So, apparently WW is pretty good.

[Souplex]

Please abbreviate responsibly.
WW means Wild West here.
GoW is Gears of War, not God of War.
WWF is the World Wrestling Federation not Wildlife foundation.
NAMBLA is the National Association of Marlon Brando Look-Alikes.

 

[BrawlMan]

I am willing to give Wonder Woman a chance. Man of Steel I liked, BvS was ok, and Suicide Squad had many problems. Honestly, Joker should have been the main villain, because Enchantress comes off as to generic.

I have been deliberately avoiding trailers so I can come in with a clean opinion. Plus, I did not want to spoil myself.

Please abbreviate responsibly.
WW means Wild West here.
GoW is Gears of War, not God of War.
WWF is the World Wrestling Federation not Wildlife foundation.
NAMBLA is the National Association of Marlon Brando Look-Alikes.

That's a South Park joke I have not heard in a long time. Funny thing, before Gears even came out, GoW meant God of War at the time. Now it's GOW, but some people still get that mixed up. And to me, the WWF will always be the Wrestling Federation, not that WWE crap. Fucking bullshit copyright.

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

Yeah, I don't believe it. Same people said Suicide Squad and Ghostbusters were good. At this point its healthier and easier to assume all DC movies are terrible until they can prove otherwise.

 

[DoPo]

Fucking bullshit copyright.

It's trademark.

 

[Samtemdo8_v1legacy]

Yeah, I don't believe it. Same people said Suicide Squad and Ghostbusters were good. At this point its healthier and easier to assume all DC movies are terrible until they can prove otherwise.

Quite a cynical as fuck statement now isn't it?

I know people that still likes Suicide Squad now.

 

[BrawlMan]

Fucking bullshit copyright.

It's trademark.

Oh...Fucking bullshit trademark!

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

Yeah, I don't believe it. Same people said Suicide Squad and Ghostbusters were good. At this point its healthier and easier to assume all DC movies are terrible until they can prove otherwise.

Quite a cynical as fuck statement now isn't it?

I know people that still likes Suicide Squad now.

Is it really cynical to assume the people who've been making terrible movie after terrible movie are going to make another terrible movie?
Or is it simple insane to do the same thing over and over, ie making DC movies, expecting different results, one that doesn't suck?

After Suicide Squad any good will DC has with its fans should have evaporated. DC has dropped the ball too many times to get the benefit of the doubt. Especially considering all the leaks during production that Wonder Woman was a hot mess, with re-writes, cuts, edits, re-shoots, etc all over the place. It looks just as hacked and stitched together as Suicide Squad.

 

[JagermanXcell]

Yeah, I don't believe it. Same people said Suicide Squad and Ghostbusters were good. At this point its healthier and easier to assume all DC movies are terrible until they can prove otherwise.

Quite a cynical as fuck statement now isn't it?

I know people that still likes Suicide Squad now.

Is it really cynical to assume the people who've been making terrible movie after terrible movie are going to make another terrible movie?
Or is it simple insane to do the same thing over and over, ie making DC movies, expecting different results, one that doesn't suck?

To add to this, it's not cynical to assume it'll be shlock when it's given history of shlock time and time again. That's not to say being pleasantly surprised is out of the question. Recent example, Split, made by famous trash fire M Night Shamandong. Rented in and went in expecting an add on to his series of trash fires and was genuine happy to be taken aback by how competent it was. I'll give him a small benefit of the doubt from now on, but will always remember that he's the idiot that made Lady in the Water/The Happening.

Which is not to say that if WW is good we should sing it's praise. Just that they need to try Really. Damn. Hard. to win back people who left due to their inability to learn that they're amateurs when it comes to cobbling up a decent film.

As for my opinion on WW... the editing might kill it. It always does.

 

[Cicada 5]

Yeah, I don't believe it. Same people said Suicide Squad and Ghostbusters were good. At this point its healthier and easier to assume all DC movies are terrible until they can prove otherwise.

Quite a cynical as fuck statement now isn't it?

I know people that still likes Suicide Squad now.

Is it really cynical to assume the people who've been making terrible movie after terrible movie are going to make another terrible movie?
Or is it simple insane to do the same thing over and over, ie making DC movies, expecting different results, one that doesn't suck?

