PSA: Ubisoft is Revoking Far Cry 4 CD-Keys From 3rd Party Re-sellers - Update 2

Strazdas

Robots will replace your job
May 28, 2011
8,407
0
0
Snotnarok said:
how are customers supposed to know who is and isn't legit? Somehow I bet it's not always easy to tell. If anything they should fine the ones selling the keys, why the customers?
A passing glance is enough to tell G2A is not legit.

Also why wouldnt it be costumers problem? If i steal your car and then sell it to somone, do you expect it to not be confiscated if im caught? because thats what happened here. keys were stolen.
 

Snotnarok

New member
Nov 17, 2008
6,310
0
0
Strazdas said:
Snotnarok said:
how are customers supposed to know who is and isn't legit? Somehow I bet it's not always easy to tell. If anything they should fine the ones selling the keys, why the customers?
A passing glance is enough to tell G2A is not legit.

Also why wouldnt it be costumers problem? If i steal your car and then sell it to somone, do you expect it to not be confiscated if im caught? because thats what happened here. keys were stolen.
Looks aren't everything, there's plenty of odd looking websites selling things and they're legit. Call me crazy but a car vs a digital code for a game is vastly different. One is being returned to the owner and the other is being nullified.

This G2A place is a company, or there's a face behind the website. They can be sued for doing this. Something Ubisoft would probably be better off doing because the PR fallout from this isn't going to be good.
 

Strazdas

Robots will replace your job
May 28, 2011
8,407
0
0
Snotnarok said:
Looks aren't everything, there's plenty of odd looking websites selling things and they're legit. Call me crazy but a car vs a digital code for a game is vastly different. One is being returned to the owner and the other is being nullified.

This G2A place is a company, or there's a face behind the website. They can be sued for doing this. Something Ubisoft would probably be better off doing because the PR fallout from this isn't going to be good.
removing of the key here is a VERY GOOD thing to make people avoid buying stolen keys. its a lesson that, apparently, thousands failed to learn.

Sure, there may be odd looking sites that are legit sellers, but the amount of such is small enough to be ignored. if it looks shady, acts shady and offer shady services, its probably shady.

G2A is polish company. good luck suing them.
 

Snotnarok

New member
Nov 17, 2008
6,310
0
0
Strazdas said:
Snotnarok said:
Looks aren't everything, there's plenty of odd looking websites selling things and they're legit. Call me crazy but a car vs a digital code for a game is vastly different. One is being returned to the owner and the other is being nullified.

This G2A place is a company, or there's a face behind the website. They can be sued for doing this. Something Ubisoft would probably be better off doing because the PR fallout from this isn't going to be good.
removing of the key here is a VERY GOOD thing to make people avoid buying stolen keys. its a lesson that, apparently, thousands failed to learn.

Sure, there may be odd looking sites that are legit sellers, but the amount of such is small enough to be ignored. if it looks shady, acts shady and offer shady services, its probably shady.

G2A is polish company. good luck suing them.
I still think it's a shitty thing to do to customers, I'm not saying that all of them are legit and trying to scam or whatever but they're punishing people who are in some way trying to legit-ly buy the game. They could have just pirated it and instead they're trying someway to buy it, they just don't want to pay their regional bullshit prices, so this will likely be the straw that makes them just go pirate the game anyway.

Ubisoft and battling pirates, they do it wrong every, single, time.
 

OldNewNewOld

New member
Mar 2, 2011
1,494
0
0
Strazdas said:
Snotnarok said:
how are customers supposed to know who is and isn't legit? Somehow I bet it's not always easy to tell. If anything they should fine the ones selling the keys, why the customers?
A passing glance is enough to tell G2A is not legit.

Also why wouldnt it be costumers problem? If i steal your car and then sell it to somone, do you expect it to not be confiscated if im caught? because thats what happened here. keys were stolen.
Ubisoft nowhere said they were stollen.
It might as well be the case that they were bought in a cheap region and resold for a profit. Knowing Ubisoft, that's probably the case. Also what about G2A makes it not look legit at "a passing glance"? The site looks a lot better than freaking Steam or Origin. Compared to GMG it's a freaking masterpiece. Pretty much every site that sells digital goods looks like shit and shady. Andif you read the updated, G2A will give new keys to the costumer while Steam doesn't give back money for a game that was sold broken and wouldn't run no matter what you did. Turns out Steam is the shady dealer who doesn't care about the consumer and is in the bed with Ubishit. Why wouldn't they when they have people defending them no matter what bullshit they pull.
 
