Review: Street Fighter IV

[JamminOz07]

I can't find "Trial Mode" only the "Training" mode!

oh, is it under the "challenge mode" menu? sorry, didn't get that far...

EDIT: sorry for the double post, I quoted when I intended to edit... please don't moderate me again! I don't like being on probation...

 

[Razorback0z]

Not looking for a flame war among so many fans of this genre... but I just have to say.

Quote:
"At its core, the gameplay remains essentially unchanged from the days of Street Fighter II"

Which is why I was sick of these games in about 1985 and can not for the life of me understand how they have made it into the new millenium.

Just my 2c... go ahead Fatality on me...

 

[Slycne]

Not looking for a flame war among so many fans of this genre... but I just have to say.

Quote:
"At its core, the gameplay remains essentially unchanged from the days of Street Fighter II"

Which is why I was sick of these games in about 1985 and can not for the life of me understand how they have made it into the new millenium.

Just my 2c... go ahead Fatality on me...

I don't like mushrooms, but I don't expect all the mushrooms farms to shut down because of it. I think you can see where I am going with that.

 

[Eric the Orange]

So I was playing this game and managed to beat the second round final boss after a bunch of tries. I thought "wow, normals hard, i'll try easiest and see how much easier it is". but strangly I found easiest to be just as hard as normal. Is this just me, or has anybody else noticed this?

 

[BIGpanda]

how come the wii isn't seeing a release date?

Because Capcom can't be arsed porting it is my guess.

The Wii isn't that much weaker than the X-Box or PS3, but it's probably weak enough that it would require some work (like Dead Rising).

There's also the fact that most companies are too busy flooding the market with crappy party games to care that the Wii also has a more hardcore faction who are dying to see anything get released.

that's rather this appointing to hear. it's not like the wii can't handle the control differences, hell that's why there's the option to play with a classic or gamecube remote for the damned console. I get that the nintendo want's in on a different variety of fans but this is the kind of shit that made me embarrassed to have a gamecube.

 

[BIGpanda]

So I was playing this game and managed to beat the second round final boss after a bunch of tries. I thought "wow, normals hard, i'll try easiest and see how much easier it is". but strangly I found easiest to be just as hard as normal. Is this just me, or has anybody else noticed this?

don't mind the double post.

seth is an asshole, he keeps teleporting across the screen and gets really happy with that grab button. I just raped him with sagat and ryu, EX-attacks are your friends people.

 

[Logan Westbrook]

Living in the UK as I do, I have to wait until tomorrow to get my hands on it, but once I do, I'm coming for you Funk, Keane and Slycne*


[small]*albeit coming to get my ass handed to me, but still coming...[/small]

 

[inkheart_artist]

Soul Calibur 4 was a let down but it was better then this.

 

[Ranzel]

Soul Calibur 4 was a let down but it was better then this.

Try giving reasons why next time you post, makes you look like less of an ass.

I really want this game; I really want to get good at this game. My problem is that I don't even want to try the game unless I have an arcade stick and I just can't seem to find one that's worthwhile and isn't $100 or more. I barely have the money for the game itself.

 

[darrinwright]

I've been sooooo hyped to play this game.

Another review read, and another time I tell myself I'm not an idiot for just buying it RIGHT NOW, monthly budgets be damned.

 

[inkheart_artist]

Soul Calibur 4 was a let down but it was better then this.

Try giving reasons why next time you post, makes you look like less of an ass.

I really want this game; I really want to get good at this game. My problem is that I don't even want to try the game unless I have an arcade stick and I just can't seem to find one that's worthwhile and isn't $100 or more. I barely have the money for the game itself.

My bad, I just spoke about all of the reasons I feel that way in another thread. But after about 8 hours of playing and losing on Street Fighter 4 to Zangief, Abel, and Seth I have no doubt that this game is not accessable to casual gamers; more for its broken grab mechanics then anything else. Even on easy the character chain grab relentlessly and as soon as they hit you once you've lost the round.

