The Big Picture: Destined for Disappointment, Part 1

[felicia_angel]

I think my problem with adding it to some of the movies is that it's not really needed - the TMNT are GIANT MUTANT TURTLES, and April O'Neil is a reporter. Or scientist, depends. If Hannibal can gender-bend and update Freddie Lounds from Phillip S. Hoffman to the red-head playing her now, or if Elementary can have Holmes and Watson meet over something besides sharing a room, you can have a two-hour movie that has April doing science or reporting to find them out, learn their backstory, and there be epic brawl at the end.
...and I think I just wrote a better story then what they showed for the new TMNT movie.

 

[BehattedWanderer]

I'm gonna bet that the destiny thing for the Star Wars prequels works because he actually completed his predestined action, except every wise mentor figure who looked at the damn prophecy completely misread it.

Anakin was supposed to bring balance to the force. Everyone thought that this meant he'd destroy the dark side, which just exemplifies how little they understand the concept of balance. At the beginning of Star Wars I, there are hundreds of Jedi and two Sith. At the end of Star Wars III, there are two Jedi, and two Sith. It's not hard to realize.

I always like the heroes who rise to the occasion more than the destined ones. Xenoblade, Dragon Age, Mass Effect (when the writers weren't trying to deify Shepard, anyway), the mooks you control in Fallout, they all produce that fun mix of a character who does it on their own but still shapes the world in the same way as someone destined to do so.

 

[Scorpid]

Please Movie Bob continue to shit on the new Star Trek movies. People cannot be allowed to think those two movies were good!

 

[Scorpid]

I'm gonna bet that the destiny thing for the Star Wars prequels works because he actually completed his predestined action, except every wise mentor figure who looked at the damn prophecy completely misread it.

Anakin was supposed to bring balance to the force. Everyone thought that this meant he'd destroy the dark side, which just exemplifies how little they understand the concept of balance. At the beginning of Star Wars I, there are hundreds of Jedi and two Sith. At the end of Star Wars III, there are two Jedi, and two Sith. It's not hard to realize.

I always like the heroes who rise to the occasion more than the destined ones. Xenoblade, Dragon Age, Mass Effect (when the writers weren't trying to deify Shepard, anyway), the mooks you control in Fallout, they all produce that fun mix of a character who does it on their own but still shapes the world in the same way as someone destined to do so.

My problem with that theory is that.... well umm it sort of is sad. The Republic gets torn apart to be replaced with something evil and then that gets again torn asunder turning the nearly unified galactic government into a galaxy of many separate governments that'll no doubt turn on each other. So did force correct itself because the Galaxy was about to get TOO good for everyone so it had to reset things back to something like what we have now? are we doomed to nation states or future space governments to fight the same endless battles for resources and ideologues till of all of life gets snuffed out making all our endeavors meaningless!? ARE WE FUCKED FOREVER!?!?!??!?

And your right Shepard became a example of what Bob was talking about lazy writing.

 

[dubious_wolf]

Shit Megan fox is back? Couldn't We have just left her in the Transformers series and moved on?

 

[Canadamus Prime]

I too think the whole Destiny thing is overdone and poorly utilized. I personally find it much more interesting when a hero rises to the task, not because he or she is destined to, but because he or she is called upon by chance and wants to do what is required of them.

 

[Piorn]

Destiny in the Prequels? I guess it's about Anakin, then?
Anakin always struck me as the kind of character that you see when a cartoon villain wears a disguise. Like when it's painfully obvious which of these Mr.Krabs' is the evil robot doubleganger and which one the original.
Non-child Anakin is evil throughout the 2nd and 3rd movie, and the audience knows it all the time, but nobody in the story seems to realize.

 

[BehattedWanderer]

My problem with that theory is that.... well umm it sort of is sad. The Republic gets torn apart to be replaced with something evil and then that gets again torn asunder turning the nearly unified galactic government into a galaxy of many separate governments that'll no doubt turn on each other. So did force correct itself because the Galaxy was about to get TOO good for everyone so it had to reset things back to something like what we have now? are we doomed to nation states or future space governments to fight the same endless battles for resources and ideologues till of all of life gets snuffed out making all our endeavors meaningless!? ARE WE FUCKED FOREVER!?!?!??!?

And your right Shepard became a example of what Bob was talking about lazy writing.

Eh. No one said destiny was always a force for good. In Star Wars, it was all about balance, not about things tending toward peaceful and benign. Equilibrium is the most desirable state of being for all things, including (presumably) non-sentient galactic forces that allow you to shoot lightning, toss around spaceships, and convince some questionably intelligent clones that these aren't the droids they're looking for. Whether it results in something sad or destructive isn't really the concern. It's like forest fires--yeah, the fire is bad, but it allows the forest a fresh supply of delicious ashy nutrients with the added benefit of more space for each tree to grow, while also clearing out some potentially harmful smaller plants that could be leeching water and minerals from the soil, which would make it harder for other plants to grow.

 

[Dandres]

Reading these forms makes me feel old. When I think of good destiny of Buffy the Vampires Slayer the show. When one slayer dies another girl is destined to be the next slayer. It showed that while some one is destined they do not always turn out for good like with Faith or the people pushing the destiny line are in there right mind like the Watchers Counsel.

 

[Mr. Q]

Couldn't help but think of this through the entire episode. I figure that not only will April's father be Master Splinter, but Casey Jones will be some long lost brother. That, or they'll remake him into some teen girl's pretty boy fantasy instead of the macho man he is.

