Racist Idioms

[yeah_so_no]

Do you use idioms which have racist origins of which you weren't aware, and had someone call you on it?

I regularly use the expression "to call a spade a spade", and drew the indignation of a black girl in one of my classes who informed me (rather snottily) that "spade" was another way of referring to a black male slave, and the expression is derogatory.

Have other people had this happen? Do people say they've been gypped, or had someone be an "Indian giver" (or perhaps less overtly offensive expressions), and had someone take offense?

I'm sure I have and I make no apologies for it. Those expressions are ingrained in the public discourse and have lost any former racial connotations. Racism is the belief that certain races are inferior to other races. If there is no belief and no intent to be racist, then it isn't racist. It's not possible to be "accidentally" racist.

Bous points for: having been bitched at for using "he" to indicate both males and females as in the sentence "if someone's worried about his grades, he should go talk to his professor".

Many cultures use "he" when referring to both males and females. We are one of them. We do not have a word that encompasses both males and females and I refuse to use both of them every single time.

If someone wants to use "she" for both, I won't correct them. But I won't be going along.

"if someone's worried about their grades, they should go talk to their professor".

"They" is the PLURAL form of "he."

It would be like using "we" instead of "I." That only works if you're Sméagol or a medieval king.

Actually, the singular "they" has been a valid grammatical usage going back to Shakespeare's time. It, like splitting the infinitive, were vilified when Latin-loving grammaticists created "rules" for English that were based on Latin and didn't actually match, well, English.

 

[cptjack42]

The phrase 'no more comments from the peanut gallery' comes from the segregated theaters where blacks would buy peanuts because they were cheaper.

I find that hard to believe, you got a source on that?

The voices in my head.

 

[Glerken]

Someone got angry when I went up to a group of people (both male and female) and said "Hey guys"
I'm not going to say "hey guys and gals", that sounds stupid. I was referring to the whole group, so did it really matter?

 

[Desaari]

the term "Gypsy" was created by the Nazi's. it was simply their generic name for all Itinerant people.

I'm sure that isn't true; I'll quote wiki since I don't know the etymology too intimately:

"The word derives from the word for 'Egyptian' in Latin...They received this name from the local people either because they spread in Europe from an area named Little Egypt, in Southern Balkans or because they fitted the European image of dark-skinned Egyptians skilled in witchcraft."

 

[kawligia]

Do you use idioms which have racist origins of which you weren't aware, and had someone call you on it?

I regularly use the expression "to call a spade a spade", and drew the indignation of a black girl in one of my classes who informed me (rather snottily) that "spade" was another way of referring to a black male slave, and the expression is derogatory.

Have other people had this happen? Do people say they've been gypped, or had someone be an "Indian giver" (or perhaps less overtly offensive expressions), and had someone take offense?

I'm sure I have and I make no apologies for it. Those expressions are ingrained in the public discourse and have lost any former racial connotations. Racism is the belief that certain races are inferior to other races. If there is no belief and no intent to be racist, then it isn't racist. It's not possible to be "accidentally" racist.

Bous points for: having been bitched at for using "he" to indicate both males and females as in the sentence "if someone's worried about his grades, he should go talk to his professor".

Many cultures use "he" when referring to both males and females. We are one of them. We do not have a word that encompasses both males and females and I refuse to use both of them every single time.

If someone wants to use "she" for both, I won't correct them. But I won't be going along.

"if someone's worried about their grades, they should go talk to their professor".

"They" is the PLURAL form of "he."

It would be like using "we" instead of "I." That only works if you're Sméagol or a medieval king.

Actually, the singular "they" has been a valid grammatical usage going back to Shakespeare's time. It, like splitting the infinitive, were vilified when Latin-loving grammaticists created "rules" for English that were based on Latin and didn't actually match, well, English.

Be that as it may, the whining of the PC crowd is not enough justification, IMO, to abrogate almost 400 years of established tradition and force the compliance of all of modern English speaking society.

 

[Maze1125]

Do you use idioms which have racist origins of which you weren't aware, and had someone call you on it?

I regularly use the expression "to call a spade a spade", and drew the indignation of a black girl in one of my classes who informed me (rather snottily) that "spade" was another way of referring to a black male slave, and the expression is derogatory.

Have other people had this happen? Do people say they've been gypped, or had someone be an "Indian giver" (or perhaps less overtly offensive expressions), and had someone take offense?

I'm sure I have and I make no apologies for it. Those expressions are ingrained in the public discourse and have lost any former racial connotations. Racism is the belief that certain races are inferior to other races. If there is no belief and no intent to be racist, then it isn't racist. It's not possible to be "accidentally" racist.

Bous points for: having been bitched at for using "he" to indicate both males and females as in the sentence "if someone's worried about his grades, he should go talk to his professor".

Many cultures use "he" when referring to both males and females. We are one of them. We do not have a word that encompasses both males and females and I refuse to use both of them every single time.

If someone wants to use "she" for both, I won't correct them. But I won't be going along.

"if someone's worried about their grades, they should go talk to their professor".