Now, I play a lot of fighting games and I have a feel for the difference between casual and hardcore. Games like Guilty Gear Isuka are the pinnacle of hardcore fighting games. They relentlessly abuse you and never give you an easy fight and if you don't know every single game mechanic, not to mention where and when to use your characters move set, you lose. Apparently Street Fighter 4, if you go against the AI of the three characters I've mentioned becomes far worse then that. It took me about an hour and a half to get to level 100 in Isuka, for a hardcore fighting game thats very understandable but even the final dog/shark/robot/yeti boss had some weaknesses you could exploit to win and he never used a move that would instantly kill you regardless of anything else.

I lost to Abel for two hours until I had to resort to finding a cheap weakness to the AI in the form of constant light punching, I lost to Seth for three hours and I ended up having to spam the armored attack constantly like the light punch on Abel to just get through the FIRST ROUND. I've been losing to Zangief even on easy for another three hours because after legitimately trying to play fairly for about an hour and hopelessly trying to find anything to exploit to allow me a victory I still can't beat the inevitable chain grab combo to death to which theres no escape. You try and stay aray from him, he uses a backhand move to get to you quickly that allows him to step through fireballs. Try him from the air, same move hits you to the ground with incredible priority which he chains into a grab. He even seems to have an uncanny sixth sence for when your trying to use an EX or ultra move. It absolutely breaks the arcade mode because you have to fight at least two of these guys to beat it.

Never once did I have to resort to retarded button smashing on any other fighting game past the original Marvel vs. Capcom.

Now as to why Soul Calibur 4 is better? Well first off, there isn't any of what I mentioned in it, it has cheap characters, Algol and the Apprentice, but even to a casual player playing on easy you can beat them playing legitimately with some patience and practice in a few rounds. Second off, while it has nuances and special game mechanics that make you an unbeatable hardcore vet, if you want to just play casually through a game mode, the AI is forgiving enough to allow you through without all the special attacks, armor breakers, instant kill moves, unblockable attacks, ect. ect.

Hell, by that standard even the Guilty Gear series is more accessable to casual players when playing easy then Steet Fighter 4.

 

[Keane Ng]

Yeah, anyone who wants to get a few rounds in whenever (I'll go easy on ya...heh) can feel free to add me, my GT's in my profile. You can also add me even if you don't want to play SF4. I also am very good at Bomberman and Uno.

 

[John Funk]

Soul Calibur 4 was a let down but it was better then this.

Try giving reasons why next time you post, makes you look like less of an ass.

I really want this game; I really want to get good at this game. My problem is that I don't even want to try the game unless I have an arcade stick and I just can't seem to find one that's worthwhile and isn't $100 or more. I barely have the money for the game itself.

My bad, I just spoke about all of the reasons I feel that way in another thread. But after about 8 hours of playing and losing on Street Fighter 4 to Zangief, Abel, and Seth I have no doubt that this game is not accessable to casual gamers; more for its broken grab mechanics then anything else. Even on easy the character chain grab relentlessly and as soon as they hit you once you've lost the round.

Now, I play a lot of fighting games and I have a feel for the difference between casual and hardcore. Games like Guilty Gear Isuka are the pinnacle of hardcore fighting games. They relentlessly abuse you and never give you an easy fight and if you don't know every single game mechanic, not to mention where and when to use your characters move set, you lose. Apparently Street Fighter 4, if you go against the AI of the three characters I've mentioned becomes far worse then that. It took me about an hour and a half to get to level 100 in Isuka, for a hardcore fighting game thats very understandable but even the final dog/shark/robot/yeti boss had some weaknesses you could exploit to win and he never used a move that would instantly kill you regardless of anything else.

I lost to Abel for two hours until I had to resort to finding a cheap weakness to the AI in the form of constant light punching, I lost to Seth for three hours and I ended up having to spam the armored attack constantly like the light punch on Abel to just get through the FIRST ROUND. I've been losing to Zangief even on easy for another three hours because after legitimately trying to play fairly for about an hour and hopelessly trying to find anything to exploit to allow me a victory I still can't beat the inevitable chain grab combo to death to which theres no escape. You try and stay aray from him, he uses a backhand move to get to you quickly that allows him to step through fireballs. Try him from the air, same move hits you to the ground with incredible priority which he chains into a grab. He even seems to have an uncanny sixth sence for when your trying to use an EX or ultra move. It absolutely breaks the arcade mode because you have to fight at least two of these guys to beat it.

Never once did I have to resort to retarded button smashing on any other fighting game past the original Marvel vs. Capcom.

