Superman and now Captain America. Why so much dislike for being "overpowered"?

[Sir Thomas Sean Connery]

snip

snip

See, but you're wrong because Vibranium. And with that, your entire argument is utterly demolished. Somewhere in the universe this element exists that appears to break Newtonian laws. Maybe the material is bound with a quantum teleportation polarity reversing newtron reverser. It's not really a big problem, especially considering the invincible green monster that exists and the fact that there actually were ancient aliens and they're still around and they fly and hit things with lightning hammers.

OT:
Whoever said Cap is overpowered seems to not know anything about the character.

Superman I actually sort of agree with, but to be fair, I know virtually nothing about him or his enemies.

 

[Miss G.]

snip

Are you really gonna nitpick the nature of the fictional extraterrestrial metal/element, Vibranium, for not following real-universe laws of physics? Marvel's Universe, Marvel's rules, which for the kind of Vibranium in Cap's shield goes; it has the ability to absorb all vibrations in the vicinity as well as kinetic energy directed at it. The energy absorbed is stored within the bonds between the molecules that make up the substance. As a result, the more energy vibranium absorbs the tougher it becomes, however, there is a limit. Then there's the "proto-adamantium" (unique to the shield), that's mixed in as well, which is slightly different than true adamantium in that it's stronger than the latter, though both are nearly indestructible (and also completely fictional).

 

[Jux]

I'm really hoping they cover the Civil War arc in a movie down the line. I think it would give the movie Cap alot more depth.

...the more energy vibranium absorbs the tougher it becomes, however, there is a limit. Then there's the "proto-adamantium" (unique to the shield), that's mixed in as well, which is slightly different than true adamantium in that it's stronger than the latter, though both are nearly indestructible (and also completely fictional).

Aye, Fear Itself. Seeing that made me D:

 

[Elvis Starburst]

Now that the storm of people complaining about the accusations of CA being overpowered is over, let's get back on topic! I dunno about the Captain, but I dislike Superman for being overpowered myself. My reason for this is because when you have a near invincible man with almost no limits or weakness (I said ALMOST), it's hard for me to really connect with him. It makes him feel like some absolute omni being that cannot be stopped, so all of the struggles in the world really feel like nothing he can't handle, and that's not fun or interesting to me.

I like those with actual arcs, weaknesses, and development that doesn't basically end up with the man who can do the shit Superman does. Take the movie Chronicle for example (And I'm talking about it as if you've seen the movie. I'm too lazy to do a plot synopsis). Andrew may end up being super powerful, and would have ended up going to near super hero strengths, but he clearly has faults, and starts getting overpowered for reasons based on his background. There was a connection with him, he was able to be related to (Not for me, but for some, I'm sure), and you could sympathize with him. Hell, his actions would probably mirror others to a T. THAT is a well rounded character with super human abilities. Superman, to me, is just a brick who cannot be stopped. Thus, un-interesting as all hell

 

[Samechiel]

Nah, I get that just fine, and normally wouldn't think of nitpicking this. I'm just stubborn enough that I won't let the idea that this is actually possible slide.

Except that nobody thinks it is actually possible, so you just come off as looking silly by nitpicking.

 

[Reiper]

Nah, I get that just fine, and normally wouldn't think of nitpicking this. I'm just stubborn enough that I won't let the idea that this is actually possible slide.

Who knows, human understanding of physics and the universe is still pretty juvenile, and maybe such a force or element exists that breaks our current model of physics! The molecule man did say that the atomic composition was stranger than both the silver surfer's board, as well as Thor's magic hammer.

In any event, it serves its literary purpose, which is to make cap even more badass.

That is another thing I forgot about, since Cap is worthy to wield Thor's hammer, imagine if old Steve Rogers had both the shield and the hammer, he would be unstoppable!

 

[Klumpfot]

snip

Are you really gonna nitpick the nature of the fictional extraterrestrial metal/element, Vibranium, for not following real-universe laws of physics? Marvel's Universe, Marvel's rules, which for the kind of Vibranium in Cap's shield goes; it has the ability to absorb all vibrations in the vicinity as well as kinetic energy directed at it. The energy absorbed is stored within the bonds between the molecules that make up the substance. As a result, the more energy vibranium absorbs the tougher it becomes, however, there is a limit. Then there's the "proto-adamantium" (unique to the shield), that's mixed in as well, which is slightly different than true adamantium in that it's stronger than the latter, though both are nearly indestructible (and also completely fictional).

Is there any explanation as to how Captain America moves the shield, if it is impossible to impart kinetic energy on it? Is it only the front that is reflective? I'm genuinely curious!

OT: I'm not sure. The most overpowered being from comics I can think of is Dr. Manhattan, and he was still a compelling character, in my opinion.

