Security Guard kicks ass and takes name.

[II2]

*looks at thread*

>__O

I think regardless of your feelings on the politics and cultures, we can at least agree that it's very bad thing when people get shot, but that violence in self defense is (often) justified and that being rushed by multiple hooded, armed men is sufficient justification to take action.

 

[Goofguy]

Say what you will about the security guard but the suspects had it coming. They were rushing armed in to that building with the intent to rob the place. If you put yourself in such a position, you better be ready to face the potential consequences (imprisonment, death, injury).

It's easy to sit here and critique the security guard. Until you find yourself in that situation with three armed thugs coming towards you, you can't really speak against him. Often, such split second decisions could mean the difference between life and death.

 

[axlryder]

I'm pretty sure there was no name-taking done by the security guard in this video. I'm disappointed by the misleading title.

Well, it was a time to kick ass and take some names...without taking the names.

Probably obscure video game reference for the win!
For the record, it's from Deer Avenger 4

Yeah, I'd say that ranks about an 8.5 on my obscurometer.

 

[Savryc]

Good on him, I'd happily buy the guard a pint. Let those scumbags rot for all I care if you're going in armed it's obvious what your intention is, no sympathy for them whatsoever and a giant...


...to the people trying to bash the security guard for doing his job with zero casualties.

 

[Nickolai77]

Not to belittle the security guard or anything, but he could have heard them running outside before they opened the door, warning him to their presence hence his startlingly quick reaction time.

Still- very impressive performance from the security guard. He saw armed figures running at him in ski masks. Obviously a very dangerous situation but he what was necessary.

 

[Saladfork]

I'm going into security myself, and security guys aren't allowed to carry firearms in Alberta unless autherized by the soliciter general, and he generally only allows it for armoured van companys and bodyguards. I'm actually rather glad that I won't have an option for lethal force, since I'd rather not have the risk of somebody dying over a misjudgement on my part. Hopefully if and when I join the police, the training will be good enough to where I'll feel cmfortable with my own judgement in that regard, but I don't right now.

That said, I think this guy did the right thing, considering the high liklihood of criminals being armed in the states.

 

[DoPo]

I'm pretty sure there was no name-taking done by the security guard in this video. I'm disappointed by the misleading title.

Well, it was a time to kick ass and take some names...without taking the names.

Probably obscure video game reference for the win!
For the record, it's from Deer Avenger 4

Yeah, I'd say that ranks about an 8.5 on my obscurometer.

No worries, I didn't even remember that game until I saw your post. And I realised I haven't heard anybody mention it in...a very long tome. We're talking 8+ years here. You're excused.

But if you have the opportunity, do try DA4, say if they release it on GOG or something. It's incredibly fun game - a deer is hunting hunters. And he looks like this

Also, you get fart powers. And lots of hilarious quotes.

 

[GundamSentinel]

I'm on the fence. Here in the Netherlands, because of the relatively small presence of organized crime and drug problems and yes (it's silly to deny it), because of gun control (well, maybe not gun control itself, but more the national attitude towards it), gun crimes are very rare. The reaction of this security guard would be unthinkable here, and not just because he'd probably be prosecuted into jail for shooting someone without a 100% clear cause. This situation just doesn't really happen here, and certainly not on a regular basis.

But I can certainly understand how these situations would exist in America and how the security guard's reaction would (and maybe should) be condoned. It's a matter of atmosphere and attitude, both of which are very different here than in the US. That's why I can't really blame the security guard for the way he reacted.

That said, I don't think he should be lauded for it either (I frankly find that abhorrent). He did what he thought was right, considering the circumstances. Whether it was the right thing, I don't know. It's not the way I'd reacted, but again, I can't blame the guy for doing what he did.

 

[McMullen]

You may be European and therefore unaware of this, but guns still work when you're laying down. For all that guard knew, the failed robber was about to turn around and start shooting back.

