Quick Time Redux

[The Random One]

You know what game I think did it right? Too Human.

Wait, don't go away. It's true.

In Too Human, to kill these 'trolls', you can climb up their backs and shove your weapon down their head-analogues. There are no button prompts in it, other than to jump on their back, and it's more of a context sensitive action than a quick time event. You need to balance your character on top of the troll, which you do by just looking at how well balanced he is rather than trying to juggle some sort of scale, and then you press the attack button when you're balanced, which you know because the camera will zoom in. Too complicated for you? That's OK - you can kill the troll the regular way. It's complicated because you need to target each of the troll's body parts (and the aiming in that game is not exactly flawless) so the reward is welcome, but not unsurmountable.

Of course, that's during gameplay, not cutscenes. Still, parts of it still work.

It's too bad Too Human never bothered to explain this. And that it's a pretty bad game (nowhere as bad as people are saying, but still, pretty bad). And that SK wasted time and money on it rather than doing a new Eternal Darkness.

 

[Rarhnor]

I strongly disagree with the article, especially regarding using SW:TFU as an example. I dreaded the fact that I had to, STILL, press buttons after half an hour worth of duel time, only to be mocked by QTE to actually finish him off. Can't I just see a quick cinematic sequence, to get my "I killed him" joy feeling, rather than pressing more buttons?
One of the joys of defeating a hard enemy is to be able to kick back and just blow off the steam, that your boiling anger created. It's NOT to feel a tickle below my belt-buckle, because I pressed a button correctly.
Jeez, if I wanted to get a snuff hard-on for my button timing, I'd go play Guitar Hero, till my fingers bleed.

 

[Sjakie]

Great minds think a like, they say....
Now we know small minds do the same

QTE's suck balls, always have and always will imo!
Best 'kind of' QTE's that i liked was the way you could handle conversation in Mass Effect 2 with it's paragorn/renegade options flashing across your screen. It provided something extra but nothing that important that you could not do without.
But the whole 'press X to not die', has been tried and failed on so many levels.
If i wanted to show off my button mashing skills i will play a platformer and those dont polute my screen with controler symbols.

 

[Roboto]

Great minds think a like, they say....
Now we know small minds do the same

QTE's suck balls, always have and always will imo!
Best 'kind of' QTE's that i liked was the way you could handle conversation in Mass Effect 2 with it's paragorn/renegade options flashing across your screen. It provided something extra but nothing that important that you could not do without.
But the whole 'press X to not die', has been tried and failed on so many levels.
If i wanted to show off my button mashing skills i will play a platformer and those dont polute my screen with controler symbols.

Yes, I was just thinking about his distinct lack of ME2 in the article.

 

[Cynical skeptic]

Honestly, I don't think a lot of effort should be exerted on getting quicktime events "right." Considering they're nothing but a stopgap (period) for simplifying the execution of actions more complex than the average console controller (or mainstream gamer) can perform, any effort spent getting them "right" is wasted. Polishing the brass on the titanic.

The goal of gaming, right now, should be to make it possible to do things like slice an AT-AT in half without having to play a little game of simon. Quicktime events, no matter how "well" or "poorly" they're done, is the game telling the player, "sit over there and amuse yourself while I do something awesome." Its a big brother taking the controller away so he can beat a level while you hand him a soda or something. Its the complete antithesis of interactivity.

They're just proof whats possible in a video game is far beyond the reach of whats possible with current input devices.

 

[Mr.Pandah]

Decent article, but without any mention of the Bourne Conspiracy game, I'm kind of disappointed. If there ever was a game that got it right, it was definitely that game. It was all about the speed and the reflexes and actually got me into it, thinking that I'm making this guy do all of this awesome stuff because I am fast enough to control Jason Bourne. The game used a sort of coo-ing sound when there was about to be a QTE and you could activate some on your own for quick instant kills. That game was definitely the best example I can think of for QTEs done right, and personally...I actually enjoyed them.

Oh yeah, theres also Ninja Blade.

 

[KEM10]

Heavy Rain had good QTE.....

But seriously, the only movie/QTE that I enjoyed were the ones in Soul Caliber III. They weren't needed and only added minor tweaks to the story or gave you a slight handicap for the next match if you missed it.

 

[carpathic]

" Now a player can jump between PlayStation and Xbox seamlessly without worrying about the irrelevant and entirely cosmetic differences between the controllers."


