The Animal Crossing Afro Puffs / Space buns controversy and questions over who can play as what in games

[Dalisclock]

Oh don't get me wrong, it wasn't an actual incident. I've noticed that it's a running gag that Tom Nook is a greedy capitalist/mob boss/whatever, and given that all flora and fauna have value in-game, it represents capitalism's commodification of everything.

It's people taking it too seriously, but having fun, knowing that they're taking it too seriously. I think. I've never played Animal Crossing.

I always heard the joke about him being a slum lord but yeah, I can see the capitalism jokes coming from there. But yeah, it's a chill game about anthro animals and hanging with them. And chilling to a dog playing the guitar.

Also, something about turnip markets?

 

[Hawki]

Also, something about turnip markets?

Well, Peach needs a supply for all those vegetables she throws in Smash Brothers.

Though if that's a case, suddenly, it's commentary on feudalism. And this is already a monarch who believes in the concept of "let them eat cake." 0_0

 

[Baffle]

Good cuz i like aerith. She makes me smile.

I've got bad news. You might want to sit down for this.

 

[Schadrach]

Is this an outrage of smaller, equal size, or larger than the dust up over Abby?

I mean, there's a lot.

Gamers Are Mad a Woman in a Video Game Has Muscles

Don't worry, almost anyone can have big arms like Abby in 'The Last of Us: Part II.' Here is how she probably would have done it.

www.vice.com

crossfit women - Google Search

Oh, disregard that last one. That's my fap material and in no way shows that women can actually have arms like that.


This feels like a case of selective outrage. And that's fine. But this is literally the second thread made just for the Afro Puffs. Abby's "non-typical body type" arms and the rage along with it doesn't seem to have a single thread.

Sure, it might have been discussed in the TLOU 2 thread, but I don't see a separate thread about Abby's arms. No issue about literally hundreds or more gamers going out of their mind that a woman can have muscles with Crossfit exists, but we have to continue to think about Afro-puffs.

How do we all go on?

Thing I find the most amusing about all the Abby stuff is how many people were claiming that any complaint about Abby was fundamentally transphobic, while ignoring that Abby was supposed to be a cis woman and that no one seemed to really be complaining about the trans character that appeared in the game, Lev.

 

[CriticalGaming]

I've got bad news. You might want to sit down for this.

What?

 

[ObsidianJones]

I think the difference is they doxxed this girl for not submitting to them and apologizing for this.

I actually think that speaks to the level of cowardice people have. They will punch down, not up. Doxxing a big company and all its workers like Naughty Dog will get someone sent to jail. A random person on the internet is easy prey.

I firmly believe if big companies didn't come replete with all their lawyers, you would see more attacks for Cyberpunk's stance on sexuality and gender norms, Pitchford's shenanigans in everything, what Komani did to Kojima... you know what, basically everything.

Does it make it better? No. But that's the entire reason people posture so much on the internet. They'll do it to people they can get away with. Or why people call the cops on minorities for minor disagreements. Because the idea will be the caller will be trusted, and the police will Punish the minorities for daring to speak up to them.

I've got bad news. You might want to sit down for this.

God Damnit, Baffle! You don't do that!

What?

Hey, nothing to think about, buddy! Remember the Golden Saucer? Wasn't that good times? Let's just talk about that for like... oh, I don't know... 50 years straight?

 

[Dreiko]

What?

Don't let them confuse you with their lies. Remake is gonna let you use your phoenix downs! Believe in the dream!

 

[Trunkage]

Don't let them confuse you with their lies. Remake is gonna let you use your phoenix downs! Believe in the dream!

I have not played the remake but am aware that so much as changed.... don't you think they're going to change that part too?

 

[Dreiko]

I have not played the remake but am aware that so much as changed.... don't you think they're going to change that part too?

Not much changed actually, they just fleshed out a ton of stuff that you only saw a bit of and made it more meaningful like the Avalance people and Aeris' sector with the orphanage and so on.