I love comments like this. I've seen more and bigger guns during visits to Europe than I have while growing up and living in the US.

 

[GistoftheFist]

As expected. Gun thread = belittle/insult America for having them.

I propose we invent a new ___'s Law: anytime violence/shooting happens, someone will mention America in a negative way every time. Sort of like Godwin's Law.

 

[username sucks]

What? Hes being complemented for this? In the video you can clearly see that they turn to run as soon as he pulls the gun, but he still keeps shooting them as they are running. He did react quickly, but he also definitly overreacted here. If they are already running, why whould he shoot them? I would complement him if he stopped shooting as soon as he noticed that they were running, but he keeps shooting even at the guy who is crawling out the door.
Captcha: Lets be serious now

Let me know how rational you are thinking when 3 armed men, with hoods covering their faces rush into your store/cafe/whatever and you are (literally) caught in the moment.
I had the pleasure of being dragged along at gunpoint in the morning when me and my co-workers were opening the supermarket I worked at at the time. I didn't have a gun to draw on them, but on the way (whilst being pushed forward by the muggers) from the kantina where I was putting on my workclothes to the office where the safe is located, I was activating every silent alarm I could get my hands on.

In hindsight it may have been a dumb thing to do, because if the muggers actually did their homework and knew where all the silent alarms were and how to activate them, they would have put a stop to me before I even got the chance. Maybe even with a bullet.

But those are snap-decisions you make in the heat of the moment.

You have the benefit of hindsight and even misplaced sympathy for the robbers. These guys took a chance by trying to rob a place, and actions have consequences. They got more than they could handle, I applaud the security guard for his swift and decisive action which probably saved lives and kept whatever customers were in the building at the time from a traumatic experience. I had to get fucking therapy to get over my ordeal, because having a gun pushed against the back of your skull is not something that you just shrug off.

This whole event took less than 5 seconds, you had the entire length of the video, plus maybe a few extra minutes to write a post about that. You can't compare these situations. You can't judge what the security guard should have done. It does not work that way.

Put some more thought into your replies before you shoot your mouth off.

If you finished reading my comment, you would have seen that I said his quick reaction was commendable, but I didn't like that he continued to shoot at a guy that was crawling on the ground after already being shot. Also, you just said that I spoke incorrectly because I had too much time to think about it, then told me to think more before posting. And I thought that the whole point of a comment section on a news article is for people to analyse the news. I said what he should have done, but I never said that he should be expected to do it, because I know its a stressful situation. I know, because I have had my former best friend try to kill me punching me in the head while trying to drown me in a pool. I didnt think clearly, and I didn't expect anyone to in a bad situation.

 

[username sucks]

What? Hes being complemented for this? In the video you can clearly see that they turn to run as soon as he pulls the gun, but he still keeps shooting them as they are running. He did react quickly, but he also definitly overreacted here. If they are already running, why whould he shoot them? I would complement him if he stopped shooting as soon as he noticed that they were running, but he keeps shooting even at the guy who is crawling out the door.
Captcha: Lets be serious now

I did not see them running until several shots were already fired. What I saw was the front one taking cover for a moment before running.

The shots were justified.

As far as the "keep shooting" thing, you ALWAYS keep shooting until you are out of danger, when your life is in danger. That's one of the first rules of firearm defense. You always shoot to kill in a shoot-out scenario, and you keep firing until you are out or until the threat is absolutely eliminated.

What we saw was the would-be thieves leave out the door, but that doesn't mean that they wouldn't have just taken cover behind the door. His shots certainly discouraged that idea.

Like I said, his shooting is justified at the beginning, but the part I didnt like was continuing to fire at a guy he already hit, and who was crawling to get away. Even if that is standard firearm defense, I still question it because in my opinion that part is just wrong. I thought it was overreacting m=because of the stressful situation, but people that had plenty of time to think about it say to do this? Now that is plain wrong.

