Romance with NPC's - Your thoughts?

[Seydaman]

(Go Team Merrill!)

*Waves flag*

OT: It depends on how it is done. The romance in Skyrim and Fable felt lifeless and out of place. I enjoy it in (most) Bioware games. It ends up being how it is done. You see, romance is an important part of being human (Some would say the most important part), so doing it well is something consideration should be put into.

 

[balladbird]

I love a good romance, so I'm all for having the option of a relationship with NPCs.

The big rule here, though, is to remember not to half ass it! a shoe-horned in love story doesn't please anyone. people who like love stories hate it because it feels trite, and people who don't will hate it because it wastes time. the token ability to romance anyone, for instance, is pretty lousy. I had less than no motivation to romance in fable, for instance. Bioware did well enough with romances, although the fact that mass effect couldn't decide on which girls/guys to make romanceable, coupled with their fear of giving you a commited relationship, resulting in new girls/guys to romance with nary a passing mention to your old relationship, took a lot of the wind out of my sails there.

so, TLDR:

short answer- yes with an "if"

Long answer- no, with a "but"

 

[Specter Von Baren]

I'll admit, it can often be a big thing for me because I'm a hopeless romantic. Keep in mind though, this is only the case where the romance involves actual characters and not blank slates.

 

[Snowbell]

I'm a big fan of romance in games! But I prefer it to be Bioware style (specific options with character development and depth) rather than Fable style (grab anyone and have a kid with them, no personality or development whatsoever). I only dislike it when the games try to force it on you, such as Kaiden and Cortez a la Mass Effect.

In fact, I don't think there are enough romance options! Many times has there been a companion in a Bioware game that I would choose over the only romance options!

 

[Athinira]

The ironic thing is that the very best romances in games are usually mods.

In Baldur's Gate 2, i have played two different fan-created romances. One is Tashia [http://readme.spellholdstudios.net/Tashia_Readme.htm], a female elven sorceress, and another is Chloe [http://www.spellholdstudios.net/ie/chloe], a female lesbian human half-goddess of the Yr'kai tribe (who founded the way of the Kensai), with the interesting twist that if the player don't romance her (or can't), she will romance Imoen instead.

Despite being fan-made, both of them are very well written, have backstory, great voice-acting, custom encounters, custom romance-music, portraits, custom cutscenes, and a woven well into the events of the game (including the kidnapping in Chapter 6). Tashia is especially great, because she is basically what Aerie should have been IMO

Those are just my personal two favorite examples. That are many more romance-mods than those two, but case in point is that fans often care a lot more about romances than the developers/publishers, and as such tend to make the best romances. Oh, and it also explains why Baldur's Gate is still a f****** awesome series <3

 

[Psychobabble]

Don't mind it exists as some people find it enjoyable. Personally however romantic pixels just feels like so much ego wanking. This feeling isn't helped by the high rate of ham-handed cliche drivel narrative written with all the subtlety of a brick to the teeth.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

My issue with them is that they are usually done poorly. Have a few conversations, exchange a gift or 2, then sex. That's not romance. Hollywood action movies do romance better than that and that's saying something.

 

[Xan Krieger]

Well basically they're the only romance I'll ever have so they're all great to me. I just assume they're done right because I wouldn't know what a real life romance is like and I never will.

 

[skywolfblue]

I generally shy away from romances in games. I dunno, it just doesn't turn me on. And I'm far from being asexual, so don't get me wrong.

It's difficult to pinpoint why. So let me try.

Partly because the romances in Bioware-type games feel oddly mechanical. Push the paragon/benevolent options, receive vagina.
I don't know how they'd fix that, but that's how it feels to me. It's simultaneously too easy and too difficult. You tap a few buttons and away you go. Horizontal waltz, fill your boots. Hope you didn't decide to play the game in the living room while the family are trying to watch Coronation Street.
But then if you happened to miss one of the buttons, uh oh, no hanky panky for you. Didn't compliment the girl at the right time, now it's barred forever. Pester the helpless bint after every mission all you like, won't change anything because you didn't schmooze hard enough after she killed her dad (or kidnapped her sister, or any other strange family issues).

And then partly because most of the love interests are crazy. They want your semen to make an Old God, or used to be a career assassin, or whatever.

And then many of the options don't turn me on. Which maybe makes me weird. I saw the Tali love threads. I saw the quarian forum avatars. Made me feel wrong for wanting to punch a ************ every time someone said "Keelah se'lai".

Well put. I'm not really fond of them just lining up and "push button to romance".

