So apparently JonTron is a racist

[Terminal Blue]

Perhaps because dismissing arguments just because they come from Sargon makes you seem like the sort of bigot that he made his Youtube career in criticizing?

I don't consider it bigotry to refuse to watch awful youtube videos. If anything, I consider it bigotry to insult my intelligence by making awful youtube videos and expecting me to watch them and thus facilitate you making more of them.

If you can't even read the correct study for a video you're making, if you instead read a completely different, unrelated study but don't read past the first page, if you cite statistics from a piece of research whose conclusion entirely disagrees with your own without making this clear, then you've forfeited your right to my time. Not because of who you are, but because you've demonstrated how little you actually think of your audience.

Oh, and openly laughing at the idea of women being orally raped.. that was pretty shit too. Not sure I'm totally down with that.

 

[gigastar]

Oh, and openly laughing at the idea of women being orally raped.. that was pretty shit too. Not sure I'm totally down with that.

This is news to me, got a link to it?

Honestly, at this point if I want to see an end to Sargon's relevance I just have to sit here and watch as he gets himself banned from Twitter for posting gay porn.

If theres one thing i know Twitter does, its that they dont ban people for posting porn.

Not even child porn, if what i hear about Malaysian Twitter is even partially true.

 

[Skatologist]

JonTron has reemerged.

And nothing of value was said. Again, the blatant ignorance of people toward criticism of white people fucking astounds me.

Also since nobody showed it yet:

 

[Terminal Blue]

If theres one thing i know Twitter does, its that they dont ban people for posting porn.

They don't ban you for talking about immigration either.

But they do ban you for repeatedly sending gay porn to specific people in an effort to "trigger" or harass them, because how better to entertain both sides like a rational person than to tweet images of guys entertaining both sides, amiright?

 

[shrekfan246]

Perhaps because dismissing arguments just because they come from Sargon makes you seem like the sort of bigot that he made his Youtube career in criticizing?

(That's rhetorical, by the way. I've been around long enough to know how the "WELL YOU'RE THE REAL BIGOT" shtick goes.)

If you want to see an end to Sargon's relevence you wont get it by flinging point blank dismissals and buzzwords at anyone who links to him, the bulk of his fans are people who have grown sick of seeing exactly this happening in political discourse and they will certainly not come to your point of view if your only response is to refuse to engage.

Except, as I've already said, there's no point in engaging with any of his fans, because they refuse to acknowledge that anyone else has a valid point of view in the first place.

Like, dude, I've done this before. Many times. I've tried, again and again. I've been doing this dance for literal years now. Sargon himself refuses to accede that his position is incorrect when actual facts counter him, and that sort of personality attracts fans who act the exact same way. And in this era of everything being called "fake news" it's even more pointless, because now all of these right-wing pundits and their frothing fans have a quick and easy label that they can slap on everything they don't like. There's no point trying to get them to see things from my perspective, because they're actively refusing to even entertain the idea that any other perspectives might be valid. And like I said, they do this in the direct face of literal facts that prove that their perspective is misinformed, ignorant, or otherwise untrue, sometimes even misreading those facts and trying to use them as support for their own positions.

I disagree on this, the best way to discredit someone is to let them represent thier viewpoint to the masses, therefore digging thier own graves if their views are grossly out of sync with the popular opinion.

My point was that I don't need to give them any credit. I'm far past letting anyone like Sargon, or Thunderf00t, or Paul Elam, or Roosh V, or Mike Cernovich, or Matt Forney, or Davis Aurini, or whatever other Youtube blabbermouth have the benefit of the doubt, because I've seen and read enough from them and their fans to know that... well, frankly, my time is better used just not bothering trying to refute them or anyone who agrees with them.

Let me reiterate, I have actively seen and heard and read what their positions on various political subjects are, and I made the informed decision based upon that knowledge to disregard the things that they have to say. I'm not just off-handedly dismissing people because I don't like them or because I'm some feminazi beta SJW who wants to censor everyone; I'm actively deciding that they're not worth my time because their ideas are so retrograde and come from such a fantasy world depiction of the world that literally sitting here staring at a wall would be a better use of my time. I've said it before and I'll say it again and I'll keep saying it until the end of time: I don't need to tolerate other peoples' intolerance. Not putting up with the active subjugation of minorities and women is in nowhere near the same ballpark as criticizing and mocking insecure white men with an overinflated and honestly rather pathetic view of masculinity.

 

[Dansen]

JonTron has reemerged.

He is so full of shit. I can't get through it in one sitting, his condescension is palpable. Now that he is alone on his private channel he can portray himself as the reasonable one to all his subscribers. Look, Destiny wasn't great either, If he was interested in having a real debate he would have found a moderator(and I don't mean some yokel from youtube). That being said Destiny actually tried to have some type of dialogue with Jon, while Jon did everything in his power to avoid it. The whole video was Jon makes bold, vaguely racist claim, Destiny challenges him on his claim, Jon smugly laughs and changes the subject. Rinse and repeat. Their are points he made in this video I am fine with, I even agree with a lot of them, but he needs to own up to the fact that what he said during the "debate" had some serious implications. The issue of racial identity is a complex one, one that I don't think John grasps at all.