 

[username sucks]

What? Hes being complemented for this? In the video you can clearly see that they turn to run as soon as he pulls the gun, but he still keeps shooting them as they are running. He did react quickly, but he also definitly overreacted here. If they are already running, why whould he shoot them? I would complement him if he stopped shooting as soon as he noticed that they were running, but he keeps shooting even at the guy who is crawling out the door.
Captcha: Lets be serious now

I have a class D security license, and I can tell you that Security Guards are told the same thing that cops are. You only draw your gun if you're going to use it. Once you start shooting, you keep shooting until the target is dead or out of your LOS. There are no other options.

Which is why I feel this is kind of 'eh'. You're only supposed to draw your gun as a last resort (I would say that in this case it's justified because the three guys were armed, BUT did the security guard really have enough time to realize that they were armed? I'm not sure...)

Still, shooting at a guy thats crawling away and obviously not a threat anymore? That is pretty low, even if you are instructed to do that.

How does being on the floor make you no longer a threat? You may be European and therefore unaware of this, but guns still work when you're laying down. For all that guard knew, the failed robber was about to turn around and start shooting back.

Sorry, but not that it matters, Im American. Also, if you get shot, your thought process is more likely to be "holy shit Im getting out of here" than " I'll just walk it off and rob this place that still has a security guard pointing a gun at me"

 

[Signa]

If it was anything like that other attempted internet cafe robbery, then this guy did the right thing, no question about it.

Seeing the video shows some guys being stopped before they could actually cause harm, which is admittedly a little off-putting. It's harder to 100% justify shooting someone when their only crime up to that point was acting rowdy with a strange sense of apparel. Do I have any doubt that they were up to no good? None at all.

Are you fucking kidding me? Please read your own post again and get back to me on how many things are wrong with that statement. In the meantime I will be busy banging my head against my desk.

Quite flaming me, human torch. I'm agreeing with the situation. Judging by your quoted post I read, you agree too. I just know the gun control advocates love to be whiners about some of these things. "oh dear, he hadn't opened fire on any innocents yet, so he didn't deserve life-threatening injuries!" I was showing them the ground they have to stand on with those statements, and how shallow it was. Could I possibly could have phrased something better? Maybe.

I completely misread your post, consider my first reply retracted. My apologies.

Well, as long as you didn't give yourself a concussion for headdesking, mind telling me what you thought I meant? Since I wrote it, it's hard to misread it and know what you were thinking.

 

[axlryder]

No worries, I didn't even remember that game until I saw your post. And I realised I haven't heard anybody mention it in...a very long tome. We're talking 8+ years here. You're excused.

But if you have the opportunity, do try DA4, say if they release it on GOG or something. It's incredibly fun game - a deer is hunting hunters. And he looks like this

Also, you get fart powers. And lots of hilarious quotes.

The image has told me everything I need to know. Playing this game is now mandatory. I only wish I'd known of its existence sooner. Kind of looks like Earthworm Jim meets Duke Nukem.

 

[James Joseph Emerald]

I should have known this would immediately turn into a gun control / anti-USA flamewar...

Can you blame them? It's a topic that will always remain hot. If people feel the desire to talk about this, then we should we let them. Besides some obvious trolling and name-calling, there is no harm. The day we stop debating is the day humanity has given up.

If only there was a section of this forum where ceaselessly cyclical arguments of a political nature could be carried out without derailing threads that have even the slightest relevance...

Also, I'd hardly call the majority of these posts a "debate". Intellectually Dishonest Person #1 says "Dis iz y Merika is teh evulz!" and Intellectually Dishonest Person #2 says "No! If we dont haf gunz, who will shot all da terrorist?"
Besides, the issue of gun control is irrelevant in this post; the interesting part to debate is whether it was reasonable force. But even that's a very hard argument to sustain, because I don't think you can be expected to spend a lot of time exploring the philosophical ramifications of your actions when three masked gunman storm into your shop. That's a pretty solid 'shoot first, ask questions later' scenario.