After Suicide Squad any good will DC has with its fans should have evaporated. DC has dropped the ball too many times to get the benefit of the doubt. Especially considering all the leaks during production that Wonder Woman was a hot mess, with re-writes, cuts, edits, re-shoots, etc all over the place. It looks just as hacked and stitched together as Suicide Squad.

Those were rumors. They hadn't even shown the uncut version to outsiders at that time.

 

[Cicada 5]

Do any of these reports say if this movie treats war in a respectful manner?

 

[Samtemdo8_v1legacy]

Do any of these reports say if this movie treats war in a respectful manner?

BAH, I wanna know if its treats its warfare as epic and glorious as possible!!!

 

[Samtemdo8_v1legacy]

Tell me why you think that people wouldn't behave the way it was portrayed in those movies.

But movies are escapism, not reminders of how shitty the real world is.

I don't care how 'real' it is, I want to see Clark's dad love and support him. Not emotionally abuse him and tell him that he should have let his friends and classmates die to preserve his secret.

Or commit suicide in front of him to preserve his secret.

Or gaslight him by twisting his ideas around about how he's going to change the world

but shouldn't

Superman's parents are infuriatingly awful in MoS. I dont care if a real person would think that, it's just hard to watch.

Well the Escapism would be ruined anyway considering Superheroes do their thing in Modern day cities. Especially when you deal with non superhero characters.

I did not felt Escapism watching The Increadibles.

 

[Mangod]

Tell me why you think that people wouldn't behave the way it was portrayed in those movies.

But movies are escapism, not reminders of how shitty the real world is.

I don't care how 'real' it is, I want to see Clark's dad love and support him. Not emotionally abuse him and tell him that he should have let his friends and classmates die to preserve his secret.

Or commit suicide in front of him to preserve his secret.

Or gaslight him by twisting his ideas around about how he's going to change the world

but shouldn't

Superman's parents are infuriatingly awful in MoS. I dont care if a real person would think that, it's just hard to watch.

Yeah, I watch and read Superman-related stuff for the heroism; if I want to see how shit the world is, there's the Lifetime Movie of the Week. [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LifetimeMovieOfTheWeek]

 

[Palindromemordnilap_v1legacy]

So far Wonder Woman is the only DC film that has keep my interest and kept me thinking "okay, yeah, I can see this working" even after all the trailers and clips and promo shots have been released. So fingers crossed it lives up to the early hype

 

[Hawki]

I just wish it wasn't doing that incredibly ugly blue-grey lighting thing. The other DC movies all did it too and it was a large part of why they all looked like drab, eyeball-repellent turds.

Disagree there.

There was a video done on this awhile ago, but the DC movies have so far used physical film rather than digital recording. There's a visual richness to the DC films that the Marvel films have lacked. Even BvS, for all its flaws, is goregous to look at.

GoW is Gears of War, not God of War.

Ooh, there's a gauntlet if I saw one. ;p

Yeah, I don't believe it. Same people said Suicide Squad and Ghostbusters were good.

But Ghostbusters was good.

But movies are escapism, not reminders of how shitty the real world is.

Yeah, no. Just no.

Movies can be escapism, but it's disingenuous to suggest that that's all they (or fiction) can offer. Plenty of films I've seen this year alone have dealt with the harsh realities of the world, and been stronger for it. Even films like MoS, which are primarily escapist, are made stronger by having some gravitas, ranging from consequence to how people would actually treat a godlike being. Even Marvel/Fox have occassionally dealt with real-life parallels (Iron Man 3, Logan) and been stronger for it. Compare and contrast this to Guardians of the Galaxy 2 and, well, yeah, it's fun, I guess, but that's all it is. 'Fun.' A popcorn movie. Not something that has lasting impact because the next MCU is going to feature the same types of characters fighting the same type of villain in the same type of formula. Like I said, 'fun,' but not something that's going to be in my top ten list at the end of the year, and possibly not even in a top twenty list. I'll defend genre fiction to the death, but if all a film has to offer is escapism, then I'm not giving it special treatment when better alternatives exist.

 

[Zhukov]

I just wish it wasn't doing that incredibly ugly blue-grey lighting thing. The other DC movies all did it too and it was a large part of why they all looked like drab, eyeball-repellent turds.

Disagree there.

There was a video done on this awhile ago, but the DC movies have so far used physical film rather than digital recording. There's a visual richness to the DC films that the Marvel films have lacked. Even BvS, for all its flaws, is goregous to look at.

I don't give a damn what kind of film they use if they then go and cover that film in drab filters.

