School Uniform

[HonorableChairman]

I went to Catholic boy's school and we didn't have so much of a uniform as a business dress code. (Dress pants, tucked in dress shirt, tie, belt, dress shoes, shortish hair, no piercings etc)

Other than that the student had free reign. You could wear neon green pants if you so chose.

As for proper uniforms, however, I see no real issue with them and I think people who find some deep-seated problem they cause are really just trying to justify complaining. (although weather should be taken more into account when they design the things, I'll concede that.)

 

[Abedeus]

I am for all women in uniform. Ahem.

ALL FEMALE OFFICERS WILL BE REQUIRED TO WEAR TINY MINI-SKIRTS!!

Ahem, sure, obviously I have nothing against female clothes. Considering they are in 95% skirts...

 

[Naeo]

Many American PUBLIC schools have no uniform. To my knowledge almost all the private ones do. And all the public school uniforms that I know of/about are basically "polo shirt with khaki pants/shorts/skirt if you're a girl".

 

[esperandote]

You wear those clothes when you are learning in school, so when you put those clothes on you know you are going into learn and not screw around. It gets you into the working mindset.

Shittest excuse ever.

What I wear has no effect on my abilities to learn and absorb information.

What about what others wear? mini skirts, thight jeans, low cleaveges

 

[AndyFromMonday]

Well in one of my previous posts I did mention kids from other schools entering the school grounds to start a fight, I also stated it has happened before and he was caught before it could happen.

Again, with so many teachers in sight it would have been impossible for the child in question to actually start a fight. Unless, that is, the teachers are incompetent.

Not every school is like yours. My area isn't the richest of areas, a lot of kids can't get much. Also bullying isn't only physical, it is also verbal, they can get teased for wearing certain clothes lowering their self esteem. As stated before, kids are cruel and will find whatever excuse they can to bring someone down and clothes give them an easy target.

And wouldn't that happen eitherway? They can find the fact that the uniform will most likely be dirty or that they don't own the current "gadgets". Honestly, uniforms do nothing to aleviate this and not to mention the cost to the so called "poor" family in order to actually buy that uniform. Also, if your area is poor and the majority of kids that go to school are poor then that means any "rich kid" will be bullied if he ever dares to open his mouth. The majority usually trumphs upon the minority.

It's psychological. Your sub-concious mind identifies those clothes with learning. It happens with other activities, not necessarily clothes are the item you would identify, but for school a uniform usually does the trick.

What about your backpack and books? What about the fact that you're heading towards a school? What about the fact that you're in a school? What about the fact that you're preparing for class? Your sub-concious identifies these things with learning as well.

You are obviously very set against this

No. I am simply set against undermining the freedom of expression of children and forcing them to wear uncomfortable uniforms that do jack shit.

As in most debates I see no way of changing your opinion

Of course you will not change my opinion unless you actually provide arugments. You can either debunk my attempt at debunking your crap or you can admit that there is no justifiable reason for uniforms when everything an uniform can do can be done so by other means without making the students uncomfortable.

o im not going to bother,

If you can't change someone's opinion ignore their every argument and assume you have the upper hand, right?

my point was it helps but you obviously don't see it that way.

No, I do not see any justifiable need to force uniforms upon children. If you have any other argument or want to disprove my own arguments and debunking's to your own then you are free to do so.

I was using my experience as a teacher which I think should count for something but hey what do I know.

That's an argument from authority and that's bullshit. But hey, if you want to dance to that song then why not. I was using my experience as a student but hey, what do I know. I was only exposed to the so called "bad side" of school life for about 12 years and I truly know nothing about how school works.

You wear those clothes when you are learning in school, so when you put those clothes on you know you are going into learn and not screw around. It gets you into the working mindset.

Shittest excuse ever.

What I wear has no effect on my abilities to learn and absorb information.

What about what others wear? mini skirts, thight jeans, low cleaveges

That's called a dress code. It's complete different from uniforms.

 

[AndyFromMonday]

Double post, ignore.

 

[Mr Montmorency]

You are obviously very set against this, As in most debates I see no way of changing your opinion so im not going to bother, my point was it helps but you obviously don't see it that way, I was using my experience as a teacher which I think should count for something but hey what do I know.

Your position as a teacher gives you no pull in this argument seeing as you don't wear a uniform anyway and don't know the problems people have to deal with when they're forced to.

If you're not going to bother, then you've given up and lost because you have no points. Don't act as if you're all high and mighty about it by playing the authority card.

You know just because I teach doesn't mean I don't wear a uniform you know I still wear a shirt and look respectful and even when I was a kid I wore a uniform so don't say I know nothing about the subject. I have points but you don't consider them valid for some reason when others have pointed them out and agreed with them.

I have not lost, in fact how can you lose when an opinion is subjective? a discussion is two people trying to convince each other that their viewpoint is the best, just because I see no point in trying to debate with you means I have lost it just means you not a very good person to debate with, you come across as very ignorant and aggresive, if someone disagrees with you then they are obviously wrong etc. There is being assertive and getting your point across and then there is being aggressive which just alienates peoples and makes people not want to talk to you, maybe you should take that into consideration.