 

[Reiper]

snip

Are you really gonna nitpick the nature of the fictional extraterrestrial metal/element, Vibranium, for not following real-universe laws of physics? Marvel's Universe, Marvel's rules, which for the kind of Vibranium in Cap's shield goes; it has the ability to absorb all vibrations in the vicinity as well as kinetic energy directed at it. The energy absorbed is stored within the bonds between the molecules that make up the substance. As a result, the more energy vibranium absorbs the tougher it becomes, however, there is a limit. Then there's the "proto-adamantium" (unique to the shield), that's mixed in as well, which is slightly different than true adamantium in that it's stronger than the latter, though both are nearly indestructible (and also completely fictional).

Is there any explanation as to how Captain America moves the shield, if it is impossible to impart kinetic energy on it? Is it only the front that is reflective? I'm genuinely curious!

Its probably best not to think about it too much. If such an object ever gain any momentum it would probably destroy everything in the universe in its way lol.

 

[Something Amyss]

In fact, I would say out of all the superheros with powers, Captain America is probably one of the least powerful over all, especially in a universe with characters like Doctor Strange.

One of the more common criticisms of Cap as part of the Avengers IS that he's a slightly super human fighting alongside actual superhumans, Gods, and sometimes Hulks. And I can understand that, but it's so common in comic books I was used to it by the time I was eight.

So yeah, Cap as overpowered is baffling to me too.

Sorry, but still nope. You couldn't absorb nearly enough energy that way to begin with, and even if you could, adding energy to molecular bonds as you describe weakens them, not strengthens. It would be like giving a room full of five year olds a case of Red Bull energy drinks to consume.

I'm sorry, I don't get the point of nitpicking the way this works in the same universe where gods and sorcerers are real. Not to mention one where dozens of people run supersuits on the principles of zero point energy. You have dudes who can lift buildings with no risk of structural collapse, people getting powers thruogh nukes and animal bites, and people who can produce near-infinite energy from their bodies.

Why is Vibranium such a sticking point?

 

[balladbird]

"overpowered" is a problem because a story is only as good as its conflict. The more basically strong your hero, the greater the amount of skill and effort it takes to make stakes that are both believable and suspenseful. Superman stories are the biggest offender in this regard, with decades of writing for him resulting in some truly ham-fisted attempts to create tension in his stories.

this is a personal opinion, of course, and not one everyone shares. If Fist of the North Star managed to run for years despite only three opponents giving the main character an honest fight in hundreds upon hundreds of chapters, why shouldn't superman or cap?

 

[Something Amyss]

Adamantium was an actually realistic proposed real life material, not used because of cost and workability. It would be a mixture of titanium with a carbon-composite lattice structural overcoating similar in typing to diamonds. Hence "Adamantium": Adamant (Diamond) + Titanium.

But the material, while extremely heat and damage resistant, would be too hard to incorporate into most military hardware (it couldn't be used to cover tanks, for example) so it never went past testing stages.

I'm pretty sure it's nowhere near as strong or workable as the fictional version, though.

 

[IamQ]

Oh. So you can smack around Darkside no problem? So ever other time before now when villains nowhere near his level showed up, you were just taking the piss? Good to know.

Not sure what people's problem with Captain America is. I guess since he's the only one with powers in a movie full of badass normals, he's out of place.

That scene is actually one I like with superman. It makes him seem more human when you realize how frustrated he is that actually could defeat some of these guys with no effort at all, but he always has to constantly adapt to his weaker surroundings. We've all had those moments where we know we can do more, but for some reason we have to hold it back, so it's nice to see that this applies to superheroes too at times.

 

[Heronblade]

snip

snip

See, but you're wrong because Vibranium. And with that, your entire argument is utterly demolished. Somewhere in the universe this element exists that appears to break Newtonian laws. Maybe the material is bound with a quantum teleportation polarity reversing newtron reverser.

Thank you for bringing that up, I thought I was just about out of things to nitpick, and thereby amuse myself.

There are exactly 98 elements found in nature, no more, no less. The table goes up to 118, but all elements on that upper end are increasingly unstable. The last of these, Ununoctium, exists for less than a thousandth of a second before radiating protons away and becoming a different element.

This is not to say that other elements cannot exist, that is patently untrue. but there is indeed a problem. Elements are defined by the number of protons they have, and there is no room in the middle of the list for any more elements. Any and all new baryonic elements would have at minimum 119 protons, would be lethally radioactive, and would only be able to exist in its current form for even less time than Ununoctium does. It kind of makes it difficult to use.

I'm sorry, I don't get the point of nitpicking the way this works in the same universe where gods and sorcerers are real. Not to mention one where dozens of people run supersuits on the principles of zero point energy. You have dudes who can lift buildings with no risk of structural collapse, people getting powers thruogh nukes and animal bites, and people who can produce near-infinite energy from their bodies.