"They" is the PLURAL form of "he."

It would be like using "we" instead of "I." That only works if you're Sméagol or a medieval king.

Actually, the singular "they" has been a valid grammatical usage going back to Shakespeare's time. It, like splitting the infinitive, were vilified when Latin-loving grammaticists created "rules" for English that were based on Latin and didn't actually match, well, English.

Be that as it may, the whining of the PC crowd is not enough justification, IMO, to abrogate almost 400 years of established tradition and force the compliance of all of modern English speaking society.

Exactly, and traditionally the correct was to refer to a single person of indefinite sex is "they". Hence using "he" is not only sexist, it is non-traditional.

 

[bmf185]

Do you use idioms which have racist origins of which you weren't aware, and had someone call you on it?

I regularly use the expression "to call a spade a spade", and drew the indignation of a black girl in one of my classes who informed me (rather snottily) that "spade" was another way of referring to a black male slave, and the expression is derogatory.

Have other people had this happen? Do people say they've been gypped, or had someone be an "Indian giver" (or perhaps less overtly offensive expressions), and had someone take offense?

I'm sure I have and I make no apologies for it. Those expressions are ingrained in the public discourse and have lost any former racial connotations. Racism is the belief that certain races are inferior to other races. If there is no belief and no intent to be racist, then it isn't racist. It's not possible to be "accidentally" racist.

Bous points for: having been bitched at for using "he" to indicate both males and females as in the sentence "if someone's worried about his grades, he should go talk to his professor".

Many cultures use "he" when referring to both males and females. We are one of them. We do not have a word that encompasses both males and females and I refuse to use both of them every single time.

If someone wants to use "she" for both, I won't correct them. But I won't be going along.

"if someone's worried about their grades, they should go talk to their professor".

No. That means that "somebody" is worried about the grades of other people. English doesn't have a gender-neutral third person possessive for this (like "su" in Spanish). As for just using one gender, I usually still say "his or her" just in case there are other grammar Nazis around. Does calling someone a grammar Nazi count for this? Do we have to worry about their feelings?

 

[yeah_so_no]

I'm sure I have and I make no apologies for it. Those expressions are ingrained in the public discourse and have lost any former racial connotations. Racism is the belief that certain races are inferior to other races. If there is no belief and no intent to be racist, then it isn't racist. It's not possible to be "accidentally" racist.

Bous points for: having been bitched at for using "he" to indicate both males and females as in the sentence "if someone's worried about his grades, he should go talk to his professor".

Many cultures use "he" when referring to both males and females. We are one of them. We do not have a word that encompasses both males and females and I refuse to use both of them every single time.

If someone wants to use "she" for both, I won't correct them. But I won't be going along.

"if someone's worried about their grades, they should go talk to their professor".

"They" is the PLURAL form of "he."

It would be like using "we" instead of "I." That only works if you're Sméagol or a medieval king.

Actually, the singular "they" has been a valid grammatical usage going back to Shakespeare's time. It, like splitting the infinitive, were vilified when Latin-loving grammaticists created "rules" for English that were based on Latin and didn't actually match, well, English.

Be that as it may, the whining of the PC crowd is not enough justification, IMO, to abrogate almost 400 years of established tradition and force the compliance of all of modern English speaking society.

400 years? Not even close. More like 200.

http://www.crossmyt.com/hc/linghebr/austheir.html

And using the plural they goes back even further than your 400 years--it's been used since the 1300's.

 

[Weaver]

Do you use idioms which have racist origins of which you weren't aware, and had someone call you on it?

I regularly use the expression "to call a spade a spade", and drew the indignation of a black girl in one of my classes who informed me (rather snottily) that "spade" was another way of referring to a black male slave, and the expression is derogatory.

Have other people had this happen? Do people say they've been gypped, or had someone be an "Indian giver" (or perhaps less overtly offensive expressions), and had someone take offense?

I'm sure I have and I make no apologies for it. Those expressions are ingrained in the public discourse and have lost any former racial connotations. Racism is the belief that certain races are inferior to other races. If there is no belief and no intent to be racist, then it isn't racist. It's not possible to be "accidentally" racist.

Bous points for: having been bitched at for using "he" to indicate both males and females as in the sentence "if someone's worried about his grades, he should go talk to his professor".

Many cultures use "he" when referring to both males and females. We are one of them. We do not have a word that encompasses both males and females and I refuse to use both of them every single time.

If someone wants to use "she" for both, I won't correct them. But I won't be going along.

"if someone's worried about their grades, they should go talk to their professor".

No. That means that "somebody" is worried about the grades of other people. English doesn't have a gender-neutral third person possessive for this (like "su" in Spanish). As for just using one gender, I usually still say "his or her" just in case there are other grammar Nazis around. Does calling someone a grammar Nazi count for this? Do we have to worry about their feelings?

lol I don't have feelings, don't worry.

 

[Bofus Teefus]

Do people say they've been gypped...

Apparently, I'm a descendant of a long line of gypsies and thieves. This is at least the straightest answer that I can get out of my parents. What the hell is a gypsy, and should I be offended when people say this?