Ahhh watch out for the fanboys.....


Meh...meh...meh....six axis...meh...meh...meh

 

[Jandau]

QTEs on the PC - Let's see... Console QTEs generally use the four face buttons (XYAB and such). Hmmm, I wonder where in the average PC control layout one might find four buttons whose position relative to each other stays mostly the same?

In case I was too subtle: Use WASD (or whatever the direction keys are mapped to) for QTEs on the PC! Those four are always close to each other and in a configuration similar to the XYAB keys of the standard 360 controller. If you need more than that, use stuff that's likely to be close by such as the "Use" or "Reload" keys.

OR you could just use the advantages of the PC as a platform! and let us REMAP the QTE keys as we see fit. Wouldn't that be grand?

Finally, go through the trouble of making icons for the various keyboard keys. I'm sure your budget can survive a bit more spending in the "generic icons" department...

 

[JemJar]

Great article, but you missed a trick:

Do not make QTEs repetitive, do not impose them on a section of gameplay which you expect / demand that players will replay a dozen or more times.

The culprit for this one? Namco's Soul Calibur III. Each play through of the arcade mode there are, iirc, two QTEs in cutscenes in the middle. This is arcade mode, on a beat 'em up. Something the player is expected to go through about 20 times.

N.B.: You don't fail entirely if you miss it, but you do start the first round on 60% health.

 

[aithilin]

I enjoyed them in Kingdom Hearts. They appeared during most of the boss fights but weren't necessary for success, but you got a cool cinematic when you pulled them off. They weren't strictly pass/fail either-- when you successfully completed a step in the sequence, it pushed the character a bit further, if aborted, you didn't lose anything through it.

 

[JEBWrench]

1.cutscene is differentiated from eventscene(music would be appropirately demistealthy)
2.stopped or slowed time
3.let it be multiple options,each represents an idea(one of em is the fastest route)
4.ideas clearly associated with buttons/logics the player already understands
5.options are visualised thoughts(= transparent parts of imagined reality)
6.there is some kind of shadow getting thinner as the idea is vanishing with time(happens only in slowtime scenes)
7.multiple logical ways to trigger specific action(action/direction based)
8.neglect=/=instant death

This is pretty much the way Alpha Protocol handles everything.

As for the article: Shamus, your number 1 idea was milked to death during the FMV era. And it sucked. Please let's not go back to that.

 

[Ringwraith]

Only game I so far played with a significant number of QTEs is RE5 on PC, (I've played Gears 2, though it only really has one that pops up rarely), due to my odd keyboard layout, I've had to reassign my use key, so I can punch guys in the face more often. However, the live-saving ones I often don't have masses of trouble with, mashing move left/right is surprisingly easy, probably easier from the little experience I had of the console version's 'rotate the stick' version. Probably because it requires less rearrangement of your hand positions, as I've seen people switch to the palm of their hand to spin the stick fast.

However, I do agree that they aren't the best thing ever, though I've found a way to cope despite not playing games with them often. I do very much hate the grab of RE5's dogs, you will lose at least half your health no matter how superhuman your reflexes. At least the run-of-the-mill townsfolk have the common courtesy to only take a small slither off if you pull it off, and not masses if you fail horribly.

I also haven't got very far into RE5, so I probably haven't found many of the recurring insta-kill QTEs.

 

[timmytom1]

I`ve never really got the hate for QTE i can understand that if you`re not familiar with the pad in your hand it can be a fustrating experience but i`ve always enjoyed them (well more than the usual mega-uber overdrive bulshit that most bosses somehow pull when in their death throes) also RE4 has probably the hardest QTE`s ever i don`t think i`ve come across a game where i`ve died so many times cutscenes before or since , probably because they were fast and random

 

[rsvp42]

Are QTEs really that bad? The developers made a choice, it's how the game is played, end of story. Honestly, it doesn't ruin the immersion any MORE than a "talk" icon over a character's head or an "open" prompt at a door. Why don't I hear people complaining about those elements?