Jun 20, 2013
112
0
0
Augustine said:
SomeGuyOnHisComputer said:
Judging by the controversy surrounding unveiling of current generation on consoles, this may/may not last. Physical distribution is on the decline.
I think the controversy points more in the direction of it lasting, the consumers basically won. I wouldn't say physical games are on the decline, at least on console. Digital distribution seems to mostly be a PC thing, most console gamers I know don't even really buy games digitally.
 

Kahani

New member
May 25, 2011
927
0
0
albino boo said:
There is your version of reality and the laws version reality
No, there is precisely one version of reality and it's really rather sad how little interest you apparently have in learning what that is. The law is freely available for everyone to read. You claim there is law which treats theft of physical goods and breach of copyright by downloading digital goods in the same way. Prove it. Cite the actual law you claim exists. Cite a single case where someone has been criminally charged for downloading or uploading files. Cite a single case where someone has been prosecuted in any way for downloading copyright material. You can't do so, because no such law exists and no such cases have ever happened. Either support your claims, or have the basic decency to just admit you're wrong.
 

gigastar

Insert one-liner here.
Sep 13, 2010
4,419
0
0
BiH-Kira said:
Ubisoft nowhere said they were stollen.
They didnt initially, now they have and EA has backed them up on this.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx
 

CoL0sS

New member
Nov 2, 2010
711
0
0
gigastar said:
They didnt initially, now they have and EA has backed them up on this.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx
Could you please briefly explain what the article is about ? I've seen several people around the web share it, but for some reason it won't load for me :/
 

Therumancer

Citation Needed
Nov 28, 2007
9,909
0
0
I think Ubisoft puts out a decent product, though I am appalled by their business practices and anti-consumer policies like forcing us all to remain constantly online with Uplay.

That said, after some long consideration here I'm not sure how to solve this problem. Let's be honest, the price of goods fluctuating heavily from one area to another based on the local economies is well known. This is why for a lot of trade you wind up having to pay "duty" or entry and exit taxes when buying goods from a nation when things are cheap, this is to prevent people from buying up cheap goods and moving them into another economy and undercutting all the prices. That sounds good on paper but economies are very sensitive and it ultimately goes to some very unpleasant places when followed through to it's logical extremes which is why it's accepted as a necessary evil. For those who haven't travelled this is what a "Duty Free" station is all about, basically it's a store on a border or a port where tourists can buy things in very small quantities for personal use at the native price, everything else you bought needing to have more money paid on it before it can leave the country.

Right now with virtual products there isn't any easy way to equalize the price, a code is a code so to speak. If you charge someone what the market can bear in one place, nothing prevents the person from selling that cheaper version of the same product to a more affluent country with higher prices, undercutting that local market, and making a product. The people in less developed nations aren't be exploited here, as much as they are exploiting holes in the system when they would rather have the money than the games. Needless to say the markets in more developed nations aren't happy about this and as they do a lot of business with the publishers, the publishers are acting on their behalf to try and control the price. Especially seeing as if all the trade winds up happening at the lower, developiong nation rates, they themselves make less profit due to the prices being set low. With virtual goods where there is effectively unlimited supply as well, the issue of value and market control is already a touchy subject.

Now, it's easy to say that Ubisoft should only charge what the lowest market on earth will bear, but at the end of the day it's likely this wouldn't make them much money especially with what they invest in their products, and it is fair for them to be a business (albeit I don't like how far they push it). What's being done as a sort of "favor" to help bring games to less fortunate neighbors by charging what they can afford isn't something that can sustain the entire business.

At the end of the day Ubisoft is in the position of either choosing to only sell games to developed, first world, nations with the richest markets, OR to punish those who seek to undercut the pricess by buying only from sources from those less developed areas. What your seeing here is similar to what happens with physical goods, if someone gets caught trying to smuggle stuff pasty duty stations especially in large quantities they are the ones that are punished, not the people providing or re-selling the goods. They generally get their stuff confiscated (and depending on what it is and the relevant laws it can get really harsh above and beyond that). This is sort of like the equivalent of say heading out to the islands and loading up a boat with a bunch of hardwood furniture and stuff and sneaking past the duty station with the intention of selling it in the US for ten or twenty times what you paid and then getting caught.

Now of course virtual products do play some havoc with this logic since you are ultimately only buying one product for personal use. However the usual logic behind the existing laws is based around physical goods and tourists needing to physically travel to the location in question. Some guy say paying $5 for a hardwood walking stick that might cost $100 in the US is no big thing, that's a souveneir for someone who travelled that doesn't really do any damage. With these kinds of virtual transactions though people can do it again and again and pretty much use it to undercut the pricing and trade control of an entire area of products.