 

[gigastar]

Now that he is alone on his private channel he can portray himself as the reasonable one to all his subscribers.

The video was posted as unlisted, so the only people who are going to see it are the drama vultures like us.

 

[Dansen]

Now that he is alone on his private channel he can portray himself as the reasonable one to all his subscribers.

The video was posted as unlisted, so the only people who are going to see it are the drama vultures like us.

I'm torn on it being a mature move or him just trying to protect his channel, probably a bit of both. My point still stands. He is prettying up and glossing over things he said in the debate in order to appear more reasonable.

 

[zellosoli]

i would advise actually watching it even if you don't like it, and pick apart his arguments based on what he actually says on a regular basis

Why, though?

His videos, much like videos from the vast majority of bloviating right-wing talking heads, are exercises in Gish Gallops of propaganda and conspiracy that are only actually believable to the people who are already on his side. Moreover, it's not our job, as random users on the internet, to refute the claims of racist idiots. Certainly it's tempting, because when confronted with so much that's so wrong our inherent interest lies in correcting them, but I can pretty definitively say that doing so honestly makes zero difference because the people who support heads like Sargon don't actually care about refutations "based on what he actually says". Something interesting about the alt-right is that they don't let facts get in the way of their perception of the world. And more to the point, they tend to rely on things that have already been proven wrong to support their positions, even after being shown how their evidence is wrong.

Sometimes it's just not worth entertaining "both sides". Also, I don't know if you're a fan of the guy or just came to different conclusions about him, but it's really smugly dismissive to assume that someone hasn't actually watched the person they're criticizing just because they're referring to them in a way you clearly don't appreciate, as if they would obviously see the person the same way you do if they would just watch those videos. That's not how opinions work.

sorry but i dont and have never agreed in the notion of only hearing one side of a story (and the passive aggressive tone implying that im "smugly dismissive" speak more of your disposition than mine, but if im being honest, you come off as pretty pompous and not invested in discussion but rather picking a tribe and being the louder and more obnoxious than the other guy)
i try to listen to a lot of opinions, even the ones i disagree with and sargon is one of those voices, because dispite my reasearch, im open to the idea i could be wrong and that a persons opinions can change over time. this means yes, i will give the time and day to listen to others and let the merits of the discussion stand on their own, becuase thats not just freedom, thats being respectful. and that's how we all win and move forward together

as for your other arguments
i have a feeling that you seem to label anyone whos dose not fit in with your opinions seems to be labeled as a Alt-right, sargon seems to come off as an ultra - nationalist but not really an alt right (personally i have issues with that anyway but i digress)

plus your arguments seem to add up to "i dont look at both sides, because i'm right and thats all that matters" (im being pretty blunt and sure theres more nuance but im going off what you give me)
i dont pretend that i or anyone else here on the internet will ever have the full answers, but to close off the possibility of learning more (even if it's just to learn an opponents weaknesses) is foolish and makes you no better then those you would demonize

fight smarter, not harder

went on a bit of a rant there, so sorry everyone

 

[gigastar]

If theres one thing i know Twitter does, its that they dont ban people for posting porn.

They don't ban you for talking about immigration either.

True but Twitter has been taking various measures against accounts that dont fall into Jack Dorsey's brand of politics.

Sure they call it 'filtering low quality posts' but the simple fact of the matter is that because we dont see theese posts unless we specifically look for them, we dont know if theyre just someone tweeting 'kill yourself ******' or something that Jack decrees to be politically incorrect.

But they do ban you for repeatedly sending gay porn to specific people in an effort to "trigger" or harass them, because how better to entertain both sides like a rational person than to tweet images of guys entertaining both sides, amiright?

Allegedly the guy who reported the gay porn wasnt even a target of the campaign.

Also, the targets of the interracial gay porn campaign was the conservative enthno-facist alt-right. He wholeheartedly disagrees with thier viewpoints and wanted total disassociation from them, and went about this by using gay porn to purge the alt-right from his twitter followers.

...fuck me im defending someones right to respond using porn. I may as well join /pol/ now.

 

[gigastar]

Now that he is alone on his private channel he can portray himself as the reasonable one to all his subscribers.

The video was posted as unlisted, so the only people who are going to see it are the drama vultures like us.

I'm torn on it being a mature move or him just trying to protect his channel, probably a bit of both. My point still stands. He is prettying up and glossing over things he said in the debate in order to appear more reasonable.

Im not denying Jon said some truly outrageous shit on that stream, however i still dont think hes an ethno-facist.

 

[gigastar]

Let me reiterate, I have actively seen and heard and read what their positions on various political subjects are, and I made the informed decision based upon that knowledge to disregard the things that they have to say. I'm not just off-handedly dismissing people because I don't like them or because I'm some feminazi beta SJW who wants to censor everyone; I'm actively deciding that they're not worth my time because their ideas are so retrograde and come from such a fantasy world depiction of the world that literally sitting here staring at a wall would be a better use of my time. I've said it before and I'll say it again and I'll keep saying it until the end of time: I don't need to tolerate other peoples' intolerance. Not putting up with the active subjugation of minorities and women is in nowhere near the same ballpark as criticizing and mocking insecure white men with an overinflated and honestly rather pathetic view of masculinity.