XD Oh my God! I completely forgot about that scene from Young Frankenstein. Thank you.

I agree with Bob on this completely. The overuse of the destiny plot is so bad, I wouldn't be surprised if these shit writers and filmmakers use Joseph Campbell's Heroes Journey as masturbation material. This is I love The Lego Movie on so many levels; one of them being that it slams the overused concept of the destined hero and Hollywood's inability to stop using it. Franchises like Spider-Man, Star Trek, Superman, and TMNT deserve better than a bunch of no-talent fuckwits trying to get by on regurgitating the same plot many moviegoers are tired of.

 

[Dandres]

The Lego Movie!

Spoiler

Lord Business: The Kragle, the most powerful super weapon is mine.
Lord Business: Ah! The Kragle!
Lord Business: Now my evil power will be unlimited! Can you feel me?!
Robot: I can feel you.
Lord Business: Wooh! Nothing's gonna stop me now!
Vitruvius: Wait! There is a prophecy.
Lord Business: Oh, now there's a prophecy.
Vitruvius: About the Piece of Resistance.
Lord Business: Oh, yes, the supposed missing Piece of Resistance that can somehow magically disarm the Kragle. Give me a break!
Vitruvius: One day a talented lass or fellow, a Special one with face of yellow, will make the Piece of Resistance found from its hiding refuge underground. And with a noble army at the helm, this Master Builder will thwart the Kragle and save the realm, and be the greatest, most interesting, most important person of all times. All this is true, because it rhymes.
Lord Business: Oh, well. That was a great inspiring legend that you made up.
Lord Business: The Special one? What a bunch of hippy dippy baloney.
-
Vitruvius: The prophecy's not true. I made it up.
Emmett: I?m not special?
Vitruvius: But what I?m about to tell you will change the course of history. [He dies.]

Vitruvius? Ghost: The only thing anyone needs to be special is to believe that they're special.

 

[shrekfan246]

Wait you don't despise the Star Wars Prequels? I have found a brother in arms! *hugs tight* At last. I truly have found a magnificent treasure of a human being today.

A few of us exist.

We simply learned long ago to never let the world learn of our sins.

OT: Well, I don't think I have much other input to put in reference to this episode, except for predicting that Bob is going to utterly hate the new Turtles movies. It'll be interesting to see which angle he takes with Star Wars next week, though.

 

[Strain42]

I'm sure someone has already said this by now, but to be fair, Iron Man had some of the whole destiny thing going on, especially in the sequel.

I mean c'mon, Howard Stark laid out that entire city so that his future son could use his holographic computer as a blueprint to invent a new element that saves him from an affliction that couldn't possibly have been foretold?

But yeah, I agree. Forcing destiny where destiny don't belong ain't a smart idea.

 

[Callate]

I think one could make a pretty good argument that the most recent Captain America actually is a destiny movie. The foreshadowing of the shield with the garbage can lid, the implicit suggestion that it isn't just getting the super-soldier serum that makes someone heroic but that the serum is bringing out of the inner qualities of the person it's used on (which also leads to the Red Skull); arguably, Erskine even acts as a surrogate father figure, leaving his legacy to Steve Rogers on his premature death.

 

[Flunk]

Try watching Japanese TV shows without hearing about destiny (unmei) constantly. I'm not sure if Japanese people really believe in destiny or if their writers are just even lazier than Hollywood writers.

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

I'm gonna bet that the destiny thing for the Star Wars prequels works because he actually completed his predestined action, except every wise mentor figure who looked at the damn prophecy completely misread it.

Anakin was supposed to bring balance to the force. Everyone thought that this meant he'd destroy the dark side, which just exemplifies how little they understand the concept of balance. At the beginning of Star Wars I, there are hundreds of Jedi and two Sith. At the end of Star Wars III, there are two Jedi, and two Sith. It's not hard to realize.

Heh, a wanderer after my own heart; I was going to say the same exact thing. Yoda even said something to that effect: "A prophecy that misread, could have been". He realized far too late that "perfect order" is not "balance".

 

[Tim Chuma]

Stephen Chow has made several movies where his character starts off as a "bad guy" or not really someone you would want to support and goes through trials coming up as good in the end. My favourite movie of his is God of Cookey, a parody of cooking shows and Iron Chef where a TV chef is usurped by his business partner and "wins back from the streets" by teaming up with a gang of street food hawkers. It also has the Eighteen Bronzemen who beat the snot out of him, I have never laughed so much https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8UTANHpsV0

There is also "Love on Delivery" where a lowly delivery boy wins the day by not fighting. The "master" he is training with is just ripping him off and doesn't actually train him. He wins by luck in a Garfield mask and has to "train" not to fight, just to get through three rounds
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4-Lqj_dlDU

Stephen Chow has also starred in a version of "Journey to the West" where crotch fires get stamped out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lZNkOS4S6k and is remaking it as a trilogy (at the same time as another team is doing it), which is the closest to the "destiny" story.

 

[attackshark]

so, bob, what you're saying is that destiny is the narrative shaky-cam of modern-day film making?

 

[daxterx2005]

TMNT 2: April's Dad Splinter

 

[ccggenius12]

The comedic value I obtained from this episode was greatly enhanced by pretending that every time he mentioned "Destiny", he was talking about a stripper. Sick of seeing it trotted out indeed.

Well at the end Anakin did bring balance to the force like he was supposed to, just at the end of movie VI instead of III.

No, he balanced it at the end of 3. There were a lot more Jedi than Sith. Balance means equal numbers. The prophecy dictated that he kill children, lots of them.