The ending is just alluding to the potential of things changing down the line but it's extremely ambiguous. I'd say at this point I put them keeping that bit at like 90% but they may somehow undo it down the line through weird time travel shenanigans. That's way more likely than just going a different way entirely.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

Will do lol

You put a lot more effort into your OP than me though, to be fair.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

I actually think that speaks to the level of cowardice people have. They will punch down, not up. Doxxing a big company and all its workers like Naughty Dog will get someone sent to jail. A random person on the internet is easy prey.

I firmly believe if big companies didn't come replete with all their lawyers, you would see more attacks for Cyberpunk's stance on sexuality and gender norms, Pitchford's shenanigans in everything, what Komani did to Kojima... you know what, basically everything.

Does it make it better? No. But that's the entire reason people posture so much on the internet. They'll do it to people they can get away with. Or why people call the cops on minorities for minor disagreements. Because the idea will be the caller will be trusted, and the police will Punish the minorities for daring to speak up to them.



God Damnit, Baffle! You don't do that!



Hey, nothing to think about, buddy! Remember the Golden Saucer? Wasn't that good times? Let's just talk about that for like... oh, I don't know... 50 years straight?

As someone who's been watching Hololive for about 5 months now, I can assure you that just having a company behind them didn't stop the doxxing of one of their talents that led to her quiting or stop the hate messages another is still dealing with.

 

[ObsidianJones]

As someone who's been watching Hololive for about 5 months now, I can assure you that just having a company behind them didn't stop the doxxing of one of their talents that led to her quiting or stop the hate messages another is still dealing with.

Is Hololive as big as Naughty Dog?

 

[Specter Von Baren]

Is Hololive as big as Naughty Dog?

I'm not sure how I'm supposed to compare what is essentially a talent agency and a game company but perhaps this can give some idea.

Most Super Chatted YouTube Channels

A super chat (implemented on January 12, 2017) is a type of donation which appears as a highlighted message on a livestream. From around 2020, the list for the most super chatted channels has been primarily dominated by Japanese virtual YouTubers. This table is updated as of December 18, 2023...

youtube.fandom.com

Of the top 20 Superchat earners on Youtube, 12 of them are Hololive talents as are the top 3. The top earner, Coco, has made over a million dollars just in Superchats since her debut almost exactly a year ago (December 4th). One of their recent talents, Gura, reached 1 million subscribers within 39 days of her first stream. Now I know people can say, "Who the hell cares?" but my point is just that at least within the realm of the Youtube ecosystem, they are a relatively new (About 3 years old) but rapidly growing company.

 

[ObsidianJones]

I'm not sure how I'm supposed to compare what is essentially a talent agency and a game company but perhaps this can give some idea.

Most Super Chatted YouTube Channels

A super chat (implemented on January 12, 2017) is a type of donation which appears as a highlighted message on a livestream. From around 2020, the list for the most super chatted channels has been primarily dominated by Japanese virtual YouTubers. This table is updated as of December 18, 2023...

youtube.fandom.com

Of the top 20 Superchat earners on Youtube, 12 of them are Hololive talents as are the top 3. The top earner, Coco, has made over a million dollars just in Superchats since her debut almost exactly a year ago (December 4th). One of their recent talents, Gura, reached 1 million subscribers within 39 days of her first stream. Now I know people can say, "Who the hell cares?" but my point is just that at least within the realm of the Youtube ecosystem, they are a relatively new (About 3 years old) but rapidly growing company.

I don't know enough about the event to comment on them, that's why I asked. If they are rapidly growing and this happened when they didn't have clout, that would explain. If they didn't do anything and they already had clout... Don't know. Did the people who doxxed this youtuber know that he or she was apart of this big group?

 

[Specter Von Baren]

I don't know enough about the event to comment on them, that's why I asked. If they are rapidly growing and this happened when they didn't have clout, that would explain. If they didn't do anything and they already had clout... Don't know. Did the people who doxxed this youtuber know that he or she was apart of this big group?

