Silicon Knights Boss Says Used Games Drive Up Prices

[Redd the Sock]

Funny, I remember a time when most games weren't bought, they were rented. I buy more games a year now than I ever owned on my NES, SNES or N64.

Sorry, but I think game companies should look at the industry before jumping on the used market, specifcally oversaturation. Too many games coming out to people on fixed incomes, and of course we find cheaper alternatives. And honestly, when is the last time anyone marketed a six month old game?

 

[Andy Chalk]

Okay, this is just a flat-out lie. I remember new games going for $30.00 less than 20 years ago. Then they nudged up to $40.00, then $50.00, and now here we are at $60.00. Even adjusted for inflation, that's nowhere close to flat.

First of all, don't call me a liar. Second, videogames have always been available at a wide range of prices, but across comparable releases, there is simply no rational way to argue that game prices haven't remained flat.

A few examples:

Chuck Yeager's Advanced Flight Trainer, 1987 - $54.95

Star Trek: The Rebel Universe, 1988 - $61.95

Max Payne, 2001 - $69.99

Morrowind Collector's Edition, 2002 - $79.99

Splinter Cell, 2003 - $59.99

Oblivion Collector's Edition, 2006 - $69.99

Thief: Deadly Shadows, 2004 - $49.99

Diablo, 1996 - $54.99

Diablo 3, 2012 - $59.99

I could go on, but I don't think it's necessary.

 

[Micalas]

There's a reason many believe Steam sales are the true meaning of Christmas; it's the same reason Gabe Newell's pool keeps overflowing.

I thought that was just displacement
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Displacement_(fluid)

CAPTCHA: schoishway. wot?

snip

I don't think you should throw collector's editions in there. Of course their price is higher. Other than that, I agree with what you're saying.

 

[BoogieManFL]

I saw PC games increase to $60 before I heard anything about the evil used game sellers.

Also I've read reports that digital game sales are starting to exceed physical copy sales.


Hmm...

EDIT: I can see their logic too, but what are they going to do about it? It'd be nice if the people who benefit from the used game sales sent some small percentage back directly to the developer that'd be cool.

But let's be honest, we all know how the world works. Something else would have been the cause for game sales increasing because I am sure they'd steadily get more expensive anyway because everyone always wants more for the same work.

 

[Lord Beautiful]

In short:

"Wah, we're not making games people actually want to keep anymore! Damn you, used marketz!"

Suck it up and make shit we don't want to give up. Pursue excellence. You know, that one thing you fuckers actually had a number of years ago.

Seriously, I knew about Too Human, but these were the guys behind X-Men: Destiny? Jesus Christ!

 

[Andy Chalk]

I don't think you should throw collector's editions in there. Of course their price is higher. Other than that, I agree with what you're saying.

It's a range of games. Besides, the relevant point as it applies to those two games is that of two very similar CEs from the same franchise, the cheaper one is also the newer one. And I'm pretty sure Daggerfall (which was only available in one edition) clocked in at $79.99, more than either of the other two.

Anyone who thinks gamers were cheaper 20 years ago wasn't buying games 20 years ago.

 

[Baresark]

snip

I know you didn't say anything about online passes. They used that same set of excuses to justify it.

Listen, I'm not trying to start a fight. But you are living in a fantasy land. They aren't looking for a reason to reduce game prices. And you are just buying their lines, which is good because you are who they are selling to. You stated that if they got just 3% of revenues they would be inclined to reduce prices. They would not be, nor will they be inclined to drop prices. If they got their 3%, they would want 5%. If they got 10%, they would want 20%.

They could reduce prices. They could rein in spending. They could utilize time and manpower much better. They could stop spending $20 Million for a product they could make for half that or less. They could make the first move. They don't do any of these things. They want people to make the first move. Well, people have made the first move, they did what all people will always do: They buy games for as cheap as they possibly can. Anything else would be just pure insanity.

 

[Micalas]

I don't think you should throw collector's editions in there. Of course their price is higher. Other than that, I agree with what you're saying.

It's a range of games. Besides, the relevant point as it applies to those two games is that of two very similar CEs from the same franchise, the cheaper one is also the newer one. And I'm pretty sure Daggerfall (which was only available in one edition) clocked in at $79.99, more than either of the other two.

Anyone who thinks gamers were cheaper 20 years ago wasn't buying games 20 years ago.

Oh, I got ya. I didn't even notice that Morrowind was more expensive than Oblivion. Impressive data point for your argument. I'm only 22 so I wasn't buying games 20 years ago. You can bet your ass I was playing them though. My NES still works. Prices for the most part, have indeed remained flat. My knowledge is more from the past 10-15 years, but this is and has been the equilibrium for quite some time.

That said, I don't believe for a minute that when we one day go 100% digital that the savings will be passed onto us. New releases will still be around $60. Bet on it.