 

[The Human Torch]

Well, as long as you didn't give yourself a concussion for headdesking, mind telling me what you thought I meant? Since I wrote it, it's hard to misread it and know what you were thinking.

For a moment I thought that you were angry at the security guard for taking such decisive action. But after going through the thread again, it's more likely that I quoted the wrong post since some time ago they moved the Quote button from the bottom of the post to the top and I still fall for that trap every now and then.
I should really double check more.

 

[The Human Torch]

If only there was a section of this forum where ceaselessly cyclical arguments of a political nature could be carried out without derailing threads that have even the slightest relevance...

Also, I'd hardly call the majority of these posts a "debate". Intellectually Dishonest Person #1 says "Dis iz y Merika is teh evulz!" and Intellectually Dishonest Person #2 says "No! If we dont haf gunz, who will shot all da terrorist?"
Besides, the issue of gun control is irrelevant in this post; the interesting part to debate is whether it was reasonable force. But even that's a very hard argument to sustain, because I don't think you can be expected to spend a lot of time exploring the philosophical ramifications of your actions when three masked gunman storm into your shop. That's a pretty solid 'shoot first, ask questions later' scenario.

I agree 100% with you, all that I was saying that it's hard to keep these kind of debates out. Same reason why you can't make a post that only has the slightest connection to religion, because that ends up in a flamewar as well.

I just like to believe that a few people are very 'passionate' about this and will jump on any occassion just to air their frustrations. The Escapist should have a seperate "Gun-Law" forum section, should be a guaranteed hit.

 

[irmasterlol]

What? Hes being complemented for this? In the video you can clearly see that they turn to run as soon as he pulls the gun, but he still keeps shooting them as they are running. He did react quickly, but he also definitly overreacted here. If they are already running, why whould he shoot them? I would complement him if he stopped shooting as soon as he noticed that they were running, but he keeps shooting even at the guy who is crawling out the door.
Captcha: Lets be serious now

I have a class D security license, and I can tell you that Security Guards are told the same thing that cops are. You only draw your gun if you're going to use it. Once you start shooting, you keep shooting until the target is dead or out of your LOS. There are no other options.

Which is why I feel this is kind of 'eh'. You're only supposed to draw your gun as a last resort (I would say that in this case it's justified because the three guys were armed, BUT did the security guard really have enough time to realize that they were armed? I'm not sure...)

Still, shooting at a guy thats crawling away and obviously not a threat anymore? That is pretty low, even if you are instructed to do that.

How does being on the floor make you no longer a threat? You may be European and therefore unaware of this, but guns still work when you're laying down. For all that guard knew, the failed robber was about to turn around and start shooting back.

Sorry, but not that it matters, Im American. Also, if you get shot, your thought process is more likely to be "holy shit Im getting out of here" than " I'll just walk it off and rob this place that still has a security guard pointing a gun at me"

I was just playing up the "0mg those crazy 'murricans sure love their gunzzzzz" angle for laughs. Now I've never been shot, but I have had my fight or flight response triggered a few times, and I'm sure you have at least once, too. There is no thought process. When people panic, we're unpredictable. If robber guy's instincts tell him that the best way to survive this situation is to kill whatever is hurting him, that's exactly what he's going to do. Even if the odds were 30% chance of shooting back and %70 percent chance of him running, I still wouldn't bet my life on it.

 

[irmasterlol]

You may be European and therefore unaware of this, but guns still work when you're laying down. For all that guard knew, the failed robber was about to turn around and start shooting back.

I love comments like this. I've seen more and bigger guns during visits to Europe than I have while growing up and living in the US.

Come on now, don't tell me you've never heard of playing up stereotypes for laughs. Maybe the part of the U.S. in which you were raised was too liberal for things like this:


But I have to say, the cameraman's apparent childlike glee is my favorite thing about that video.