In regards to Aloe (The one that was doxxed) I'll quote and direct you to an explanation of the events as is known (This happened just before I started watching Hololive but the community was still upset about it then. Still is really)

Spoiler: The events

This is a small quote from the post.

"The stream itself was around six minutes. In it, Aloe revealed to the audience that she had breached the terms of her contract with Cover Corp by accident. According to her, a Live 2D (L2D) broadcast of her testing her model out was dug up and found out by the public that happened during May of 2020. At the time, Aloe had requested permission from her manager to try out her model on a previously owned account, one that would later expose her private life to a startling degree.

The manager complied with her request and she most likely spent a while trying out the rigging of her model before finishing up. However, neither her nor her manager had actually ended that test, leaving a backdoor for people to find. It was password protected, but someone was able to find it and trace it back to her. This would lead to a multitude of doxxing attempts onto the talent. She would further go on to address rumors and the concerning amount of harassment around her."

It would be difficult for the people to not have known she was part of Hololive as everyone after the unofficial Gen 0 debuted as being part of Hololive and do so as a group in a generation.

Now as to Coco, the other person that is still receiving hate messages, the people that are still attacking her also certainly know she's part of Hololive as the reason they are sending hate messages directed at her is because she, *gasp* mentioned Taiwan when talking about statistics of what countries she gets the most viewers from. This has led to Chinese nationals seeing her very existence as an insult to them and led to the entire Chinese branch of Hololive being retired.

 

[ObsidianJones]

In regards to Aloe (The one that was doxxed) I'll quote and direct you to an explanation of the events as is known (This happened just before I started watching Hololive but the community was still upset about it then. Still is really)

Spoiler: The events

This is a small quote from the post.

"The stream itself was around six minutes. In it, Aloe revealed to the audience that she had breached the terms of her contract with Cover Corp by accident. According to her, a Live 2D (L2D) broadcast of her testing her model out was dug up and found out by the public that happened during May of 2020. At the time, Aloe had requested permission from her manager to try out her model on a previously owned account, one that would later expose her private life to a startling degree.

The manager complied with her request and she most likely spent a while trying out the rigging of her model before finishing up. However, neither her nor her manager had actually ended that test, leaving a backdoor for people to find. It was password protected, but someone was able to find it and trace it back to her. This would lead to a multitude of doxxing attempts onto the talent. She would further go on to address rumors and the concerning amount of harassment around her."

It would be difficult for the people to not have known she was part of Hololive as everyone after the unofficial Gen 0 debuted as being part of Hololive and do so as a group in a generation.

Now as to Coco, the other person that is still receiving hate messages, the people that are still attacking her also certainly know she's part of Hololive as the reason they are sending hate messages directed at her is because she, *gasp* mentioned Taiwan when talking about statistics of what countries she gets the most viewers from. This has led to Chinese nationals seeing her very existence as an insult to them and led to the entire Chinese branch of Hololive being retired.

Oh, ok. Hololive is a Japanese Company? This is making more sense.

This is the same country that just fired a woman for stating that the mayor that she worked for sexually assaulted her.

Councilor who accused Japanese mayor of sexual assault voted out after locals said she 'degraded' women | CNN

Residents of a small town in central Japan have overwhelmingly voted to remove the local council's only female member after she accused the mayor of sexual assault.

