Sorry, Mass Effect 3 complainers

[Chairman Miaow]

There are some really good breakdowns coming out now that we have all had our chance to vent.
Cooler heads have done a great job making some sense out of the ending.

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/10761785/1

This link uses elements of two leaked scripts, in addition to several community spawned findings to provide clarity to the catalysts logic and the ending at large. A must read.

In any case, welcome to the fold. Enjoy the free multiplayer dlc until extended cut and beyond.

Edit: link fixed ;-)

My biggest complaint with that is that is the bit where it says the reapers haven't reached the singularity because they cannot self-evolve. The Geth can make modifications and improvements to themselves, just look at legion. Are the Geth more advanced than the reapers?

 

[Acton Hank]

Welcome to the club, I was actually hoping someone would make a thread like this.
One of the many frustrating things about the whole controversy was people like Moviebob making judgements when they had absolutely no fucking idea what they were talking about.

People assuming that we were angry because the ending didn't fit our personal taste rather than because the ending was completely irredeemable garbage.

Looking back I was more frustrated at the incoherence than the ending's bad quality.

 

[devotedsniper]

The thing that ruined it for me was the fact the only difference in the endings was recolouring, whats the point in putting a minimum of 40 hours in all 3 games to have a 5 minute ending which is esentially the same no matter what you do. Considering this is possibly the most loved trilogy out there right now you would have thought they would have made more of an effort to end it rather than pretty lights in a 2-3min video.

I went in expecting either a good ending or a bad ending (depending what you did throughout but no, all we got was pretty colours.

 

[Emiscary]

I fucking despise the term "butthurt". It exists *solely* to trivialize people's anger. 200+ dollars and an equivalent number of hours is not a trivial expense of either to a normal person.

Choice.
Quality Story.

Those are the things I was paying for.

What I got?

Horde Mode.
And a Diabolus Ex Machina.

And all because EA/Bioware don't give a fuck about what I want. Which would be fine in and of itself- but they pretended that they did. All those promises about not forcing a lame binary ending on us? That our choices would play a real and significant role in the story's conclusion? Horseshit, from start to finish.

And the worst part? They seemed genuinely *shocked* when they were called out on said bullshit. IE:

"Oh, we meant for you to hate it."
"I mean we don't know why you're mad."
"I mean we're listening."
"I mean we'll get to work on that band-aid right away."
"Multiplayer 'rewards' anyone?"
"Hey... anyone for multiplayer 'rewards'? Huh? Anyone?"

 

[SonicWaffle]

I don't think they stopped giving a shit, rather they were going for something that didn't really work well in the end, or they ran out of time. A combination of the two makes the most sense to me.

I can't imagine what they might have been going for, considering how bad of a fit the ending was with the rest of the game. One of those weird "nobody really knows what happened" endings? I'm of the opinion that those are kinda bullshit, I like to know what's actually going on rather than being told that magical coloured lights fixed everything.

As for time, they had a game that was already guaranteed money in the bank. The final part of an epic, beloved trilogy with a very loyal fanbase who wouldn't have minded the game being a little late if it made for a better experience. Given that the game wasn't rushed to a particularly popular (ie Christmas) release date and actually came out in a fairly dead period, what kind of deadline would they have been pushed to?

 

[SonicWaffle]

Also annoyed that I couldn't continue my Romance side story with Ashley in ME2.

You're a sick, sick individual. It was all about Jack. Who doesn't love a nutty tattooed *****?!

 

[Best of the 3]

Given the choice I don't think Bioware would have released that as the ending. I also don't think they'd have done a multiplayer. However I can see they're EA overlords playing a big part in it. It wasn't the ending that pissed me off, it was that small pop up window saying to continue the adventure using the DLC. Fuck that, that just looks like greed and money grabbing to me. Same with the multiplayer in a way.

If I remember in hearing rightly, the whole developmental team wasn't even in agreement or production of the ending, only lead designer and Hudson (I think). I don't think this is what they wanted at all, they were just given a list (probably) by EA stating, we want an ending that leaves lots of room for DLC, and a multiplayer that does the same and offereing replayability.