Romances that are actually woven into the main plot tend to be a million times better, and I love those. Enslaved is a good example. Romance is an important step for any character, why should it be treated as secondary and only given a few passing dialogue scenes?

 

[Ruzinus]

I'm playing Rune Factory 4 and...
...yeah, I'm enjoying the "romance" bit enough.

There's something a bit odd about them, because they're so far removed from reality, yknow? In a game its like "okay, the cast is this, and the possible romances are these characters, and you just pick the one you like best and theyre sure to accept you so long as you engage in enough dialogue with them or give them enough gifts."

and blah blah blah, and there's just no actual chance of rejection. Wouldn't it be interesting to have a Harvest Moon game where NPCs are trying to woo each other? Or... I dunno, that's all I got for ways to make it more realistic at the moment.

But I guess it's an odd thing to complain about... I mean, violence is games is so far removed from reality... as is hacking, lockpicking, and pretty much anything else.

 

[Rebel_Raven]

I like them as an option.

Moreover, I like LGBT options. They're generally kinda rare lil' gems.

I think they need to be more common as an option. It's not about self projection for me, usually, though, it's more to the point of making characters more real, IMO. Depth of story.

 

[StriderShinryu]

I'm a huge fan of relationships in games. I think they almost always add something to the experience, even when they aren't handled all that well. In fact, the lack of customization in individual experience in games that don't have relationship systems is one reason why Square's RPGs have fallen out of favour with me.

 

[Zeldias]

Generally fun, although not always. Skyrim's was awful. Rune Factory 4 seems pretty bland as far as that goes. Right now, I feel like Dragon Age 2 has done it best because the other characters actually seem to be their own people, whereas in Mass Effect and Dragon Age: Origins, the romance NPCs felt more like pawns to manipulate. I did like the chatter when romancing someone in DA:O, though.

I'm hoping that going forward, as we figure out ways to make games feel more morally ambiguous (which seems difficult enough, given how utilitarian advancement in games tends to work out to be), that we also get NPCs that feel more like their own people that are also falling in love with the PC. I basically just hope that there comes a time where romances in games work out to feel more organic than they currently do.

I tend to enjoy them, but I also think there's a lot of room for growth.

And obviously, more varied racial (NOT talking elf/dwarf bullshit, but black, Asian, etc) options, more LGBT+ options, etc.

 

[Bad Jim]

I think the main problem is that in real life, romance is not a sidequest. It is our reason for existence, to find someone special and raise a family with them. We don't raise children to help us do our jobs, we do our jobs to support our families.

In a game though, we are generally interested in our jobs, particularly exciting stuff like saving the world, while we are not interested in a virtual family. Which means that if the game is realistic, romance is just a massive drain on our resources for something we don't really care about. If it's not a massive drain on our resources, it is way too easy to be convincing.

Perhaps we should have a game where you are not the savior of the world, but one of his parents, and must convince someone to marry you and raise that kid to be a hero. Or maybe it's a good thing that I don't write plots for games.

 

[NortherWolf]

I think the main problem is that in real life, romance is not a sidequest. It is our reason for existence, to find someone special and raise a family with them. We don't raise children to help us do our jobs, we do our jobs to support our families.

In a game though, we are generally interested in our jobs, particularly exciting stuff like saving the world, while we are not interested in a virtual family. Which means that if the game is realistic, romance is just a massive drain on our resources for something we don't really care about. If it's not a massive drain on our resources, it is way too easy to be convincing.

Perhaps we should have a game where you are not the savior of the world, but one of his parents, and must convince someone to marry you and raise that kid to be a hero. Or maybe it's a good thing that I don't write plots for games.

I'd pay good money for a game like that. It's one of the best ideas I've heard in years.
Get to making games this instant!
Please?

 

[Oroboros]

I think RPGs do this best, Baldurs gate and PST both did it, but did it without holding your hand and having some stupid little heart symbol next to the text.

Indeed. Relationships in BG are so easy to mess up. Especially one of them, when you can actually come into a conflict between getting through your current objective smoothly and not making your lover dump you. You can even lock yourself out of them by just trying to keep the catfights under control (Yes, I'm looking at you, Jaehira and Viconia!). And they might also show you how your love interest has an entirely different side...(and this time I'm looking at you, Aerie.)

Romances in Planescape: Torment were interesting too, they weren't the classic type but there's some obvious romantic tension between TNO, Annah and Fall-From-Grace. You can't really pursue either though, what with your entire situation (and one of them killing you if you do, as much as she doesn't want to do that).