www.cnn.com

Residents of a small town in central Japan have overwhelmingly voted to remove the local council's only female member after she accused the mayor of sexual assault.
Shoko Arai, 51, was voted out on Sunday in Kusatsu, which is famous for its natural hot springs and resorts. The dismissal request claimed Arai's allegations had "degraded" the women of the Gunma prefecture town.
In total, 92% of votes lodged demanded her removal, according to Kusatsu officials.
The controversy began in November last year, when Arai published an e-book claiming she had been forced into a sexual relationship with the town's mayor, Tadanobu Kuroiwa.
A motion to fire the mayor was voted down, and Arai was expelled from the assembly a month later. However, the expulsion was appealed, and ultimately reversed by the prefecture.
After she was reinstated, a group of 19 residents led by council chairman Takashi Kuroiwa sent a dismissal request to the council, prompting the residential referendum that unseated Arai last weekend.
The dismissal request also claimed that Arai's statements to media about the assault allegations had hurt Kusatsu's reputation. It pointed to several specific remarks Arai had made, including ones that town women were "treated as objects," and that women often became mistresses to powerful male resort owners to gain privileges.
The request pointed out that the mayor had denied the allegations, and Arai's salary as a council member was a "waste" of taxpayer money.
In an official response to the council, Arai said the mayor and other council members calling for her removal were the ones damaging the town's dignity and reputation.
Her ousting on Sunday has pushed the resort town into the national spotlight. Since the weekend, the town hall has received dozens of calls criticizing Arai's dismissal, mostly coming from outside the town, said Kusatsu official Kenji Hagiwara. Many callers called the decision unfair and sexist.
"This is an unprecedented situation," Hagiwara told CNN. "We worry the image of this town is damaged."

I don't think protecting their female employees would be actually high on Hololive's list of things to do.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

Oh, ok. Hololive is a Japanese Company? This is making more sense.

This is the same country that just fired a woman for stating that the mayor that she worked for sexually assaulted her.

Councilor who accused Japanese mayor of sexual assault voted out after locals said she 'degraded' women | CNN

Residents of a small town in central Japan have overwhelmingly voted to remove the local council's only female member after she accused the mayor of sexual assault.

www.cnn.com

I don't think protecting their female employees would be actually high on Hololive's list of things to do.

......... Do you really not realise how bigoted this makes you sound? "This company comes from this country so the people in it are terrible." Excuse me? How is this any different than if someone said you were a thief just because you're black?

 

[Thaluikhain]

......... Do you really not realise how bigoted this makes you sound? "This company comes from this country so the people in it are terrible." Excuse me? How is this any different than if someone said you were a thief just because you're black?

Well, that's conflating ethnicities with countries, for one.

 

[ObsidianJones]

......... Do you really not realise how bigoted this makes you sound? "This company comes from this country so the people in it are terrible." Excuse me? How is this any different than if someone said you were a thief just because you're black?

From the same article

Former Prime Minister Shinzo Abe pledged in 2013 to close the gender employment gap, a policy dubbed "Womenomics." The campaign has pushed a number of measures, like setting targets of at least one female executive per company and offering tax incentives to companies that encourage mothers to return to work.
But seven years on, the campaign has had limited success, with gender discrimination and inequality still rife. The #MeToo movement led to concrete progress in other countries and a shift in cultural conversation -- but it was met with resistance in Japan.
In a case that gained international attention in 2017, freelance journalist Shiori Ito alleged a high-profile journalist had invited her to dinner two years prior, and then raped her.
The response was far from supportive -- she received threats, backlash on social media, and even fled Japan, fearing for her and her family's safety. Even authorities tried to discourage her from pursuing legal action, she said.

What I'm stating is that the Japanese Government and culture has long been permissive to Gender Biased Discrimination. Something that is well documented.

Japan's sexism problem runs deep

With only tepid support in Japan for the #MeToo campaign against sexual harassment, Amnesty's East Asia Researcher Hiroka Shoji believes Japanese women must hold the government to account and demand respect for their rights.

www.amnesty.org.au

Japan's systemic barriers to gender equality

The recent scandal involving medical universities rigging the exam results of female applicants are a reminder of the persistent gender discrimination and inequality in action within Japanese society.

www.japantimes.co.jp

How to narrow Japan’s widening gender gap

The country ranks 121st out of 153 countries, according to the Global Gender Gap Report 2020.

www.weforum.org

Feminist scholar calls Japan's gender problem "human disaster"

After several high-profile incidents in recent years highlighted Japan's problems with sexism, a Japanese women's studies pioneer has been presented a special recognition from Finland

english.kyodonews.net

Why gender inequality persists in corporate Japan

by Kumiko Nemoto It might be expected that a surge in the number of highly educated women living in an advanced economy and under a democracy should increase gender equality in that society, includ…

workinprogress.oowsection.org

Japan Is a Poor Performer on Gender Equality. Can the ‘Womenomics’ Initiative Help?