While I do agree that QTEs aren't the most elegant solution for triggering and continuing complex moves, I feel like the hate gets magnified because of forums like there. To be honest, if I had never visited gaming sites like these, read the forums, watched ZP, I would never have felt the same way. I accepted QTEs as a way of interacting with the game. I'm not suggesting that we stop critiquing games, no sir. But I wonder sometimes if we complain about things more because we can and people will listen, as opposed to having a really good reason to complain.

edit: although QTEs in a story cutscene are annoying, especially if they don't warn you. The only way to do that successfully would be to do it in most of the beginning cutscenes and give people time to get used to them. If you suddenly introduce them in a major story scene 1/4 of the way into the game, you're doing it wrong.

 

[Phishfood]

I`ve never really got the hate for QTE i can understand that if you`re not familiar with the pad in your hand it can be a fustrating experience but i`ve always enjoyed them (well more than the usual mega-uber overdrive bulshit that most bosses somehow pull when in their death throes) also RE4 has probably the hardest QTE`s ever i don`t think i`ve come across a game where i`ve died so many times cutscenes before or since , probably because they were fast and random

I'm dyspraxic. QTEs mess with my head something awful. Even with a game designed for PC controls I have major trouble with them, as in the QTE is over before I've figured the first key to press. Controlling an FPS I can do, its something specific to QTEs that messes me up.

Also, they are rather anti the point of computer games. There is one single set solution for them - press all the right buttons at the right time. The game itself I can dodge left, dodge right, duck behind that wall over there or just plain shoot first.

 

[GodKlown]

Perhaps the only QTE that I actually didn't mind was in Saints Row 2 during the fight club side missions when you had someone's health down low enough and could finish them off. It was similar to what I am hearing about God of War (wouldn't know, only barely played the first one and tuned out of them after that), but the button prompt was left up on the screen for at least five to ten seconds before switching to something else. If you missed the button switch, it didn't totally screw it all up. The progress started to decline, allowing you a chance to make a change to the correct button(s). Even if you failed it miserably, you still had a chance to knock the guy to the ground and do it again with no penalty other than having to do it again.

QTE as a whole, especially in Resident Evil, is pretty annoying when they give you one shot at getting it right and the sequence changes on the fly. During a split-screen co-op game, it can be funny to screw it up and the other player suffers the consequences of your misstep. I can recall a few times running down that narrow corridor away from that boulder and jumping over gaps until you pressed the wrong button and your partner would fall and hear my brother swear loudly and then laugh. In some games where they feature it during a cut-scene, I wish they would just have a complete skip over the scene altogether instead of skipping the cut up to the QTE. Trying to get me more involved in the story by making it more interactive doesn't make for a more interesting story or force me to pay attention. If anything, it just pulls me out of the game since now I have to concentrate on some arbitrary sequence when I was trying to focus on the story.

There's a time and place for everything, and you can't sweeten every title with a QTE. If there is no sense in doing them, don't throw them in just for the gimmick effect. Maybe if your cut scene didn't take fifteen minutes and you have to throw in a QTE to keep your system from going into standby, we'd all be better off.

 

[Rack]

"QTEs suck less than ever"

Except of course for when they were in Shenmue and didn't suck at all. Anyone tempted to do QTEs should play Shenmue, and if they ever feel like they are doing something different they should stop it and play Shenmue.

 

[Rot Krieg]

Quantum of Solace actually did vary the amount of time you have to hit the right button for its QTEs. First time through I don't think I missed a single one. After I restarted on the hardest difficulty, the window for hitting them was much smaller, and I actually had to pay attention.

Even if they did use them in that game, it was only for their hand-to-hand cutscenes. They stayed out of the way for the most part, and on normal were fairly easy to finish.

 

[Outright Villainy]

I don't feel QETs have a place in gaming at all. They are esssetially a "Well we are sory this cut-scene is so long here is a arbritarty immersion breaking sign that makes your reclining during this awesome cutscene redundant and only serves to cuase you irritation" or just that sense of "Haha you have to watch this all over gain, pay attention fucker!".

They are a rudementary way, proabaly the most rudementary way, of linking cutscene to gameplay that only exist to add the illusion of interactivity to passive veiwing. If they existed during a DVD they would just piss everyone off. Get we just get over this cute idea from 1999 and get on with our cut scene?

Oh god yes. It has no place in cutscenes. I'd argue it has no place at all, but for the love of god not in cutscenes. At least in Metal gear solid, all the Qtes were just for flashbacks or first person easter eggs: Completely inconsequential if you didn't bother with it. This is the only acceptable way really. That or using them to make a choice in a cutscene, but as reflex test just to make you watch it all again if you fail in completely idiotic.