Now, perhaps I misunderstand things, but the point I'm getting at is that I don't like Ubisoft, but I can't really see how else they could solve the problem, and they do have a legitimate gripe here, as much as I am predisposed to dislike them for their other policies. The only other alternative would be to try and use draconian methods to control where their products... taking a sneering elitist attitude about how video games are not to be sold to "undeveloped" peoples and only to their more advanced superiors... To be honest though given the themes present in some of their games I'd find it kind of darkly hilarious especially if they put it that way. Effectively taking the same attitude as a lot of their Templar bad guys... "Yes, we did make a game about the plight of the downtrodden people being victimized by the arrogant overlords of other civilizations... but you aren't enlightened enough to appreciate this message... (muttering about unenlightened savages in need of deliverance at the point of a musket)" (Delivered in the voice of the Templar Governor from "Black Flag" of course). :)

Probably not popular sentiments here, but it's my thoughts. I'm trying to think it through and see it from both perspectives rather than just jumping on a "bash Ubisoft" bandwagon (which is hard not to do, because nowadays I love to bash Ubisoft... it's like the Snively Whiplash of video game producers... at least EA makes an effort to disguise it some times... with Ubisoft I can just imagine a CEO twirling a mustache and cackling evilly has he tells a secretary to relay how 30FPS is more cinematic... before breaking into a musical number about how evil and greedy he is).
 

gigastar

Insert one-liner here.
Sep 13, 2010
4,419
0
0
CoL0sS said:
gigastar said:
They didnt initially, now they have and EA has backed them up on this.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx
Could you please briefly explain what the article is about ? I've seen several people around the web share it, but for some reason it won't load for me :/
Basically Ubisoft (after deactivating the stolen keys) later clarified that the keys were originally bought from Origin using stolen credit cards. A few hours later EA confirmed this.
 

CoL0sS

New member
Nov 2, 2010
711
0
0
gigastar said:
CoL0sS said:
gigastar said:
They didnt initially, now they have and EA has backed them up on this.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx
Could you please briefly explain what the article is about ? I've seen several people around the web share it, but for some reason it won't load for me :/
Basically Ubisoft (after deactivating the stolen keys) later clarified that the keys were originally bought from Origin using stolen credit cards. A few hours later EA confirmed this.
Thank you. I'm still a bit confused however. Wasn't aware you could get Ubisoft games through Origin.
 

Augustine

New member
Jun 21, 2012
209
0
0
SomeGuyOnHisComputer said:
Augustine said:
SomeGuyOnHisComputer said:
Judging by the controversy surrounding unveiling of current generation on consoles, this may/may not last. Physical distribution is on the decline.
I think the controversy points more in the direction of it lasting, the consumers basically won. I wouldn't say physical games are on the decline, at least on console. Digital distribution seems to mostly be a PC thing, most console gamers I know don't even really buy games digitally.
A short while ago, there was no console digital distribution at all. Now it is quite prominent, while not as prominent as on PC, but steadily growing compared to consoles in previous generations. We may argue about the degree to which physical distribution is declining, but I do not see how the argument can be made that it is not declining in the first place.
 

Hgdrifter

New member
Dec 7, 2010
5
0
0
I rarely post here, mostly just a lurker. But since I'm directly involved in this situation, I'm going to try and add some perspective on the issue. I'm one of the people that got their keys banned and bought from G2A.com, now of course after this I learned my lesson and will never buy from a site like that again. So yada yada yada, let's get that out of the way.

Now here's the sequence of events that I've gone through so far, and as of right now I still haven't gotten a refund and I'm not planning to ask for another key from them.

I got my key banned the day after, and when you try to redeem the key again on Uplay you get an error message the key was banned for no particular reason. I then opened a ticket with G2A and they said you need to provide a bunch of screenshots. The list of the screenshots were your Uplay library, the error code, and an official response from Ubisoft. After reading that, I contacted G2A through their live chat system to make sure I had to provide the screenshots since I started doing some research on the issue. My case wasn't unique and they stated I had to provide the screenshots anyway. The CSR then told me the process after all the info is provided. Basically, after you provide the info stated above they contact the seller and make a judgement.

I opened a ticket with Ubisoft to get a response from them, knowing how much time a ticket response can take from any huge company I called their call center and got an expedited response from them to get the thing going.

I then submitted all the info G2A required and waited a couple days. Of course no response from them, so I went through live chat again. The CSR I talked to said he couldn't access the ticket so the only he could do was mark it as urgent for the department that handles these kind of issues. Now the purchase was made through Paypal so of course there's a bit of a cushion in getting my money back. But I've been pressing filing a dispute with Paypal to hopefully get the G2A customer service to expedite everything. As of right now, my ticket with G2A is marked as urgent and I'm giving them another 48 hours to respond. (48 hours from yesterday so 24 hours) If nothing happens I'm going to escalate it to Paypal and tell them the whole story.