 

[SonicWaffle]

and that's the thing, some people dismissed the "complaining" without actually know or bothering to know what it was all about

Speaking for myself, I think a lot of it was likely mental self-defence.

"It's Mass Effect 3, I've been waiting so long for this, it just can't be that bad. They must be wrong!"

I also didn't understand the hostility some people had when I wanted to entertain the Idea of indoctrination theory...

I've read up on that, it makes plenty of sense to me.

...anyway my reasoning with the whole thing is that there is really nothing to be gained in NOT changing the ending due to "art"

Depends where you draw the line. Is it acceptable to paint over the Mona Lisa because you don't like her smile? Yes, I know it's an extreme example, but the logic follows. If you say "this is art, a creation with a purpose and a message, but I don't like the message so I want it to be different" regarding a video game and then pressure the developer into doing it, how is that different from petitioning directors or painters or authors to change things you don't like about their work?

by changing...or with this extended cut we are getting, its a chance to gain [i/] something[/i]

Gain what? They've said they aren't changing what happens, just explaining it a little more. It'll be like that extra bit at the end of Lost, where Ben pops up to explain away the polar bears. Did it suddenly convert anyone who hated the finale? I doubt it.

oh well, apology accepted

Huzzah! I shall not go to my grave hated!

 

[SonicWaffle]

Yeah, I definitely think that the damage has been done. I don't really think BioWare has any way to possibly salvage this except maybe by throwing their hands up in the air and claiming that the Indoctrination Theory is right, even if that was never their intention. But short of that, we've already seen the piss-poor ending and it's not something that some "clarification" will erase.

Aye, they can't sweep it under the rug by giving us more details. Either they expand on a hated ending, or they throw in a "it was all a dream" bit and piss people off more. Or indoctrination theory, I suppose, but I get the feeling that's a bit too high-brow.

As for why, there are some strong signs pointing to the ending being changed around multiple times, and eventually the producer just whisked away the lead writer and the two of them together came up with the ending without any input from the rest of the writing team. All other parts of the game had gone through the peer review process, up until that part. Apparently the producer wanted a thought-provoking ending that made people talk and think for a while. But he unsurprisingly made a horrible judgment call and instead everyone just raged. Rather than philosophical arguments about synthesis, technological singularities, etc. BioWare's forums just exploded in a giant outcry of "WTF?!" I just hope they realize that they shouldn't let the producer make a creative call like that ever again.

Thanks, that's interesting to know.

 

[SonicWaffle]

Looks like we had another Andy Chalk here. Don't play Mass Effect 3 but give your opinion anyway, no matter how worthless it is!

Oh well.

Erm...did you not read the OP, or something?

 

[Zhukov]

...anyway my reasoning with the whole thing is that there is really nothing to be gained in NOT changing the ending due to "art"

Depends where you draw the line. Is it acceptable to paint over the Mona Lisa because you don't like her smile?

No, probably not.

But it's perfectly acceptable to say, "Hey, Da Vinci, one of her eyes is upside down! Might wanna fix that."

 

[SonicWaffle]

I won't say the series is ruined for me, but it will feel peculiar to play through all 3 games and then turn the third one off 10 minutes before the end to make up my own ending.

I won't lie, I was tempted, but I'm A) a sucker for closure (albeit shitty closure) and B) was really curious as to whether the end could possibly be as bad as people said. Turns out it was half-and-half; it was bad, but not as bad as some people made it out to be. As yet, it has not raped my children, although I'll be keeping an eye on it.

 

[Professor Putricide]

His name was Marauder Shields. And he tried to stop you. D:

As someone who's also recently beaten the game, I can say I'm at least curious to see what happens next. I wasn't happy with the ending, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't wanting to see what they throw out there. I don't want them to fix it, but I do kinda care to see what they put out there to clarify it.

By the way, have you looked into the Indoctrination theory? Kinda makes things make more sense. I really liked what I read with that one.

 

[SonicWaffle]

...anyway my reasoning with the whole thing is that there is really nothing to be gained in NOT changing the ending due to "art"

Depends where you draw the line. Is it acceptable to paint over the Mona Lisa because you don't like her smile?

No, probably not.