Now as to why Soul Calibur 4 is better? Well first off, there isn't any of what I mentioned in it, it has cheap characters, Algol and the Apprentice, but even to a casual player playing on easy you can beat them playing legitimately with some patience and practice in a few rounds. Second off, while it has nuances and special game mechanics that make you an unbeatable hardcore vet, if you want to just play casually through a game mode, the AI is forgiving enough to allow you through without all the special attacks, armor breakers, instant kill moves, unblockable attacks, ect. ect.

Hell, by that standard even the Guilty Gear series is more accessable to casual players when playing easy then Steet Fighter 4.

Uh.

That's... really interesting, because I don't know of anybody else who had that problem.

 

[inkheart_artist]

Uh.

That's... really interesting, because I don't know of anybody else who had that problem.

People have said the same thing in the other thread about this. Even in a few reviews linked from metagamer reviewers hinted at it in their reviews about how wonderful this game is supposed to be.

 

[Vortigar]

*snip*

A few tips:

Against chain grabbers: jump straight up or backdash as you stand up. Practically every character also has EX moves which are usable on wakeup if the enemy is nearby (shoryu, spinning bird kick, flash kick, etc etc).

Against Zangief and Abel: play the keep away game. Stay close enough to be able to move in and poke with one or two hits when you get an opening and back away again. They're geared to murder you up close, don't let them get there. Back dash, back jump and fireball spam are your friends.

Seth = cheap. Be cheap back. He's a total bs character, (like I-No's EX boss version with unlimited tension you meet in GGX2#R's storymode with Dizzy) find and abuse their weaknesses as the normal strategies don't apply to these types.


Also, what is playing legitemately? Not turtling? Not throwing five times in a row? Not throwing fifteen fireballs in a row? Why not? The game doesn't care about this. It isn't concerned with what looks cool or nice. Look at the game as you would at Ninja-Gaiden: find the best way to cut the enemy into the tiniest pieces while taking as little damage as possible. The point isn't doing cool stuff, the point is maximizing damage and minimizing risk (and when you get good at this it then leads to doing cool stuff). But above all, the game is about facing human opposition. The AI is nothing more than a glorified training dummy (and a required obstacle to unlock all the characters).

Guilty Gear is constructed around the principle of relentlessly attacking. SC4 is uber masher friendly because properly defending is hard and most attacks leave you in advantage on both hit or block allowing you to keep attacking no matter what. SF4 simply doesn't work that way and punishes you for your mistakes. SF4's AI should teach you that relentlessly attacking is suicide, moderate your attacks, wait for openings and then strike.

 

[Eric the Orange]

lotta text

First off id like to say, 2-3 HOURS? Either you were exagerateing or you have much more paitence than me.

Anyways, really SF4 is for SF fans. Ima guess your not one cause to be honest I found this game about average difficulty for a SF game. Really I thought the original SF2 was harder than this game. To put it another way, if you like SF games you'll like this, if you don't, you won't.

The game is tough and I had problems but I've beatten it without to much difficulty. And I am by no means an expert. Heck I can only pull off a hadoken half of the time (not exagerateing).

That being said the games has definate problems. Like I said i'm by no means skilled so trying to pull off the combos in challange mode is an impossible task for me, much less utilizing them in combat. And true, to do that you'd need to be a seriously hardcore player. And yes the grab happy charicters are annoying, though personaly I had more trouble with sagat then zangeif. And the difficltuy need serious tweeking if esiest is only slightly easier than normal.

cause really SF4 belongs to an older brand of fighting game, like king of fighters(or any SNK game really). Where its not so much about intuition and getting in sync with the game (like most 3D fighters), as it is about mastering a set of moves that works and spamming the hell out of them (at least against the computer, human players will work around this if there any good).

But really, you lost to Seth the first round? He isn't grab happy the first round, so it shoulden't be for the same reason you lost to the other 2. He's incredibly preditable, he always dose the dahlsim punch at range so you jump in hit him while he dose it, jump out, and repeat.

 

[inkheart_artist]

lotta text

First off id like to say, 2-3 HOURS? Either you were exagerateing or you have much more paitence than me.