Japan has been a chronic poor performer when it comes to gender equality. Has its

www.brinknews.com

Matahara: An Issue with a Larger Context

Aug 20, 2015 // Japanese women often have to make a difficult choice: career or family? And when women attempt to do both, have a job and children, they are...

www.diplomaticourier.com

The Japanese Culture and the Japanese Ethnicity are two different things. Holding on to Japanese culture is something anyone can do, if they were raised in Japan and Japan only. I could be as cultural Japanese as anyone else if I was raised in the Japanese culture only. Just as I could be Republican as anyone else if I was raised in a strictly Republican culture. The Japanese Ethnicity is not beholden to any mindsets or mannerisms for the fact that their genotype and phenotype expresses what we, as a civilization, define to be Ethnically Japanese.

For your analogy to make sense, it wouldn't be because I'm Black that people would consider me a thief, but because America has a long running culture of allowing the males of this country to be thieves, and in fact encourages us to be so.

Are we on the same page again?

 

[Specter Von Baren]

From the same article



What I'm stating is that the Japanese Government and culture has long been permissive to Gender Biased Discrimination. Something that is well documented.

Japan's sexism problem runs deep

With only tepid support in Japan for the #MeToo campaign against sexual harassment, Amnesty's East Asia Researcher Hiroka Shoji believes Japanese women must hold the government to account and demand respect for their rights.

www.amnesty.org.au

Japan's systemic barriers to gender equality

The recent scandal involving medical universities rigging the exam results of female applicants are a reminder of the persistent gender discrimination and inequality in action within Japanese society.

www.japantimes.co.jp

How to narrow Japan’s widening gender gap

The country ranks 121st out of 153 countries, according to the Global Gender Gap Report 2020.

www.weforum.org

Feminist scholar calls Japan's gender problem "human disaster"

After several high-profile incidents in recent years highlighted Japan's problems with sexism, a Japanese women's studies pioneer has been presented a special recognition from Finland

english.kyodonews.net

Why gender inequality persists in corporate Japan

by Kumiko Nemoto It might be expected that a surge in the number of highly educated women living in an advanced economy and under a democracy should increase gender equality in that society, includ…

workinprogress.oowsection.org

Japan Is a Poor Performer on Gender Equality. Can the ‘Womenomics’ Initiative Help?

Japan has been a chronic poor performer when it comes to gender equality. Has its

www.brinknews.com

Matahara: An Issue with a Larger Context

Aug 20, 2015 // Japanese women often have to make a difficult choice: career or family? And when women attempt to do both, have a job and children, they are...

www.diplomaticourier.com

The Japanese Culture and the Japanese Ethnicity are two different things. Holding on to Japanese culture is something anyone can do, if they were raised in Japan and Japan only. I could be as cultural Japanese as anyone else if I was raised in the Japanese culture only. Just as I could be Republican as anyone else if I was raised in a strictly Republican culture. The Japanese Ethnicity is not beholden to any mindsets or mannerisms for the fact that their genotype and phenotype expresses what we, as a civilization, define to be Ethnically Japanese.

For your analogy to make sense, it wouldn't be because I'm Black that people would consider me a thief, but because America has a long running culture of allowing the males of this country to be thieves, and in fact encourages us to be so.

Are we on the same page again?

The analogy works because both are making assumptions about people without basing it on the actual character of the individuals.