But it's perfectly acceptable to say, "Hey, Da Vinci, one of her eyes is upside down! Might wanna fix that."

And if he then says "yeah, I know, that's the way I created it"? If he intends for it to be the way it is, do we still have the right to tell him to change it to suit us?

To continue to painting analogy, would you go to Picasso and say "Dude, that's supposed to be a face? You can't paint worth shit, man, go back and do it again"

 

[SonicWaffle]

I fucking despise the term "butthurt". It exists *solely* to trivialize people's anger. 200+ dollars and an equivalent number of hours is not a trivial expense of either to a normal person.

Yeah, I don't like it either, but I felt I had to throw it in there to prevent the obligatory "lol another butthurt ME fanboy" post

 

[Casual Shinji]

I won't say the series is ruined for me, but it will feel peculiar to play through all 3 games and then turn the third one off 10 minutes before the end to make up my own ending.

I won't lie, I was tempted, but I'm A) a sucker for closure (albeit shitty closure) and B) was really curious as to whether the end could possibly be as bad as people said. Turns out it was half-and-half; it was bad, but not as bad as some people made it out to be. As yet, it has not raped my children, although I'll be keeping an eye on it.

You'd better; There's still ending DLC on the way.

 

[Mikeyfell]

ME 3 thread= Yet another morning shot.

I'm afraid for the fix too mostly because I'm not convinced that it couldn't get worse from here.

A fix would be nice, but honestly the chances that any change will make things better is like 1 in a million at this point.

Frankly if the Extended Cut DLC isn't the Indoctrination Theory, I just don't want to hear about it.

 

[DarkTenka]

Ill say this, out of the 3 choices you make 1 of them actually sort of corresponds to the "only" ending that the game has. If you chose to hybridise artificial and organic life the ending sort of makes sense. However if you chose either of the other options then the ending makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. So there is 1/3 chance that you will walk away not quite impressed but not terribly displeased.

Its not until you go back and find out that all 3 endings are completely the same that you feel like you have been wronged by Bioware/EA. The fact that there are 3 different coloured explosions just feels like a huge spit in the face.

I could go on and on about how the choices you made in earlier games never really amounted to much, but all I would really want out of a fixed ending is to see what happened to all the people we saved, and how they try to get back on their feet. You chose to settle the dispute between quarians and the geth? .. I want to SEE that! .. I want to see them working together to build a peaceful existence at the end. What happened to the council? What happened to all your Squadmates who were not on the Normandy?

All they need to do is add half a dozen or so cutscenes to show us some aftermath, they dont actually need to CHANGE anything .. they just to need to actually MAKE the ending!

 

[Woodsey]

Shepard was being indoctrinated.

Someone felt this was at the core of the series, Shepard's personal struggle, and so that's what the final victory/loss pertains to. Clearly, the vast majority don't feel this way, and instead the better choice would have been to have this incredibly personal sequence and then a confirmation of the Reaper's defeat/victory, as well as a last look at the fates of your living crew members. What's left is a clever sequence which makes for an inappropriate ending.

And yes, he was being indoctrinated. You don't need a 20 minute video to tell you that the big black tentacle lines, screen distortion, Reaper noises and Shep clutching his head whilst talking to Anderson and the IM were blatant signs of him being indoctrinated.

So yes, I was irked by the ending because it's not where I would have ended it, but I do not in a million years think it should be changed. The epilogue they're releasing should be more than enough, and even then I'm only fine with it because it seems to only be providing an explanation. (Although I do suspect they would have charged for it had there not been such outrage.)

 

[Zagzag]

The whole controversy has been going on for a while now, regarding whether fans have any right to demand that a game (or any other work of art) ending be changed simply because they didn't like it. I don't think I agree with that. I was firmly on the side of the naysayers, believing that such a thing was just a bit childish, equivalent to stamping your feet because you didn't get what you wanted.

I, and I believe the vast majority of people who disliked the ending are not "demanding" it be changed. This is one thing that people simply do not get. Publicly expressing dislike for something is not the same as demanding that it be "fixed". I would personally like Bioware to change it, but saying this is like saying I would like to be given loads of money for doing nothing. It does not mean that I expect, or feel I have any right to it hapenning.