Why is Vibranium such a sticking point?

It is not in and of itself. I'm just having too much fun with the science lesson to let it go.

 

[Sir Thomas Sean Connery]

snip

snip

See, but you're wrong because Vibranium. And with that, your entire argument is utterly demolished. Somewhere in the universe this element exists that appears to break Newtonian laws. Maybe the material is bound with a quantum teleportation polarity reversing newtron reverser.

Thank you for bringing that up, I thought I was just about out of things to nitpick, and thereby amuse myself.

There are exactly 98 elements found in nature, no more, no less. The table goes up to 118, but all elements on that upper end are increasingly unstable. The last of these, Ununoctium, exists for less than a thousandth of a second before radiating protons away and becoming a different element.

This is not to say that other elements cannot exist, that is patently untrue. but there is indeed a problem. Elements are defined by the number of protons they have, and there is no room in the middle of the list for any more elements. Any and all new baryonic elements would have at minimum 119 protons, would be lethally radioactive, and would only be able to exist in its current form for even less time than Ununoctium does. It kind of makes it difficult to use.

Ah yes, but this is only necessarily true in THIS universe/reality. Maybe the vibranium came from somewhere else and just managed to make itself at home.

 

[Ruisu]

Well I never felt like Superman was too OP in Man of Steel for example, mainly because most of the time he was actually "outmanned" by Zod's soldiers in smallville, and then almost outpowered by Zod himself in metropolis.
Not to mention a lot of little details in how he flies that make him feel more "human". Most of his flights mid-fights resulted in him crash landing, it really feels like even he is not capable of fully controlling his own power at that point.

 

[Heronblade]

snip

snip

See, but you're wrong because Vibranium. And with that, your entire argument is utterly demolished. Somewhere in the universe this element exists that appears to break Newtonian laws. Maybe the material is bound with a quantum teleportation polarity reversing newtron reverser.

Thank you for bringing that up, I thought I was just about out of things to nitpick, and thereby amuse myself.

There are exactly 98 elements found in nature, no more, no less. The table goes up to 118, but all elements on that upper end are increasingly unstable. The last of these, Ununoctium, exists for less than a thousandth of a second before radiating protons away and becoming a different element.

This is not to say that other elements cannot exist, that is patently untrue. but there is indeed a problem. Elements are defined by the number of protons they have, and there is no room in the middle of the list for any more elements. Any and all new baryonic elements would have at minimum 119 protons, would be lethally radioactive, and would only be able to exist in its current form for even less time than Ununoctium does. It kind of makes it difficult to use.

Ah yes, but this is only necessarily true in THIS universe/reality. Maybe the vibranium came from somewhere else and just managed to make itself at home.

It would have to come from a reality with radically different physical laws, all the way down to the quantum physics level.

Regardless of what it was before, it would either behave according to the laws of this universe once it arrived, and/or be completely impossible for us to interact with it.

 

[Ferisar]

snip

snip

See, but you're wrong because Vibranium. And with that, your entire argument is utterly demolished. Somewhere in the universe this element exists that appears to break Newtonian laws. Maybe the material is bound with a quantum teleportation polarity reversing newtron reverser.

Thank you for bringing that up, I thought I was just about out of things to nitpick, and thereby amuse myself.

There are exactly 98 elements found in nature, no more, no less. The table goes up to 118, but all elements on that upper end are increasingly unstable. The last of these, Ununoctium, exists for less than a thousandth of a second before radiating protons away and becoming a different element.

This is not to say that other elements cannot exist, that is patently untrue. but there is indeed a problem. Elements are defined by the number of protons they have, and there is no room in the middle of the list for any more elements. Any and all new baryonic elements would have at minimum 119 protons, would be lethally radioactive, and would only be able to exist in its current form for even less time than Ununoctium does. It kind of makes it difficult to use.

Ah yes, but this is only necessarily true in THIS universe/reality. Maybe the vibranium came from somewhere else and just managed to make itself at home.

It would have to come from a reality with radically different physical laws, all the way down to the quantum physics level.

Regardless of what it was before, it would either behave according to the laws of this universe once it arrived, and/or be completely impossible for us to interact with it.

That's just super lame sounding, that's about it.

"Well, see, it came from an alternate reality where Vibranium exists, but it actually doesn't do shit here."

Wow, that's a huge waste of space in a narrative driven by super-natural physics-breaking objects and beings. Woo.

Much like anything outside the realm of reality in fiction, all you can do is give throw-backs to actual physics and pretend. It's pretty much what defines most of these universes.

pretending

EDIT:
Also a bit presumptuous in the whole "well it may have COME from a place where the laws of physics are different, but I KNOW that WITHOUT A DOUBT we wouldn't be able to work with it. Because, you know, I have experience with this sort of thing."

Right. XP

Also when did the Marvel Universe become our Universe...