BvS was fucking ugly. There was a bare handful of pleasantly lit scenes. Everything else was hospital neon, nighttime, or overcast. Sends the eye skidding around the screen desperately searching for some colour. It's like the people in charge forgot that sunlight exists. It's the kind of aesthetic I'd use for a film about someone grappling with suicidal depression, not a superhero movie.

 

[Hawki]

BvS was fucking ugly. There was a bare handful of pleasantly lit scenes. Everything else was hospital neon, nighttime, or overcast. Sends the eye skidding around the screen desperately searching for some colour. It's like the people in charge forgot that sunlight exists. It's the kind of aesthetic I'd use for a film about someone grappling with suicidal depression, not a superhero movie.

So, all superhero movies should have the same aesthetic? That's a pretty depressing thought in itself.

Not that I really care about the genre, but while I can't give much praise to BvS, I still thought it looked beautiful. I find the MCU films far more garish aesthetically - there's either nothing interesting going on visually, or they take the Guardians route and saturate everything in colours.

There's 'gravitas' and then theres sticking your head up your ass trying to be serious

A grown man telling his child son that he should have let his classmates die in front of him to protect his secret is Head-up-Ass stupid

A grown man literally committing suicide in front of his son because even attempting to not die might reveal his secret is Head-up-ass stupid

But the other half of the movie is just Pa Kent listing out people that Clark should have let die so that nobody figures out he's The Special.

You...do realize that Clark's arc in the film is basically proving Pa Kent wrong, right? That as well-founded as his fears are, at the end of the day, the human race isn't so far gone that they aren't worth saving, that not every member of said human race is going to look up to him in fear, or can change their minds when presented with evidence to the contrary (e.g. the colonel guy)?

The movie isn't adult. It doesnt have weight or gravity. It barely has a message. For all the deal it made about Superman's S being the symbol of hope, its completely dry of it.

Disagree. On the personal level, as someone who saw MoS after losing their job and was feeling down by it, I did come out of the film feeling much happier. It's an example where escapism can have a tangible effect.

On the more analytical level, I disagree with the film being devoid of hope. Humanity fights back against the kryptonians despite the odds, Perry stays with his co-worker as the end nears rather than saving himself (human bonds remaining strong in the face of death), that Clark can be accepted at all, etc. Super Man has a habit of inspiring those around him once he puts the cape on. Even before it he's shown to have the desire to help people (the bus, the argument in the car), and in the former, 'inspires' the kid's mum on the bus and the kid himself.

I will say that despite all this, I don't consider MoS to be a "good" film, only average. But it's the interesting kind of average that's marred by stumbles (mainly in its editing and pacing) rather than the safe, formulaic average that the MCU (and many action movies) put out.

 

[Zhukov]

BvS was fucking ugly. There was a bare handful of pleasantly lit scenes. Everything else was hospital neon, nighttime, or overcast. Sends the eye skidding around the screen desperately searching for some colour. It's like the people in charge forgot that sunlight exists. It's the kind of aesthetic I'd use for a film about someone grappling with suicidal depression, not a superhero movie.

So, all superhero movies should have the same aesthetic? That's a pretty depressing thought in itself.

Didn't say that. I said they should avoid that one particular ugly aesthetic.

Movies can be escapism, but it's disingenuous to suggest that that's all they (or fiction) can offer. Plenty of films I've seen this year alone have dealt with the harsh realities of the world, and been stronger for it. Even films like MoS, which are primarily escapist, are made stronger by having some gravitas, ranging from consequence to how people would actually treat a godlike being. Even Marvel/Fox have occassionally dealt with real-life parallels (Iron Man 3, Logan) and been stronger for it. Compare and contrast this to Guardians of the Galaxy 2 and, well, yeah, it's fun, I guess, but that's all it is. 'Fun.' A popcorn movie.

"Here's how the world would really react to a flying man with laser eyes" isn't gravitas. It's just taking the inherently goofy premise of a superhero and playing it with a joyless poker-face, which just doesn't work. It results in a movie about Superman that can't bring itself to say the word "superman". In the hands of a decent script writer it might be a deconstruction, but that's been done a thousand times before and it's pretty clear audiences aren't looking for a deconstruction of Superman.

Meanwhile Guardians 2 managed to include themes of negligent/abusive fatherhood while still starring a talking raccoon and generally being a jolly good time.