Let's not go down this route again. Don't play the hero because you can't back up your points.

I'm not being ignorant. If being ignorant is being adamant that my conclusion is correct unless proven otherwise... then I guess I'm ignorant.

Also, as discussed at length throughout the topic, this situation is not subjective. This argument is not about "liking" the uniform or not, as subjectivity would denote. Many of the complaints have been over the practicality (or lack thereof) which denotes objectivity. So... yeah.

If this was subjective in any way, nobody would possibly be arguing over this because there would be no point. You're confusing the two because you yourself are ignorant about the situation and refuse to change your mind. Which is why you have "given up" if you truly had a decent point, you would have tried to convince us, and if it didn't work, you should have realised your point was flawed. But you played the "subjective" card.

 

[2012 Wont Happen]

School uniforms seem needless to me. Our school gets along fine without them.

However, I wouldn't mind a school uniform if the school would let us cut our hair and get piercings how we want to. I can understand wanting us to wear certain things when at school, but making rules that effect how we always look is ridiculous.

 

[Mr Montmorency]

You wear those clothes when you are learning in school, so when you put those clothes on you know you are going into learn and not screw around. It gets you into the working mindset.

Shittest excuse ever.

What I wear has no effect on my abilities to learn and absorb information.

What about what others wear? mini skirts, thight jeans, low cleaveges

Then that's your problem. If you don't learn to deal with it, then how will you learn how to do it in real life? Exactly what school has a part in teaching. Well, they would if they didn't have uniforms.

 

[NoblePhilistineFox]

I dont have a school uniform, but I wear the same thing every day anyway so... :/

 

[Trace2010]

In the Summer heat, I'm really hating my school uniform. Everyday we have to wear and keep on for most of the day, a dark blazer so you can imagine the nasty sweat patches. I hear that in America most schools have no uniform, I rule I would love. It would mean actually being able to keep cool in the heat and not being boiled alive. I hear a lot of arguments for and against having no uniform and was wondering how people are coping with the heat (in London anyway) and what they think about school uniform in general.

Nope...we now have mandatory school unis up through middle school- though most schools will allow students to wear their activity "spirit shirts"- for music, sports, etc, almost everyday of the year. PTA usually also sells acceptable T-shirts as a fundraiser as well.

 

[Fearzone]

Catholic school girl uniforms are my favorite.

 

[Jamieson 90]

You are obviously very set against this, As in most debates I see no way of changing your opinion so im not going to bother, my point was it helps but you obviously don't see it that way, I was using my experience as a teacher which I think should count for something but hey what do I know.

Your position as a teacher gives you no pull in this argument seeing as you don't wear a uniform anyway and don't know the problems people have to deal with when they're forced to.

If you're not going to bother, then you've given up and lost because you have no points. Don't act as if you're all high and mighty about it by playing the authority card.

You know just because I teach doesn't mean I don't wear a uniform you know I still wear a shirt and look respectful and even when I was a kid I wore a uniform so don't say I know nothing about the subject. I have points but you don't consider them valid for some reason when others have pointed them out and agreed with them.

I have not lost, in fact how can you lose when an opinion is subjective? a discussion is two people trying to convince each other that their viewpoint is the best, just because I see no point in trying to debate with you means I have lost it just means you not a very good person to debate with, you come across as very ignorant and aggresive, if someone disagrees with you then they are obviously wrong etc. There is being assertive and getting your point across and then there is being aggressive which just alienates peoples and makes people not want to talk to you, maybe you should take that into consideration.

Let's not go down this route again. Don't play the hero because you can't back up your points.

I'm not being ignorant. If being ignorant is being adamant that my conclusion is correct unless proven otherwise... then I guess I'm ignorant.

Also, as discussed at length throughout the topic, this situation is not subjective. This argument is not about "liking" the uniform or not, as subjectivity would denote. Many of the complaints have been over the practicality (or lack thereof) which denotes objectivity. So... yeah.

If this was subjective in any way, nobody would possibly be arguing over this because there would be no point. You're confusing the two because you yourself are ignorant about the situation and refuse to change your mind. Which is why you have "given up" if you truly had a decent point, you would have tried to convince us, and if it didn't work, you should have realised your point was flawed. But you played the "subjective" card.

Well my opinion is subjective, I think wearing uniform is good is subjective, I did raise good points earlier in the thread which I think you missed.

Here they are

1. It allows staff to easily identify pupils and distinguish them from intruders that might present a threat.

2. It helps to reduce bullying as everyone looks the same or similar whereas kids from poor backgrounds might be singled out if their clothes are seen to be scruffy etc.

3. It protects your real clothes from damage or theft.

4. It prepares you for work in the future as you will most likely have to wear a suit and tie in most jobs.

5. It helps you, most kids are tired in the morning and picking out clothes is a pain.

6. It helps you get into the work mentality, Uniform is for school and work, own clothes are for play and outside etc.

I went to some extent to explain why I thought those points were valid but like I said before you obviously disagreed and I'm not going to waste my time on someone who feels so strongly about the subjective when I know I can't convince them to my point of view.

