Thaluikhain said:
Wrex Brogan said:
Also, the worst part is now I'm going to have to listen to FAAAAAAAR too many people talk about how amazing and awesome this is and how if you don't like it you're homophobic and it's just... fuckin', god dammit. Yes, great, a gay character in a mainstream movie, fantastic, it's still a shitty go at it given they're just slapping homosexuality on him like a fresh coat of paint instead of putting some thought into it and making a new character (heh, 'putting thought' into the new Star Trek. I need to stop having such high hopes for the impossible), that again, the dude they're paying homage to himself disagrees with.
Eh, aren't they completely rewriting everyone and everything about NewTrek, though? Not saying this is necessarily a good move, but it sorta fades into the background a bit.
Happyninja42 said:
Sorry I'm not up to speed on this but, let me see if I have this right. The new Sulu in the JJ Abrams Trek-verse, is going to be officially established as gay in the upcoming movie? How is this different from the original? I mean, did they ever establish Sulu's orientation one way or the other in the original series? I'm guessing they didn't, given the time period, but if they never said one way or the other in the original work, then what does it matter?
...ok, this is a rant thread, but I'll explain in greater detail/context:
I'm gay. I am of the opinion that if they truly, sincerely wanted him to be gay (he was established as straight in the original series, and Takei refers to him as such),
then they would've done it in the first film. Instead, they're making a big song and dance of it for the third film, taking an already-established character and making him gay despite the wishes of the man they're doing it for in the first place and instead of doing what that man advised which was... apply a little imagination and create an interesting original gay character instead. So, the fact that it's coming in on the third film, they're ignoring what Takei is saying and that they didn't bother making an original character to do so... I'm not buying it as anything less than some shallow pandering, not something done with good will or noble intentions. A straight (heh) 'fuck you' to gay people because again,
a gay man told them he wasn't ok with it and they still did it, patting themselves on the back all the while.
Regardless of quality, original canon, alternative universe mumbo-jumbo... it's a bunch of straight guys telling a gay guy that 'no, we're keeping it despite you saying you're not ok with it'. That is something that, quite frankly, can Fuck Right Off. All the reasoning, all the defense, it's just the same soggy bullshit from people who like the sound of their own voice more than the voice of the people they're representing. Simon Pegg - and again, it's enormously disappointing to hear him say these things - said he wouldn't make an original gay character since it'd be 'tokenism', which is such a sack of crap. If a character is token, it's because you didn't give enough of a fuck writing them, not because they're the only gay character on board, so I'm not buying that for a minute.
As to 'why it matters' - look, I said in my first post that I've had 'straight people explain a gay character written by straight people' to me. That's literally happened to me
five fucking times today, where straight people I know have come to me all excited about Gay Sulu and then getting annoyed because I'm not all 'YAY I LOVE HIM BECAUSE I TOO AM A HOMOSEXUAL'. If this was an original character - hell, if they weren't even making a big announcement about it and it was just 'there' in the movie - I'd be waaay more positive about it. But this? As said, it's just a coat of paint slapped over something old with someone trying to sell me that it's new. I don't want that. I want what Takei wants - Original gay characters. Thoughtful gay characters. Interesting gay characters. Not a repackaged Sulu with the 'Approved by Takei!' hastily scratched off.