago as well. In fact steam is pulling keys all the time that are bought with fraudulent CC and then traded using steams trade function.

 

[Monsterfurby]

Hate to be that guy, but...

Update 2: Ubisoft has updated it's official statement, ...

Heil Grammar!

But, regarding the topic at hand:

I guess with that new explanation, it's a fair measure to take. Would have been great if they'd communicated that earlier, but alright. I still think keysellers are alright and it's acceptable to use them, with a healthy dose of caveat emptor.

It should be noted that I've had a case where I'd bought a key from Kinguin that had already been redeemed. Their support was extremely quick in returning my money and fixing the situation, even though the seller had all but disappeared. Can't really say I found them (Kinguin) to be especially shady.

 

[shirkbot]

Shitty to custumers? perhaps. Its a fair thing to do though. a key was stolen (bought by stolen CC info that issued chargeback afterwards), so the key is returned to the owner. If you bought a stolen item your item will get confiscated. you can demand a return from a thief, but a thief isnt always willing to give it. so dont buy items from thieves. its a risky business and this time it got caught.

I do agree that Ubisoft is awful at battling pirates.

I think we can all agree that Ubisoft is bad at battling pirates, but then again I don't know a single company that is Good at it.

That said I do want to point out a flaw in the "car theft" analogy that's been floating around this whole time: While digital products are legally treated identically to physical ones, they are not the same and we need to remember that. Normal property theft is 0-sum. When a physical item is stolen, the owner no longer has it and when found it is returned to the owner so that they can either use it or sell it. In this case Ubisoft (possibly) lost money, but nothing else. They could still sell FC4 exactly as well as before and revoking those keys from those players amounts to destroying those copies of the game. I understand that Ubisoft is legally well within their rights to revoke the keys, and that they were purchased using stolen credit cards, I'm just saying that it doesn't seem benefit anyone to do so. That and that our digital property laws need updating. Anyway I hope they catch the actual thieves. Those credit cards were still stolen no matter what else is going on.

OT: I know that these resellers are not always 100% on the up and up, but the main two do sound like they're trying to do right by their customers by offering refunds or replacement keys. Good on them.

 

[gigastar]

It should be noted that I've had a case where I'd bought a key from Kinguin that had already been redeemed. Their support was extremely quick in returning my money and fixing the situation, even though the seller had all but disappeared. Can't really say I found them (Kinguin) to be especially shady.

Being a habitual cynic, i have to note that they probably have to do this since anyone who gets burned by a fruad key and doesnt get compensated becomes a negative PR anecote for thier site.

A similar thing can be observed with Origin too, you must have seen someone gushing about how excellent thier customer support apparently is.

 

[Wasted]

Hasn't The Escapist linked to G2A deals in the past? I remember being linked to that website from here during the "Deals of the Week" post and, after seeing how shady the website looked, held off from purchasing anything from there. Guess my fears were confirmed.

 

[Monsterfurby]

Being a habitual cynic, i have to note that they probably have to do this since anyone who gets burned by a fruad key and doesnt get compensated becomes a negative PR anecote for thier site.

A similar thing can be observed with Origin too, you must have seen someone gushing about how excellent thier customer support apparently is.

Oh, absolutely - no doubt the have to do that. Customer service is all they have to stand out.

But does the 'why' really matter? Excellent customer service still is excellent customer service, even if *gasp* the company only wants to be seen in a good light and/or prevent legal repercussions.

 

[Strazdas]

I think we can all agree that Ubisoft is bad at battling pirates, but then again I don't know a single company that is Good at it.

That said I do want to point out a flaw in the "car theft" analogy that's been floating around this whole time: While digital products are legally treated identically to physical ones, they are not the same and we need to remember that. Normal property theft is 0-sum. When a physical item is stolen, the owner no longer has it and when found it is returned to the owner so that they can either use it or sell it. In this case Ubisoft (possibly) lost money, but nothing else. They could still sell FC4 exactly as well as before and revoking those keys from those players amounts to destroying those copies of the game. I understand that Ubisoft is legally well within their rights to revoke the keys, and that they were purchased using stolen credit cards, I'm just saying that it doesn't seem benefit anyone to do so. That and that our digital property laws need updating. Anyway I hope they catch the actual thieves. Those credit cards were still stolen no matter what else is going on.

OT: I know that these resellers are not always 100% on the up and up, but the main two do sound like they're trying to do right by their customers by offering refunds or replacement keys. Good on them.

Id say CDP is pretty good at that. know plenty of pirates that will buy witcher 3 on principle. but yeah, most companies are awful at it.

As far as your flaw, the same can be applied to piracy, so if we take the idea that piracy is wrong, then so is buying stolen keys.

In case of piracy ubisoft does not directly loose anything either. yet, it is illegal to do so and often frowned upon by society (though from ethical perspective one could argue it not being bad).

And yes, i agree that the right thing is happening. people whose fault it was that innocent costumers bought stolen keys - the resellers - are the ones paying for it now. Imo the sites refunding the costumers is the best way to go about it.

 

[Dagda Mor]

I think we can all agree that Ubisoft is bad at battling pirates, but then again I don't know a single company that is Good at it.

That said I do want to point out a flaw in the "car theft" analogy that's been floating around this whole time: While digital products are legally treated identically to physical ones, they are not the same and we need to remember that. Normal property theft is 0-sum. When a physical item is stolen, the owner no longer has it and when found it is returned to the owner so that they can either use it or sell it. In this case Ubisoft (possibly) lost money, but nothing else. They could still sell FC4 exactly as well as before and revoking those keys from those players amounts to destroying those copies of the game. I understand that Ubisoft is legally well within their rights to revoke the keys, and that they were purchased using stolen credit cards, I'm just saying that it doesn't seem benefit anyone to do so. That and that our digital property laws need updating. Anyway I hope they catch the actual thieves. Those credit cards were still stolen no matter what else is going on.

OT: I know that these resellers are not always 100% on the up and up, but the main two do sound like they're trying to do right by their customers by offering refunds or replacement keys. Good on them.

Keep in mind that Ubisoft had already recorded those sales in the books. As far as their accounts go, they effectively just lost a lot of revenue through no fault of their own. Although the keys are not physical objects, they are still property, and it makes sense to seize the stolen property. Now, if they were clever, they'd be thinking at the margin and consider how best to make up the lost revenue--if I were the CEO of Ubisoft, I might suggest allowing people whose keys were seized to buy their keys at the same price they paid for it if they present a receipt. Maybe that's not the best way to handle the situation, but there are a million better ways than just seizing the keys and leaving it at that.