The perspective I'm trying to give here is that as a consumer, I'm caught in a really messy customer service loop. Having to potentially deal with 4 companies to resolve this issue (I'm counting my bank in the off chance Paypal can't do anything.) Ubisoft should have realized this when they took action on this, as I'm never going to buy another Ubisoft game for a really long time and if I do, I'll wait until it's like $5. Of course there's minimal effort on their part so they can probably care less. Doing some research, G2A is apparently a reliable source to get cheaper games. (Take that in anyway that you will.) But their response in all of this is horrendous. Even after they released their official statement on Facebook, I still haven't gotten any response from them. What makes it that much more irritating is that they said they have to contact the seller, which if they did obtain the key from a stolen credit card, they're already long gone and probably won't respond to G2A at all. (I'm saying if on the credit card portion as some sellers may have used the region locked loophole. I realize it's highly unlikely, but I'm trying to cover all the potential scenarios.)

TLDR: From a consumer stand point. The consumer is stuck in an ugly customer service loop and it sucks.
 

gigastar

Insert one-liner here.
Sep 13, 2010
4,419
0
0
CoL0sS said:
gigastar said:
CoL0sS said:
gigastar said:
They didnt initially, now they have and EA has backed them up on this.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx
Could you please briefly explain what the article is about ? I've seen several people around the web share it, but for some reason it won't load for me :/
Basically Ubisoft (after deactivating the stolen keys) later clarified that the keys were originally bought from Origin using stolen credit cards. A few hours later EA confirmed this.
Thank you. I'm still a bit confused however. Wasn't aware you could get Ubisoft games through Origin.
Well you cant anymore. Ubisoft titles have been pulled from Origin as a result of this.
 

Steve the Pocket

New member
Mar 30, 2009
1,649
0
0
albino boo said:
Steve the Pocket said:
albino boo said:
If you buy a stolen car in good faith you get to keep it right?
If I bought a car from a legit-looking used car lot, and it turns out to be stolen, I expect to get my money back from somebody. They can't just say I'm as guilty as the thief because I don't magically have the ability to tell a stolen car from a legitimate one. Otherwise, all they've done is trade one victim (the car's rightful owner) for another (the money's rightful owner, me) and in the meantime where has the money gone? Does the thief get to keep it? Does the government seize it and get to keep it? If it's already been spent, am I not as much entitled to compensation as if they'd broken into my house and stolen it from me in cash?
You might expect your money back but you would be wrong. You are not entitled to your money and you have no legal rights to recover that money. Its the principle of caveat emptor, or english "let buyer beware". The person from whom you bought also bought in good faith, why should they lose money instead of you?
Assuming the dealer got it from the thief, as opposed to being the thieves themselves, then they deserve to get their money back as well. Basically, everyone the criminal has wronged deserves compensation. "Buyer beware" as you're defining it just sounds like a fancy way of saying "People who sell things have the right to do whatever they want, up to and including literally breaking the law, because CAPITALISM, BITCHES."
 

Atmos Duality

New member
Mar 3, 2010
8,473
0
0
Assholes commit fraud, publisher invokes wrath, and it's only the legitimate paying customers that are left twisting in the wind.

Yeah, that's pretty much what I've come to expect now.

When "Caveat emptor" is the best justification one can offer for such underhanded bullshit, that's a rather dire statement about the reality of the games market...and why I don't do business with Ubisoft, period.
 

David Eristavi

New member
Jan 28, 2015
1
0
0
People using the car theft analogy are not really being accurate, it's more like you buy a stolen car from a seller, you are are unawar of the car being stolen and then a week later Ubisoft breaks into your car and drives it back to his own home. The point is, if it's a crime, dont take it upon yourself to deal with it, and secondly they could have given warning about this, like 'sorry but this is my car which was stolen and the police are here to confirm that'.

Ubisoft has rights to property that is under its ownership, but when someone else thinks that it is under their ownership it is not fair to swipe it from under their nose. official statements would be proper, and using legal action against the 'fraudsters' (if that is what the issue is) to pay for that damage!!
 

Vigormortis

New member
Nov 21, 2007
4,531
0
0
jayzz911 said:
TLDR: wasnt credit card fraud, they just want more of your money.
Mmm...except that it was.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2015/01/27/ubisoft-says-deactivated-far-cry-keys-purchased-with-stolen-credit-card.aspx

Just sayin'.