No exageration and it wasn't about patience it was about tearing my hair out cause I wasn't going to be beaten by some Russian in oversized tighty whiteys. When I finally submitted, my controller met its demise against my wall (could've been worse I was about ready to throw it at him and destroy my TV before I took a quarter step back and aimed elsewhere)

I haven't been a tremendous fan of Capcom fighting games since Rival Schools. Although I didn't play on easiest when Zangief wiped the floor with me the second time, just easy.

For Seth I don't know. By the time I got to him I would be still so worked up over the grab fags that first round wouldn't work out. Not to mention I only managed to get to him once and on medium.

For Vortigar legitimately means not spamming the the same attack over and over (and only spamming the attack, no moving included). When I have to resort to that the game becomes a pointless and unrewarding grind. When I had to beat Seth and Abel like that the stress of fighting them for so long didn't meet a resolution. Although thank you for taking the time to write those tips.

 

[Woe Is You]

For Vortigar legitimately means not spamming the the same attack over and over (and only spamming the attack, no moving included).

You talk about playing legitimately when no such a thing really exists in a single player game. Especially against a computer that blatantly cheats (in RTS and/or fighting games this is often really evident). If you use codes that turn you invincible or modify the game, yeah, that's cheating. Finding a flaw in the way the AI plays and taking advantage of it? Not really cheating at all.

Speaking of the game itself, it has quite a few things that fly in the face of it being "newcomer friendly". I know, I'm backing my stance here, but now that I've actually played it, it actually feels more complex than Third Strike in some ways. For example, the super and ultra moves require pressing 2 and 3 buttons at once respectively, some of the timing for the combos is a bit ridiculous and the training mode merely teaches you moves, none of the mechanics that go behind them. It does kind of feel like the old SF2 when you play with the old cast (they've nailed the physics of that game) but this really isn't the game that I'd get my non-fighter fan friends to play.

Character unlocks are also stupid and I'm disappointed to see them in the game. I just wanted to brush up my Sakura and fool around with Dan online. Why the hell am I forced to play the boring single player part to enjoy the multiplayer? Stupid, stupid decision.

Another thing is that the long combos that even the practice mode teaches seem pretty redundant in this game. The manual gives an example about cancelling with Ken: you can cancel a shoryuken into another shoryuken. What it forgets to mention, though, is that a fierce shoryuken is actually more damaging than those two shoryukens. This problem with cancelling works into the combos themselves, where you're given a long combo but the damage scaling basically negates a huge chunk of that damage, making a low short into ultra do about as much damage as some of the longest combos out there. A lot of the time that makes actually learning some of the long combos pretty pointless. Maybe this is why it's called beginner friendly?

I'm still enjoying it but it really isn't the experience I thought it'd be. Actually, I think HD Remix is much closer to the user-friendliness that was touted as a major feature in this game.

 

[Keane Ng]

Also, what is playing legitemately? Not turtling? Not throwing five times in a row? Not throwing fifteen fireballs in a row? Why not? The game doesn't care about this. It isn't concerned with what looks cool or nice. Look at the game as you would at Ninja-Gaiden: find the best way to cut the enemy into the tiniest pieces while taking as little damage as possible. The point isn't doing cool stuff, the point is maximizing damage and minimizing risk (and when you get good at this it then leads to doing cool stuff). But above all, the game is about facing human opposition. The AI is nothing more than a glorified training dummy (and a required obstacle to unlock all the characters).

Play to win. Cheap is a word used by losers.

 

[ZantetsukenQ]

Another thing is that the long combos that even the practice mode teaches seem pretty redundant in this game. The manual gives an example about cancelling with Ken: you can cancel a shoryuken into another shoryuken. What it forgets to mention, though, is that a fierce shoryuken is actually more damaging than those two shoryukens. This problem with cancelling works into the combos themselves, where you're given a long combo but the damage scaling basically negates a huge chunk of that damage, making a low short into ultra do about as much damage as some of the longest combos out there. A lot of the time that makes actually learning some of the long combos pretty pointless. Maybe this is why it's called beginner friendly?
.

I do believe that the idea of the cancelling is for safety as opposed to offence. If someone blocks the first, you have a way to cancel and backdash to safety, or forward dash to a low attack, and carry on. I do agree that some of the combo's feel pointless, but practicing them is actually improving my speed of execution of other moves. I must say in light of this, that the Challenge Trial mode gets a big kudos from me.