Thats it, im not replying because there is no point, but hey if you want the last word and the need to feel like you have "won" then go right ahead.

 

[hurfdurp]

I wish we had uniforms in High School, assuming they were sensible. It would have alleviated a lot of class disparity, and I would never have had to see the outline of people's balls in their skinny jeans. I think it would create more of a sense of unity, and probably look pretty classy. At the very least, no one would ostracize you for what you were wearing, that has to count for something.

 

[Trace2010]

I can't really see the argument for uniforms. Dress Codes yes, but taking it to the uniform extreme? I was so much happier with everything once I left the catholic school uniform system.

Some people abuse the privilege, but that's why we have dress codes.

Some people abuse the dress codes...thus, schools have uniforms...

 

[El Poncho]

Well in one of my previous posts I did mention kids from other schools entering the school grounds to start a fight, I also stated it has happened before and he was caught before it could happen.

Again, with so many teachers in sight it would have been impossible for the child in question to actually start a fight. Unless, that is, the teachers are incompetent.

Not every school is like yours. My area isn't the richest of areas, a lot of kids can't get much. Also bullying isn't only physical, it is also verbal, they can get teased for wearing certain clothes lowering their self esteem. As stated before, kids are cruel and will find whatever excuse they can to bring someone down and clothes give them an easy target.

And wouldn't that happen eitherway? They can find the fact that the uniform will most likely be dirty or that they don't own the current "gadgets". Honestly, uniforms do nothing to aleviate this and not to mention the cost to the so called "poor" family in order to actually buy that uniform. Also, if your area is poor and the majority of kids that go to school are poor then that means any "rich kid" will be bullied if he ever dares to open his mouth. The majority usually trumphs upon the minority.

It's psychological. Your sub-concious mind identifies those clothes with learning. It happens with other activities, not necessarily clothes are the item you would identify, but for school a uniform usually does the trick.

What about your backpack and books? What about the fact that you're heading towards a school? What about the fact that you're in a school? What about the fact that you're preparing for class? Your sub-concious identifies these things with learning as well.

1. Out of the building in the playground there is generally no teachers, maybe one or two passing by every 10minutes.(This is my school, since I have been to no other school I cannot base it on anything else)

2. I can't deny that, but clothes are more in the open, not everyone brings their gadgets to school, their clothes may be dirty but they could hand wash them if things got desperate where as at the time they may not be able to buy new clothes. My area is poor in parts but there is certain bits with rich families and the other surrounding areas.

3. Yes they could trigger it as well, but if you are also wearing clothes you would, lets say wear when sitting about the house/going out and having fun you may identify them with doing nothing. You will always have the feeling of your clothes on you while in school. I will have to admit that it would vary with different people since not everyone is the same, but with a uniform you are covering all bases.

 

[Unhappy Crow]

I live in DC, and no matter what school you went to, you have to wear uniform. I got use to it for many years. From yellow shirt and green pants in elementary to white shirt and blue pants in junior high to white shirt and black pants (with the school belt) and black shoes in high school. Now that I'm in college, I'm glad I can finally wear whatever I want.

 

[Mr Snuffles]

-snip-.

Can't afford more clothes?! Fuck off, do you know how much uniforms cost? Give or take, it's over double the cost of any ordinary clothing item because it's tailor made for the school. If anything, it means nothing because then the indication for poor kids would be the ones who can't afford the uniform instead - making the whole idea mute in the first place.

Also, poor kids are never the ones who are bullied. The poor kids are the ones who do bully. They're poor for a reason, it's because they have shitty parents, ego, they're pricks. I know. I went to school with kids who never bothered wearing uniforms and turned up in tracksuit bottoms and Nike shoes - chavs.

You're really DIGGING now.

I can argue against you from a first hand point of view. I go to a (rather expensive) fee-paying school in Manchester (and before you call me a rich prick, I'm going to state that I am on a bursary), and the rich kids do take pride of place. There is a popular brand which is expensive called Superdry, and all the rich kids have it, and I have come in in cheaper items of clothing from Topman. You have no idea the kind of abuse I received, I got spat at, hit, shouted at etc. from all the posh children from their 3 story mansions in Cheshire, who deem that the poorer kids are inferior to them and therefore they can seize control.

So yes, poor kids ARE bullied, and quite frequently too...

PS. No, my parents aren't shitty, they work hard for the living they do, and look after me very well. I don't try to deny the fact that I'm poor, I take it on the chin and accept it, and as far as I'm aware, I'm not a prick...

 

[Bourne]

You'll appreciate the uniform later in life, when you think about having to look at Ed Hardy and clever one-liner t-shirts the rest of your life.

 

[Grayjack]

No uniforms were I lived. I kinda wish we did have them, though. I don't feel like looking at teenagers with their pants around their knees.