 

[Lunar Templar]

i saw 'silicon knights' and my first thought was 'so .... a company that makes shitty games is bitching now? good for them, hate see them waste time on making a game of theirs good'

meh, just another dev whining about not getting the cut from a sale they have no claim to

Did you actually even read it?
He says that syndicated used games sellers like gamestop removed the possibility of long term sellers.
THAT IS A BAD THING.

i skimmed it.
well for them its bad, but then again, i pretty much just use steam now, so, i couldn't really care less about what ever lame 'rewording' they wanna use for they're crying over, again, 'not getting a cut of sale they have no claim to'

sides, with all the crap most devs and publishers pull on us, i find it hard to care when they start bitching like this

But he said that digital distribution is a great thing!
He said that the loss of long term sales sucks and force publishers to sell allot of copies early.
But some dev's can survive on low selling over a long time but that has been stopped by gamestop.
Tough luck for them sell a million copies in a month or die! it goes now.
Steam is an example of selling in the long run.
Digital distribution returns the long term sales that the industry lost back in the early 2000's

return of the sale figures is only really good for them, not us.

we'll still get saddled with shit in the AAA field that's not worth the cost of entry, with content a mounting to little more then DLC, but they'll have they're sales ....

good
for
them
-.-
no, if you'll excuse me, I'll be sifting through all the shit to find something i actually want to play

 

[CoL0sS]

Hmmm wasn't something like this already discussed in <a href=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.354980-Used-Game-Sales-Killing-Single-Player-Titles?page=1>this article, more specifically this part

Braben said that having a game sell out the first day is not a good thing anymore. "The idea of a game selling out used to be a good thing, but nowadays, those people who buy it on day one may well finish it and return it," he said. "People will say 'Oh well, I paid all this money and it's mine to do with as I will', but the problem is that's what's keeping the retail price up.

"Prices would have come down long ago if the industry was getting a share of the resells," Braben stated.

While a small smart part tried to agree in soft,thin voice, a bigger part just knocked the door down and punched him in the stomach.

I think it's more about the greed. No one ever mentions stupid, unsuccessful ways publishers have been fighting used games,. No one ever tries to provide us with desirable alternatives that aren't forced on us. No one ever argues when developers sell their digitally distributed, popular titles at $70 several months after release. No one ever points at GameStop, or tires to come up with some sort of deal to satisfaction of all parties.
Nah, it's easier to argue the whole concept while trying to come up with one argument that will make you seem less greedy.

No, it's always guys like

Silicon Knights chief Denis Dyack

or indeed

David Braben - a veteran game developer since he made the space trading sim Elite

that try to argue, instead of making a game that justifies it's $60 price tag. Something I would gladly purchase, even after those first two weeks when their revenue decreases because people are more inclined to buy it used.

 

[BrotherRool]

This is a fun debate to have once. Less so when we have it the fiftieth time with no new information or arguments

 

[Keslen]

Solution: Lower the cost of a new game the farther it gets from its release date. It'll effectively destroy the used game market, but the player will get their games even cheaper (if they're willing to wait a bit for 'em).

 

[Snow Fire]

What this man says is absurd, and simply baseless conjecture, and I for one will not stand for this. *puffs cheeks*

Also, we need the used game market, without it, how would people with lower incomes even enjoy the gifts of gaming. If they really wanted to save a ton of cash, and cut the price, they'd go drm-free digital distribution all the way, allowing you to copy the game to your own discs/sd card/whatever as many times as you want, and install on any number of computers you own. And maybe just completely cut their marketing departments, and use social media and Google for advertising.

 

[Veldel]

It's funny since your company has yet to MAKE a game that's WORTH $60.

Eternal Darkness Sanirys Requiam was amazing and still love it guess thats why i payed full price and still play it.

P.S Pinkie Pie is best pony

OT: He makes a few good points while I almost never buy used games mostly due to liking my games in pristine condition. I do feel the used game market is hurting games some mostly smaller games sense it has become now that first sales can make or break a company due to sleeper hits being how some made most there sales

I think DD&PC is suffering most from DRM its why i dont get to many titles that way minus GOG

 

[80Maxwell08]

Well to be a bit off topic here at the closest Gamestop near my house there is a new copy of Too Human. It has been there for a few years now. Every time I go in there I debate if I should buy it out of pity and to finish it since I owned it before and I wonder how it ended. I never do because they never lowered the price of it from $30. It has been at that price for those years it has been there. I do wonder if that lonely game will ever be taken home.

 

[Kroxile]

Bullshit.

The only thing that increases the cost of new videogames is greed. Plain, simple, cut, and dried.

When the medium does eventually go to digital distribution publishers will still charge $60+ dollars for their games. It won't matter. Piracy, Used Games, etc are just fall guys that these companies use to justify their greed and piss poor treatment of their customers.

And this pure greed is why every one of these companies has kept their prices the same over a period wherein inflation has meant the value of te dollar has gone lower.

Whats wrong inside your head?

Aside from dealing with the relatively short memories of my more ignorant cohorts in this shared hobby, nothing.

Games just last gen were only 30-40 dollars brand new... 50 for whatever CE they had.

Whats wrong inside your head?

 

[koroem]

Give me Too Human 2 and you will make money? Stop talking and go develop. Go go go.

Captcha on the forums now... SERIOUSLY? I'm so tired of Captcha bs everytime I want to do something on the internet...