I love BG, but I'm not sure I'd point to the BG games as shining examples of Romance options in games. Like many rpgs with Romance options they seem to be highly biased in one direction or another. In the case of the BG series, there are three options for male characters, while female characters get...Anomen. Likewise, Viconia is the only 'evil' romance option available, and that is somewhat sullied by the fact that a significant part of her romance involves redeeming her with the power of love and all that. So evil players get the shaft as well. And of course, no matter how much Bioware gets lauded for its inclusion of non-hetro romance options in their later games, neither the BG games nor the NWN games have such options.

Planescape did have great romances though, I'll give it that.

I think Romance options are something that has to have a lot of thought and work put into them to make them worthwhile IMO, because you should have at least one to represent good/evil characters each, as well as straight/non-straight for female and male characters. That's at least eight romance options there to cover all their bases, though devs can and double dip on some categories by making characters bi or enabling characters to convert them from one alignment to another. Still, most devs seem to have an inclination to be increadibly lazy in this department, so in short, while I think Romances in games (particularly in rpgs) are a good idea in theory, I find the scope of the execution is often severely lacking.

 

[GabeZhul]

After some consideration, I would say my favorite romance was in Ar Tonelico II.
It is a criminally underrated JRPG with some prominent visual novel elements, and even though I admit it has flaws, and by that I mean actual flaws, not the whimsical gameplay elements and the sexual innuendos scattered around that some people couldn't seem to get over, but it has one of the best cast I have ever seen with great character-development and romances that actually take a lot of time, effort and dedication to develop.

Also, I couldn't help but notice that a lot of people mentioned Katawa Shoujo which, while a unique and interesting story, wouldn't really be the first example that would spring to mind when I want to talk about romantic visual novels.
Also note that in most visual novels tying a a plot/scenario to a heroine/love interest is pretty much a convention, even in the most plot-focused VNs. As such I would say it is a pretty good medium for anyone looking for more romance-oriented works, though they have a tendency to be extremely formulaic in their own way.

Finally, for Skyrim/Fable, you guys are missing a crucial point: those are not "romances". In Skyrim it is pretty much spelled out that finding a spouse through the amulet of Mara is not really about love but about convenience, both in-universe and in game-mechanics. It compares better to arranged marriages where both parties get something out of the deal and has nothing to do with the feelings of the participants.
Oh, yeah, and Skyrim actually has one awesome romance: Serana in Dawnguard. Sadly Bethesda messed it up pretty hard by not allowing her to be married, but if you choose the right conversation options throughout the Dawnguard quest-line, it becomes blindingly obvious that there is a lot of chemistry and affection between the Dragonborn and her, and this romance actually makes a lot of sense taken just how much both of them rely on the other.

As for Fable... Pfff... It's a joke, really. In fact, the "romance" in these games are so pointless it makes Skyrim's marriage look downright heartwarming in comparison. At least in Skyrim you had to friggin talk to someone and do a quest for them before the option came up, while in Fable you can walk in a town while being 100% good and just throw a wedding ring to the first person who you meet (and who will immediately fall in love with you for some reason) without even knowing their name!

 

[Something Amyss]

I tend to dislike them, and find them awkward at best. As such, I don't normally pursue them unless there's a reward.

I feel like I should make a "just like real life" joke here, but my girlfriend reads The Escapist and would kill me.

 

[DementedSheep]

Assuming we are talking about with an undefined PC. I like to see all available content and often you learn more about a character that way (biware RPG's tend to lock half of you're companions stories and interactions behind a romance. I wish they had better friendship paths) which is why I do the romances in games. I?m not a romantic person though it can add to the plot and give opportunities to characteristic your PC. If its adds nothing I don?t bother.

I find a lot of video game romances turn romance into ego stroking ?Oh PLAYERNAME you?re so awesome and beautiful and other nonspecific things, lets have sex? type crap. I suppose if you have a PC that could have number or personalities or little of one it?s hard to write a convincing romance or once in which the character actually argue occasionally and feel like their own people.

With a defined PC it can be done well but most games don't have great writing to begin with and I think they suffer from the same issue as movies do where there just isn't enough time to develop a relationship properly. It ends up feeling awkward, contrived or like a cheap plot device.

Not related to the topic but I swear if the next piece of fiction I watch or read has a drawn out love triangle or stalking is hot I'm going to go on a fucking murderous rampage.

 

[Evil Smurf]

I liked the Saints Row 4 school of thought. It got to the point and was kinda funny.
<youtube=wVMQg0tnsVg>