Gypsies are travellers that live in caravans, mobile homes, trailers etc. They were traditionally stereotyped as being thieves, scammers, and the like, and in modern times don't fit into society as they don't own or rent land and as such are looked down upon for being social misfits.
There are also many other factors to account for society's dislike and mistrust of them, for example: often after staying on an area of land they will leave behind large amounts of waste, leaving the local councils to clean it up at the expense of the taxes from the rest of society.
You should probably take offence if someone says it to you in a malicious way, but not otherwise.

okay, to clarify here, A Gypsy is simply an Itinerant person, basically they still insist on living nomadic lifestyles and refuse to settle down in one place.

the term "Gypsy" was created by the Nazi's. it was simply their generic name for all Itinerant people.

Well...learn something new every day. So what this amounts to is that if someone were to ask about my heritage, I should just say "your guess is as good as mine." Right?

 

[iggyus]

This racism thing annoys. Whenever you say something someone always gets offended because its "racist"

 

[xkat]

When I was younger, I used a lot of those terms without really thinking about it. But, my college education was largely focused on anthropology, comparative religions, and education. So, I don't really make those mistakes anymore. I usually notice when other people do though. However, I don't get offended. Sometimes I try to educate them with a bit of historical background on the origins of the phrase or term, other times I just let it roll. It really depends on how receptive to enlightenment I think the person will be.

 

[kawligia]

Exactly, and traditionally the correct was to refer to a single person of indefinite sex is "they". Hence using "he" is not only sexist, it is non-traditional.

400 years? Not even close. More like 200.

http://www.crossmyt.com/hc/linghebr/austheir.html

And using the plural they goes back even further than your 400 years--it's been used since the 1300's.

Even if it was as little as 200 years, its more than enough to establish its place as the current tradition. Maybe it wasn't the PAST tradition, but it is the CURRENT tradition.

Just because people used to do something centuries ago doesn't mean you can just up and do it claiming it preempts the current tradition. If you want to make that arguement that we SHOULD readopt that old tradition, FINE. But don't act like you are automatically correct because you dug up some old rule that was forgotten centuries ago.

And it's not "sexist." Sexism, like racism, is the belief that one is better than the other. Something can only be sexist or racist if you have that belief and an intent to convey it. It's NOT POSSIBLE to be "accidentally" racist or sexist.

Using words in their currently well established usage is NOT sexist or racist because it does not imply an attempt to convey racist or sexist beliefs. It implies nothing more than an attempt to use the word in its accepted manner.

 

[The Infamous Scamola]

Do people say they've been gypped...

Apparently, I'm a descendant of a long line of gypsies and thieves. This is at least the straightest answer that I can get out of my parents. What the hell is a gypsy, and should I be offended when people say this?

Gypsies are travellers that live in caravans, mobile homes, trailers etc. They were traditionally stereotyped as being thieves, scammers, and the like, and in modern times don't fit into society as they don't own or rent land and as such are looked down upon for being social misfits.
There are also many other factors to account for society's dislike and mistrust of them, for example: often after staying on an area of land they will leave behind large amounts of waste, leaving the local councils to clean it up at the expense of the taxes from the rest of society.
You should probably take offence if someone says it to you in a malicious way, but not otherwise.

okay, to clarify here, A Gypsy is simply an Itinerant person, basically they still insist on living nomadic lifestyles and refuse to settle down in one place.

the term "Gypsy" was created by the Nazi's. it was simply their generic name for all Itinerant people.

Well...learn something new every day. So what this amounts to is that if someone were to ask about my heritage, I should just say "your guess is as good as mine." Right?

Don't listen to what these idiots are saying, Gypsy was not a term invented by nazis and it's not true that they don't fit into society.
Why, many great English actors were of Gypsy descent, Charlie Chaplin, Michael Caine and Bob Hoskins to name a few. Elvis also had gypsy blood in him.

If you want to learn more about the subject:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani_people

 

[Inverse Skies]

Not that I know of. I remember a football commentator here in Aus got in trouble a few years back because of this comment;

'Neon Leon is having a night that is as black as a dogs guts'

By which he meant he wasn't playing very well, but because Leon was Indigeous it was taken as a racist slur so he had to formally apologise for the remark.

 

[bodyklok]

I don't think thats ever happend to me.

 

[Orekoya]

I used to get called on that when I was really young, so now I return the favor by reminding anybody with baggy pants that the origin of wearing your pants lower than the norm came from prison and meant you were a prison b*tch, to give more readily available access to those who owned them. When they left prison they still kept their pants baggy out of a learned habit. Of course it isn't true but I just like seeing the reaction.

 

[Orekoya]

Edit: Bah, double post. -_-

 

[7moreDead_v1legacy]

Pot called the kettle black...not racist as far as I know, but the times on forums people have been like "WTF U KANT SAY THAT!!1". -.- PC madness I tell you.

 

[SimuLord]

In a game of Empire: Total War I had the enemy surrounded and stupidly had my guys shooting inward while standing in a circle around the target. It was a great example of a Polish firing squad.