Alright. We can end this by agreeing to disagree.

 

[WindKnight]

.

Also, the targets of the interracial gay porn campaign was the conservative enthno-facist alt-right. He wholeheartedly disagrees with thier viewpoints and wanted total disassociation from them, and went about this by using gay porn to purge the alt-right from his twitter followers.

...fuck me im defending someones right to respond using porn. I may as well join /pol/ now.

Well, if he doesn't want the alt-right among his followers, maybe he should stop making stuff that appeals to the alt-right?

Or is that expecting a little too much introspection, and self analysis?

 

[Terminal Blue]

This is news to me, got a link to it?

Wait for the words "dried semen".

Actually, you may as well watch the whole thing while you're here because.. it's pretty sad, to be honest. I don't even really rate Kristi's performance, but it does illustrate the basic difference between someone who never does more than a cursory few minutes of research on any given topic and someone who has had years of formal training.

Like.. this should not be acceptable. This level of research, this lack of respect for the time and intelligence of your audience should not be acceptable. It's certainly not acceptable to me. If someone is going to organize a petition [https://www.change.org/p/universities-suspend-social-justice-in-universities] calling for broad censorship of university curricula, I expect that person to have comprehensively read up on the issue. Carl does not read anything which takes longer than a couple of minutes to read.

 

[shrekfan246]

plus your arguments seem to add up to "i dont look at both sides, because i'm right and thats all that matters" (im being pretty blunt and sure theres more nuance but im going off what you give me)

Actually, my argument is that I have looked at "both sides", and determined that the one in which people like Sargon of Akkad fall down on is unilaterally indefensible.

 

[BadNewDingus]

I hardly pay attention to the trends when it comes to who does what race-related. The majority of news stories I see on TV(local news) is black people committing crimes or whatever(I do live next to Detroit). Just like any story about a white man talking about race, it's basically some idiot white guy saying a bunch of racist stuff. Yet, I know not all black people are criminals. I know not all white people are racist. I just see the news trying to sway me into it, or it's just that I notice those stories out of the crap that is reported daily?

 

[gigastar]

Also, the targets of the interracial gay porn campaign was the conservative enthno-facist alt-right. He wholeheartedly disagrees with thier viewpoints and wanted total disassociation from them, and went about this by using gay porn to purge the alt-right from his twitter followers.

...fuck me im defending someones right to respond using porn. I may as well join /pol/ now.

Well, if he doesn't want the alt-right among his followers, maybe he should stop making stuff that appeals to the alt-right?

Or is that expecting a little too much introspection, and self analysis?

I specifically said the enthno-facist alt-right. Not the anti-SJW alt-right.

And since you seem to think you know what youre talking about, find me one example of Sargon supporting the idea of an enthno-state, and link me directly to it.

 

[gigastar]

This is news to me, got a link to it?

Wait for the words "dried semen".

Actually, you may as well watch the whole thing while you're here because.. it's pretty sad, to be honest. I don't even really rate Kristi's performance, but it does illustrate the basic difference between someone who never does more than a cursory few minutes of research on any given topic and someone who has had years of formal training.

Like.. this should not be acceptable. This level of research, this lack of respect for the time and intelligence of your audience should not be acceptable. It's certainly not acceptable to me. If someone is going to organize a petition [https://www.change.org/p/universities-suspend-social-justice-in-universities] calling for broad censorship of university curricula, I expect that person to have comprehensively read up on the issue. Carl does not read anything which takes longer than a couple of minutes to read.

Sargon himself thinks he was total shit in that debate. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlBqt_Q089U] And im certainly not about to defend him there.

And yes, fucking pathetic that anyone should let themselves be run into the ground by Kristi Winters. However dont think it diminishes his value as a critic on political matters.

Come to think of it i actually find that debate to be relevant to Destiny and JonTron too. Both Sargon and Jon were not experienced debaters and their opponents gave them the rope to hang themselves with.

As for that petition, i actually agree that courses that seem to taking students and turning them into activists should be suspended for review. If nothing else its a fundamental betrayal of the concept of university, instead of being enlightened theese students have come out with worse job prospects than before and indoctrinated into a 'Everyone i dont like is Hitler' school of thought.

 

[Skatologist]

> "Let's have an honest conversation about race."

> Literally says wealthy blacks commit more crimes than poor whites with absolutely no basis in actual fact.

You know, honest! /s

 

[Silvanus]

As for that petition, i actually agree that courses that seem to taking students and turning them into activists should be suspended for review. If nothing else its a fundamental betrayal of the concept of university, instead of being enlightened theese students have come out with worse job prospects than before and indoctrinated into a 'Everyone i dont like is Hitler' school of thought.

How on earth do you know that? What's your level of familiarity with these courses?

All we have to go on is a highly charged, rhetorical account from a political opponent. We cannot simply assume his analysis is on the money and he must be right about them.